Sex without Love

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    Sep 01, 2013 7:20 PM GMT
    So I've been reading through topics around here and I noticed the one topic asking for a count of how many people you've slept with at your age, and I was quite surprised how high everyone's number was. I know men have a pretty strong sex drive (I'm no exception to that) but I was curious of how you personally feel about having sex with someone you may not love or really care about?

    Did you find that your first few experience were with someone you loved and shared your first time with someone special, or did you just base that off a different standard such as looks/convenience/whoever you could find to get the job done?

    I'm just curious, because the very limited experiences I've had with being involved with anyone on a sexual level where there wasn't an established feeling of trust/love, really made me feel pretty sick. Like legit horrible to the point where I've decided that's not a way of living for me. I guess overall it makes me feel unsafe knowing that someone can be that close to you when you really have no idea what their intentions are what they're like, or if they're even someone you would respect upon getting to know more.

    I have no problem with people exploring as long as your safe and what not, but I can't deny that after reading that thread, if I met a guy whose number was in the thousands, or even hundreds unless we had a strong connection it would be difficult for me to be with that person. Mainly just because I feel that is a good indicator of how you perceive love and sexuality and general, and I feel as if having an incredibly high number compared to me would mean you look at those 2 things too differently for us to get along.

    Once again, no disrespect you do whatever you want in with your life I support it fully, and understand the logic between having quick/immediate sexual relations/hookups, it can be a pretty thing knowing two people can share something that beautiful right away, but I guess maybe my main fear is that people don't interpret sex to be beautiful or special? That it's just something you do and there's not much behind it, which upon writing makes me feel as if that's where a lot of my sexual skepticism spawns from.

    Anyways thoughts?
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    Sep 01, 2013 7:27 PM GMT
    "Sport Sex" can be fun, but is generally void of the satisfying element of the deep connection which "love" can bring to the encounter. Fine for busting a nut, but not something to "live" off of.
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    Sep 01, 2013 7:56 PM GMT
    I was on a hook up site recently, and this one guy's profile was full of "ask me"s. He IM'd me, so I asked about a few things. Apparently 3 or 4 messages was too much (fill it out dude, so I don't have to ask) . He said, irritated "it's just a fuck!"

    I thought, is it?

    No matter how long I've been around, or how many BFs or lovers I've had.....and yes tricks too, I've never thought of it as "just a fuck!" I've always looked for some sort of potential. Sometimes quickly dashed....but I still look for it! LOL

    "....but I guess maybe my main fear is that people don't interpret sex to be beautiful or special?" Some don't care at all. I do, still. So I'm not completely jaded. I can Sport Fuck too as long as I like the person. (I didn't like Mr. "Just a Fuck" too much after that) It isn't in the numbers, it's in the person's character and heart. Love would be ideal, but sometimes sex is just for fun. A dichotomy for sure. But anything can lead to something.
    The "Whore with a Heart of Gold" may not be a myth after all. icon_biggrin.gif
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    Sep 01, 2013 8:09 PM GMT
    I see....yeah for me even categorizing the kinds of sex you can have disturbs me a bit, it's kind of objectifying but I understand what you guys are saying and what you guys said was accurate and true.

    I look at sex as unionizing, and there are levels of how strong you unionize and how less strongly you do. I'm also pretty paternal and I guess whenever I see troubled youth or troubled people in general, I think of their parents and I feel as if they didn't take love/sex seriously enough to provide a supportive enough home for their kids. Which is something that crosses my mind when I hear about sex that's kind emotionally disconnected and or just "fun". I will literally web it to the contrary result of those impulsive decisions which just negatively stimulates me when I hear sex being casually thrown around in conversation.

