Living Life Contradicting yourself.

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    May 02, 2013 7:21 AM GMT
    I just read how pornstar Jake Genesis issued an apology for being in porn and is basically done with the industry. Personally, I really like the guy, not just his body, his attitude and sense of humor.

    One of the points he made, was that he was living life contradicting his own beliefs. This got me to wondering if this ever really happens, or if we change our beliefs when bad things happen. So here are my questions for you:

    Have you ever contradicted your own thoughts/words/beliefs/actions in some way?
    Was it a big or small contradiction?
    Does it matter if it's a small contradiction?
    Did you just change your beliefs afterwards or try to stay true?
    In all honesty did you change your beliefs because it was what you truly belived, or because you dealt with some sort of negative after effect.


    I realize no one is perfect, and everyone is hypocritical at one point or another. But I also realize that people claim to have beliefs, but sometimes just don't follow through with them. Other times, it isn't until bad things happen that they start staying true to their beliefs.

    For the most part, I stick to my beliefs. There have been times that I've strayed from my own beliefs and known it, but I still maintain my beliefs to a certain extent. But I also realize that beliefs, morals and words can change over time.

    So, what say you?
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    May 02, 2013 9:59 AM GMT
    Have you ever contradicted your own thoughts/words/beliefs/actions in some way?
    In all honesty did you change your beliefs because it was what you truly belived, or because you dealt with some sort of negative after effect.

    whether it is good or bad to me, I don't care because I believe only in truth and the truth has no contradiction.
    For eg: If I think I'm good at something, but in reality it is overconfidence that's making me to think like that...I'll go with reality.
    But how can I distinguish between confidence and overconfidence?
    well...in overconfidence you'll meet failures more often.
    But instead of quitting at what I do, I'll realize my problem and I'll try to lower my self esteem and continue doing it till I gain confidence.

    If it's a bad thing, then I'll definitely quit (at least I'll try)
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    May 02, 2013 11:19 AM GMT
    My life today is a complete contradiction of what used to be.

    The biggest challenge I face today is that love, the action, goes against everything I ever knew. I believed that love was just something I could use when I wanted to. I could use it as an apology. It was something that felt good as much as it felt bad which was a fun ride in itself. It was a way to control people through dishonesty and/or manipulation.

    Through taking responsibility, I had to unlearn the things that didn't work anymore. I was so full of self-pity and arrogance that I was horribly miserable-- just like the ones that taught me. My fault in it all? I couldn't see the truth, and the true disconnect would be that I still went on blaming others for my actions. Sometimes open-mindedness is so uncomfortable that we take the path of least resistance and remain blinded.

    I have freedom today.

    Oh and congratulations on making the decision to talk to your family about what it is you want and need.
  • thegaymessiah

    Posts: 214

    May 02, 2013 11:26 AM GMT
    He seemed conflicted honestly. And that he disliked being attracted to other men.

    I feel a little sorry for him. The world makes you feel that you aren't somebody until you have sex with the opposite sex. There's no sugarcoating that.
  • MikeW

    Posts: 6061

    May 02, 2013 1:27 PM GMT
    I'm having difficulty with your term "beliefs." I'm not sure but I think you're using the term to mean "core values." To me these are different. I'll explain.

    When I was a boy growing up I was very religious, southern Baptist to be precise. This in part was due to my family but not totally. What I mean is, the specific form of the belief system I was born into was southern Baptist with a bit of Pentecostal thrown in. There was a time, around age 10, 11, 12, where I carried a red letter New Testament with me every where I went, and I read it constantly. However, although this was the "form" I was given, the fact is I had my own deeply personal relationship with what some would call "spirituality." What the New Testament said to me, the meaning I found in it, was often at odds with what I was told it meant by adults around me.

    As a teenager and young adult I went through a lot of changes which included a rejection of all "religions" as such, what I'd been given to "believe". However, what I did not reject were my own "core values" such as the 'sacredness' of life, the value of honesty and integrity, etc.

