"All American Boy" has an important hidden message

  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Jul 11, 2013 3:50 PM GMT
    With all of the articulate and passionate praise and criticism of Steve Grand's "All American Boy" music video, I think a very important aspect of this piece has been overlooked. There is a very important lesson in this video for straight guys that are hit on by gay guys; be a good guy about it. The way the "All American Boy" responds to Steve Grand's skinny dip kiss is subtle, but brilliant; he puts his arm around him as if saying, "it's cool. We're good." And yes, the most homophobic of homophobes will not get this far into the video to see this scene. But those straight brothers who are open minded and evolved will view this exchange as reinforcement of the perspective that we are all indeed brothers, and even if you're not interested in someone else's sexual advance, just smile and take it for what it is, a compliment from a fellow human being.
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    Jul 11, 2013 3:57 PM GMT
    Interestingly, I was explaining to a gay friendly, hot young guy the other day that he should be kind if an "older" gay man hits on him because gay men of a certain generation aren't used to straight guys being so nice and can misinterpret their signals.
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    Jul 11, 2013 4:08 PM GMT
    One of my gay mates took our mutual straight mate to a gay sauna once. The straight didn't believe such a place existed. He was hit on by a guy - obviously. My mate calmly removed the guy's hand from his own knee and said "no thank you". How lovely. So proud of my straight mate.
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    Jul 11, 2013 5:09 PM GMT
    angrygarbagestateresident saidi think you're confused about everything. for one, most straight dudes wouldn't skinny dip with another guy for that matter and most people would agree that two dudes skinny dipping will likely imply that neither of them are straight. two, it's basic decency as a human being. look @ like this, if you tried what you said with a woman, that would be sexual harassment. so i don't agree at all with your motion of telling some straight guy to be nice about sexual advances whenever you feel like sexually harassing him. i just think it's weird how some gay guys think there's nothing wrong with sexually harassing another guy or throwing advances at random dudes they like but will cop an attitude if the "wrong" guy does the same thing to them. it's basic courtesy.


    A therapist could make a fortune off that.

    Here's the pro bono.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_harassment
    Sexual harassment is bullying or coercion of a sexual nature, or the unwelcome or inappropriate promise of rewards in exchange for sexual favors.

    Life is not the workplace.

    Being sexual is being human. Being human is not sexual harassment.

    That you don't want sex with someone who wants sex with you is an annoyance--and often to both parties, haha--not a sexual harassment.

    Not taking no for an answer might be a violation and I say "might" because some like to be chased. But unless you know the other person is already in a commitment, than the only thing that putting forth the proposition violates is the other person's overly inflated ego or delusional sense of righteousness.

    polls_S920_NO_SIGN_4547_930260_answer_3_
  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Jul 11, 2013 5:19 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    angrygarbagestateresident saidi think you're confused about everything. for one, most straight dudes wouldn't skinny dip with another guy for that matter and most people would agree that two dudes skinny dipping will likely imply that neither of them are straight. two, it's basic decency as a human being. look @ like this, if you tried what you said with a woman, that would be sexual harassment. so i don't agree at all with your motion of telling some straight guy to be nice about sexual advances whenever you feel like sexually harassing him. i just think it's weird how some gay guys think there's nothing wrong with sexually harassing another guy or throwing advances at random dudes they like but will cop an attitude if the "wrong" guy does the same thing to them. it's basic courtesy.


    A therapist could make a fortune off that.

    Here's the pro bono.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_harassment
    Sexual harassment is bullying or coercion of a sexual nature, or the unwelcome or inappropriate promise of rewards in exchange for sexual favors.

    Life is not the workplace.

    Being sexual is being human. Being human is not sexual harassment.

    That you don't want sex with someone who wants sex with you is an annoyance--and often to both parties, haha--not a sexual harassment.