    I definitely take life more seriously than most but when your life is spent dedicated towards trying provide and protect for others I guess the bigger picture creeps in much too quickly when you want to make those youthful impulsive decisions, as honest and understandable as they are.
  • TheBizMan

    Posts: 4091

    Sep 01, 2013 9:51 PM GMT
    I'm just not a person that attaches very easily. The one time I did see a guy on a regular basis the sex became boring and the chemistry dried up.. at least for me. He wanted to start a relationship. It was at this point I had to part ways with him.
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    Sep 01, 2013 10:59 PM GMT
    The sex was nice but with Love I know it would have been Exceptional... icon_cool.gif
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Sep 01, 2013 11:19 PM GMT
    I could never do the sex with a stranger thing. I need to feel comfortable with someone, not saying it needs to be true love or a deep commitment, just a level of affection.
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    Sep 01, 2013 11:48 PM GMT
    unckabasa saidI was on a hook up site recently, and this one guy's profile was full of "ask me"s. He IM'd me, so I asked about a few things. Apparently 3 or 4 messages was too much (fill it out dude, so I don't have to ask) . He said, irritated "it's just a fuck!"

    I thought, is it?

    No matter how long I've been around, or how many BFs or lovers I've had.....and yes tricks too, I've never thought of it as "just a fuck!" I've always looked for some sort of potential. Sometimes quickly dashed....but I still look for it! LOL

    "....but I guess maybe my main fear is that people don't interpret sex to be beautiful or special?" Some don't care at all. I do, still. So I'm not completely jaded. I can Sport Fuck too as long as I like the person. (I didn't like Mr. "Just a Fuck" too much after that) It isn't in the numbers, it's in the person's character and heart. Love would be ideal, but sometimes sex is just for fun. A dichotomy for sure. But anything can lead to something.
    The "Whore with a Heart of Gold" may not be a myth after all. icon_biggrin.gif


    I'm with you here. For me, it's NOT "just a fuck". I've always sought "connection" even if I know that the reality of the encounter is that it is fleeting (like when I'm on vacation far away from home).
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    Sep 01, 2013 11:52 PM GMT
    There's no such thing as sex without love. In fact, every time I jack off I tell myself I love me after I'm done, then cuddle with myself.
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    Sep 01, 2013 11:58 PM GMT
    paulflexes saidThere's no such thing as sex without love. In fact, every time I jack off I tell myself I love me after I'm done, then cuddle with myself.


    Lol first off, glad you do that because self love is a bigger turn on than most know. Secondly I sort of feel you on that and i agree there is always at least a little love in any sexual encounter, but I think that to say the same amount of love is every encounter isn't true, which is what I'm debating despite how blunt/sort of misleading my topic's name is.
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    Sep 02, 2013 12:04 AM GMT
    Scruff said
    paulflexes saidThere's no such thing as sex without love. In fact, every time I jack off I tell myself I love me after I'm done, then cuddle with myself.


    Lol first off, glad you do that because self love is a bigger turn on than most know. Secondly I sort of feel you on that and i agree there is always at least a little love in any sexual encounter, but I think that to say the same amount of love is every encounter isn't true, which is what I'm debating despite how blunt/sort of misleading my topic's name is.
    I was actually being sarcastic. icon_wink.gif
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    Sep 02, 2013 1:05 AM GMT
    paulflexes said
    Scruff said
    paulflexes saidThere's no such thing as sex without love. In fact, every time I jack off I tell myself I love me after I'm done, then cuddle with myself.


    Lol first off, glad you do that because self love is a bigger turn on than most know. Secondly I sort of feel you on that and i agree there is always at least a little love in any sexual encounter, but I think that to say the same amount of love is every encounter isn't true, which is what I'm debating despite how blunt/sort of misleading my topic's name is.
    I was actually being sarcastic. icon_wink.gif


    Aww Dam.... I was excited finally meet a self cuddler I thought only I did that.
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    Sep 02, 2013 1:09 AM GMT
    True love is all BS! I'll just take the sex and run!
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    Sep 02, 2013 3:24 PM GMT
    Some bitter people in here!

    True love exists, but it's not for everyone. You have to be open for that to happen, if you have a shitty attitude just stick with casual sex, that's probably gonna suit you best.

