SciFi/Fantasy

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 05, 2008 9:51 PM GMT
    Does anyone read scifi/fantasy? Read any good stuff with gay dudes in it? I'm not necessarily talking about gay sex all thru the book (tho I wouldn't turn it down), just some decent gay/bi/whatever characters.

    I'd like this to be a post for people to make recommendations...

    so, here's a couple.

    Neil Gaiman: Murder Mysteries (actually a graphic novel, but still good)

    Mercedes Lackey: the original Last Herald Mage series

    Tanith Lee: Tales of the Flat Earth Series
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    Dec 05, 2008 10:38 PM GMT
    Samuel R. Delaney often includes gay characters or protagonists in his work. Unfortunately, he is also a professor of semiotics and enjoys showing off. While he may have fun writing sentences that span two pages, reading them is not always so enjoyable.

    There are any number of amateur efforts available on Nifty.org. Brandon Fox has a widely-advertised trilogy, in which a group of magicians unleash their powers through gay sex, but really, they are on par with the amateur stuff available free on-line.

    And of course, googling "gay science fiction" turns up numerous lists. Never heard of most of that stuff.
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    Dec 05, 2008 10:46 PM GMT
    Actual books I've read:

    Tanith Lee - Death's Master (part of the Flat Earth series) < really enjoyed this one. Beautifully written

    I've read Mercedes Lackey, but those had no gay content. I didn't read the entire series, the ones I've read are very disjointed.. I've read Arrow's Flight, The White Gryphon, Magic's Pawn, and the Oathbound. Also Storm Rising, which I think is also part of the Heralds series, or if not, then set in the same universe.

    RM Meluch - Sovereign, also very good. I liked the ending very much. icon_smile.gif Almost like a gay love story set in space.

    Samuel R. Delaney - Tales of Neveryon has limited gay content. I only read one book. Didn't care for it much. Too tedious heh. But the main protagonist buys and keeps a slave boy who later becomes his partner-lover. I think I've also read his book Dhalgren, but I can't remember for sure. Delaney has a style of getting 'into character' too much in his books, that it becomes pedantic. icon_razz.gif Almost Tolkienish LOL.

    Perry Moore - Hero, can be classified as scifi I think. Very enjoyable read. icon_razz.gif

    I also have a few I torrented long ago icon_razz.gif Still haven't gotten around to reading it, since I hate reading ebooks. I'll list some authors I recognize as scifi/fantasy bignames and the books they authored with gay content (not sure to what extent since I haven't read them):

    Marrion Zimmer-Bradley - Catch Trap

    Arthur C. Clarke - Imperial Earth
    Orson Scott Card - Songmaster (I hate this homophobic mormon, but I might read his book someday. If only to figure out how someone who hates gays can write about gay characters and pedophilia so unabashedly)
    Tanya Huff - Blood series, Crystal Series, and the Keeper Chronicles series
    Melissa Scott - Dreamships
    J.M. Snyder - Operation Starseed

    Edit: Also some short stories featured in those science fiction/fantasy compilations. I remember reading The Green Lion, I forgot the author, concerning an old alchemist who falls under the spell of a young man who claims to be the son of an old lover of his (The old man was supposed to be Socrates I think, LOL), but it is hinted from the beginning that the young man might actually be the homunculus of his former lover. icon_razz.gif

    Also I read the original short story of The Forever War by Joe Haldemann, which became the first few chapters to the book (which I have yet to read). It's good. icon_smile.gif

    The Machiavelli Interface by Steve Perry hints at a lesbian affair in the earlier book of the trilogy, so I think that can also be considered GLBT.

