Here's where America went wrong.

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    Aug 21, 2013 3:37 PM GMT
    This is a citation of the Universal health care page on Wikipedia:

    Most current universal health care systems were implemented in the period following the Second World War as a process of health care reform, intended to make health care available to all, in the spirit of Article 25 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights of 1948, signed by every country doing so. However, the USA did not ratify the social and economic rights sections, including Article 25's right to health.[8]

    Makes for good reading, Health care is not a commodity you runaway capitalists, it is a human right!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_health_care
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    Aug 21, 2013 3:43 PM GMT
    So why doesn't Obama ratify the Covenant finally, it's been signed by the US Government for almost 50 years now, shouldn't you guys be getting round to it by now?
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    Aug 21, 2013 3:54 PM GMT
    pogaymon saidour government is ran by big business and that's the problem. the politicians are controlled by those fools. the same reason why schools are being shut down and more prisons are being built by private companies. the same reason why the nra and guns will always be legal in this country. the same reason why drugs are illegal in this country. it all boils down to capitalizing off of the ills of society. icon_sad.gif the healthcare industry is a BIG business in the states. they don't want a universe healthcare system because these sociopathic corporate ceos and etc love their money so much. they rather see kids that need heart transplants die than to lose a dollar.


    Thats why I don't like business and business people, I believe is trade and privization for some things, but a society's healthcare is not one of them, the same goes for our schools, librarys, fire and police services etc. There can be both public and private healthcare options, why not both?

    The healthcare businesses in America can still compete with a National Health Service, and many well off American's will still go for that option, I just don't see why they would rather 50 million American's lives be at risk than face a little competition, it's competition what capitalism is all about?
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    Aug 21, 2013 3:55 PM GMT
    lol who ever said the US government is there to help people? For the past 40 years, their job is to:

    build weapons
    procure oil
    keep bankers out of jail
    keep shipping lanes/trade routes open
    keep bankers out of jail
    promote lousy pharmaceuticals
    keep bankers out of jail
    etc

    you get it
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    Aug 21, 2013 4:03 PM GMT
    If healthcare (not health insurance) is a basic human right, then those providing healthcare should be forced to do it without any compensation. And those providing all the medicine and medical supplies should provide them without any compensation.

    Now, how would those "organizations" providing medicine and medical supplies be able to develop new medicines and medical supplies? That takes money. Where does that money come from?

    The logical answer would be the government. Therefore, in order to provide for "the General Welfare" the government should be the entity providing healthcare services (not health insurance), the government should be developing medicines and medical supplies. But the government isn't a thing, it is people. And those people should therefore be compelled to provide their skills and talents in the development of medicine and medical supplies for no compensation.

    But they should be compensated, no? What's a "fair" amount of compensation? Who decides what is a "fair" amount of compensation? The United Nations?

    When the first humans roamed the earth, surely they also had a "right" to healthcare. How would they have been provided healthcare, as is their "basic human right" back then?

    I look forward to the answers to these questions.

    Oh and one more. What does this have to do with "All Things Gay" except for the fact that most gays are socialists and would support such a flawed statement that healthcare is a basic human right?
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    Aug 21, 2013 4:04 PM GMT
    It's appalling that America is literally in breach of the UN's human rights protocols and those who oppose giving it's citizens these basic human rights are called socialists, fact that's even a slur is equally disturbing, America and no nation can function is a completely capitalist society, if it were completely capitalist, there would be practically no government to speak of.

    It's also amazing to point out that, since America signed the covenant, it employs the policy to other places to give their citizens free healthcare, example, Guantanamo Bay, which houses America's terrorists, but doesn't give it's owe citizens this right, it's like apartheid South Africa deploring racist policies in other country's.
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    Aug 21, 2013 4:08 PM GMT
    GoNYMets2012 saidIf healthcare (not health insurance) is a basic human right, then those providing healthcare should be forced to do it without any compensation. And those providing all the medicine and medical supplies should provide them without any compensation.

    Now, how would those "organizations" providing medicine and medical supplies be able to develop new medicines and medical supplies? That takes money. Where does that money come from?

    The logical answer would be the government. Therefore, in order to provide for "the General Welfare" the government should be the entity providing healthcare services (not health insurance), the government should be developing medicines and medical supplies. But the government isn't a thing, it is people. And those people should therefore be compelled to provide their skills and talents in the development of medicine and medical supplies for no compensation.

    But they should be compensated, no? What's a "fair" amount of compensation? Who decides what is a "fair" amount of compensation? The United Nations?

    When the first humans roamed the earth, surely they also had a "right" to healthcare. How would they have been provided healthcare, as is their "basic human right" back then?

    I look forward to the answers to these questions.

    Oh and one more. What does this have to do with "All Things Gay" except for the fact that most gays are socialists and would support such a flawed statement that healthcare is a basic human right?


