CNN OP ED: "Bradley Manning Betrayed America"

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    Aug 03, 2013 5:55 AM GMT
    http://edition.cnn.com/2013/07/31/opinion/schoenfeld-manning-verdict/index.html?iid=article_sidebar

    Do you agree?

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    Aug 03, 2013 6:13 AM GMT
    I'm a bad American because I don't know enough to answer your question. Was he involved in Wikileaks? I thought that was embarrassing, but not a betrayal. Wasn't he Grand Marshall or something at SF Pride, or did that fall through?

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    Aug 03, 2013 6:23 AM GMT
    Charges for aiding the enemy?

    The enemy is your government!
    Truth never betrays, it's the hiding of truth that betrays.

    Isn't one of America's greatest president said
    “Let the people know the truth and the country is safe”. Abraham Lincoln

    It's the hiding of it that caused all this. I strongly believe Bradley Manning (whatever his primary motives are) he just made you free.

    Your govt. is so feared for its sins that whatever comes next, it'll blame him, but not on themselves for poor, selfish & corporate ruling.
  • AMoonHawk

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    Aug 03, 2013 6:25 AM GMT
    He's an idiot ... and the government is either incompetent or used him to leak what they wanted leaked ... you don't put children in charge of classified information
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    Aug 03, 2013 6:39 AM GMT
    He's not a traitor. He's not a hero. He's just naive. And he committed a crime.

    I'm really glad he got acquitted for the "aiding the enemy" charge though. I don't think he betrayed or harmed America. Our politicians are doing a great job of doing that. Instead, like the article mentioned, he betrayed the individuals mentioned in the leaked documents.
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    Aug 03, 2013 1:41 PM GMT
    This man was in a sworn position of trust, and betrayed that trust by downloading classified information and gave it to someone who wanted to publicize it. If information is classified, then by definition, it is sensitive and it's revelation could easily have serious consequences regarding national security, personnel here and abroad, and military here and abroad. This is why he's a traitor and should be executed.
  • HottJoe

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    Aug 03, 2013 2:08 PM GMT
    Blakes7 saidThis man was in a sworn position of trust, and betrayed that trust by downloading classified information and gave it to someone who wanted to publicize it. If information is classified, then by definition, it is sensitive and it's revelation could easily have serious consequences regarding national security, personnel here and abroad, and military here and abroad. This is why he's a traitor and should be executed.

    God, you're insane.

    Of course heroes get martyred all the time... I think he did what he did in good faith. I think he did what he felt was morally right, when he saw the cover up of innocent people being murdered. The government calls them causalities of war, but, then, so are the innocent people who died on 9/11.

    One thing I've noticed, that's relevant to this site, is that Manning was ostracized by his family for being gay, and has only ever been persecuted, whereas Edward Snowdon has been lionized, rooted for, and had his father say that his son is a hero. Double standards abound.

    I sympathize with Manning, but I understand why many Americans, democrats and republicans alike, want to crucify him.
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    Aug 03, 2013 3:11 PM GMT
    HottJoe saidOf course heroes get martyred all the time... I think he did what he did in good faith. I think he did what he felt was morally right, when he saw the cover up of innocent people being murdered. The government calls them causalities of war, but, then, so are the innocent people who died on 9/11.

    He swore to follow the oath he took, he broke the law by doing what he did. Whether it was in good faith or morally right, whether he thought it would help or not doesn't matter.

    This man is on the lowest rung of the ladder, he has no idea what damage could have or was caused by what he did.

    He took it to the extreme. Doesn't matter if you work for the government or the private sector, you're loyalty is expected and he broke that loyalty and the law. Punishment follows as it always does when you get caught with your hand in the cookie jar.
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    Aug 03, 2013 3:19 PM GMT
    eb925guy said
    HottJoe said

    He swore to follow the oath he took, he broke the law by doing what he did. Whether it was in good faith or morally right, whether he thought it would help or not doesn't matter.

    In theory you're right, but, do the ones who want to punish him live up to the oaths that they undertook?...I don't think so.
    That's why, one should trust in people not in oaths.
  • HottJoe

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    Aug 03, 2013 3:26 PM GMT
    eb925guy said
    HottJoe saidOf course heroes get martyred all the time... I think he did what he did in good faith. I think he did what he felt was morally right, when he saw the cover up of innocent people being murdered. The government calls them causalities of war, but, then, so are the innocent people who died on 9/11.

    He swore to follow the oath he took, he broke the law by doing what he did. Whether it was in good faith or morally right, whether he thought it would help or not doesn't matter.

    This man is on the lowest rung of the ladder, he has no idea what damage could have or was caused by what he did.

    He took it to the extreme. Doesn't matter if you work for the government or the private sector, you're loyalty is expected and he broke that loyalty and the law. Punishment follows as it always does when you get caught with your hand in the cookie jar.