  • UncleverName

    Posts: 741

    Dec 05, 2008 11:36 PM GMT
    Lust is good and interesting http://www.amazon.co.uk/Lust-Geoff-Ryman/dp/0002259877

    There's another series where the main characters are gay throughout all 3 books. The writing's ok. No real sex, and again, the writing's just ok.
    http://www.amazon.com/Dreamers-Silent-Empire-Steven-Harper/dp/0451458435

    The stuff on Nifty is good, but really hit or miss. I tend to check that out every once in awhile, but it's so rare to find something great. Kind of like gaytube.
  • UncleverName

    Posts: 741

    Dec 05, 2008 11:39 PM GMT
    The Forever War was interesting, but wasn't really about gay characters too much (in the full version). They don't really show up towards the end, and then it's just to make a statement about a possible society.
    Worth a read, but the gay thing isn't really a good gay thing, imo.
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    Dec 05, 2008 11:48 PM GMT
    I'd forgotten about The Forever War... that was a long time ago. (Wasn't it serialized in Analog in the 70's ?) Lots of hits on the web about Ridley Scott directing an upcoming movie based on the book. It can be seen as more homophobic than homophilic, though. I suppose they could make the movie either way, or cut that part out all together.
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    Dec 05, 2008 11:58 PM GMT
    Sedative saidActual books I've read:

    Tanith Lee - Death's Master (part of the Flat Earth series) < really enjoyed this one. Beautifully written

    I've read Mercedes Lackey, but those had no gay content. I didn't read the entire series, the ones I've read are very disjointed.. I've read Arrow's Flight, The White Gryphon, Magic's Pawn, and the Oathbound. Also Storm Rising, which I think is also part of the Heralds series, or if not, then set in the same universe.





    I love the Flat Earth Series!! I wrote a series of short stories in the same quasi-poetic prose style she uses as a tribute to Tanith Lee. (Yes, I am a geek).

    The Mercedes Lackey ones I read were the Last Herald Mage books...and the main guy was gay. None of her later books had gay characters, which I thought was odd, plus her writing got annoying so I quit buying her books.

    I'm gonna print this thread off and go shopping, lol...
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    Dec 06, 2008 12:20 AM GMT
    I take back what I said, I do remember gay elements in one of the books I've read by Mercedes Lackey. An old mage with white hair I think... the memory is vague. I've read it sooo long ago. Freshman high school, when I was only around 12. I remember it because the paperback book had illustrations which is pretty weird for a paperback. I think it was the guy with the bird (falcon? bird of paradise?) as his familiar. icon_razz.gif

    As for the Forever War, well that's disappointing. I read the short in the Bootcamp 3000, an sf compilation. It was then titled Hero, I think.

    Very few mainstream scifi/fantasy titles are truly gaythemed.

    Of those I've read and listed before, only Sovereign has a truly gay main character.

    Oh and yeah, how could I forget, LOL. Ursula K. LeGuin's The Left Hand of Darkness. Though it is more along the lines of Death's Master, considering that it deals with hermaphroditic characters.
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    Dec 06, 2008 12:28 AM GMT
    Hmm... I recall a book or novella, read a long time ago, that I just can't dredge up. One of the protagonists comes from an all-male society where everyone goes nude. When they have to wear clothing, e.g. a space suit, it's always transparent (for religious reasons). I remember thinking at the time that it seemed like a hot idea, but could be pretty nasty in practice.
    Seems like a Delaney story line, but I can't find it.
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    Dec 06, 2008 12:30 AM GMT
    tommysguns2000 said
    Sedative saidActual books I've read:

    Tanith Lee - Death's Master (part of the Flat Earth series) < really enjoyed this one. Beautifully written

    I've read Mercedes Lackey, but those had no gay content. I didn't read the entire series, the ones I've read are very disjointed.. I've read Arrow's Flight, The White Gryphon, Magic's Pawn, and the Oathbound. Also Storm Rising, which I think is also part of the Heralds series, or if not, then set in the same universe.





    I love the Flat Earth Series!! I wrote a series of short stories in the same quasi-poetic prose style she uses as a tribute to Tanith Lee. (Yes, I am a geek).



    I've only read one. icon_cry.gif And a short story about a girl who escapes from a convent. She's one of my absolute favorites. You described her style perfectly - Poetic Prose. I'll see if I can hunt up some of her other books.

