Gay Rights in Utah?

  • riverwild

    Posts: 40

    Oct 19, 2013 1:50 AM GMT
    I recently received a job offer in Salt Lake City. It looks like a really fun place that has progressed quite a bit from the Mormon influence. It also appears that there is a good size gay population.

    Does anyone know much about LGBT Rights in Utah? I know marriage isn't legal, but civil unions, employee benefits for partners, adoption?
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    Oct 19, 2013 6:44 AM GMT
    Dunno. I did some business there in the 90's. I gather that it has advanced some, but... You still had to be a member of the church to do any kind of business. Several of my cousins live there, and the ones that wanted to climb the corporate ladder had to be in the church. (The others, worked at the dump and as baggage handlers.) Last time I spent any time there, there happened to be the first-and-last-ever Greatful Dead concert in town. The TV news covered it as if it were a soviet invasion. If "The Onion" had existed at the time, you would have sworn that the news broadcasts were total spoofs. Sadly, they were not.
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    Oct 19, 2013 6:47 AM GMT
    consult the almighty wiki

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Utah
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    Oct 19, 2013 2:35 PM GMT
    I would be very careful about moving to such a state.

    They voted for that crazy Republican Mike Lee for the Senate. Clearly they are not a state that is friendly towards liberals and progressives. Who knows what the population might decide to do to progressives one day, let alone the LGBT community.

    No, there's just too much risk associated with moving to a red state. Best to stay among like-minded progressives in Washington / Oregon / California / Illinois / New York / Massachusetts / etc.
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    Oct 19, 2013 2:43 PM GMT
    MisterOrally saidI would be very careful about moving to such a state.


    I wouldn't have thought someone who changes his location (not to mention his identity) almost every week would be reticent about moving anywhere.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14360

    Oct 19, 2013 3:49 PM GMT
    riverwild saidI recently received a job offer in Salt Lake City. It looks like a really fun place that has progressed quite a bit from the Mormon influence. It also appears that there is a good size gay population.

    Does anyone know much about LGBT Rights in Utah? I know marriage isn't legal, but civil unions, employee benefits for partners, adoption?
    I would be very careful if were you about accepting this job in Utah. It is a very conservative state and even though Salt Lake City has somewhat become more progressive, it is still quite conservative though no where near as bad as rural, outlying areas of Utah.
  • slimnmuscly

    Posts: 541

    Oct 19, 2013 4:18 PM GMT
    If you pass on the job, you should definitely let the employer know the state's anti-gay policies were a factor in your decision. Businesses need to hear that such policies are costing them talent.
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    Oct 19, 2013 5:39 PM GMT
    It's nice to see people who don't spend much time in the state where I live offer so much helpful advice along with zero relevant information.

    As a Non-Mormon living in Utah I can tell you right now, if you are coming here with the preconceived notion that because of the Mormon influence or because we tend to live our lives at a slower pace with pretty conservative values, we are somehow inferior or backwards compared to you and other places, by all means don't come here because we don't want you here any more than you will want to be here, because all we will ever hear from you is how awful it is here because you hate Mormons and what they have built here and god knows we get enough of that already.

    If you are coming here with the idea that you are going to be bringing us backward hayseeds your more civilized progressive ideas, like the ones that have made California, Washington, Oregon, Chicago, New York , Detroit or any other Progressive enclaves paradises to live in, please don't come here, we like what freedom we have left and we really don't need anymore taxes and restrictions.

    If you're coming here with a preconceived notion of who and what Mormons are and aren't willing to give as much in their direction as you're expecting from them , please don't come here because you will never be happy here. The fact is that Mormons are here and for all the people who don't like that, then they shouldn't come here, because the Mormons aren't going anywhere.

    If your coming here and the most important thing to you is gay rights, being gay and expecting understanding and tolerance from people who you have no intention of granting the same understanding and tolerance to, then don't come here because you won't be happy. If you are coming with an open mind and willing to extend the same understanding and tolerance to the Mormons that you expect from them you might be surprised.

    If your coming here with the idea that you are somehow better than we are and that we are expected to treat you that way, don't come here, we already have enough assholes who come here with that attitude every year for the Sundance Film Festival.

    If you feel the need to be gay first instead of being human first, you can't extend the same understanding and tolerance you expect from others to them and you need to be in the echo chamber of a Progressive enclave, don't come here because you will not be happy and in turn you will make us unhappy by having to put up with your bitching about how much you hate it here and how the Mormons are responsible for everything wrong in your life and we already get enough of that bullshit.
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    Oct 19, 2013 5:51 PM GMT
    shybuffguy saidIt's nice to see people who don't spend much time in the state where I live offer so much helpful advice along with zero relevant information.

