Latent Homo in Need of Dating Advice

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 08, 2008 11:16 PM GMT
    Hey guys. I'm a nice guy—decent looking, in good shape, successful in life and career. I'm in my 40's, having been married for a long while and with three young adult children (the youngest is 17 and she lives with me).

    I'm posting anonymously because I feel a little embarrassed about this topic. I guess I am relatively new to dating men, and am having some conflicting feelings about my position in life these days. I have no trouble meeting men, and most are good-looking, seem pretty nice and so forth. I don't have to look very hard to get a date, this usually happens pretty easily. But getting one to stick around is tough and I'm beginning to see a pattern: once we have sex it's over. Now maybe I'm a lousy lover, but I hope that's not the case. Jesus, I really hope that's not the case. icon_sad.gif

    I'll give you an example. Last week I met a guy online and we had a drink together. Nothing happened between us but I could tell he was interested in me. Yesterday we met for an exhibition and he sidled up close to me the whole time we were together in the museum. We took a walk and I invited him back to my place. We kissed, things got warmed up and then we undressed each other. Eventually, we had sex. I enjoyed it and thought he did too. We made plans to run together in the park this morning. We were supposed to meet at 10:00 am so I took off at 9:30 to meet him there. No sign of him. Like a fucking idiot I waited for 20 minutes, then finished the run on my own. When I got home there was a message on my cell, delivered at 10:07 (after our agreed upon meeting time) saying he wasn't up for a run. Later he caught me online. No apology, just a message saying he sent me the text and that he hadn't been able to get out of bed to run. I let it go, because I didn't want to expend any more energy by scolding him for his lack of consideration, and I just said I had things to do. I am really toughening up with this cascade of disappointments. I guess he didn't just ditch me outright, but I took his lack of consideration as a true sign that either he wasn't interested enough and/or that he was definitely not for me.

    It feels as if there's an endless parade of self-centered assholes coming my way (how's that for a scary image? icon_lol.gif ) and I'm feeling a little ground down by it. I'm not looking for the love of my life—just someone who might enjoy my company for more than a quick shag and who may take an interest in getting to know me.

    I know it's impossible to get any concrete answers or advice with such minimal information, but I guess I'm wondering if this is a common problem. And is this unique to gay men? I keep turning it over in my mind, trying to understand what I am doing wrong. Maybe it's the fact that my daughter lives with me. Maybe the age difference bugs these guys (most are at least 6 years younger than I). Maybe I'm expecting too much and I should simply say "the line forms here fellas—who's first?"

    I have a date with another guy tomorrow—just a chance to meet and take a walk—to get to know one another. But I am almost prepared to cancel it rather than face another disappointment. He's 10 years younger than me, professes to prefer guys my age, and appears to be a decent guy. But I'm getting pretty cynical and I'm prepared for the worst. Sounds pretty pathetic, I know.

    In any case, I'd like to hear if others have the same problem. Or if you're the kind of guy who is reluctant to dedicate your attention to someone like me, then why is that the case?

    Thanks
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Nov 08, 2008 11:22 PM GMT
    It's my opinion that if you are looking for a relationship, then having sex too soon sends mixed signals. If you ware looking to date, then go on more than one before letting him into the cookie jar. Be upfront about wanting to take things slow.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 08, 2008 11:31 PM GMT
    After reading what happened to you I will say you are not alone in that fact. In my more naive days I would give guys the benefit of the doubt or try to think better for them that they can't be that self-centered but sadly its common.

    I dont konw if it hardwired into our genetics or just part of the gay culture that we have to keep looking for something better, which in the long run gets us nowhere.

    The best thing I can tell you is to tough it out like I did. There is alot of shit you have to shine before you find the diamond in the rough, or at least someone who isnt a total flake

    Now I hope Im not coming across as bitter in this post but I did have to take a break from dating for a good part of this year because of a sitaution like you faced but Ive learned from my mistakes and better things are happening now and Im certain they will for you
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 08, 2008 11:59 PM GMT
    I think this happens quite abit. I'm going to have to say that most guys are just looking for a quick hookup, especially online. They don't have to get emotionally involved. This seems to be the trend in my past.
    If you want something more than put it out there.

    What I always say (used to say), 'I slept with him because I wasn't interested.'

    You fuck someone right away when you aren't interested. I told a guy once, 'I didn't sleep with you right away because I like you.'
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 09, 2008 12:19 AM GMT
    Well, I certainly feel for you.

