Fair or not?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 05, 2013 8:27 AM GMT
    Ok. So you get to the airport and your bag is 9 lbs over your baggage allowance. The check-in person tells you that you either have to pay a fee of $100 or get 9 lbs out of your bag. Fair enough, rules are rules.

    A heavily overweight person checks in right after you. She looks at least 60 lbs heavier than you so the plane will, in theory, burn more fuel transporting her than you.

    Is it fair that the airline asks you to pay $100 for your 9 lbs of extra luggage while accepting her 60 lbs of extra body weight free of charge? Just saying.. ;)

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 05, 2013 8:58 AM GMT
    No it isn't fair. I've always been in favour of making fat people pay for their weight on a plane.
    I see it as utterly ridiculous that someone who in total ( person and baggage) weighs less ends up paying more for luggage alone. The passenger and the luggage should be weighed in total.
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    Sep 05, 2013 9:06 AM GMT
    boorangOz saidNo it isn't fair. I've always been in favour of making fat people pay for their weight on a plane.
    I see it as utterly ridiculous that someone who in total ( person and baggage) weighs less ends up paying more for luggage alone. The passenger and the luggage should be weighed in total.


    There are some airlines that do make overweight people pay more, depending on their physical experience. I believe Southwest will make an overweight person pay double if that person ends up occupying more than 1 seat once they sit their ass down. I saw this on some show about airlines and man, these people got pissed!
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    Sep 05, 2013 4:52 PM GMT
    Well, we will be paying way more than $100 dollars for our obese brethren when Obama Care kicks in.
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    Sep 05, 2013 5:02 PM GMT
    no, it's not fair at all, especially when the person next to you overflows into your seating space.
    other aspects would have to taken into consideration as well if an airline were to charge by weight. aspects such as height, the customers bmi (given that it is not 100% accurate) and maybe age.

    samoa air started charging customers by weight earlier this year. it would be interesting to find out how that has worked for them.
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    Sep 05, 2013 5:32 PM GMT
    Toscar saidOk. So you get to the airport and your bag is 9 lbs over your baggage allowance. The check-in person tells you that you either have to pay a fee of $100 or get 9 lbs out of your bag. Fair enough, rules are rules.

    A heavily overweight person checks in right after you. She looks at least 60 lbs heavier than you so the plane will, in theory, burn more fuel transporting her than you.

    Is it fair that the airline asks you to pay $100 for your 9 lbs of extra luggage while accepting her 60 lbs of extra body weight free of charge? Just saying.. ;)



    Just curious if you would be making this same argument for a bodybuilder as well? You know all those muscles weigh a lot too icon_wink.gif
  • LJay

    Posts: 11612

    Sep 05, 2013 5:35 PM GMT
    Take a train.

    OR

    Pack well ahead and send your luggage by UPS. Just fly with a small carry on.

    OR

    Teleconference and save the energy.
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    Sep 05, 2013 5:39 PM GMT
    That made me laugh and it is very true. I had one lady complain to change her seat on a flight since she was in her terms "Being suffocated and pinned against the window" icon_smile.gif.
  • tuffguyndc

    Posts: 4437

    Sep 05, 2013 5:41 PM GMT
    wow, really dude, that is such a stupid and ignorant thing to say. only a bitch or a asshole would be so crude to make a comment like that
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    Sep 05, 2013 5:48 PM GMT
    The OP states in his profile he weights 175 lbs. This is about 20 lbs heavier than the avg female weight of around 155lbs. Is it fair to all those women (and smaller males) paying for the extra fuel cost associated with transporting his extra weight?
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    Sep 05, 2013 5:55 PM GMT
    Putting price tags on people based on their weight would not be deemed fair treatment. Businesses are suppose to look at their prices as per-person, not as per-pound-per-person. The amount of fuel to get only the people from one place to another does not change because those are the people who have paid to take that flight.

    That's why they charge you for your luggage. You can't just shed a few pounds on the spot, but you can easily control the amount of personal belongings that you take with you. The problem is some people seem to think that they need to pack their life away, and the airlines want to discourage that.

    There are probably more reasons to why they charge more for luggage these days other than fuel. In fact I'm sure it has more to do with labour than fuel, as the amount and weight of luggage affects those who need to load those bags onto the plane. I can remember taking a coach bus where the driver had to tell a passenger to load one of their bags themselves because it was too heavy, and his union prohibited drivers from loading luggage that was above a certain weight. Some people may think that's silly, but that's how our society is.

