"I'm gay and saving sex till marriage" - by Constantino Diaz-Duran

  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Apr 21, 2013 11:58 PM GMT
    "I'm gay and saving sex till marriage"

    http://www.howaboutwe.com/date-report/why-im-saving-myself-for-my-gay-marriage/

    "Is it surprising that more and more conservatives are coming out in favor of marriage equality? Hardly. I’m not the first to note that this is not a triumph of liberal ideology, but rather of conservative, traditional values. I live in New York, and for me—a gay man who has never quite fit in with the progressive democratic crowd—having the opportunity to get married means having the chance to live, finally, according to the precepts of my Christian faith.

    ...I was raised Roman Catholic, and had been very close to the church as a teenager, but I rejected religion in college because there didn’t seem to be a way of reconciling Christianity—or at least what I heard Christians saying—with my sexuality.

    The limitations on gay relationships affected my approach to dating. It was hard to take it seriously, and I had trouble imagining that I would ever have what I wanted: a life-long committed relationship and a family. I was listening to the people who shared my religion say that marriage was only between a man and a woman—that I could never have what they had. So I didn’t even try...

    The future I wanted seemed totally out of reach, but I still went on dates, and eventually met a good man...We spent nine years as a couple, seven of them cohabiting.

    Our relationship fell apart gradually...that’s the problem with dating in a world where there is no big knot to be tied—you just sort of coast through, forever-single-but-coupled, living by well-meant, but unenforceable promises. The level of commitment and accountability is just not the same as when you’re legally bound, and your covenant is respected, dignified, and taken as seriously by your peers and society.

    I have nothing but respect for older gay couples who stuck it out despite the lack of societal recognition, but it’s fair to say that most of us don’t have the self-discipline to make it work without that extra binding tie. Most of us need the accountability...

    I ended my relationship shortly after marriage equality passed in New York State—the irony does not escape me, but by then it was too late for us...

    Being able to picture myself as a Married Man transformed the way I approached dating...I’ve found a Christian community that recognizes marriage equality.

    ...I believe promiscuity and premarital sex devalue love and water down the sanctity of what I understand as marriage....I believe God calls us to be chaste until marriage, not because sex is wrong or dirty, but rather because it is beautiful—a gift from Him...Sex is, to use a word some might dislike, holy. It belongs in the context of Holy Matrimony.

    ...I see that while I did not choose to be gay, I can choose to at least try and live as a Christian. I am dating a Christian man I met online. We were first drawn to each other’s pictures (what can I say: he’s hot), but it’s our faith and shared interests that really brought us together. We have prayed together, and we believe God wants us to behave as a Christian couple.

    And so, and even though neither one of us is a virgin, my boyfriend and I have decided to abstain from premarital sex—including oral sex, masturbation, and even sexting...

    ...I will someday be able to get married in a church, and the vows I make to my husband will be taken as seriously as those of any other man. This raises the bar....This is what marriage equality is ultimately about: the recognition that gay people not only have the same dreams and yearnings as straight people, but that we must also hold ourselves to the same standards and obligations. This is why the option (perhaps even the expectation) of getting married can and will change the way gay people approach dating. It certainly has for me."
  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Apr 22, 2013 12:07 AM GMT
    Those of you who know Tino personally and have followed his career will recognize in this piece his unique gifts as a writer: soothing thoughtfulness and a deep love of humanity but at the same time a willingness to be provocative and controversial.
  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Apr 22, 2013 12:07 AM GMT
    A comment left on his article:

    59279_10200383910033037_725244762_n.jpg
  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Apr 22, 2013 12:13 AM GMT
    yourname2000 saidGod, what a blowhard. icon_rolleyes.gif


    Next time can you tell us how you really feel about it and not hold back any? Hahaha, I lol'd
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 12:20 AM GMT
    I agree with this article a lot and I feel like legalizing gay marriage would in a way legitimize the gay lifestyle and relationship.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 1:18 AM GMT
    It's beautifully written. If I were editing it, though, I'd have wanted to change this part:

    ...I believe promiscuity and premarital sex devalue love and water down the sanctity of what I understand as marriage....I believe God calls us to be chaste until marriage, not because sex is wrong or dirty, but rather because it is beautiful—a gift from Him...Sex is, to use a word some might dislike, holy. It belongs in the context of Holy Matrimony."

