THE SCALE OF THE UNIVERSE !!!

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    Dec 08, 2013 5:20 PM GMT
    http://htwins.net/scale2/

    One of my favorite things to go on when bored icon_cool.gif

    If you have not seen this before then enjoy icon_smile.gif
  • MikeW

    Posts: 6061

    Dec 08, 2013 5:36 PM GMT
    Thanks, that was fun! icon_smile.gif What kind of amazes me is that the majority of the knowledge base making up this exhibition is less than 100 years old. This exhibit compares relative *size* but what about relative *time*? Considering homo sapiens have been around for 10s of thousands of years, and *that* is a very thin slice of universal history, how is it all of a sudden the universe is coming to know itself *through us*?
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    Dec 08, 2013 9:35 PM GMT
    Very cool
    more so, because a friend of mine reminded me yesterday that Andromeda is on a collision course with the Milkyway--YOLO
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    Dec 08, 2013 9:41 PM GMT
    I've been kind of bored lately and have spent several days watching the Science Channel. I'm mind-boggled by what's going on out there. I'm also mind-boggled by the amount of money we spend to *find out* what's going on out there.
    350px-CMB_Timeline300_no_WMAP.jpg
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    Dec 08, 2013 10:00 PM GMT
    That was really cool.
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    Dec 08, 2013 11:04 PM GMT
    I've seen that site before (I think even posted on RJ) and I've long kept in mind relative scale, having as a kid had one of those galaxy "you are here" pointing pics on my desk, but I think looking at it this time made me take notice of the "weak force" (I guess symbolized by that "W"?) as the smallest confirmed length (10 to the minus 16th power) while the science theorizes down to the minus 35th power.

    So just looking back, which you'd think would be the easy view--hindsight being 20/20--we don't even know for certain half of what we suspect. While looking forward, science can so far measure up to 10 to the 27th power, the size of the "observable universe" as this presentation puts it, but we don't know yet how far that goes if expanding or do such measurements even apply when considering the possibility of parallel universes, other dimensions, that kind of stuff.

    So for all we know, what might be the distance from the closest edge of one universe to the opposite edge of an entirely different universe might very well be the shortest distance not yet known.

    With all we know, it seems like science still has work to do.
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2605

    Dec 09, 2013 12:12 AM GMT
    MikeW saidThanks, that was fun! icon_smile.gif What kind of amazes me is that the majority of the knowledge base making up this exhibition is less than 100 years old. This exhibit compares relative *size* but what about relative *time*? Considering homo sapiens have been around for 10s of thousands of years, and *that* is a very thin slice of universal history, how is it all of a sudden the universe is coming to know itself *through us*?


    The universe may already have begun to know itself long before we came along; we just inhabit a tiny part of it, and for a similarly small time. Who knows what`s gone on elsewhere and when? We may be very late comers to this party of consciousness!

    One of the amazing facts emerging from cosmology is how much of the universe is 'dark' and how little is 'light'; how the vastness we see out there is the exception, not the rule, in the universe.
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    Dec 09, 2013 12:18 AM GMT
    +1 to this post. that site rules
  • ASHDOD

    Posts: 1057

    Dec 09, 2013 12:19 AM GMT
    wow cool ,and in hebrew too ! icon_smile.gif
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    Dec 09, 2013 12:28 AM GMT
    MikeW saidThanks, that was fun! icon_smile.gif What kind of amazes me is that the majority of the knowledge base making up this exhibition is less than 100 years old. This exhibit compares relative *size* but what about relative *time*? Considering homo sapiens have been around for 10s of thousands of years, and *that* is a very thin slice of universal history, how is it all of a sudden the universe is coming to know itself *through us*?


    There's a hypothesis saying that the universe created human beings and intelligence to know itself. Just like we create something to test our own capabilities.

    This is quite educational.
  • MikeW

    Posts: 6061

    Dec 09, 2013 12:36 AM GMT
    Lincsbear saidWho knows what`s gone on elsewhere and when?

