Is Gay the New Black? (AP article via MSNBC)

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    Dec 01, 2008 6:38 PM GMT

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27983598/
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Dec 01, 2008 7:42 PM GMT
    Absolutely ....

    we are the New Black
    Gay men in particular are the group who can be discriminated against without drawing boo's and hisses from the general population

    We are tolerated but under the cover of anonymity ie: in the voting booth or during a drive by the code is very different
    it's Fag
    and Homo
    and You'll rot in hell
    What's doubly imposing is that this is being overseen by one of the largest opinion makers in the America since its inception
    The Christian Church

    and sorry to say ... until they Lose power we won't gain it
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    Dec 01, 2008 8:50 PM GMT
    Yes, gay is definitely the new black. Especially in spite of a disproportionate majority of straight black people voting hate into the California constituion.

    Having said that, keep in mind that being gay and black can still be more socially oppressive than just being gay or black independently. So while you can feel proud to be the new black, all the gay blacks on this site still have super star minority status over most (not all) other RJ members.
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    Dec 01, 2008 9:00 PM GMT
    People's views of gays have always been more negative than that of racialized groups. And people's views of gay men have usually been more negative then their views of lesbians. I remember the days when gays were thought of as dirty old men trying to corrupt boys or teenagers into their disgusting lifestyle. Often people thought of gay as being synonymous with pedophilia.

    Fortunately the number of people who hold these extreme views of gays have significantly decreased over the past 20 years (more so outside of the USA). Now if a homophobe equates a gay man with a pedophile they will usually receive a very negative reaction from most people. However, amongst those that hold very rigid religious views the negative stereotypes still are prevalent. Many of these people have difficulty tolerating views that do not mesh perfectly with the Bible and still cannot accept same-sex attractions as biologically based, but see it as a personal choice to commit a sin.

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    Dec 01, 2008 9:03 PM GMT
    SurrealLife saidPeople's views of gays have always been more negative than that of racialized groups. And people's views of gay men have usually been more negative then their views of lesbians. I remember the days when gays were thought of as dirty old men trying to corrupt boys or teenagers into their disgusting lifestyle. Often people thought of gay as being synonymous with pedophile.


    Why use the past tense? Many of these negative stereotypes remain current among our detractors.
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    Dec 01, 2008 9:12 PM GMT
    Red_Vespa said
    SurrealLife saidPeople's views of gays have always been more negative than that of racialized groups. And people's views of gay men have usually been more negative then their views of lesbians. I remember the days when gays were thought of as dirty old men trying to corrupt boys or teenagers into their disgusting lifestyle. Often people thought of gay as being synonymous with pedophile.


    Why use the past tense? Many of these negative stereotypes remain current among our detractors.


    I agree, my first response was accidentally truncated, I have expanded it considerably.
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    Dec 01, 2008 10:47 PM GMT
    GQjock saidAbsolutely ....

    we are the New Black
    Gay men in particular are the group who can be discriminated against without drawing boo's and hisses from the general population

    We are tolerated but under the cover of anonymity ie: in the voting booth or during a drive by the code is very different
    it's Fag
    and Homo
    and You'll rot in hell
    What's doubly imposing is that this is being overseen by one of the largest opinion makers in the America since its inception
    The Christian Church

    and sorry to say ... until they Lose power we won't gain it
    dittio.
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    Dec 01, 2008 11:22 PM GMT
    Are you talking aboutGWM or Gay men period? Explain your point.
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    Dec 01, 2008 11:29 PM GMT
    gay is nothing new, its just more accepted.

    We fuck dude, nothing stylish about it or a trend
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    Dec 01, 2008 11:38 PM GMT

    Onslaught, don't look now but people are discriminating against you because you fuck dudes.
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    Dec 01, 2008 11:56 PM GMT
    Not to discount the struggles of either the Black community or the GLBT community, but I don't understand the purpose of saying we are the new Black. Is it a way to try and legitimize our civil rights struggle by looking at it through the lens of familiar, racial oppression? It is like an inferiority complex in our own community, our right is not valid until we pin it to a valid one.