    to this:


    ...I believe promiscuity and premarital sex devalue love and water down the sanctity of what I understand as marriage....I believe God calls me to be chaste until marriage, not because sex is wrong or dirty, but rather because for me, it is beautiful—a gift from Him...Sex is, to use a word some might dislike, holy, for me it belongs in the context of Holy Matrimony."
  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Apr 22, 2013 3:47 AM GMT
    ^ I think the "for me" stuff is implied when he starts off "I believe". By the way, I don't agree with Tino on abstinence (for straight or for gay couples), but his writing is always so nice to read, and I do think he is right about the accountability effect the marriage option will have on gay relationships, which are right now far too dilettantish for my tastes.
  • whytehot

    Posts: 1166

    Apr 22, 2013 4:00 AM GMT
    meninlove saidIf I were editing it, though, I'd have wanted to change this part to this:

    ...I believe promiscuity and premarital sex devalue love and water down the sanctity of what I understand as marriage....I believe God calls me to be chaste until marriage, not because sex is wrong or dirty, but rather because for me, it is beautiful—a gift from Him...Sex is, to use a word some might dislike, holy, for me it belongs in the context of Holy Matrimony."


    Yes... only politically-incorrect views require every sentence be lame-ified with "in my humble opinion"
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 4:07 AM GMT
    TroyAthlete said^ I think the "for me" stuff is implied when he starts off "I believe". By the way, I don't agree with Tino on abstinence (for straight or for gay couples), but his writing is always so nice to read, and I do think he is right about the accountability effect the marriage option will have on gay relationships, which are right now far too dilettantish for my tastes.


    *eye twinkle*



    My feeling is that 'For me' doesn't judge others, and even invites guys that feel that same to identify a little better. That's why I thought I'd use it.

    All the same, the straight divorce rate is a little appalling. I'm going to sound completely wacko here, but from what I've seen, a lot of marriages involving gay people have occurred among couples who have been together first in all respects for a good number of years.
  • LEANDRO_NJ

    Posts: 1116

    Apr 22, 2013 4:14 AM GMT
    In my honest opinion marriage of any kind is a trap created to benefit one and not the other! Love is NOT defined by a contract or a piece of paper!

    LOVE IS DEFINED BY LOVE...NOT A MARRIAGE, CIVIL OR OTHERWISE!!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 4:31 AM GMT
    whytehot said
    meninlove saidIf I were editing it, though, I'd have wanted to change this part to this:

    ...I believe promiscuity and premarital sex devalue love and water down the sanctity of what I understand as marriage....I believe God calls me to be chaste until marriage, not because sex is wrong or dirty, but rather because for me, it is beautiful—a gift from Him...Sex is, to use a word some might dislike, holy, for me it belongs in the context of Holy Matrimony."


    Yes... only politically-incorrect views require every sentence be lame-ified with "in my humble opinion"


    That's not the point at all. He's found his journey's path, not yours or mine. I found his personal convictions and revelations from religious feelings and knowledge, though wonderful, sounded as though it was directed at others rather than solely himself.

    icon_wink.gif

  • whytehot

    Posts: 1166

    Apr 22, 2013 4:49 AM GMT
    meninlove said
    whytehot said
    meninlove saidIf I were editing it, though, I'd have wanted to change this part to this:

    ...I believe promiscuity and premarital sex devalue love and water down the sanctity of what I understand as marriage....I believe God calls me to be chaste until marriage, not because sex is wrong or dirty, but rather because for me, it is beautiful—a gift from Him...Sex is, to use a word some might dislike, holy, for me it belongs in the context of Holy Matrimony."


    Yes... only politically-incorrect views require every sentence be lame-ified with "in my humble opinion"


    That's not the point at all. He's found his journey's path, not yours or mine. I found his personal convictions and revelations from religious feelings and knowledge, though wonderful, sounded as though it was directed at others rather than solely himself.

    icon_wink.gif



    You or anyone here would be singing a different tune if this article was promoting the virtues of free love or sexual experimentation, or how "everyone" needs to bottom at least once, etc. The point is this guy believes God wishes for everyone to be chaste until marriage; your edits would change his meaning. It's not wrong to have an opinion about how others should live their lifes; the rest of us are free to take it or leave it.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 4:56 AM GMT
    Whatever you like, whytehot. icon_wink.gif
  • Apparition