    As for those people who take up more seats, or more room, I think that's a different issue entirely. I don't really know what the best solution would be to accommodate that.
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    Sep 05, 2013 6:06 PM GMT
    go_dreaming saidPutting price tags on people based on their weight would not be deemed fair treatment. Businesses are suppose to look at their prices as per-person, not as per-pound-per-person. The amount of fuel to get only the people from one place to another does not change because those are the people who have paid to take that flight.

    That's why they charge you for your luggage. You can't just shed a few pounds on the spot, but you can easily control the amount of personal belongings that you take with you. The problem is some people seem to think that they need to pack their life away, and the airlines want to discourage that.

    There are probably more reasons to why they charge more for luggage these days other than fuel. In fact I'm sure it has more to do with labour than fuel, as the amount and weight of luggage affects those who need to load those bags onto the plane. I can remember taking a coach bus where the driver had to tell a passenger to load one of their bags themselves because it was too heavy, and his union prohibited drivers from loading luggage that was above a certain weight. Some people may think that's silly, but that's how our society is.

    As for those people who take up more seats, or more room, I think that's a different issue entirely. I don't really know what the best solution would be to accommodate that.


    The taking up two seats problem is a situation where I think having that person pay for the additional seat is the appropriate thing to do. Their use of two seats means that an additional person can't be on that flight. If a person were in the other seat, they'd have bought the seat. Why should it be any different if someone takes up the additional seat?
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    Sep 05, 2013 6:09 PM GMT
    Our grandfather was an original investor/co-founder of UAL (previously United Air Transport). This problem has emerged in recent years as many people have become more and more obese. Here's what United (and others) have decided:

    United Airlines has a new policy for obese travelers: they must buy a second seat on a subsequent flight if the plane is full, or agree to move to a pair of empty seats (at no additional charge) if the plane has ample space available.* United's new guidelines are similar to those already in place at Delta, Southwest, and other carriers.

    Who are these "passengers requiring extra space"? United defines the obese as being unable to fit into a single seat in the ticketed cabin; unable to properly buckle the seatbelt using a single seatbelt extender; and/or unable to put the seat’s armrests down when seated.

    Any obese person who refuses to comply will not be allowed to board the flight. The fare for the second seat will be the same as the fare paid for the original seat—even if the second ticket is purchased on the day of departure when, as United notes, fares are normally higher.

    Robin Urbanski, a spokeswoman for United's parent company, told reporters that the Chicago-based airline decided to introduce this policy after receiving hundreds of complaints annually from passengers.

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    Sep 05, 2013 6:14 PM GMT
    [quote][cite]ftnipp said[/cite]
    Just curious if you would be making this same argument for a bodybuilder as well? You know all those muscles weigh a lot too icon_wink.gif

    Hm, I guess I would. In principle there's no difference. Although on second thought, it wouldn't be fair to e.g. tall people who naturally happen to weigh more or even pregnant women etc. which makes it a bit silly question lol. Guess that's what happens when you take an overnight flight and go 26 hours without sleep. Consider topic closed. ;)
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    Sep 05, 2013 7:18 PM GMT
    In some cases obese people can be an advantage if you have to sit next to one. I was getting on a Southwest flight and was the last person on. A very obese woman had the seat arm up and was overflowing into the only empty seat beside her. I went and got a flight attendant and said that I wouldn't be able to sit in the "available" seat. She went and looked and agreed and they bumped me to the next flight and gave me a free round trip ticket to anywhere.
  • BillandChuck

    Posts: 2024

    Sep 05, 2013 10:00 PM GMT
    Alpha13 saidWell, we will be paying way more than $100 dollars for our obese brethren when Obama Care kicks in.

    Ain't it the truth!
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    Sep 05, 2013 10:06 PM GMT
    ftnipp saidThe OP states in his profile he weights 175 lbs. This is about 20 lbs heavier than the avg female weight of around 155lbs. Is it fair to all those women (and smaller males) paying for the extra fuel cost associated with transporting his extra weight?