    As a Non-Mormon living in Utah I can tell you right now, if you are coming here with the preconceived notion that because of the Mormon influence or because we tend to live our lives at a slower pace with pretty conservative values, we are somehow inferior or backwards compared to you and other places, by all means don't come here because we don't want you here any more than you will want to be here, because all we will ever hear from you is how awful it is here because you hate Mormons and what they have built here and god knows we get enough of that already.

    If you are coming here with the idea that you are going to be bringing us backward hayseeds your more civilized progressive ideas, like the ones that have made California, Washington, Oregon, Chicago, New York , Detroit or any other Progressive enclaves paradises to live in, please don't come here, we like what freedom we have left and we really don't need anymore taxes and restrictions.

    If you're coming here with a preconceived notion of who and what Mormons are and aren't willing to give as much in their direction as you're expecting from them , please don't come here because you will never be happy here. The fact is that Mormons are here and for all the people who don't like that, then they shouldn't come here, because the Mormons aren't going anywhere.

    If your coming here and the most important thing to you is gay rights, being gay and expecting understanding and tolerance from people who you have no intention of granting the same understanding and tolerance to, then don't come here because you won't be happy. If you are coming with an open mind and willing to extend the same understanding and tolerance to the Mormons that you expect from them you might be surprised.

    If your coming here with the idea that you are somehow better than we are and that we are expected to treat you that way, don't come here, we already have enough assholes who come here with that attitude every year for the Sundance Film Festival.

    If you feel the need to be gay first instead of being human first, you can't extend the same understanding and tolerance you expect from others to them and you need to be in the echo chamber of a Progressive enclave, don't come here because you will not be happy and in turn you will make us unhappy by having to put up with your bitching about how much you hate it here and how the Mormons are responsible for everything wrong in your life and we already get enough of that bullshit.

    I got the impression that the OP does have an open mind, and that the negative attitudes are coming from those who responded.
  • riverwild

    Posts: 40

    Oct 19, 2013 5:51 PM GMT
    shybuffguy saidIt's nice to see people who don't spend much time in the state where I live offer so much helpful advice along with zero relevant information.

    As a Non-Mormon living in Utah I can tell you right now, if you are coming here with the preconceived notion that because of the Mormon influence or because we tend to live our lives at a slower pace with pretty conservative values, we are somehow inferior or backwards compared to you and other places, by all means don't come here because we don't want you here any more than you will want to be here, because all we will ever hear from you is how awful it is here because you hate Mormons and what they have built here and god knows we get enough of that already.

    If you are coming here with the idea that you are going to be bringing us backward hayseeds your more civilized progressive ideas, like the ones that have made California, Washington, Oregon, Chicago, New York , Detroit or any other Progressive enclaves paradises to live in, please don't come here, we like what freedom we have left and we really don't need anymore taxes and restrictions.

    If you're coming here with a preconceived notion of who and what Mormons are and aren't willing to give as much in their direction as you're expecting from them , please don't come here because you will never be happy here. The fact is that Mormons are here and for all the people who don't like that, then they shouldn't come here, because the Mormons aren't going anywhere.

    If your coming here and the most important thing to you is gay rights, being gay and expecting understanding and tolerance from people who you have no intention of granting the same understanding and tolerance to, then don't come here because you won't be happy. If you are coming with an open mind and willing to extend the same understanding and tolerance to the Mormons that you expect from them you might be surprised.

    If your coming here with the idea that you are somehow better than we are and that we are expected to treat you that way, don't come here, we already have enough assholes who come here with that attitude every year for the Sundance Film Festival.

    If you feel the need to be gay first instead of being human first, you can't extend the same understanding and tolerance you expect from others to them and you need to be in the echo chamber of a Progressive enclave, don't come here because you will not be happy and in turn you will make us unhappy by having to put up with your bitching about how much you hate it here and how the Mormons are responsible for everything wrong in your life and we already get enough of that bullshit.


    Is your intent to scare everybody off from SLC? I'm certainly not someone who screams "I'm gay!" while walking down the street, nor do I expect special treatment for being gay. What I expect is fair and equal treatment. If a married couple can obtain spousal benefits from employers then I'd like my partner to receive that same option. I also don't want to be the victim of a hate crime and afraid of being myself out in public.

    Frankly, I find the Mormons to be much friendlier to gays moving to the state than you!
  • riverwild

    Posts: 40

    Oct 19, 2013 6:06 PM GMT
    I've done a bit more homework since the original post. The state as a whole is still very conservative. However, SLC, the UfU and Utah State U are all relatively liberal. They have adopted many rights for gay couples.