    Free Health care, free, that should solve your insurance question, and it should be paid by higher taxes or responsible spending by a nations government, maybe stop nation building and going to wars for oil so much.

    Almost every other developed nation in the world makes it work, surely America can too, and Universal healthcare/insurance doesn't mean private companies would be eliminated, they're not going to be forced to shut down.
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    Aug 21, 2013 4:09 PM GMT
    Frankly, the US could care less about the UN (it's for "other" countries). To us, it's just a building on the East Side full of bickering elitists on an expense account
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    Aug 21, 2013 4:12 PM GMT
    somersault saidFrankly, the US could care less about the UN (it's for "other" countries). To us, it's just a building on the East Side full of bickering elitists on an expense account


    I hope America's relative decline does continue, its not actually a bad thing, it would do your nation some good frankly, yano what we did here in the UK right after we gave India it's independence? We established the NHS. icon_cool.gif
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    Aug 21, 2013 4:12 PM GMT
    GoNYMets2012 saidIf healthcare (not health insurance) is a basic human right, then those providing healthcare should be forced to do it without any compensation. And those providing all the medicine and medical supplies should provide them without any compensation.




    Hmm...in your country you have the right to bear arms. Does that then mean that no gun dealer is to be paid or get any kind of compensation? Manufacturers of said guns and ammo, too? Are guns handed out to every citizen of the US free of charge? How many free guns does a citizen of the US get in their lifetime?



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    Aug 21, 2013 4:18 PM GMT
    i2ci2i said
    somersault saidFrankly, the US could care less about the UN (it's for "other" countries). To us, it's just a building on the East Side full of bickering elitists on an expense account


    I hope America's relative decline does continue, its not actually a bad thing, it would do your nation some good frankly, yano what we did here in the UK right after we gave India it's independence? We established the NHS. icon_cool.gif


    Oh so nice that your warmongering Royal assholes gave the poor Indians their independence and taught them how to live, that's nice of you icon_rolleyes.gif

    Did the opium trade to China dry up? lol
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    Aug 21, 2013 4:23 PM GMT
    somersault said
    i2ci2i said
    somersault saidFrankly, the US could care less about the UN (it's for "other" countries). To us, it's just a building on the East Side full of bickering elitists on an expense account


    I hope America's relative decline does continue, its not actually a bad thing, it would do your nation some good frankly, yano what we did here in the UK right after we gave India it's independence? We established the NHS. icon_cool.gif


    Oh so nice that your warmongering Royal assholes gave the poor Indians their independence and taught them how to live, that's nice of you icon_rolleyes.gif

    Did the opium trade to China dry up? lol


    Note I'm not British, nor no I particulary care for the UK either, but I do like the NHS, my point is that the expense of being the global superpower is often detrimental to the superpowers citizens welfare wise, America can't afford to take care of it's poor because it's too busy policing the world like Britain once did, also the british never taught the indians how to live either.
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    Aug 21, 2013 5:45 PM GMT
    i2ci2i said
    GoNYMets2012 saidIf healthcare (not health insurance) is a basic human right, then those providing healthcare should be forced to do it without any compensation. And those providing all the medicine and medical supplies should provide them without any compensation.

    Now, how would those "organizations" providing medicine and medical supplies be able to develop new medicines and medical supplies? That takes money. Where does that money come from?

    The logical answer would be the government. Therefore, in order to provide for "the General Welfare" the government should be the entity providing healthcare services (not health insurance), the government should be developing medicines and medical supplies. But the government isn't a thing, it is people. And those people should therefore be compelled to provide their skills and talents in the development of medicine and medical supplies for no compensation.

    But they should be compensated, no? What's a "fair" amount of compensation? Who decides what is a "fair" amount of compensation? The United Nations?

    When the first humans roamed the earth, surely they also had a "right" to healthcare. How would they have been provided healthcare, as is their "basic human right" back then?

    I look forward to the answers to these questions.

    Oh and one more. What does this have to do with "All Things Gay" except for the fact that most gays are socialists and would support such a flawed statement that healthcare is a basic human right?


    Free Health care, free, that should solve your insurance question, and it should be paid by higher taxes or responsible spending by a nations government, maybe stop nation building and going to wars for oil so much.

    Almost every other developed nation in the world makes it work, surely America can too, and Universal healthcare/insurance doesn't mean private companies would be eliminated, they're not going to be forced to shut down.


    It's not Free - somebody pays for it or somebody is compelled to provide it without compensation. Since this is your topic, and I have taken time to contribute to it, I ask you to please re-read what I wrote and answer the questions.
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    Aug 21, 2013 5:46 PM GMT
    meninlove said
    GoNYMets2012 saidIf healthcare (not health insurance) is a basic human right, then those providing healthcare should be forced to do it without any compensation. And those providing all the medicine and medical supplies should provide them without any compensation.