    Posts: 3521

    Apr 22, 2013 4:57 AM GMT
    marriage was meant as a contract to pass on land and power.

    that said....

    it was also meant for a society that got married as young teenagers and died when they were 35, and actually worked for a living, so premarital sex and divorce were not usually a priority, its not like they had time for "fun" if you were a peasant.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 5:07 AM GMT
    It irks me when religious people try to "reconcile" (read: ignore) the parts of their religion that are inconvenient for them and just follow the parts they find appealing. If that's what you're going to do, why not just live your life the way you want instead of clinging to a religion whose rules you bend to your will anyway. This guy is free to live his life as he wants but he's deluding himself if he thinks that he's following some biblical standard.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 6:29 AM GMT
    Cardinal724 saidIt irks me when religious people try to "reconcile" (read: ignore) the parts of their religion that are inconvenient for them and just follow the parts they find appealing. If that's what you're going to do, why not just live your life the way you want instead of clinging to a religion whose rules you bend to your will anyway. This guy is free to live his life as he wants but he's deluding himself if he thinks that he's following some biblical standard.



    Well there is no true biblical standard to be honest. Since the thing came off the presses people have been picking and choosing how they choose to follow it,
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 6:47 AM GMT
    MashogaNubianPrince said
    Cardinal724 saidIt irks me when religious people try to "reconcile" (read: ignore) the parts of their religion that are inconvenient for them and just follow the parts they find appealing. If that's what you're going to do, why not just live your life the way you want instead of clinging to a religion whose rules you bend to your will anyway. This guy is free to live his life as he wants but he's deluding himself if he thinks that he's following some biblical standard.



    Well there is no true biblical standard to be honest. Since the thing came off the presses people have been picking and choosing how they choose to follow it,


    Which just proves my point...
  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Apr 22, 2013 10:25 AM GMT
    Cardinal724 said
    MashogaNubianPrince said
    Cardinal724 saidIt irks me when religious people try to "reconcile" (read: ignore) the parts of their religion that are inconvenient for them and just follow the parts they find appealing. If that's what you're going to do, why not just live your life the way you want instead of clinging to a religion whose rules you bend to your will anyway. This guy is free to live his life as he wants but he's deluding himself if he thinks that he's following some biblical standard.



    Well there is no true biblical standard to be honest. Since the thing came off the presses people have been picking and choosing how they choose to follow it,


    Which just proves my point...


    By that logic there's no rules and standards for anything -- there is no creed, oath, constitution, rulebook, handbook, lawbook followed 100% by 100% of its aherents 100% of the time. People in any sect agree on the big points and argue over the details, that's not unique to religion.

    If picking and choosing from the Bible is the way people -- in your words -- "want" to live their lives, then you should have no problem with it.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 11:59 AM GMT
    TroyAthlete said
    Cardinal724 said
    MashogaNubianPrince said
    Cardinal724 saidIt irks me when religious people try to "reconcile" (read: ignore) the parts of their religion that are inconvenient for them and just follow the parts they find appealing. If that's what you're going to do, why not just live your life the way you want instead of clinging to a religion whose rules you bend to your will anyway. This guy is free to live his life as he wants but he's deluding himself if he thinks that he's following some biblical standard.



    Well there is no true biblical standard to be honest. Since the thing came off the presses people have been picking and choosing how they choose to follow it,


    Which just proves my point...


    By that logic there's no rules and standards for anything -- there is no creed, oath, constitution, rulebook, handbook, lawbook followed 100% by 100% of its aherents 100% of the time. People in any sect agree on the big points and argue over the details, that's not unique to religion.

    If picking and choosing from the Bible is the way people -- in your words -- "want" to live their lives, then you should have no problem with it.


    Except no one does "agree" on the big points either. Are people born with original sin or no? Trinitarianism or unitarianism? Hell a lake of fire or just separation from God? Do you need to be baptized or no? Faith alone necessary or is it faith plus works? Is the communion wafer symbolically or literally the flesh and blood of Christ?

    There are thousands of sects of Christianity and none of them agree on even the most fundamental tenants of their faith. This isn't a good thing. It makes Christianity look like a joke.