    As a whole, adoption and marriage are still outlawed in the state. There is a major court battle challenging the current laws. I doubt they will change immediately, and if they did then I'm sure there would be new laws or many appeals to the ruling. Nonetheless, they are progressing. Like many of the states in the country, it will just take time.

    I also found it interested that an openly gay man was elected to the State Senate...

    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/56989161-78/state-couples-marriage-utah.html.csp
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    Oct 19, 2013 7:10 PM GMT
    riverwild said

    Is your intent to scare everybody off from SLC? I'm certainly not someone who screams "I'm gay!" while walking down the street, nor do I expect special treatment for being gay. What I expect is fair and equal treatment. If a married couple can obtain spousal benefits from employers then I'd like my partner to receive that same option. I also don't want to be the victim of a hate crime and afraid of being myself out in public.



    Are you in a same sex marriage?

    Also, the chances of you being a victim of a hate crime because you are gay are much higher in "progressive" NYC than anywhere else, so I advise you to not buy into the whole "if it's a conservative state, I am at risk" bull.
  • KissTheSky

    Posts: 1981

    Oct 19, 2013 7:28 PM GMT
    Since almost a third of the U.S. states have now legalized marriage equality, I don't know why any gay American would choose to move to a state that treats gay people as second-class citizens. I think the ban on adoption is even creepier, since it means the state's lawmakers consider you a pedophile.
    I moved away from the South years ago to escape that kind of ignorance and bigotry and would never consider returning to that kind of hostile environment.

    I also agree with the poster who said that if you turn down the job, you should tell the company why. Republicans' bigotry has consequences, including economic ones.

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    Oct 19, 2013 7:52 PM GMT
    Utah receives $1.07 from your federal gov't for every one dollar it pays in.

    I suggest you be as gay-acting as you like. The tax dollars of Progressive America have paid for them to STFU at the very least.
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    Oct 19, 2013 8:03 PM GMT
    riverwild saidI recently received a job offer in Salt Lake City. It looks like a really fun place that has progressed quite a bit from the Mormon influence. It also appears that there is a good size gay population.

    Does anyone know much about LGBT Rights in Utah? I know marriage isn't legal, but civil unions, employee benefits for partners, adoption?


    Might just be my favorite state, especially color country in southern Utah. Beautiful part of the country and wonderful people, and yes, I'm talking about the Mormons.
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    Oct 19, 2013 8:18 PM GMT
    tothepoint saidUtah receives $1.07 from your federal gov't for every one dollar it pays in.

    I suggest you be as gay-acting as you like. The tax dollars of Progressive America have paid for them to STFU at the very least.


    Why do you keep posting from a "hidden" profile when we can see who you are just by using the "Quote" button?
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    Oct 19, 2013 8:33 PM GMT
    MisterOrally said
    tothepoint saidUtah receives $1.07 from your federal gov't for every one dollar it pays in.

    I suggest you be as gay-acting as you like. The tax dollars of Progressive America have paid for them to STFU at the very least.


    Why do you keep posting from a "hidden" profile when we can see who you are just by using the "Quote" button?


    Quite the understatement.

    He may think it makes it more difficult for admin to delete him .... again.
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    Oct 20, 2013 8:31 AM GMT
    MisterOrally said
    Why do you keep posting from a "hidden" profile when we can see who you are just by using the "Quote" button?


    You're not exactly RJ's master of deception yourself.
  • Destinharbor

    Posts: 4435

    Oct 20, 2013 4:04 PM GMT
    Wow. Shybuffguy has some serious issues. Self loathing the first of many. The OP asked a very reasonable question and gets this response from the one local? I live in a conservative part of Florida and certainly understand the problems of a fairly open city surrounded by close-minded rednecks who unfortunately out-number us at the voting booth. Sounds like shy buff has allied with the haters. Bud, we're asking for nothing the straights haven't had throughout history. Sorry, we're demanding it. Ya don't ask, ya don't get. But equally true is Askin ain't getten. You go back into your closet and pretend these great Mormons don't know you're gay and don't hate you for it.
  • 24hourguy

    Posts: 364

    Oct 20, 2013 4:50 PM GMT
    SLC is a pretty city, and nicely cultured as far as the arts are concerned.....but personally, I wouldn't feel safe there as a gay man for the same reason I wouldn't feel safe in Arizona as a Latino. -It would have to be a pretty compelling ($$) career opportunity for me
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    Oct 20, 2013 5:25 PM GMT
    Destinharbor saidWow. Shybuffguy has some serious issues. Self loathing the first of many. The OP asked a very reasonable question and gets this response from the one local? I live in a conservative part of Florida and certainly understand the problems of a fairly open city surrounded by close-minded rednecks who unfortunately out-number us at the voting booth. Sounds like shy buff has allied with the haters. Bud, we're asking for nothing the straights haven't had throughout history. Sorry, we're demanding it. Ya don't ask, ya don't get. But equally true id Askin ain't getten. You go back into your closet and pretend these great Mormons don't know you're gay and don't hate you for it.


