Who's immature? I can't tell

  • christastic

    Posts: 376

    Oct 17, 2013 6:24 AM GMT
    So I've been dating this guy since early September. We have a great physical chemistry, but I'm worried that we are emotionally and intellectually incompatible. He's only a year younger, but I feel as if he doesn't understand a lot of concepts that I consider to be common sense.

    For context, I'm the kind of person who believes that for most issues there's a truth that exists regardless of our understanding, and that we're all at various closeness to that truth in our understanding. If it was the 1600's I would have stated that the earth was stationary based on what I saw was the evidence available thus far, but accept the possibility that I may be wrong, and I would indeed be wrong. My bf would have said that Galileo and I are simultaneously right due to our different perspectives, which irks me to no end.

    He has motivational quotes plastered around his bedroom. His system of values seem to be nothing more than a series of safe one-liners such as "whatever makes you happy" or "we're all different". For example, when I mentioned my desire for the gay community to shed its negative stereotypes (which most of my friends would easily agree with), here's how the conversation might go completely off course (keep in mind this is paraphrased from a much longer conversation and only reflects the points made, hence may sound curt):

    Him: Why should you even care about other people's business.
    Me: Every slutty vapid village queen out there confirms perceptions and fears that cause parents to disown children, and delay genuine acceptance of gays.
    Him: Life's too stressful already; instead of digging into these ditches and holes in life, just skip over them
    Me: What do you mean?
    Me: Actually I think I get it... these are other people's problems, meh
    Him: Well it's always up to your interpretation
    Me: Who cares how I interpret it! I could be wrong. What matters is what you intended to mean
    Him: But your interpretation might be right too even if different from mine.
    Me: Any saying could have many valid interpretations, but if uttered by you in the context of a particular conversation, the only meaning that is relevant or "correct" in this context is the one you intended!
    Him: So how did you interpret the "holes and ditches"
    Me: Problems in society that I'm better off not dwelling on?
    Him: No, what I meant was mental dilemmas you create for yourself
    Me: THANK YOU, that's all I wanted to hear, though I disagree since the things I talk about are problems that exist out there regardless of whether I choose to acknowledge it or not.
    Him: See? Your interpretation could be right too.
    Me: Yes, but wrong in terms of understanding your point of view!

    Am I just too retarded to understand an enlightened way of thinking, or is he simply too immature? Am I Galileo trying to explain heliocentricism to my contemporaries, or am I that other guy who thinks Galileo is retarded?
  • PolitiMAC

    Posts: 728

    Oct 17, 2013 6:43 AM GMT
    It sounds like he's just stirring you. It can be fun to play with someone like that icon_razz.gif I know others have done it to me. Sometimes, my dad or sister will say something I have a niggly intellectual thing about, and I'll just get started off icon_razz.gif

    The way he talks, if this is an accurate depiction, is very much how others play around with me. It's usually just funny for them to look at me get all crazy over something so comparatively minor icon_smile.gif
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    Oct 17, 2013 6:16 PM GMT
    Your post was too long for me to read, but what I can tell you is, I will need some video of you and this "person" engaging in some sort of "chemistry" if you want me knowledge and brilliance.
  • Buddha

    Posts: 1765

    Oct 17, 2013 6:57 PM GMT
    "Every slutty vapid village queen out there confirms perceptions and fears that cause parents to disown children, and delay genuine acceptance of gays."

    I hate when gay people talk like this, honestly. The LGBTQ-community is already highly stigmatized, there's no need to make ourselves into a noble savage and beat ourselves up further. Besides, a person who disowns their child because of how they believe homosexuals act is not the gay community's fault. That's just a shitty parent.

    It's a bit of "get off your high horse"-case when you feel that the answer to end homophobia is to go tolitarian on the LGBTQ-community and make everyone share the same values as you do.

    In addition, the only thing we share is our attraction to the same gender. That's really it. I don't expect you to share the same values that I have, because that just doesn't make sense. We have completely different upbringings, different friends, different goals, different jobs, different families, different experiences. We are different people, we will have different values and opinions. I will repsect that you make the choices that you see fit to live your life to the fullest without harming anyone, and I hope you respect my choices.

    I do think the notion of one absolute truth in all scenarios is absurd. I understand that seeing everything in black and white, absolute truth, one explanation is easier, I really do because I once did, but I think it's extremely limiting.

    If you think that you boyfriend is immature for trying to be respectful to others' choices and gain perspective instead of moralizing over others' actions, I think you should consider reconsidering.

    I hate when people recommend books, but I have to say that "The New York Trilogy" is a great book that has its basis in post-modern ideas and plays with idea of fixed ideas of reality. "The Sound and the Fury" is also a great book that uses existential themes and perceptions of reality.
  • whytehot

    Posts: 1165

    Oct 17, 2013 11:07 PM GMT
    Buddha said"Every slutty vapid village queen out there confirms perceptions and fears that cause parents to disown children, and delay genuine acceptance of gays."

    I hate when gay people talk like this, honestly. The LGBTQ-community is already highly stigmatized, there's no need to make ourselves into a noble savage and beat ourselves up further...

    ...It's a bit of "get off your high horse"-case when you feel that the answer to end homophobia is to go tolitarian on the LGBTQ-community and make everyone share the same values as you do...

    ...I will repsect that you make the choices that you see fit to live your life to the fullest without harming anyone, and I hope you respect my choices.