    Personally I think there is no comparison between 'sport sex' with a random guy and having sex with someone you love. The whole experience is more gratifying. Also have in mind as times goes by you know that person so well you know what gets him off and you start to explore things together, something that will never happen with casual hook ups.
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    Sep 03, 2013 12:29 AM GMT
    Actually in hindsight, just the term "Sport Sex" is extremely uncomfortable even for me to hear. I don't know, I guess since we we all created from sex when I hear that term being thrown around as if sex is a competition or something when in reality it's one of the most important acts one can ever perform, I just feel as if anyone who interprets sex as a sport is kind of ungrateful. In fact "perform" to me, is exactly correct. Sex is a performance or an art form, and when I see artists in the industry competing with one another for sales/attention I laugh because it's a contradiction. The meaning of Art and sex isn't to win but to experience, and express. You only win or lose within those forms, if that is a theme in the experience or expression you wish to create.

    There's nothing wrong with having sex in a way that is more mechanical or calculated in order to release an energy so that you can deal with your urges while not having a long term relationship if that's what you desire. Also having sex for the feeling or for the basic release is acceptable by me, but I don't understand why certain people can't speak of the subject with a little more reverence? Especially speaking to the public or to a stranger whose beliefs are unknown to you.

    Not to sound like a complete dick wipe, but is speaking about deep intense, potentially life altering experiences in a fashion where you dignify yourself and others sexually, just a higher consciousness thing to do? I guess I just can't picture someone with a high state of awareness or consciousness speaking about sex in a way that is limiting its significance since in fact it truly only does the opposite to me, which is expanding whatever feeling/thought you are experiencing. Thus referring to sex a sport for me is a limited approach to it, which is the opposite of one of its greatest potentials?

    Haha....much longer post than I expected to write. Any thoughts? Sometimes I think I should just shut my stupid young mind up and put my dick in every hole I can find like most guys my age tell me.
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    Sep 03, 2013 1:16 AM GMT
    No man, you're not alone, plenty of men straight and gay are wired the way you are.
    Funny; straight men that think this way are usually called gay behind their backs.
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    Sep 03, 2013 10:45 AM GMT
    [quote][cite]

    .... but is speaking about deep intense, potentially life altering experiences ....I guess I just can't picture someone with a high state of awareness or consciousness speaking about sex in a way that is limiting its significance ..... Thus referring to sex a sport for me is a limited approach to it, which is the opposite of one of its greatest potentials?
    [/quote]

    There in lies the rub! You can have that experience with a "stranger", the potential is still there! When I was 22 I certainly wouldn't have called it "Sport Fucking", too casual. What I expected then is not the same as now.
    It's not about "limiting its significance"...it's dealing with reality.

    It's not a Gay thing either. The whole 'sacred' thing is nice but not realistic for most people nowadays. Know many virgins these days? The whole 'save yourself for marriage' went out with "the pill" in 1966. Watch "Sex in the City" or damn near anything with an R rating +.

    Sex can and should be fun. Don't make it a task of unbearable weight and responsibility. There are at least a 1000 shades of gray. It's not black and white, maybe you'll be lucky and get that perfect relationship right off the bat without compromise. I still know the difference, but I'm an impatient fucker lol. And it's my compromise icon_evil.gif till then.

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    Sep 03, 2013 10:59 AM GMT
    Scruff said but I don't understand why certain people can't speak of the subject with a little more reverence? Especially speaking to the public or to a stranger whose beliefs are unknown to you.



    I'm going to mention this separately because this site, a forum, in the classic sense should be a place of honest exchange. I'm not going to parse it in some puritanical holy shrouded way. icon_twisted.gif This IS public, you are a stranger.....but I'm being honest. If you are offended, I don't know why. Nothing I have said hasn't been already been written.

    If I have to couch my expression to make it acceptable to you, that's wrong, it is up to you to understand........you asked.
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    Sep 03, 2013 11:06 AM GMT
    TheBizMan saidI'm just not a person that attaches very easily. The one time I did see a guy on a regular basis the sex became boring and the chemistry dried up.. at least for me. He wanted to start a relationship. It was at this point I had to part ways with him.