    I never said he wouldn't be punished.
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    Aug 03, 2013 3:59 PM GMT
    Harry7785 said
    eb925guy said
    HottJoe said

    He swore to follow the oath he took, he broke the law by doing what he did. Whether it was in good faith or morally right, whether he thought it would help or not doesn't matter.

    In theory you're right, but, do the ones who want to punish him live up to the oaths that they undertook?...I don't think so.
    That's why, one should trust in people not in oaths.

    What? Why don't you think that they don't live up to the oath they took? I'd say that 99% of them do and they're very proud of what they do and the moral responsibility of maintaining that oath!
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    Aug 03, 2013 4:00 PM GMT
    HottJoe said I never said he wouldn't be punished.
    Do you think he should be? I don't think death is appropriate but I do think punishment is in order.
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    Aug 03, 2013 4:20 PM GMT
    If it were your security that was compromised, you'd think differently. Especially if that compromise lead to you being attacked. Or killed. Manning isn't a martyr, far from it.
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    Aug 03, 2013 4:43 PM GMT
    eb925guy said
    Harry7785 said
    eb925guy said
    HottJoe said
    He swore to follow the oath he took, he broke the law by doing what he did. Whether it was in good faith or morally right, whether he thought it would help or not doesn't matter.

    In theory you're right, but, do the ones who want to punish him live up to the oaths that they undertook?...I don't think so.
    That's why, one should trust in people not in oaths.

    What? Why don't you think that they don't live up to the oath they took? I'd say that 99% of them do and they're very proud of what they do and the moral responsibility of maintaining that oath!

    I don't think that way because, They are not! Haven't you seen many cops taking power into their hands, doctors working for money instead for patients, and in every other professions.
    I took it in more general perspective, Of course there are few doctors and cops who don't live that way. I'm not talking about them, but all?

    In simple way, the ability of a oath that can be carried out by a man solely depends on the quality of the character of the man who's taking the oath.

    for instance, if you ask a vegan to take an oath to not to eat meat, he'll obviously take the oath, but if you ask a man who eats meat daily to take the oath, he may take it, though he may take the oath, It doesn't guarantee that he'll never break it. One day, his temptations may override his resistance, or in this case...Bradley Manning, broke it to only reveal the truth.
    In both the former and latter cases, they may be eligible for punishment. But before giving the punishment when also should look at the motives behind their actions. And by looking at the motives alone will someone can judge whether they can be given less or more severe punishment.
    I don't think he's eligible for severe punishment, if one looks this way. For he only revealed what's hiding, and what's hiding are America's sins which were hidden so that they can live as they like.

    It's just like a rich man bribing an officer to not to act against his interests and aid him in hiding his crimes, so that he can continue all his illegal activities and earn even more money in illegal way.
    Someone should stop him! right?
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 03, 2013 7:10 PM GMT
    I agree with aspects of the article, and the verdict, but disagree with other points.

    @Blakes7, Were we ever safe? The WikiLeaks haven’t led to increased attacks on our soil. The Boston bombings had nothing to do with them. The Tsarvaev brothers hated America for engaging in war against Muslims. In addition, they were self-radicalized by the worst aspects of their religion, including their belief that women should be oppressed. Manning rebelled against the former, which is the killing of innocent people by the US, but it’s the latter, the radical Islamists, that are the danger that most Americans fear. Indeed, radical Christians are scary, too! We'll never be safe, as long people want us dead, and they want us dead for radical religious reasons, but also for the fact that we keep engaging them in war.

    @eb925guy, He'll be punished, but your cookie jar analogy doesn't make sense. He wasn't being self-serving, nor was he attempting to aid the enemy. He's not on the enemy's payroll. He exposed aspects of the war machine. We’re essentially “feeding the troll” when we kill people from the skies. Some of what he released, like the names of intelligence sources who are living abroad, was criminal. He released information indiscriminately, and endangered people. Manning broke the law, and will pay the price, but there are instances throughout history where people who obey the law are in the wrong. Sometimes a whistle blower is a good thing, but they are usually martyrs in the end.

    One thing that’s interesting about the OP’s article is that CNN claims that Manning is anti-American because our elected officials make decisions and individuals have no right to circumvent the system. But how can voters make informed decisions about the electorate if there is so little transparency? I’m not sure if CNN knows what it’s talking about. It seems contrary to have the media report that information should be withheld from people. Just saying.

    Should Jesus have been crucified? Setting all the religious dogma aside, Jesus was killed for being a rebel. Manning is a rebel, and, like most rebels, he did what he did because he was morally compelled to speak out against what he felt were atrocities.

    I’m against religious zealots killing people and oppressing women and gays. They are not the kinds of “rebels” I stand by. I’m not, however, necessarily against people uncovering hidden truths.