    And may we read your stories? icon_twisted.gif

    Nifty.org is mostly gay porn, I've contributed one story there icon_razz.gif Back when I wrote my first gay fiction (NOOBISH as hell). I recommend serious gay fiction sites that offer free reading, like Gay Authors , AwesomeDude, Codey's World, The Mail Crew, It's Me Only From Across the Sea (IOMFATS), and Storm Nation. Most are romance stories, but a lot of authors there write original scifi and fantasy themed stories (though some also write fansubs of well-known series, LOL, which I hate). I've contributed to some of those. Some top-notch authors there.
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    Dec 06, 2008 12:45 AM GMT
    Most of the net stories eventually get copied to all of the story sites. I just mentioned Nifty because it has a "science fiction" section. Most of it's unreadable tripe, but once in a while there's something interesting.
  • Tiran

    Posts: 227

    Dec 06, 2008 12:52 AM GMT
    Lynn Flewelling's Nightrunner series. The two main characters are a gay couple. The Bone Doll's Twin and the Hidden Warrior are interesting gender studies.

    S Stirling's Island in the Sea of Time series features a lesbian couple as two of the primary characters, and one of them is the military leader for the nation.

    Storm Constantine's Wraeththu trilogy: The Enchantments of Flesh and Spirit, The Bewitchments of Love and Hate, and The Fulfilments of Fate and Desire. good luck with those. Constantine is not an easy read (I never finished the series) and you either love her or hate her.

    Sedative, the Mercedes Lackey books will often seem disjointed if you don't read them in their trilogies. One you mentioned Magic's Pawn, the main character is gay, and the book is part of the Last Herald Mage trilogy tommyguns mentioned. There are signifigant gay characters in several of her series, but overall a very gay friendly author, although very much in the Young Adult section rather than Adult.

    There isn't a lot of other -good- gay sci-fi out there, but I am always looking for more. That being said I am a mostly escapist reader, so some of the stuff out there, Delaney and others aren't to my taste.

    The Gaylaxicon sci-fi con might be place to look for more info though.
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    Dec 06, 2008 1:00 AM GMT
    The Baron Vladimir Harkonnen from Frank Herbert's "Dune" was well known for his sexual attraction to young men. This is emphasized in the 1984 film by David Lynch, albeit somewhat toned down.

    Not exactly a role model, but a fascinating character nevertheless.
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    Dec 06, 2008 1:14 AM GMT
    Oh I'm not bashing nifty. hehe. It provided tons of porn for me once LOL. And yes, once in a while you do stumble across great authors there.

    TiranSedative, the Mercedes Lackey books will often seem disjointed if you don't read them in their trilogies. One you mentioned Magic's Pawn, the main character is gay, and the book is part of the Last Herald Mage trilogy tommyguns mentioned.


    Heh. Either I was that thick-skulled back then, that juvenile, or that forgetful, that the main character being gay didn't leave a lasting impression in me. LOL. Remember I was about 12. I remember the main character was a young mage right? Was his gayness revealed early on?

    I do have the habit of reading series one by one because back then it was hard to find bookstores. Plus my meager allowance meant I can only buy books from secondhand bookstores LOL. Still, it did make me familiar with books from the golden age of scifi and fantasy. icon_razz.gif I even have some reaaally old paperbacks from as far back as the 1960's. icon_razz.gif Old works by P.J. Farmer for example (which really sucked, LOL, a far cry from his later books which were superb)

    mindgardenHmm... I recall a book or novella, read a long time ago, that I just can't dredge up. One of the protagonists comes from an all-male society where everyone goes nude. When they have to wear clothing, e.g. a space suit, it's always transparent (for religious reasons). I remember thinking at the time that it seemed like a hot idea, but could be pretty nasty in practice.
    Seems like a Delaney story line, but I can't find it.