    Dating is not easy, and I guess when people get frustrated or burned out enough, they stop caring and they decide to just fuck around with guys rather than repeatedly risking getting their hearts broken.

    Lately, I've tried dating and it hasn't gone that well. Now, I'm not an asshole... and I am reasonable about what I expect from people in terms of contact. I am also not crazy and I dont text message every five minutes (or even every three days), because I dont want to scare people away. I try to strike that 'balance' of showing interest while giving personal space.....

    I have a good personality, I treat people well and I am not an idiot..... I'm good looking enough to get a date...or so I thought....

    Anyway, my point is... don't get disappointed too quickly. Remember the old phase, "good things come to those who wait". Well I think its true! Sometimes its frustrating when you are looking for an LTR, and you get nothing but guys who are just trying to get in your pants.

    This is also an important point that others have mentioned.... Physical stuff is important... but if you do it too soon, most guys will assume that its a meaningless hookup.

    I made the mistake once of hooking up with a guy (not even sex) after a few too many drinks at a bar/ after party, after having spent the entire day with him preparing for a show. The next morning we cuddled and talked, and he seemed a really sweet guy.... Not to mention absolutely gorgeous and seemingly grounded, smart, well-adjusted and goal oriented. Later that morning he dropped me to my car and he made sure to get my number, saying that "we should definitely hang out soon." Now, I had mentally prepared myself to just go our separate ways and let that be that. But he got my hopes up with that comment. A few days later I messaged him and asked if he wanted to hang out. No response. My question: WHY WOULD YOU SAY THAT IF YOU HAVE NO DESIRE TO HANG OUT!? I dont do that to people, and I wouldnt say anything besides "hey, it was nice to meet you"... if i had no intent on hanging out with them later on.

    What did I learn? People talk a lot. It's important to stay grounded and not have your head in the clouds too much. Its fine to have some hope, but dont let your expectations or hopes run too free because, especially in the gay world... people will trample on them and you will end up disappointed.

    At the end of the day though, I think the old saying about kissing toads in order to find your prince.... probably true.

    Keep your head up and lock away the goods for a while, until you've established a good connection with said person. You have to make them work for it.... icon_smile.gif
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Nov 09, 2008 3:19 AM GMT
    I'd suggest holding off sex until you're secure in the relationship. Take it slower.
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Nov 09, 2008 5:08 AM GMT
    Coupla things that are going on....

    You're new to the "gay" life so you're diving into the deep end without a lifeguard and there are Sharks in them thar waters

    Don't jump into bed right away with these guys if you want more than Just sex
    also try and meet men in situations that are more than just sexual
    other than dating and online
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 09, 2008 5:16 AM GMT
    Where are you meeting these people?

    Many men who would be interested in a man who has a former straight life (a perceived orientation and could very well not apply to you) might be looking for a quick fuck under the noble guise of meeting a gentleman for a date.

    So, where are you meeting these people? That isn't rhetorical. If you are meeting them online your odds of landing a compatible person than if you meet them in person through some social group of function.

    Further, what are you sincerely looking for? If you keep landing these guys it could be an indication that you are actually looking for something you don't believe you want.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 09, 2008 5:46 AM GMT
    Thanks very much for these thoughtful comments and for taking so much time to reply. I really appreciate the advice, which seems to be consistent with what I assumed was part of the problem.

    Where am I meeting these people? With the exception of one guy, I have met them all online and I think you're saying something of relevance (Munching Zombie) when you say that I may actually be looking for something I don't think I want. I'm healthy and horny and I am interested in sex, of course. That said, I also would like to have sex with the same person, more than once. That doesn't seem too farfetched, but I think you're all right in saying it's too much, too fast. The best sex for me has always been has after reaching a comfort/confidence level that only comes with knowing another person. At least that's the way it is for me.

    One problem I have is the social dimension of meeting men. I am a little shy when it comes to sending out the proper signals (ie.: I have cruddy gaydar) so online has always included some certainty that the men are actually gay. I guess my late start in life after years of deliberately trying to avoid sending and receiving signals of this sort slows me down a little in social circumstances. But I live in a big European city where there's plenty to do so I shouldn't have trouble finding out where to go to increase the likelihood of meeting interesting people. I just need to work on it, I guess. The lesson here is that if I'm meeting people on websites which are predicated on the possibility of sexual contact, that's what's going to happen. Duh. I'm very sexually charged, but I will need to reign it in a little. Yikes. Easier said than done. icon_lol.gif

    I don't go to bars and clubs because I feel a bit out of place (age, etc) and I generally can't stand the music and atmosphere in those places. I think I should check out some other places and things to do: openings, cultural events, etc.