    Not taking no for an answer might be a violation and I say "might" because some like to be chased. But unless you know the other person is already in a commitment, than the only thing that putting forth the proposition violates is the other person's overly inflated ego or delusional sense of righteousness.

    polls_S920_NO_SIGN_4547_930260_answer_3_

    Thank you. I had no idea where he was coming from. And in addition to what you said, I know plenty of straight guys who skinny dip, and hot tub, and hang out together naked. It feels good and isn't something that only gay guys can enjoy.
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    Jul 11, 2013 5:42 PM GMT
    I just watched the video, and this is exactly what I intended to post on the other thread about it.

    Nice catch!

    +1
    yogadudeSEATTLE saidWith all of the articulate and passionate praise and criticism of Steve Grand's "All American Boy" music video, I think a very important aspect of this piece has been overlooked. There is a very important lesson in this video for straight guys that are hit on by gay guys; be a good guy about it. The way the "All American Boy" responds to Steve Grand's skinny dip kiss is subtle, but brilliant; he puts his arm around him as if saying, "it's cool. We're good." And yes, the most homophobic of homophobes will not get this far into the video to see this scene. But those straight brothers who are open minded and evolved will view this exchange as reinforcement of the perspective that we are all indeed brothers, and even if you're not interested in someone else's sexual advance, just smile and take it for what it is, a compliment from a fellow human being.
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    Jul 11, 2013 5:50 PM GMT
    The hidden message I'm seeing is... if you smoke and drink hard liquor 24/7, you TOO can have a rockin' body like these two guys.
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    Jul 11, 2013 6:00 PM GMT
    I was raised in Bedford Stuyvesant Brooklyn and normally straight guys did not hang out naked together.

    However, when I joined the boy scouts with other boys in my community we did go camping, and it was there that I found that straight guys seemed to like to swim naked in ponds and lakes.

    I was actually more embarrassed than the straight guys. They were all absolutely comfortable hanging out naked because there was no sexual tension between them. For them it seemed quite liberating. The group was also a mix of Latinos, Blacks, and whites.

    I happen to know many straight guys in the military who have similar stories of skinny dipping. Usually it occurs when there is a secluded area to swim. My own brothers have also done it, and none of them are gay.


    angrygarbagestateresident said
    just because it's the norm in the gay community for two guys to chill out naked DOESN'T mean that it's the norm in the straight community. you say plenty of straight guys hang out naked let alone or trying to see another man naked. maybe where you're from BUT where i'm from, most straight dudes aren't doing that. it's just not the norm or something that is socially acceptable. maybe the folks that like to joke around about being gay, are comfortable about themselves and don't care about what other people think and all BUT that's about it.

    just saying, most straight people view something as two guys running around naked skinny dipping or being in a hot tub as being homoerotic or gay so to take something from a video that pertains to a fantasy of a gay man and saying that it's an important message wouldn't fly. if you said this to most straight people, they would tell you that you're putting them in an uncomfortable position. some of like a straight female forcing herself onto a gay guy.
  • madsexy

    Posts: 4843

    Jul 11, 2013 6:02 PM GMT
    angrygarbagestateresident saidi think you're confused about everything. for one, most straight dudes wouldn't skinny dip with another guy for that matter and most people would agree that two dudes skinny dipping will likely imply that neither of them are straight. two, it's basic decency as a human being. look @ like this, if you tried what you said with a woman, that would be sexual harassment. so i don't agree at all with your motion of telling some straight guy to be nice about sexual advances whenever you feel like sexually harassing him. i just think it's weird how some gay guys think there's nothing wrong with sexually harassing another guy or throwing advances at random dudes they like but will cop an attitude if the "wrong" guy does the same thing to them. it's basic courtesy.

    You're flippin' nuts! You never skinny-dipped in a lake with your male friends? You're probably the only one. That's the entire point - if you're not homophobic or if you're not afraid of being outted, it's just stuff guys do. And "sexual harassment" without the harassment is just a pass and a miss. And the OP's point about being decent is totally valid and very timely. There's nothing wrong with an attempt, and the gay guy didn't push it or make the other guy uncomfortable. I'm betting if you think making a pass is sexual harassment that you don't get laid much! icon_lol.gif
  • PR_GMR

    Posts: 3831

    Jul 11, 2013 6:07 PM GMT
    madsexy said
    angrygarbagestateresident saidi think you're confused about everything. for one, most straight dudes wouldn't skinny dip with another guy for that matter and most people would agree that two dudes skinny dipping will likely imply that neither of them are straight. two, it's basic decency as a human being. look @ like this, if you tried what you said with a woman, that would be sexual harassment. so i don't agree at all with your motion of telling some straight guy to be nice about sexual advances whenever you feel like sexually harassing him. i just think it's weird how some gay guys think there's nothing wrong with sexually harassing another guy or throwing advances at random dudes they like but will cop an attitude if the "wrong" guy does the same thing to them. it's basic courtesy.