    heh. Reminds me of another short story (also forgot the title and author) about a man being stranded in a world populated by women survivors (only like 6 varieties of them who are cloned over and over to populate the world) of a ship crash that had reverted to a medieval way of life. Since that one also reeks of lesbianism, then add it to the ranks. icon_razz.gif

    re: Dune. Meh, the lecherous fat gay guy character is a common mainstay of science fiction. icon_razz.gif Herbert wasn't really improvising that much there. Baron Harkonnen reminds me of Jabba. LOL
  • DCEric

    Posts: 3713

    Dec 06, 2008 1:26 AM GMT
    Raymond Fiests early work, and his collaboration with Janny Wurts, was fantastic. Every person's hands I put those books in enjoys them- even if they don't like fantasy... and yet no one seems to have read them. Here are the titles you should read:

    Raymond E. Fiest
    Magician (split into Magician: Apprentice and Magician: Master when in paperback)
    Silverthorn
    A Darkness at Sethanon

    With Janny Wurts
    Daughter of the Empire
    Servant of the Empire
    Mistress of the Empire


    If you only pick up one of those books... Magician is the one to read.
    BONUS: Gay couple (you have to read between the lines) in Magician.
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    Dec 07, 2008 3:27 PM GMT
    DCEric saidRaymond Fiests early work, and his collaboration with Janny Wurts, was fantastic. Every person's hands I put those books in enjoys them- even if they don't like fantasy... and yet no one seems to have read them. Here are the titles you should read:

    Raymond E. Fiest
    Magician (split into Magician: Apprentice and Magician: Master when in paperback)
    Silverthorn
    A Darkness at Sethanon

    With Janny Wurts
    Daughter of the Empire
    Servant of the Empire
    Mistress of the Empire


    If you only pick up one of those books... Magician is the one to read.
    BONUS: Gay couple (you have to read between the lines) in Magician.



    are you kidding? I love the Empire Series, by Janny Wurts. lol, it's actually sitting right across from me on my bookshelf...but there weren't any gay characters in it...were there? I remember wishing Lujan and Papewaio were gay (together) lol...but it didn't happen.

    I also read the Feist books, but a REALLY long time ago. was anyone gay?

    I've read stuff on Nifty, and I've looked at some of the scifi. But for some reason I get more of a thrill out of it if I can buy a book...not a big fan of e-books.

    oh, and Sed? hopefully I'll be selling one of my books in January. (going to meet with an editor in NEW YORK CITY). unfortunately this particular book is a YA, but I'd be happy to send you a copy if it gets published...I'll even sign it.

    "To my Dearest Sedative..

    the inspiration for my writing, my love, and my life..

    I owe it all to you,

    jt."

    maybe something like that? (see, I write scifi/fantasy, heh heh)
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 08, 2008 1:54 PM GMT
    Add more details! Details! Details!

    Like:

    "To my Dearest Sedative..

    the inspiration for my writing, my love, and my life..

    I owe it all to you.

    jt.

    P.S. Expect a brand new jet-black Nissan GT-R this Christmas*

    Now that's more like it. icon_lol.gif

    Seriously though. Good luck with it! icon_razz.gif

    I'm actually rereading the Last Herald-Mage trilogy atm (e-books this time, and sequentially). I'm surprised because it seems like I may not have read Magic's Pawn at all. icon_confused.gif I might have confused it with another from the series I did buy, I have a tendency to remember book covers rather than contents. I do remember Valyn being mentioned in the books set in later ages in valdemar... I just never thought he was shey'a'chern. Other than that, all the Valdemar lore is coming back, and it's fun. Nostalgic LOL. Words like shey'a'chern, shin'a'in, and tayledras (tale'edras in later ages if I'm not mistaken) and their effortless familiarity bring back memories of being a kid again. icon_razz.gif I enjoyed Magic's Pawn very much, though it is a bit more on the young adult target readership, but who cares? I also enjoyed Harry Potter anyway. icon_lol.gif Starting on Magic's Promise now...
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    Dec 08, 2008 2:17 PM GMT
    Melanie Rawn's Exiles series has a couple of gay characters in it. I think that it's a really good series and the magic is amazing too. Just check it out sometime
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    Dec 08, 2008 2:26 PM GMT
    Well, I did like Gregory Maguire's _Son Of a Witch_, the sequel to _Wicked_. Fun guy-on-guy scene, but I'm still not convinced whether the main character was really gay, or just opportunistic and confused.