    To me, "beliefs" are rather superficial. People belief all kinds of things that simply have no reality what ever. Most of us once believed in Santa, for example. There are some very interesting theories about where "Santa" came from as a belief system but suffice it to say that there is no jolly white bearded fat old man who magically sleighs around the world dropping gifts through chimneys on Christmas eve. That is a myth.

    However, beneath the myth or the childish belief system, there are truths that have to do with generosity and the joy of giving and receiving. There is real "magic" but most of the time we don't see it for what it is or, rather, how important it is. A smile, a kind word, an offer of assistance... these things can do magic in the real world when we let them.

    I don't know that I can go against my "core beliefs." If I could, it would have to be an extraordinary situation.

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    May 02, 2013 4:28 PM GMT
    Interesting. Hmmm....
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    May 02, 2013 6:37 PM GMT
    WaytoDawn saidI just read how pornstar Jake Genesis issued an apology for being in porn and is basically done with the industry. Personally, I really like the guy, not just his body, his attitude and sense of humor.

    One of the points he made, was that he was living life contradicting his own beliefs. This got me to wondering if this ever really happens, or if we change our beliefs when bad things happen. So here are my questions for you:

    Have you ever contradicted your own thoughts/words/beliefs/actions in some way?
    Was it a big or small contradiction?
    Does it matter if it's a small contradiction?
    Did you just change your beliefs afterwards or try to stay true?
    In all honesty did you change your beliefs because it was what you truly belived, or because you dealt with some sort of negative after effect.


    I realize no one is perfect, and everyone is hypocritical at one point or another. But I also realize that people claim to have beliefs, but sometimes just don't follow through with them. Other times, it isn't until bad things happen that they start staying true to their beliefs.

    For the most part, I stick to my beliefs. There have been times that I've strayed from my own beliefs and known it, but I still maintain my beliefs to a certain extent. But I also realize that beliefs, morals and words can change over time.

    So, what say you?


    You did what journalists call "burying the lead." You put the most important thing at the end, as if it were an afterthought.

    Intelligent, kind, gracious, intellectually honest people allow new information to shape the things they believe. When you stop learning, you stop living.
  • killercliche

    Posts: 948

    May 02, 2013 6:43 PM GMT
    WaytoDawn said But I also realize that beliefs, morals and words can change over time.

    So, what say you?


    Morals don't always, or maybe even usually, happily coexist. They have to be prioritized sometimes.

    An easy example: most people believe in honesty; most people believe in loyalty. What if a situation with your best friend/mother etc. forces you to be dishonest in order to protect him/her? Which do you hold more dearly: honesty or loyalty?

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    May 02, 2013 8:43 PM GMT
    Harry7785 saidHave you ever contradicted your own thoughts/words/beliefs/actions in some way?
    In all honesty did you change your beliefs because it was what you truly belived, or because you dealt with some sort of negative after effect.

    whether it is good or bad to me, I don't care because I believe only in truth and the truth has no contradiction.
    For eg: If I think I'm good at something, but in reality it is overconfidence that's making me to think like that...I'll go with reality.
    But how can I distinguish between confidence and overconfidence?
    well...in overconfidence you'll meet failures more often.
    But instead of quitting at what I do, I'll realize my problem and I'll try to lower my self esteem and continue doing it till I gain confidence.

    If it's a bad thing, then I'll definitely quit (at least I'll try)


    Not everything is set in stone. Some things are all based on perspective. And this really didnt answer the question.
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    May 02, 2013 8:46 PM GMT
    deltalimen saidMy life today is a complete contradiction of what used to be.

    The biggest challenge I face today is that love, the action, goes against everything I ever knew. I believed that love was just something I could use when I wanted to. I could use it as an apology. It was something that felt good as much as it felt bad which was a fun ride in itself. It was a way to control people through dishonesty and/or manipulation.

    Through taking responsibility, I had to unlearn the things that didn't work anymore. I was so full of self-pity and arrogance that I was horribly miserable-- just like the ones that taught me. My fault in it all? I couldn't see the truth, and the true disconnect would be that I still went on blaming others for my actions. Sometimes open-mindedness is so uncomfortable that we take the path of least resistance and remain blinded.