    You're flippin' nuts! You never skinny-dipped in a lake with your male friends? You're probably the only one. That's the entire point - if you're not homophobic or if you're not afraid of being outted, it's just stuff guys do. And "sexual harassment" without the harassment is just a pass and a miss. And the OP's point about being decent is totally valid and very timely. There's nothing wrong with an attempt, and the gay guy didn't push it or make the other guy uncomfortable. I'm betting if you think making a pass is sexual harassment that you don't get laid much! icon_lol.gif


    He's indeed flipping nuts.. And he's never had gay sex. Disregard everything that comes out of Pazzy's mouth. He needs serious therapy.
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    Jul 11, 2013 6:08 PM GMT
    yogadudeSEATTLE saidThank you. I had no idea where he was coming from. And in addition to what you said, I know plenty of straight guys who skinny dip, and hot tub, and hang out together naked. It feels good and isn't something that only gay guys can enjoy.


    Are you flirting with me?
  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Jul 11, 2013 6:12 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    yogadudeSEATTLE saidThank you. I had no idea where he was coming from. And in addition to what you said, I know plenty of straight guys who skinny dip, and hot tub, and hang out together naked. It feels good and isn't something that only gay guys can enjoy.


    Are you flirting with me?

    Yes. And now lets drink some whiskey, rip off our clothes, and jump in a lake so I can lay one on you, dude. icon_wink.gif
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    Jul 11, 2013 6:12 PM GMT
    eagermuscle saidInterestingly, I was explaining to a gay friendly, hot young guy the other day that he should be kind if an "older" gay man hits on him because gay men of a certain generation aren't used to straight guys being so nice and can misinterpret their signals.
    icon_idea.gif

    Being naked with men used to be normal until the 1970's when the sexual revolution ironically made getting naked abnormal or sexual. High School phys Ed swimming used to be naked where I grew up.

    I recently had a frat dude who I knew was "curious" shockingly get sexual with me . Until this happen I thought sex with a straight dude was a gay fantasy. This is a younger / older deal as well. He is always discrete about it . He does not speak about it openly. I ve had to learn his code words. It's kinda cute.
  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Jul 11, 2013 6:26 PM GMT
    Alpha13 said
    eagermuscle saidInterestingly, I was explaining to a gay friendly, hot young guy the other day that he should be kind if an "older" gay man hits on him because gay men of a certain generation aren't used to straight guys being so nice and can misinterpret their signals.
    icon_idea.gif

    Being naked with men used to be normal until the 1970's when the sexual revolution ironically made getting naked abnormal or sexual. High School phys Ed swimming used to be naked where I grew up.

    I recently had a frat dude who I knew was "curious" shockingly get sexual with me . Until this happen I thought sex with a straight dude was a gay fantasy. This is a younger / older deal as well. He is always discrete about it . He does not speak about it openly. I ve had to learn his code words. It's kinda cute.

    Yes. Things are changing and I think this video is a deep, honest, and yes, imperfect (but what isn't?) representation of this forward movement.
  • madsexy

    Posts: 4843

    Jul 11, 2013 6:38 PM GMT
    angrygarbagestateresident said
    PR_GMR said
    madsexy said
    angrygarbagestateresident saidi think you're confused about everything. for one, most straight dudes wouldn't skinny dip with another guy for that matter and most people would agree that two dudes skinny dipping will likely imply that neither of them are straight. two, it's basic decency as a human being. look @ like this, if you tried what you said with a woman, that would be sexual harassment. so i don't agree at all with your motion of telling some straight guy to be nice about sexual advances whenever you feel like sexually harassing him. i just think it's weird how some gay guys think there's nothing wrong with sexually harassing another guy or throwing advances at random dudes they like but will cop an attitude if the "wrong" guy does the same thing to them. it's basic courtesy.