    Hell, I have a lot to learn, that much is certain. Thanks again and if there are further insights please keep them coming. I appreciate this dialogue.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 09, 2008 6:54 AM GMT
    namelessforthis saidHey guys. I'm a nice guy—decent looking, in good shape, successful in life and career. I'm in my 40's, having been married for a long while and with three young adult children (the youngest is 17 and she lives with me).

    I'm posting anonymously because I feel a little embarrassed about this topic. I guess I am relatively new to dating men, and am having some conflicting feelings about my position in life these days. I have no trouble meeting men, and most are good-looking, seem pretty nice and so forth. I don't have to look very hard to get a date, this usually happens pretty easily. But getting one to stick around is tough and I'm beginning to see a pattern: once we have sex it's over. Now maybe I'm a lousy lover, but I hope that's not the case. Jesus, I really hope that's not the case. icon_sad.gif

    I'll give you an example. Last week I met a guy online and we had a drink together. Nothing happened between us but I could tell he was interested in me. Yesterday we met for an exhibition and he sidled up close to me the whole time we were together in the museum. We took a walk and I invited him back to my place. We kissed, things got warmed up and then we undressed each other. Eventually, we had sex. I enjoyed it and thought he did too. We made plans to run together in the park this morning. We were supposed to meet at 10:00 am so I took off at 9:30 to meet him there. No sign of him. Like a fucking idiot I waited for 20 minutes, then finished the run on my own. When I got home there was a message on my cell, delivered at 10:07 (after our agreed upon meeting time) saying he wasn't up for a run. Later he caught me online. No apology, just a message saying he sent me the text and that he hadn't been able to get out of bed to run. I let it go, because I didn't want to expend any more energy by scolding him for his lack of consideration, and I just said I had things to do. I am really toughening up with this cascade of disappointments. I guess he didn't just ditch me outright, but I took his lack of consideration as a true sign that either he wasn't interested enough and/or that he was definitely not for me.

    It feels as if there's an endless parade of self-centered assholes coming my way (how's that for a scary image? icon_lol.gif ) and I'm feeling a little ground down by it. I'm not looking for the love of my life—just someone who might enjoy my company for more than a quick shag and who may take an interest in getting to know me.

    I know it's impossible to get any concrete answers or advice with such minimal information, but I guess I'm wondering if this is a common problem. And is this unique to gay men? I keep turning it over in my mind, trying to understand what I am doing wrong. Maybe it's the fact that my daughter lives with me. Maybe the age difference bugs these guys (most are at least 6 years younger than I). Maybe I'm expecting too much and I should simply say "the line forms here fellas—who's first?"

    I have a date with another guy tomorrow—just a chance to meet and take a walk—to get to know one another. But I am almost prepared to cancel it rather than face another disappointment. He's 10 years younger than me, professes to prefer guys my age, and appears to be a decent guy. But I'm getting pretty cynical and I'm prepared for the worst. Sounds pretty pathetic, I know.

    In any case, I'd like to hear if others have the same problem. Or if you're the kind of guy who is reluctant to dedicate your attention to someone like me, then why is that the case?

    Thanks


    Oh... welcome to the gay world.. icon_lol.gif

    Sorry cuz I also had this kind of thing and my bestfriend showed me this

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 09, 2008 12:43 PM GMT
    OK, an update for anyone who's intrigued by this cascade of bullshit!

    The first guy is still chatting me up on MSN, albeit with the attention of Narcissus. He's forever preoccupied with some other pursuits during our "conversations" so chatting with him is a little like chatting with a log. I think he's simply careless and self-centered, so not the type of guy I would like to have around. Case closed.

    Bt here's the kicker: the second guy I mentioned—the one I was supposed to meet for a walk—stood me up! First time in my life, and I accept this as a fortuitous sign that I need to lay low for a while and focus on work or some other productive pursuits.

    A pretty revealing few days, all told. icon_smile.gif




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    Nov 09, 2008 12:59 PM GMT
    What does your circle of gay friends (in real life, not online) look like at this point? I do not date right now b/c I am simply not emotionally mature enough yet. This does not mean I am immature they way it may typically be thought of, but I need to learn and understand the dynamics of the gay world. I may have had the slowest coming out process of anyone on RJ, lol, but to each out own.