    Slut doesn't want to be judged
  • christastic

    Posts: 376

    Oct 18, 2013 4:37 AM GMT
    I told a close gay friend about this (he's 30 and disagrees with me all the time about my values and my "judgementalness" lol), and still he found this behavior odd. But he also said there's different kinds of maturity, and that I might have misread the situation and mis-paraphrased it as a result. He also said that my bf might have been guilty in the past of the things I mentioned, felt it was hitting too close to home and simply wanted to end the topic as politely as he can.

    This was my second attempt at a deep conversation with this guy, and it failed just like the first time. Maybe time and familiarity will help break barriers...
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    Oct 18, 2013 5:27 AM GMT

    christastic said, "Me: Every slutty vapid village queen out there confirms perceptions and fears that cause parents to disown children, and delay genuine acceptance of gays."

    Well no, it doesn't. If it did, then how did we achieve 100% equality in society up here? There re a vast number of intelligent people out there who would no more judge all gay people on the antics of some any more than they would tell themselves they were awful because of the antics of other straight people. Like so:

    http://www.gloriabrame.com/

    The number of straights into things you'd find appalling are far larger than the entire gay population, yet there's an odd silence about it when it comes to accusations by the religious, isn't there?
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    Oct 18, 2013 6:02 AM GMT
    christastic saidSo I've been dating this guy since early September. We have a great physical chemistry, but I'm worried that we are emotionally and intellectually incompatible. He's only a year younger, but I feel as if he doesn't understand a lot of concepts that I consider to be common sense.

    For context, I'm the kind of person who believes that for most issues there's a truth that exists regardless of our understanding, and that we're all at various closeness to that truth in our understanding. If it was the 1600's I would have stated that the earth was stationary based on what I saw was the evidence available thus far, but accept the possibility that I may be wrong, and I would indeed be wrong. My bf would have said that Galileo and I are simultaneously right due to our different perspectives, which irks me to no end.

    He has motivational quotes plastered around his bedroom. His system of values seem to be nothing more than a series of safe one-liners such as "whatever makes you happy" or "we're all different". For example, when I mentioned my desire for the gay community to shed its negative stereotypes (which most of my friends would easily agree with), here's how the conversation might go completely off course (keep in mind this is paraphrased from a much longer conversation and only reflects the points made, hence may sound curt):

    Him: Why should you even care about other people's business.
    Me: Every slutty vapid village queen out there confirms perceptions and fears that cause parents to disown children, and delay genuine acceptance of gays.
    Him: Life's too stressful already; instead of digging into these ditches and holes in life, just skip over them
    Me: What do you mean?
    Me: Actually I think I get it... these are other people's problems, meh
    Him: Well it's always up to your interpretation
    Me: Who cares how I interpret it! I could be wrong. What matters is what you intended to mean
    Him: But your interpretation might be right too even if different from mine.
    Me: Any saying could have many valid interpretations, but if uttered by you in the context of a particular conversation, the only meaning that is relevant or "correct" in this context is the one you intended!
    Him: So how did you interpret the "holes and ditches"
    Me: Problems in society that I'm better off not dwelling on?
    Him: No, what I meant was mental dilemmas you create for yourself
    Me: THANK YOU, that's all I wanted to hear, though I disagree since the things I talk about are problems that exist out there regardless of whether I choose to acknowledge it or not.
    Him: See? Your interpretation could be right too.
    Me: Yes, but wrong in terms of understanding your point of view!

    Am I just too retarded to understand an enlightened way of thinking, or is he simply too immature? Am I Galileo trying to explain heliocentricism to my contemporaries, or am I that other guy who thinks Galileo is retarded?


    (set "hold onto your chair" = on)
    Could it be that you're the one who may be "simply too immature"?
    (set "hold onto your chair" = off)

    Seriously, I don't think you're really "immature". Also, I don't sense that you're "retarded". I don't sense from your account that "he" is "immature" or "retarded". I do sense that both of you may have different cognitive viewing points, and that perhaps if both of you took a Jung Typology Test that you both might gain insight into the other person's ways of thinking and communicating.

    Don't throw out a perfectly good bf just because you think differently. Explore and bridge the divide and you just may find a life partner for life.
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    Oct 18, 2013 6:56 AM GMT
    To be honest i have no comment!!!!!!!!!!
  • lgg5819

    Posts: 141

    Oct 18, 2013 1:08 PM GMT
    Not trying to be a douche, but id say you may the immature one if his conversation style/opinions are your biggest complaint in your relationship. To me maturity is not measured by one's opinion on things. How is he with handling finances? Does he get along well with strangers? Is he motivated? Does he plan for the long term consequences of his actions? Is he open minded and accepting of the opinions of others? To me, those are the types of things that determine whether or not someone is mature.
  • christastic

    Posts: 376

    Nov 11, 2013 4:25 AM GMT
    So I broke up with him. It's been lingering as an option in my mind for over a month, and it finally happened after he uttered, with a straight face, yet another of his silly platitudes that sounds cool in terms of word-play, but didn't make actual sense. Told him we were incompatible, chemistry didn't improve after 2 months, we operate completely differently, etc. He protested and argued that we were indeed compatible and that he doesn't necessarily want someone who shares his worldviews but can challenge him.

    But when I asked him to name something he liked about me, the only thing he could think of was my "confidence", the rest was physical attraction lol. I don't think I can have a long term relationship with someone who doesn't notice and appreciate my honesty, which is by all accounts my most obvious trait.