    You're flippin' nuts! You never skinny-dipped in a lake with your male friends? You're probably the only one. That's the entire point - if you're not homophobic or if you're not afraid of being outted, it's just stuff guys do. And "sexual harassment" without the harassment is just a pass and a miss. And the OP's point about being decent is totally valid and very timely. There's nothing wrong with an attempt, and the gay guy didn't push it or make the other guy uncomfortable. I'm betting if you think making a pass is sexual harassment that you don't get laid much! icon_lol.gif


    He's indeed flipping nuts.. And he's never had gay sex. Disregard everything that comes out of Pazzy's mouth. He needs serious therapy.


    what does sex have to do with this? it's about being respecting others around you. if you like a guy and want to know if he's gay, ask him. it's so simple. no need to get him drunk, put him in an awkward position such as luring him into some stream room then forcing yourself on him and expecting him to be friendly towards you afterwards like "we're cool. i'm not gay". where do you guys come from thinking that this is normal and acceptable behavior? that's some sexual deviant, rapist shit.

    If you think that's rape and/or sexual deviancy, then we've found another guy who must not get laid much!
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    Jul 11, 2013 6:38 PM GMT
    yogadudeSEATTLE said
    theantijock said
    yogadudeSEATTLE saidThank you. I had no idea where he was coming from. And in addition to what you said, I know plenty of straight guys who skinny dip, and hot tub, and hang out together naked. It feels good and isn't something that only gay guys can enjoy.


    Are you flirting with me?

    Yes. And now lets drink some whiskey, rip off our clothes, and jump in a lake so I can lay one on you, dude. icon_wink.gif


    I am so turned on right now that I'm going to forget you are in an open relationship and imagine that it could have been me. (You're Jewish right?)
  • madsexy

    Posts: 4843

    Jul 11, 2013 6:39 PM GMT
    Aside from all the absurd idiocy in some of these posts, the OP is great and on point, and I liked the song, maybe because it's not heavy country but light country, despite its more technical imperfections and FOR THE MESSAGE.
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    Jul 11, 2013 6:43 PM GMT
    yogadudeSEATTLE said
    theantijock said
    yogadudeSEATTLE saidThank you. I had no idea where he was coming from. And in addition to what you said, I know plenty of straight guys who skinny dip, and hot tub, and hang out together naked. It feels good and isn't something that only gay guys can enjoy.


    Are you flirting with me?

    Yes. And now lets drink some whiskey, rip off our clothes, and jump in a lake so I can lay one on you, dude. icon_wink.gif


    My word! *fans self*

    icon_wink.gif

    ...methinks Bill and I shall go a'skinnydipping forthwith.

    icon_lol.gif
  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Jul 11, 2013 6:57 PM GMT
    Sharpton saidI truly wonder how many gays feel this way about feminine or non-mainstream guys hitting on them like Steve did. None I would presume.

    The message in the video is not about how we "feel." It's about how we respond to one another. Whether you are into someone else or not, it is important that we treat others the same way we would want to be treated. To me, this video beautifully depicts the kind and compassionate way to respond to a friendly (and harmless) advance.
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    Jul 11, 2013 6:57 PM GMT
    angrygarbagestateresident saidwhat does sex have to do with this? it's about being respecting others around you. if you like a guy and want to know if he's gay, ask him. it's so simple. no need to get him drunk, put him in an awkward position such as luring him into some stream room then forcing yourself on him and expecting him to be friendly towards you afterwards like "we're cool. i'm not gay". where do you guys come from thinking that this is normal and acceptable behavior? that's some sexual deviant, rapist shit.


    Please provide us with the @min:sec of the vid so that we can view the deviant rape scene you saw.

    Because all we saw was flirting and then the fruition of the flirt when the flirting was not rejected even if then the fruition was denied. You might have seen Nessy, but all we saw were two innocent people having naked fun in a lake.