    I have a decent group of gay friends, some hot and some, well, they are mostly hot which is nice : ) I actually consider their friendships as a long term dating thing in a bizarre way. I made it very clear that i am looking for friends and not hook-ups (although I just added hook-ups to my RJ profile b/c I felt daring, ha ha). I've read threads abut how it is impossible for gay men to be friends w/o sex, etc., and that is BS. Stand your ground, take a few months and build friendships with some gay guys and then date outside of that circle using the advice from above on this thread and I think you'll be a happier man.
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    Nov 09, 2008 2:18 PM GMT
    Not sure the timeline involved here, but it sounds like you're bouncing between guys very quickly. If so, I'd say slow down - take more than a conversation online (or even two) to meet someone. Then when you do, if it's someone you think you'd want to date, don't hop into bed on the first date. Keep the focus on getting to know the person with his clothes on. Another possibility is that you're trying way too hard to connect with someone or "force" something happening too quickly. If that is true, gay or straight, most often the object of your attention can be scared off. Again, these are thoughts based on the limited information, but I'd say relax, be yourself, and take time to develop relationships. Do you have any gay friends? If not, maybe start there.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 09, 2008 2:33 PM GMT
    Again, thanks for these cogent replies. A lot of good advice here.

    Yep, I am moving too fast. It's mighty tempting and I fall for it every time! I'm putting on the brakes now, so no worries there.

    I'm not pushy in terms of sending out signals about any sort of commitment, so (at least I hope) that's not the problem.

    In response to the question about gay friends: I do have several guys I have gotten to know and like here. My only sticking point is that I'm the only American of the group so when it comes to socializing in large numbers I'm usually sidelined somewhat. There's a language barrier and it's tough to transcend to become fully immersed in the social fabric. Probably sounds like I am making excuses, but it's genuinely a little more complicated with linguistics fouling things up.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 09, 2008 3:41 PM GMT
    I can relate to your situation in life as well. I decided to look at dates like this. There's lust, there's affection and there's love. No different when I was with a woman.

    You have needs to fulfill. sometimes its lust (aka horny fucker). At times you really want some affection/physical contact- you really have a great time together in all respects. you can't get enough of the contact. Yet once it's over, you may walk away and go hmmmmm there's nothing more to this but I met an internal need.

    The ultimate goal is to love and be loved, something that takes time to build and nurture. That's a different story altogether.

    Step back for a minute, ask yourself what it is you want. You can't create a "life together scenario from a guy you don't know" especially after a roll in the hay.

    Be realistic and objective as you are not the only one that has feelings here. You also run the risk of meeting men that haven't a clue either-how to feel, how to act, come with expectations etc etc.

    So what is it nameless?
    Sex?
    Affection or closeness for the night?
    or to build a friendship with the ultimate goal of love and a LTR?
    There are incredible gay men out there-esp here in RJ, get some friends in your life. This takes work as well.

    In the meantime be proud of your life's accomplishments (your family IS your FIRST responsibility here) and how you got to where you are today. It wasn't an accident and didn't happen overnight.

    Why would this be any different? on yeah there's no need to be embarrassed. Pretty fair questions I reckon.
  • tokugawa

    Posts: 945

    Nov 11, 2008 10:46 PM GMT
    Have you tried a group of gay men who get together for something other than sex? It could be volunteering for a safer sex awareness group; it could be a gay sports club, a gay political group, a gay religious group, it could even be weekly gay bingo.

    How do you find these? An internet search engine is a very powerful tool.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 12, 2008 4:02 AM GMT
    I'll add my two cents.

    Welcome to the gay world. You will definitely meet lots of guys like that, so brace yourself and develop a thick skin if you don't already have one.

    As others have pointed out, try not to have sex too soon if you are looking for a relationship. Most gay men are fickle when it comes to this, they worship you up until the moment they do you (or you do them) and next thing you know.."who are you again?".

    When going on dates, especially with guys you meet online, try to keep your expectations low, if any. I suggest not having any expectations.

    As for making friends, check out what's in your area as far as group activities, that would be a good start.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 12, 2008 4:05 AM GMT
    I can definitely understand the challenges in a country where the primary language isn't English. Getting to know someone is challenging even when both guys speak the same language.

    For me, jumping into bed isn't the biggest problem. It's the brain chemical thing that happens that rocks my world, but only lasts for a couple of months. I just can't seem to keep it going after that.

    If only I could convince the emotional part of me that it makes no sense to fall in love with imagined attributes projected onto someone I don't know very well.

    I'm in a temporary retreat from the "hunt," while I sort through the place where these short-term involvements can fit into the rest of my otherwise interesting and engaged life.