    A more common scenario than most would admit to.
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    Sep 03, 2013 11:15 AM GMT
    Scruff said
    paulflexes said
    Scruff said
    paulflexes saidThere's no such thing as sex without love. In fact, every time I jack off I tell myself I love me after I'm done, then cuddle with myself.


    Lol first off, glad you do that because self love is a bigger turn on than most know. Secondly I sort of feel you on that and i agree there is always at least a little love in any sexual encounter, but I think that to say the same amount of love is every encounter isn't true, which is what I'm debating despite how blunt/sort of misleading my topic's name is.
    I was actually being sarcastic. icon_wink.gif


    Aww Dam.... I was excited finally meet a self cuddler I thought only I did that.
    Actually I am a self-cuddler, but it has nothing to do with jacking myself off.
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    Sep 03, 2013 11:50 AM GMT
    Scruff said
    Did you find that your first few experience were with someone you loved and shared your first time with someone special, or did you just base that off a different standard such as looks/convenience/whoever you could find to get the job done?

    I dunno, entering into casual or "sport sex" never bothered me. In the same way I don't have to be in love with my hand in order to jerk off. Hence I could go to a bathhouse when single, for instance, or accept an invite to an after-party orgy, and have a fine old time.

    So I guess I fall into the "get the job done" camp at times, to include my first-ever gay sexual encounter, and later my first anal. In each case I chose the guy in terms of practicality, and actually didn't WANT a romantic & commitment situation developing out of it.

    I can approach sex on a mainly physical, sensory level with little or no emotional involvement, although at least some minimal degree of comfort with the guy is necessary. A scruff bucket with a scary personality and freaky serial killer eyes is not gonna work.

    My main issue isn't initiating the sex, but what happens AFTER the sex. I can find myself getting emotionally attached to him, even when I know I shouldn't because he's not a good long-term match for me.

    And I realize that attraction is a complex evolutionary response, to encourage a male-female mating pair to bond together for the benefit of any offspring they produce. Well, that doesn't apply in my case, nor to other gay men, why romance isn't an essential element for merely having sex in my view.

    At the same time, when I do find a guy I love the sex becomes almost secondary, not the sole reason I'm with him. And oddly, my desire to have sex with other men, to even look at other guys, completely vanishes. Despite my very casual attitude toward sex when single, I involuntarily transform when partnered into what may be the most monogamous & faithful man on the planet. Go figure... icon_confused.gif
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    Sep 03, 2013 2:21 PM GMT
    unckabasa said[quote][cite]

    .... but is speaking about deep intense, potentially life altering experiences ....I guess I just can't picture someone with a high state of awareness or consciousness speaking about sex in a way that is limiting its significance ..... Thus referring to sex a sport for me is a limited approach to it, which is the opposite of one of its greatest potentials?


    There in lies the rub! You can have that experience with a "stranger", the potential is still there! When I was 22 I certainly wouldn't have called it "Sport Fucking", too casual. What I expected then is not the same as now.
    It's not about "limiting its significance"...it's dealing with reality.

    It's not a Gay thing either. The whole 'sacred' thing is nice but not realistic for most people nowadays. Know many virgins these days? The whole 'save yourself for marriage' went out with "the pill" in 1966. Watch "Sex in the City" or damn near anything with an R rating +.

    Sex can and should be fun. Don't make it a task of unbearable weight and responsibility. There are at least a 1000 shades of gray. It's not black and white, maybe you'll be lucky and get that perfect relationship right off the bat without compromise. I still know the difference, but I'm an impatient fucker lol. And it's my compromise icon_evil.gif till then.

    [/quote]

    Well....first off I don't think I've ever stated that having sex with a stranger is bad? I said it can be frightening or difficult for some but believing in the kindness of strangers and feeling safe with them is a good concept as well. Overall on a daily basis where I work I see lots of adults speaking about sex casually in front of youth and I feel that's a bit inappropriate sometimes unless you're teaching them something, so that's actually where most of my stance comes from on this topic.