    I have freedom today.

    Oh and congratulations on making the decision to talk to your family about what it is you want and need.


    Thanks for the kind words. I guess in your case, you changed for the better. that happens when we learn from bad experiences.
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    May 02, 2013 8:49 PM GMT
    thegaymessiah saidHe seemed conflicted honestly. And that he disliked being attracted to other men.

    I feel a little sorry for him. The world makes you feel that you aren't somebody until you have sex with the opposite sex. There's no sugarcoating that.


    What makes you say that?

    Why would he become a porn star if he was unsure of his sexuality?
    I heard he had a bf before the pornstar thing. That makes me think he knew he was gay, and just regrets being a pornstar.
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    May 02, 2013 8:55 PM GMT
    shortbutsweet said
    WaytoDawn saidI just read how pornstar Jake Genesis issued an apology for being in porn and is basically done with the industry. Personally, I really like the guy, not just his body, his attitude and sense of humor.

    One of the points he made, was that he was living life contradicting his own beliefs. This got me to wondering if this ever really happens, or if we change our beliefs when bad things happen. So here are my questions for you:

    Have you ever contradicted your own thoughts/words/beliefs/actions in some way?
    Was it a big or small contradiction?
    Does it matter if it's a small contradiction?
    Did you just change your beliefs afterwards or try to stay true?
    In all honesty did you change your beliefs because it was what you truly belived, or because you dealt with some sort of negative after effect.


    I realize no one is perfect, and everyone is hypocritical at one point or another. But I also realize that people claim to have beliefs, but sometimes just don't follow through with them. Other times, it isn't until bad things happen that they start staying true to their beliefs.

    For the most part, I stick to my beliefs. There have been times that I've strayed from my own beliefs and known it, but I still maintain my beliefs to a certain extent. But I also realize that beliefs, morals and words can change over time.

    So, what say you?


    You did what journalists call "burying the lead." You put the most important thing at the end, as if it were an afterthought.

    Intelligent, kind, gracious, intellectually honest people allow new information to shape the things they believe. When you stop learning, you stop living.


    I could have said that earlier, but it makes no difference to the question im asking. Bad things happen. Sometimes they conflict with our views. Do we let things like this alter our views?
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    May 02, 2013 8:57 PM GMT
    killercliche said
    WaytoDawn said But I also realize that beliefs, morals and words can change over time.

    So, what say you?


    Morals don't always, or maybe even usually, happily coexist. They have to be prioritized sometimes.

    An easy example: most people believe in honesty; most people believe in loyalty. What if a situation with your best friend/mother etc. forces you to be dishonest in order to protect him/her? Which do you hold more dearly: honesty or loyalty?



    Interesting. But i guess we would have to prioritize our values if something like that happened.
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    May 02, 2013 9:03 PM GMT
    MikeW saidI'm having difficulty with your term "beliefs." I'm not sure but I think you're using the term to mean "core values." To me these are different. I'll explain.

    When I was a boy growing up I was very religious, southern Baptist to be precise. This in part was due to my family but not totally. What I mean is, the specific form of the belief system I was born into was southern Baptist with a bit of Pentecostal thrown in. There was a time, around age 10, 11, 12, where I carried a red letter New Testament with me every where I went, and I read it constantly. However, although this was the "form" I was given, the fact is I had my own deeply personal relationship with what some would call "spirituality." What the New Testament said to me, the meaning I found in it, was often at odds with what I was told it meant by adults around me.

    As a teenager and young adult I went through a lot of changes which included a rejection of all "religions" as such, what I'd been given to "believe". However, what I did not reject were my own "core values" such as the 'sacredness' of life, the value of honesty and integrity, etc.

    To me, "beliefs" are rather superficial. People belief all kinds of things that simply have no reality what ever. Most of us once believed in Santa, for example. There are some very interesting theories about where "Santa" came from as a belief system but suffice it to say that there is no jolly white bearded fat old man who magically sleighs around the world dropping gifts through chimneys on Christmas eve. That is a myth.