    There's also a difference between not being able to adhere to a creed/oath/etc 100% even though you make an effort to and simply ignoring the parts that you don't want. My point is that if you are just going to follow what you already agree with and you are going to chuck aside the parts you don't agree with, then you're not actually getting your morals from your religion. You're applying your pre-existing morals onto your religion and just picking out the parts that match. If that's the case, then there's no need to claim to be an adherent. You'd live your life just the same even if you didn't believe.

    I'm not saying people shouldn't be allowed to pick and choose from the Bible but people like the guy in this article really need a reality check. The world doesn't need any more people proclaiming to know what "God" wants for us and then judging those that don't want to follow that standard, which is a standard that just so conveniently happens to mesh perfectly with the way the person preaching wants to live his life anyway (see above). It's incredibly hypocritical.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 12:19 PM GMT
    He swears he's gay, but wants to save sex until marriage? Lol. Someone is clearly in denial about his latent heterosexuality...icon_rolleyes.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 12:22 PM GMT
    No sexting????

    #lame
  • HndsmKansan

    Posts: 16311

    Apr 22, 2013 12:26 PM GMT
    What I like about it, is he lays out what makes sense for him. You can tell he wants to live the life he lays out, which is his prerogative. I didn't take it as "his attempt to tell us how to live", but rather to explain how he sees it and I wasn't threatened by it in the least. Interesting perspective.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 12:40 PM GMT
    I'm the same.
    I hold on to my virginity and not as some kind of thing to brag about (as some people think virgins boast about their virginity, I suppose some have), but because of my beliefs and what I value.

    So often people think marriage 'kills' the sex life and I think to myself "well if you didn't have it so much before marriage, you'd appreciate it more once you were married".
    I suppose it's different in the gay world since gay marriage only started to become a possibility now. I don't know if it's because back in the past there was no way for gay marriage, so gay men just figured "oh what the hell, it's not like we can get married" and so overtime the notion of 'saving' your virginity just died away since they didn't have a 'marriage' to make the sex 'sacred'.

    I guess for me, even with or without marriage I always viewed sex as a sacred thing.
    This is just my own personal view of course, and by no means am I looking for a "sex" pro as a prerequisite before getting married. I'd like us both to achieve this together with each other once we're both married, I mean isn't the fun part also about the journey too?

    Sex, or my body, for me isn't something I'd just want anyone to have.
    I do believe it really is something sacred, and often people play it down as being too prude or too old fashioned.
    To each their own of course, this is just something that I want for myself and I've already accepted that I'll be a 'minority within a minority' so to speak.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Apr 22, 2013 12:42 PM GMT
    Well whyehot, so far no one is agreeing with you.

    "The point is this guy believes God wishes for everyone to be chaste until marriage; your edits would change his meaning."

  • MadeinMich

    Posts: 1624

    Apr 22, 2013 1:45 PM GMT
    NerdMonastery saidI'm the same.
    I hold on to my virginity and not as some kind of thing to brag about (as some people think virgins boast about their virginity, I suppose some have), but because of my beliefs and what I value.

    So often people think marriage 'kills' the sex life and I think to myself "well if you didn't have it so much before marriage, you'd appreciate it more once you were married".
    I suppose it's different in the gay world since gay marriage only started to become a possibility now. I don't know if it's because back in the past there was no way for gay marriage, so gay men just figured "oh what the hell, it's not like we can get married" and so overtime the notion of 'saving' your virginity just died away since they didn't have a 'marriage' to make the sex 'sacred'.

    I guess for me, even with or without marriage I always viewed sex as a sacred thing.
    This is just my own personal view of course, and by no means am I looking for a "sex" pro as a prerequisite before getting married. I'd like us both to achieve this together with each other once we're both married, I mean isn't the fun part also about the journey too?

    Sex, or my body, for me isn't something I'd just want anyone to have.
    I do believe it really is something sacred, and often people play it down as being too prude or too old fashioned.
    To each their own of course, this is just something that I want for myself and I've already accepted that I'll be a 'minority within a minority' so to speak.


    I agree with this and I agree hole heartedly with everything the writer says in this article. I was pleasantly suprised to hear a gay man hold sex to such a high standard.

    Before I came out I was saving myself for marriage but then I was drawn to the promiscuous ways of the gay lifestyle. Now I'm a hoe icon_smile.gif
    I wish I had met someone like the writer a while ago.