    There was another book that was out in 2001. I'm afraid I don't remember the title or author: a British guy is a graduate assistant to a physics professor who develops the ability to send something small back through time. The kid hijacks it, sends a superconcetrated sterility formula into the the well in the neighbourhood where Hitler is born. Then, he wakes up the next morning in the world he created. Has anyone read it? Anyone remember the title/author?
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    Dec 08, 2008 2:31 PM GMT
    i really enjoyed arthur c clarke's "songs of distant earth" - most of the characters in the book had a relatively liberal outlook on sexuality, and some of them weren't averse to experimentation. it's all left up to the imagination for the greater part though - nothing gratuitous mentioned at all, which isn't a bad thing at all; would have ruined an otherwise great book!
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    Dec 08, 2008 3:32 PM GMT
    stormboy83 saidi really enjoyed arthur c clarke's "songs of distant earth" - most of the characters in the book had a relatively liberal outlook on sexuality, and some of them weren't averse to experimentation. it's all left up to the imagination for the greater part though - nothing gratuitous mentioned at all, which isn't a bad thing at all; would have ruined an otherwise great book!


    Oooh. Forgot about this too. To be honest, though, there were like exactly two 'hints' of homoeroticism in this book. One in which a crewmember had a sex and surfing spree with a bunch of male islander natives (and ended up dead and revived), and another in the description of the island romeo who had the unfortunate accident with the ice transfer thingie.

    This wasn't one of Clarke's better works though. :/ It's great speculative fiction as usual (especially on cultural and ecological themes), but not much of a plot. Reminds me of Cradle which was probably the most boring Clarke book ever. His Rama and Space Odyssey series are truly classics though.

    Oh and Thalassa's system of choosing a president was hilarious! icon_biggrin.gif
  • DuggerPDX

    Posts: 386

    Dec 08, 2008 3:47 PM GMT
    stormboy83 saidi really enjoyed arthur c clarke's "songs of distant earth" - most of the characters in the book had a relatively liberal outlook on sexuality, and some of them weren't averse to experimentation. it's all left up to the imagination for the greater part though - nothing gratuitous mentioned at all, which isn't a bad thing at all; would have ruined an otherwise great book!


    I second this, I like all of his books, The Rama series was one of my favorites.

    If you want a good sci-fi/fantasy/ kinda sexy read pick-up George Nader's (yes the actor) book Chrome.
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    Dec 08, 2008 4:20 PM GMT
    I remember reading Chrome many years ago. I probably still have it lying around somewhere. It's the only book that comes to mind that I liked, though not particularly 'great sci-fi'.
    At that time, I had done a lot of searches for gay themed sci-fi but most of it was either homophobic or self-loathing and it really turned me away from it. I've often found the gay subculture of sci-fi to be far smaller (percentile) than the general populace. While a lot of sci-fi writers (real ones, not nut-jobs like Hubbard) consider themselves to be liberal, thier idea of liberal thinking was one of tolerance of the 'affliction of homosexuality' rather than an acceptance and understanding of it in a truly scientific way.

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    Dec 09, 2008 12:13 PM GMT
    *sigh* yah, like Star Trek. Apparently, Gene Roddenberry wanted to include a gay character, but died before he had the chance. Then a bunch of fans filmed few non-canon Star Trek films with lgbt characters. Ah, well, you get two gay characters into those uniforms, and you'll notice problems fast enough :p
  • MusicMan87

    Posts: 305

    Dec 09, 2008 12:26 PM GMT
    I like anything by Terry Brooks... Though he doesn't tend to use many LGBT characters... still freakin sweet books, need to read the new one...