    Also I never said everyone should speak of sex reverently, I implied it as maybe I would like to see it more in society. Also reverence means deep respect or admiration for, has nothing to do with being holy or religious for me. Also I'm not saving myself for a perfect relationship either and i've had my share of sexual experiences that I'm good with and don't regret because I've learned from them.
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    Sep 03, 2013 2:34 PM GMT
    unckabasa said
    Scruff said but I don't understand why certain people can't speak of the subject with a little more reverence? Especially speaking to the public or to a stranger whose beliefs are unknown to you.



    I'm going to mention this separately because this site, a forum, in the classic sense should be a place of honest exchange. I'm not going to parse it in some puritanical holy shrouded way. icon_twisted.gif This IS public, you are a stranger.....but I'm being honest. If you are offended, I don't know why. Nothing I have said hasn't been already been written.

    If I have to couch my expression to make it acceptable to you, that's wrong, it is up to you to understand........you asked.


    When did I say I was offended? Lol I also never asked anyone to limit their thoughts or expressions for my sake

    If someone walks down the street and sees another person dressed in clothes they don't like and they say

    "hey I hate your clothes, i think they're ugly and I probably wouldn't like you because of it but that's my opinion and I can say it however I want because it's a free country"

    Yeah you can say whatever you want, and you don't have to say it in a way that's respectful as long as you're not making false accusations. Also if someone came up to me and said that and I was hurt, that's my fault for allowing it to bother me. That being said it doesn't change the fact that sometimes people go out of their way either out of ignorance or laziness to not ensure that you're respecting whom you're speaking to or the public.

    Lol overall I'm not offended. I posted fully knowing people can say whatever they like that's the whole point? So you can believe what you want and I'll believe mine. I just make sure that when I speak of my thoughts or someone else's I treat them both with respect and an open mind, as well as not under minding the thoughts and beliefs of others.

    Though for me, there is a time and place for everything, and I fine line between brutal honestly and disrespect. By the way for me is the operative phrase, meaning this applies only to me. So if you don't live life that way that's great, because I stated this only works for me, and I never stated everyone should live completely as I.
  • rnch

    Posts: 11524

    Sep 03, 2013 2:38 PM GMT
    ART_DECO said
    Scruff said
    Did you find that your first few experience were with someone you loved and shared your first time with someone special, or did you just base that off a different standard such as looks/convenience/whoever you could find to get the job done?

    I dunno, entering into casual or "sport sex" never bothered me. In the same way I don't have to be in love with my hand in order to jerk off. Hence I could go to a bathhouse when single, for instance, or accept an invite to an after-party orgy, and have a fine old time.

    So I guess I fall into the "get the job done" camp at times, to include my first-ever gay sexual encounter, and later my first anal. In each case I chose the guy in terms of practicality, and actually didn't WANT a romantic & commitment situation developing out of it.

    I can approach sex on a mainly physical, sensory level with little or no emotional involvement, although at least some minimal degree of comfort with the guy is necessary. A scruff bucket with a scary personality and freaky serial killer eyes is not gonna work.

    My main issue isn't initiating the sex, but what happens AFTER the sex. I can find myself getting emotionally attached to him, even when I know I shouldn't because he's not a good long-term match for me.

    And I realize that attraction is a complex evolutionary response, to encourage a male-female mating pair to bond together for the benefit of any offspring they produce. Well, that doesn't apply in my case, nor to other gay men, why romance isn't an essential element for merely having sex in my view.

    At the same time, when I do find a guy I love the sex becomes almost secondary, not the sole reason I'm with him. And oddly, my desire to have sex with other men, to even look at other guys, completely vanishes. Despite my very casual attitude toward sex when single, I involuntarily transform when partnered into what may be the most monogamous & faithful man on the planet. Go figure... icon_confused.gif




    My outlook on my gay sexuality also, dameitall.

    "Getting over and moving on" after a 5-plus years relationship with the first, perhaps the only, man I have ever loved/will ever love is proving to be much more difficult than I have anticipated.


    icon_sad.gif
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    Sep 03, 2013 6:36 PM GMT
    paulflexes saidThere's no such thing as sex without love. In fact, every time I jack off I tell myself I love me after I'm done, then cuddle with myself.

    This. Plus, love without sex is much more difficult to pull off.