    The Halloween Syndrome:
    Finding pleasure in pretending to be something one is not; in this case 'Str8'.

    Gay Republicans have made a fetish of deception.

    I suspect that living amongst people who demonize his true identity, yet learning how to 'pass' must give shybuffguy and his kind quite a naughty tingle.
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    Oct 20, 2013 5:51 PM GMT
    Ex_Mil8 said
    MisterOrally saidI would be very careful about moving to such a state.

    I wouldn't have thought someone who changes his location (not to mention his identity) almost every week would be reticent about moving anywhere.

    Touché!

    icon_biggrin.gif
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    Oct 20, 2013 6:13 PM GMT
    Destinharbor saidWow. Shybuffguy has some serious issues. Self loathing the first of many. The OP asked a very reasonable question and gets this response from the one local? I live in a conservative part of Florida and certainly understand the problems of a fairly open city surrounded by close-minded rednecks who unfortunately out-number us at the voting booth. Sounds like shy buff has allied with the haters. Bud, we're asking for nothing the straights haven't had throughout history. Sorry, we're demanding it. Ya don't ask, ya don't get. But equally true id Askin ain't getten. You go back into your closet and pretend these great Mormons don't know you're gay and don't hate you for it.

    I had commented earlier in the thread that I thought shybuffguy was responding more to the responses then to the OP.

    That said, I know him and I know he is the opposite of self-loathing. Also, I have observed over several years especially in this forum that the ones who use that term are generally the ones with significant issues themselves.
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    Oct 20, 2013 8:11 PM GMT
    On a positive note, living in a dogmatic culture will make you truly appreciate the freethinkers you find. And they do exist.

    The Mormons I've known who have broken free from Church brainwashing have very fine minds as a result.
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    Oct 20, 2013 9:26 PM GMT
    Destinharbor saidWow. Shybuffguy has some serious issues. Self loathing the first of many. The OP asked a very reasonable question and gets this response from the one local? I live in a conservative part of Florida and certainly understand the problems of a fairly open city surrounded by close-minded rednecks who unfortunately out-number us at the voting booth. Sounds like shy buff has allied with the haters. Bud, we're asking for nothing the straights haven't had throughout history. Sorry, we're demanding it. Ya don't ask, ya don't get. But equally true id Askin ain't getten. You go back into your closet and pretend these great Mormons don't know you're gay and don't hate you for it.


    Let me first address your ridiculous and over used charge of my being "self loathing" and "pretending" to be straight. Neither of those are true. My Mormon neighbors know that I'm gay and in truth they are more accepting of my being gay than are most of the so called "Gay Community" of my being conservative.

    Second. You, as has the OP have taken upon yourselves as if it were your right to dismiss more than 62% of the states population as if they themselves have no rights but the rights you say they can have. I find it interesting that people like you are always screeching about "majority rule", unless the majority overrules you, but, that aside.
    The Op's original statement was :

    "I recently received a job offer in Salt Lake City. It looks like a really fun place that has progressed quite a bit from the Mormon influence. It also appears that there is a good size gay population."



    So by the OP's own statement, he sees it as "progress" if the people living in the state are aligned with his ideas and and positions and have moved away from what he disparagingly refers to as the "Mormon Influence". Yet, more than 62% of the state are aligned with the ideas, positions and values of the LDS Church. I would submit to both you and the op, in light of the addresses at the recent LDS General Conference reaffirming the LDS stance on the traditional family and traditional marriage, for more than 62 % of the people living in the state for the op to move more toward alignment with their ideas and principles might represent "progress" to them . My point to the op was that if he was coming here with the idea that he was better than the majority of residents in the state by assuming that his way of thinking was the only way to progress and that he was somehow going to change the people and the state, he would be forever frustrated and unhappy here. The sad fact of life that so many refuse to admit is that it is the very "Mormon Influence" in the state that sets us apart and makes Utah an attractive palce fo many who choose to live here and most of us living here really don't want to see that change. In his replies to my original post the Op reinforced exactly the points I was making to him in my original post.

    I would also point out that many of us who have moved to Utah, both Mormon and Non-Mormon have moved her for exactly the reason the Op presents disparagingly as the "Mormon Influence". As a single parent the Mormon influence and, therefore, the more traditional conservative values were for me, as for many who move into Utah a major factor in my decision to move here. And as you have so aptly demonstrated, the Mormons hate gay people much less than gay people hate them.

    My intent in posting was never meant to be nasty toward the Op, only to be open and honest with him.