    I thought that too and wondered what's the airline definition of "extra" weight. That implies a norm. Does a kid who goes at a reduced rate ticket take up any less of a single seat than the person some consider overweight. Does a person on a single day business trip, with no luggage, cover the cost of transporting someone elses luggage? The airline has to have averages covered by their weights and balances people. Sure, it's damned annoying to be asked to cough up an extra fee. They make money on it and when we stop packing extra they'll find a new way to make a coin or two. It's not personal. It's business.
  • BAHBAA

    Posts: 122

    Sep 05, 2013 10:14 PM GMT
    I am 100% for an obese person paying for a second ticket if they take up additional room.

    I don't see why anyone would disagree with this. The way I look at it is I go out to dinner and eat two steaks I have to pay for both. I wouldn't argue with the waiter tha I have a very fast metabolism and then blame it on my genetics. icon_lol.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 06, 2013 2:53 AM GMT
    There is nothing unfair about charging people based upon the amount of resources they consume. In fact, it is unfair to do otherwise.
  • KepaArg

    Posts: 1721

    Sep 06, 2013 3:05 AM GMT
    http://m.cbsnews.com/storysynopsis.rbml?pageType=general&catid=57581555&feed_id=999&videofeed=999

    Samoa air charges people by weight
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 06, 2013 3:10 AM GMT
    Well, regardless of the methods to determine the appropriate 'fit' for the seat, I have to say that recently I sat next to a guy (middle seat) where the arm rest between us could not be lowered completely because his body was in the way. I felt like I was leaning into the aisle for the entire 3000 mile trip. Fortunately he did not smell, drool or get up every 10 minutes but it was still uncomfortable for both of us I'm sure.
  • iuguy5

    Posts: 59

    Sep 06, 2013 3:20 AM GMT
    I don't think it's particularly fair to charge people based on their weight. First nobody chooses their genetic makeup, and some people are going to be heavier no matter how healthy they eat and how much they exercise. Your bag weight, on the other hand, is entirely in your control. But if you don't fit in one seat, that is a different story---I favor making obese people buy multiple seats if there is going to be someone next to them....or maybe charging more for their seat and discounting their neighbor a bit since they will be getting less of a seat than a person with a thin seatmate. But this shouldn't be punitive, just practical. icon_wink.gif
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    Sep 06, 2013 3:56 AM GMT
    iuguy5 saidI don't think it's particularly fair to charge people based on their weight. First nobody chooses their genetic makeup, and some people are going to be heavier no matter how healthy they eat and how much they exercise. Your bag weight, on the other hand, is entirely in your control. But if you don't fit in one seat, that is a different story---I favor making obese people buy multiple seats if there is going to be someone next to them....or maybe charging more for their seat and discounting their neighbor a bit since they will be getting less of a seat than a person with a thin seatmate. But this shouldn't be punitive, just practical. icon_wink.gif


    The statement I bolded above should be the guiding principal here. An airline is in the business of transporting pounds, not people, although it may be romantic to think otherwise. Transporting pounds from one place to another -- whether those pounds are in your belly, in your bag, or in your bicep -- costs money. Is it fair to expect airlines to disregard the most basic principle of their business?

    What I described a few posts above could be called "capitalism," and what you described could be called "communism." They are both, ironically, systems meant to be just, and societies must decide which they prefer.

    What people weigh is determined in part by factors beyond their control and in part by factors within their control. The same is true of what their luggage weighs. Someone who, through no fault of his own, suffers from sleep apnea and must carry around an iron lung would have far heavier luggage than someone who doesn't.

    I don't see why fitting in one seat should be an exception to your general policy of "from each according to ability; to each according to need."

    Of course, I weigh about 20 pounds and travel light, so I would fly for free if tickets were sold based upon weight. icon_wink.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 06, 2013 3:59 AM GMT
    It's not fair, but fat people can't be dissed. It's a law or something.

    The truth is discriminatory at times. Like the Doc the other day who said that women should pay more for healthcare, because they consume more health care services.

    He's absolutely right, but OH, THE SHITSTORM that followed.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 06, 2013 4:00 AM GMT
    Yes I think it's totally fair that we are charged for the weight of our belongings versus our bodyweight. People are forced to carry their weight around with them, but when you check your luggage, other people have to then repeatedly lift, load and unload your heavy, overstuffed bags, dog carriers, golf club cases, crates etc.

    I agree that it sucks that some people take up more space on the plane than others.