    However, beneath the myth or the childish belief system, there are truths that have to do with generosity and the joy of giving and receiving. There is real "magic" but most of the time we don't see it for what it is or, rather, how important it is. A smile, a kind word, an offer of assistance... these things can do magic in the real world when we let them.

    I don't know that I can go against my "core beliefs." If I could, it would have to be an extraordinary situation.



    I said beliefs, but i was talking more about morals or values. And im kinda the same, i dont think i could go against my beliefs unless it was something serious.
  • great_scott

    Posts: 519

    May 02, 2013 9:14 PM GMT
    Yeah, everyone contradicts themselves sometimes. I try to catch myself, but it still happens every now and then. Sometimes it helps to change my point of view or at least understand a different perspective, and other times it just lets me know how strongly I truly believe in what I believe. It's happened before and will happen again.
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    May 03, 2013 3:03 AM GMT
    WaytoDawn said
    shortbutsweet saidYou did what journalists call "burying the lead." You put the most important thing at the end, as if it were an afterthought.

    Intelligent, kind, gracious, intellectually honest people allow new information to shape the things they believe. When you stop learning, you stop living.


    I could have said that earlier, but it makes no difference to the question im asking. Bad things happen. Sometimes they conflict with our views. Do we let things like this alter our views?


    You'll have to be more specific, then, about what you mean by "bad things happen."
  • LJay

    Posts: 11612

    May 03, 2013 3:19 AM GMT
    Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds. -- Emerson
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    May 03, 2013 3:29 AM GMT
    i'm human so of course, i contradict myself. i try not to but it is what it is.
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    May 03, 2013 4:39 AM GMT
    WaytoDawn said
    Harry7785 said


    Not everything is set in stone. Some things are all based on perspective. And this really didnt answer the question.

    But the truth is solid, it doesn't change...even if you ask a Theoretical physicist they will say the same. "Information is never lost in the universe'
    could you elaborate more briefly on what you're looking for!
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    May 03, 2013 5:38 PM GMT
    shortbutsweet said
    WaytoDawn said
    shortbutsweet saidYou did what journalists call "burying the lead." You put the most important thing at the end, as if it were an afterthought.

    Intelligent, kind, gracious, intellectually honest people allow new information to shape the things they believe. When you stop learning, you stop living.


    I could have said that earlier, but it makes no difference to the question im asking. Bad things happen. Sometimes they conflict with our views. Do we let things like this alter our views?


    You'll have to be more specific, then, about what you mean by "bad things happen."


    Say you use drugs recreationally. You have no problem with them. Then one day, you overdose and end up in the hospital. Does that change your view on drugs?

    Say you as a gay man don't believe in abortions. Then some girl gets you drunk and uses you to get pregnant. She refuses to have an abortion, and gives you the option of either marrying her, or paying child support all your life?

    Say you don't believe in the death penalty. Then a gay basher kills your husband. You are filled with anger and revenge. Do you want the death penalty?

    My point is that people go through life changing events. Some people hold true to their values/beliefs, others don't. They change. But if you betrayed your beliefs once, then went back to believing in them, do you think it matters. Will it empower your beliefs? Where is the line drawn between fluidity of beliefs and hypocrasy?
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    May 03, 2013 5:43 PM GMT
    Harry7785 said
    WaytoDawn said
    Harry7785 said


    Not everything is set in stone. Some things are all based on perspective. And this really didnt answer the question.

    But the truth is solid, it doesn't change...even if you ask a Theoretical physicist they will say the same. "Information is never lost in the universe'
    could you elaborate more briefly on what you're looking for!


    I'm not asking on truth, I'm asking about values, morals and beliefs.

    Say you believe in sticking up for your friends. But then you find out a friend is being bullied. But you are too afraid to help. Does that then mean you need to change your views? If you defend your friends every other time beside this, are your morals still valid? If you never help/defend your friends, can you still say this about yourself? Where is the line drawn between hypocrisy and fluidity of belief?
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    May 04, 2013 1:07 AM GMT
    WaytoDawn said
    shortbutsweet said
    WaytoDawn said
    shortbutsweet saidYou did what journalists call "burying the lead." You put the most important thing at the end, as if it were an afterthought.