    As the author of the article pointed out, there are similarities between the two struggles. But I fail to see how useful it is to do so. Sure, we could use similar tactics, but gaining support for GLBT rights in minority communities is completely different kettle of fish.
  • NickoftheNort...

    Posts: 1416

    Dec 02, 2008 12:27 AM GMT
    MunchingZombie saidNot to discount the struggles of either the Black community or the GLBT community, but I don't understand the purpose of saying we are the new Black. Is it a way to try and legitimize our civil rights struggle by looking at it through the lens of familiar, racial oppression? It is like an inferiority complex in our own community, our right is not valid until we pin it to a valid one.

    As the author of the article pointed out, there are similarities between the two struggles. But I fail to see how useful it is to do so. Sure, we could use similar tactics, but gaining support for GLBT rights in minority communities is completely different kettle of fish.

    The phrase also suggests that the struggle for equality of skin color and ethnicity is complete and has achieved its goals (which it has not).

    The LGBTQ equality causes are simultaneously separate from and intertwined with racial, gender, religious, and other forms of social identity equality causes.

    I'm more inclined toward comparing our struggles with the women's rights (and de-gendered rights) movements. Our identities and sexualities primarily frustrate the gender dichotomy (male & female completing each other) and our own struggles have been fraught with internal sexism between gay men and lesbian women.
  • MotorBrett

    Posts: 145

    Dec 02, 2008 12:52 AM GMT
    onslaught saidgay is nothing new, its just more accepted.

    We fuck dude, nothing stylish about it or a trend


    Did you even READ the article?!??

    Gay is the new black, doesn't mean a fashion statement.

    It is a reference to the civil rights plight following that of the African-American community.

    And we wonder why we have no respect on the political front....

    I can just hear the politicians at lunch next to the gay-rights rally:

    "What IS that commotion, Robert?"

    "Oh, nothing to worry about Henry. It's just those fashion-forward gays demanding something stylish again... this time it's civil-rights..."

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    Dec 02, 2008 12:59 AM GMT


    Up here we've heard this expression, that gays are the new black, but we're told it means that the emphasis is on 'new' and not meant as a replacement of racism against blacks.

    A Japanese friend explained it this way. Canada was racist against the natives here, then when blacks came they were the new 'natives'. So we understand is as this:

    gays are the new 'OK-to-discriminate-against' group. How thrilling to be the flavour of the day...even the g0ys hate us.
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    Dec 02, 2008 1:12 AM GMT
    meninlove said

    Up here we've heard this expression, that gays are the new black, but we're told it means that the emphasis is on 'new' and not meant as a replacement of racism against blacks.

    A Japanese friend explained it this way. Canada was racist against the natives here, then when blacks came they were the new 'natives'. So we understand is as this:

    gays are the new 'OK-to-discriminate-against' group. How thrilling to be the flavour of the day...even the g0ys hate us.


    If gays are the new blacks than g0ys are the new brown?

    I think we are dealing with very different themes. Discrimination due to sexuality is very different than race. I would say that discrimination due to sexuality is more like discrimination due to religion. Now someone might say that gays don't have a choice but you choose your religion. Honestly does it matter whether it is a choice are not? I may not have a choice about homoerotic feeling but I do make a choice to have sex with guys and WTF is wrong with that.
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    Dec 02, 2008 1:14 AM GMT
    For anyone who can ask a question like "Should I come out to my boss?", gay will never be the new Black.

    Of course, LGBTQ people are the targets of hateful discrimination every day, but the fact that most of us can exercise some control over who knows our sexuality and who doesn't gives us an advantage in society that few black men or women ever enjoyed.
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    Dec 02, 2008 1:17 AM GMT
    Wow, well put MikeOnMain!
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    Dec 02, 2008 1:43 AM GMT
    MikeOnMain saidFor anyone who can ask a question like "Should I come out to my boss?", gay will never be the new Black.