    And news flash: had the guy gone for just sex first and not hesitated with romance there might have been a whole different ending to that story. Oh, but that would have been perverted because it's sex. Ewwww. Sex.

    Meanwhile, one of my grade school friends who I used to play with as a kid but who then went off to live a str8 life is just now coming out as bisexual in his 50s. So I guess as kids that wasn't just me, huh?
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    Jul 11, 2013 6:57 PM GMT
    Accidentally answered the wrong question before.

    I've definitely had awkward situations like this with guys and girls who were not my type. I don't see why anyone should be insulted or upset by an innocent kiss.

    I don't personally have a problem with feminine guys, not sure what you mean by non-mainstream though.

    Sharpton saidI truly wonder how many gays feel this way about feminine or non-mainstream guys hitting on them like Steve did. None I would presume.
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    Jul 11, 2013 7:04 PM GMT
    I don't think a homophobe like the ones that change under a towel at the gym or the ones who would never change at the gym would ever want to see or hear the video. I've run across many homophobes that don't even want to see 2 guys arm in arm let alone looking at another guy.
  • groundcombat

    Posts: 945

    Jul 11, 2013 7:06 PM GMT
    CowPunk saidWell, I don't know about you, but when I was working a cattle ranch in the summer when i was in high school sometime 2,3 4 or 5 of us would go skinny dipping in the stock tank (which was more like a pond, for those who don't know) after work. We generally didn't run around with our swimsuits in the truck. My brother and I used to skinny dip in the creek behind the house. Maybe it's cultural, but I never equated it with the way gay guys might hang around in a sauna.
    I think it's easy from a different age/environment perspective to try to interpret too much from a summer swim.


    Truth. While I wouldn't say EVERY straight guy I know is comfortable skinny dipping with other dudes, I wouldn't call it that unheard of either. I find it to depend on the circumstances.
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    Jul 11, 2013 7:16 PM GMT
    angrygarbagestateresident said

    icon_rolleyes.gif flirting as in kissing?

    and if anything, the lesson from the video is to leave closeted men or guys you know that are straight alone. don't go climbing up the tree trying to chase the forbidden fruit then be all sad when you don't get it. that's just the way it is.

    i don't know where you guys think that you can go about throwing sexual advances @ folks and tell them to not get offended and to be flattered. there's a difference between telling someone "i like you and want to go out on a date with you" and telling someone "i want to fuck you. let me cum all over you" especially someone who you don't know like that. the world is NOT like grindr or any dating applications.


    The kiss was the fruition, as I said. Up until then it was flirting and the flirting was encouraged. Lots of str8 guys do that to us. Many of them love the attention and the power that gives them even when they won't admit it. It's real fucking obvious if you just look at it. Have you no real relationships by which to judge all this?

    You are so afraid of sex it's scary. Humans are sexual beings. Maybe you have trouble drawing boundaries and so you put out a great big one to make sure you don't cross a line. I don't know your personal issues. But I do know you need counseling about this. You're denying yourself a wonderful part of life.
  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Jul 11, 2013 7:25 PM GMT
    bradomo saidI don't think a homophobe like the ones that change under a towel at the gym or the ones who would never change at the gym would ever want to see or hear the video. I've run across many homophobes that don't even want to see 2 guys arm in arm let alone looking at another guy.

    Bradomo....here is a more logical response to your contribution to this thread. At the very beginning of the thread I make mention of the fact that guys who are deeply homophobic would not watch the video through to its conclusion, and therefore not see the way the straight dude responds to the gay dudes' advance. Even if they did, a video is not going to change these guys minds.

    But guys that are open minded will see this, and this will reinforce what they are probably already knowing; that everyone deserves to be treated with kindness and compassion, and this will give them the courage to live their lives responding in this way.

    As more and more people begin to view life from this perspective it will eventually make its way into the lives of the truly homophobic. They will not have to see it modeled in a video. They will see it being reflected and lived in the world all around them. This is what will help to open and change their minds; the behavior of other straight men in their lives.