    Intelligent, kind, gracious, intellectually honest people allow new information to shape the things they believe. When you stop learning, you stop living.


    I could have said that earlier, but it makes no difference to the question im asking. Bad things happen. Sometimes they conflict with our views. Do we let things like this alter our views?


    You'll have to be more specific, then, about what you mean by "bad things happen."


    Say you use drugs recreationally. You have no problem with them. Then one day, you overdose and end up in the hospital. Does that change your view on drugs?

    Say you as a gay man don't believe in abortions. Then some girl gets you drunk and uses you to get pregnant. She refuses to have an abortion, and gives you the option of either marrying her, or paying child support all your life?

    Say you don't believe in the death penalty. Then a gay basher kills your husband. You are filled with anger and revenge. Do you want the death penalty?

    My point is that people go through life changing events. Some people hold true to their values/beliefs, others don't. They change. But if you betrayed your beliefs once, then went back to believing in them, do you think it matters. Will it empower your beliefs? Where is the line drawn between fluidity of beliefs and hypocrasy?


    Some people are moral relativists. For them, nothing can change their moral viewpoints, because they were never fixed in the first place.

    So you are talking about moral absolutists. Even the most moral among us are not capable of protecting our moral beliefs 100% of the time. People are human. They make mistakes.

    Having said that, life-changing events can cause you to re-evaluate your moral stance. That's why we call them "life-changing." Perhaps waking up in the hospital caused you to realize your prior ways were wrong. The point I made earlier is that good people recognize that they don't know everything and allow new information to challenge their old views.

    If you change your moral stance whenever it suits you -- as in other of your examples -- then you are simply a moral relativist.
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    May 04, 2013 5:18 AM GMT
    WaytoDawn said
    Harry7785 said
    WaytoDawn said
    Harry7785 said

    Not everything is set in stone. Some things are all based on perspective. And this really didnt answer the question.

    But the truth is solid, it doesn't change...even if you ask a Theoretical physicist they will say the same. "Information is never lost in the universe'
    could you elaborate more briefly on what you're looking for!


    I'm not asking on truth, I'm asking about values, morals and beliefs.
    Say you believe in sticking up for your friends. But then you find out a friend is being bullied. But you are too afraid to help. Does that then mean you need to change your views? If you defend your friends every other time beside this, are your morals still valid? If you never help/defend your friends, can you still say this about yourself? Where is the line drawn between hypocrisy and fluidity of belief?


    Okay, when it comes to me, I believe in truth(to me, Truth is not only just a collection of facts, but also about what's the right thing to do in a moral way)
    So, for example if my friend is being bullied, I'll not only defend him/her when they are in danger but also make the person strong enough to defend himself/herself when the person is bullied again.
    If I never defend my friend, it means that I don't follow my beliefs which is an insult to myself by myself. So, if I'm a coward I will run away...but I'm not. So, I'll strengthen my courage first.

    If you believe in something, that something should give you courage to follow it. If it's not giving courage to you...then it means...'you believe it but don't have enough confidence in it which also mean you don't believe in it'
    So, to me the line between hypocrisy and fluidity of belief is having confidence, will power, trust in your belief and most important of all 'Courage'.
  • imbrad

    Posts: 377

    May 04, 2013 5:58 AM GMT
    I am a gay-Christian-liberal-republican. Talk about enigma. It's a frustrating contradiction but if you must label things... that's what it is. The way I think and feel fall into many categories and it's not easy.

    I can (and have) explained these contradictions to many people (usually successfully). It is important to understand that people do NOT fall easily into labels. We are unique and have many different views and more importantly cognative processes we use to approach those views.

    Our views do not negate the views of another person, we are all trying to figure this life out together. Learning new perspectives is something that helps us in that path. Sharing new perspectives is something that helps us learn.