    Of course, LGBTQ people are the targets of hateful discrimination every day, but the fact that most of us can exercise some control over who knows our sexuality and who doesn't gives us an advantage in society that few black men or women ever enjoyed.


    Exactly my point. That is why I see it more like the way someone Jewish might try to pass as non-jewish.
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    Dec 02, 2008 2:05 AM GMT
    Living in a country that the Black fella called home, until the arrival of the White Fella (Oz). Then all rights belonged to the White Fella, and the Black fella had non. We did not import our Black fella as slaves as America did, they where already here.

    But As a sixth Generation born to Oz, a True Blue Aussie, my forefathers come as pioneers and not convicts, or latter immigrants. People, homosexuals not even born to Oz get rights I still don't.

    People not even born here use my heritage as an Aussie, and are called Aussies, and they are not. Nicole Kidman: American born. Mel Gibson: American born. Russell Crow, a Kiwi. Ms newton John: Pammie. Bee Gees: Pommies. Non are Aussies, yet all have, have had rights here I've never had as a true blue Aussie.

    People who may of been born here, but non of their forefathers were. They are New Australians, first generation born to Oz, and if they too was born a Homosexual like myself. They to may have rights I don't. To wed their loved one.

    So my heritage is stole, given away to foreigners, just because they have made a few movies or made a few soundtracks, or even only born here.

    Why I am being discriminated against? Because I am blessed to have two long term relationships, with two men I love. Since I am not able to commit to them both, legally. I as a True Blue Aussie; the real thing. Have not made one steep forward in the advancement of equal rights. Yet gays not even born here, or "only" one, two or even three generation Australians, have more rights than I Do, a True Blue Aussie living in Oz.

    So do I feel like the modern day black fella living in Oz, where new comers have more rights than I do, only because I was born a pure homosexual too. Hell yes.

    It will not be until I can commit legally or wed my two men on the same day, at the same place, at the same time. Will I have rights equal to people not even born here, or "only" a few generations born here.

    As the only fag in the Village, gays not even born to Oz, can come here call Australia home, and get more rights than I. I pure homosexual, and a True blue Aussie too!

    Well pickle me grandmother...
  • cowboyathlete

    Posts: 1346

    Dec 02, 2008 3:17 AM GMT
    I think we are only partly the new Black. We are also in large part the new Communists, the subversives who are trying to infiltrate and take over.
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    Jun 11, 2009 9:34 PM GMT
    I think we are the new black from the standpoint that it is ok to discriminate against us. This is most telling when it comes to children. The court system discriminates against gay parents all the time without any remorse because "it is in the child's best interests" not to be in a home with a gay parent. Bigotry is alive and well and fostered in this environment.

    Some of us avoid discrimination because our minority status is not always apparent on its face, unlike race in many situations. When the truth is known, it sometimes costs us jobs or relationships. Sometimes, it does not because they have come to know us before they judge us.

    I think we have it easier than the American Black in many respects when it comes to discrimination.

    It is easy to hate in the abstract. Hopefully, we will make a difference and turn the tide, not by living in the gay ghetto, but living next to our neighbors and living our lives just like everyone else.

  • MercuryMax

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    Jun 11, 2009 9:36 PM GMT
    didn't we already go through this topic?
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    Jun 11, 2009 9:39 PM GMT
    OMG WE DID THIS ALREADY! READ THE FORUM POSTS BE4 U POST YO!
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    Jun 11, 2009 11:24 PM GMT
    Yep and here is the new thread:

    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/553258/
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    Jun 11, 2009 11:26 PM GMT
    SantosMadrid saidOMG WE DID THIS ALREADY! READ THE FORUM POSTS BE4 U POST YO!

    I posted this on December 1st, 2008.