    Hmm...in your country you have the right to bear arms. Does that then mean that no gun dealer is to be paid or get any kind of compensation? Manufacturers of said guns and ammo, too? Are guns handed out to every citizen of the US free of charge? How many free guns does a citizen of the US get in their lifetime?





    The right to bear arms is not defined explicitly as a "basic human right."

    #CanadaFail
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    Aug 21, 2013 5:58 PM GMT
    In the US, no ER can turn away a patient for inability to pay. I'm concerned that some people take advantage of this provision and get all their healthcare from Emergency Rooms. As more and more people refuse to find full employment, this problem is only going to get worse.
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    Aug 21, 2013 6:14 PM GMT
    You sure do have a lot of opinions on America...
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    Aug 21, 2013 6:34 PM GMT
    failscarf said
    i2ci2i said
    somersault saidFrankly, the US could care less about the UN (it's for "other" countries). To us, it's just a building on the East Side full of bickering elitists on an expense account


    I hope America's relative decline does continue, its not actually a bad thing, it would do your nation some good frankly, yano what we did here in the UK right after we gave India it's independence? We established the NHS. icon_cool.gif


    Wasn't you the same hoe that was so thirsty to come here months ago?


    yup. it is!

    but that wasn't months ago. that was like days ago.

    i'm having a hard time believing he's a real person.

    he's like from a completely different planet or smthing i dunno.

    GUYS WHAT'S A GERL
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 21, 2013 6:35 PM GMT
    Stealing it from Native Americans ... thats a good start
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    Aug 21, 2013 7:16 PM GMT
    GoNYMets2012 said
    The right to bear arms is not defined explicitly as a "basic human right."

    #CanadaFail


    Food. Basic human right. Must be paid for. Provided for free IF you're poor. Appropriately, the providers are subsidized by taxes.

    #GoNYMets2012Fail
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    Aug 21, 2013 7:34 PM GMT
    I guess it's the popular thing to rant against the U.S. these days, but you just end up looking foolish and stupid when you do. Your opinion of us doesn't really matter, and you don't really understand how our country works unless you live here. (And even then, many people don't understand it because they ignorantly base all of their opinions off of the TV and Internet, which is rampant with misinformation and half-truths.)

    Health care is not a human right because we haven't declared it to be so. It's not something you are born with, so the only way to make it a right is for the government to pass a law.

    We do have some government-run health care services in this country. I have worked in that industry for more than 10 years. You don't understand how it works. Mandating universal health care will not magically fix the problem. It's a very complicated problem with multiple facets, including politics, economics, and even social behaviors. The size and complexity of our population also plays a huge role. It is much more problematic than implementing universal health care in a smaller country. I don't have time to try to explain it, and it would be pointless for me to try since this is just a small gay fitness site that doesn't have any real influence or importance in the world.
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    Aug 21, 2013 7:43 PM GMT
    mickeytopogigio said
    GoNYMets2012 said
    The right to bear arms is not defined explicitly as a "basic human right."

    #CanadaFail


    Food. Basic human right. Must be paid for. Provided for free IF you're poor. Appropriately, the providers are subsidized by taxes.

    #GoNYMets2012Fail



    No..... Basic human rights are things that are not paid for by anyone. Do you pay for the right to vote?

    #mickeytopogigioFail
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    Aug 21, 2013 7:48 PM GMT
    mickeytopogigio said
    GoNYMets2012 said
    The right to bear arms is not defined explicitly as a "basic human right."

    #CanadaFail


    Food. Basic human right. Must be paid for. Provided for free IF you're poor. Appropriately, the providers are subsidized by taxes.

    #GoNYMets2012Fail


    youre-goddamn-right-gif.gif
  • DCEric

    Posts: 3713

    Aug 21, 2013 7:57 PM GMT
    GoNYMets2012 said
    mickeytopogigio said
    GoNYMets2012 said
    The right to bear arms is not defined explicitly as a "basic human right."

    #CanadaFail


    Food. Basic human right. Must be paid for. Provided for free IF you're poor. Appropriately, the providers are subsidized by taxes.

    #GoNYMets2012Fail



    No..... Basic human rights are things that are not paid for by anyone. Do you pay for the right to vote?

    #mickeytopogigioFail


    Yes. I do. Elections cost money, and I pay for them with my tax dollars. True, the labor is typically (though not always) volunteer, the facilities, materials and other costs are paid for by local, state and federal taxes.
  • travis_27

    Posts: 178

    Aug 21, 2013 8:02 PM GMT
    Universal health care is awesome. Everyone deserves the right to health and safety.
  • AMoonHawk

    Posts: 11406

    Aug 21, 2013 8:05 PM GMT
    Over Population ... you can't provide those sort of rights ... there needs to be death