    Right, I thought of that. Could be there are other beings who have been around far longer and are far more evolved than we are. But what I am getting at is *our* knowledge of the cosmos has shifted significantly in a *very* short period of time. Prior to about a 100 years ago it was almost universally mythologically based. WHO KNEW planets weren't gods?... that the Earth itself was a planet?...that our little heliocentric cosmos was an insignificant mote in the grand canyon of the mega-cosmos we now know about? It just seems really odd to me that this way of looking at everything has just sort of sprung up in the last 100 years after 10s of thousands of years of human existence.
  • MikeW

    Posts: 6061

    Dec 09, 2013 12:41 AM GMT
    gayusasian82 saidThere's a hypothesis saying that the universe created human beings and intelligence to know itself. Just like we create something to test our own capabilities.

    This is quite educational.

    It gets even weirder when you begin to consider the quantum implications of awareness. Can a universe exist if there's nothing within it to perceive it? Or is it that awareness of a universe elevates its potential state into an actual one?
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2605

    Dec 09, 2013 1:11 AM GMT
    MikeW said
    Lincsbear saidWho knows what`s gone on elsewhere and when?

    Right, I thought of that. Could be there are other beings who have been around far longer and are far more evolved than we are. But what I am getting at is *our* knowledge of the cosmos has shifted significantly in a *very* short period of time. Prior to about a 100 years ago it was almost universally mythologically based. WHO KNEW planets weren't gods?... that the Earth itself was a planet?...that our little heliocentric cosmos was an insignificant mote in the grand canyon of the mega-cosmos we now know about? It just seems really odd to me that this way of looking at everything has just sort of sprung up in the last 100 years after 10s of thousands of years of human existence.


    I don`t think this modern, larger, and rational knowledge of the universe is quite as young as a hundred years old. Nor has it emerged suddenly in that time. It`s been gathering speed and momentum since at least the Renaissance, I`d say. Maybe even further back to the ancient Greek philosophers, some of whom had very modern sounding ideas of the universe(natural rather than supernatural, amazingly large, and amenable to human reason, etc.)But these ideas were isolated and mostly lost in the Dark Ages.
    I think maybe the Industrial Revolution has changed things, and allowed western societies to devote more resources and people to researching these abstract questions; and linked these people up, allowing greater discussion and questioning of theories, finding ideas that explain the facts better, and thus building knowledge on knowledge, etc. Unsurprisingly, the pace of progress had accelerated rapidly in recent times.
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    Dec 09, 2013 1:15 AM GMT
    MikeW said
    gayusasian82 saidThere's a hypothesis saying that the universe created human beings and intelligence to know itself. Just like we create something to test our own capabilities.

    This is quite educational.

    It gets even weirder when you begin to consider the quantum implications of awareness. Can a universe exist if there's nothing within it to perceive it? Or is it that awareness of a universe elevates its potential state into an actual one?

    Oh please dont ask that question!
    It makes my brain go 'round inside my head. icon_wink.gif
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    Dec 09, 2013 2:44 AM GMT
    This...
    MikeW said... how is it all of a sudden the universe is coming to know itself *through us*?

    ...& this...

    MikeW said[/cite}...Can a universe exist if there's nothing within it to perceive it? Or is it that awareness of a universe elevates its potential state into an actual one?[/quote]

    ...are both inquiries of the ego, separations/elevations of the self.

    ...whereas this...

    [quote][cite]Lincsbear said
    The universe may already have begun to know itself long before we came along; we just inhabit a tiny part of it, and for a similarly small time. Who knows what`s gone on elsewhere and when? We may be very late comers to this party of consciousness!

    One of the amazing facts emerging from cosmology is how much of the universe is 'dark' and how little is 'light'; how the vastness we see out there is the exception, not the rule, in the universe.


    ...might be viewing or interpreting universe without the delusional ego. I like also how Linc put light and dark in quotes because isn't that also a matter of perspective.

    Still, you have to be careful because it is so easy to interject ego as shown by "universe may already have begun to know" as if it didn't always know in order to be universe.

    In other words, if the primordially pure state of being is the pre-bang oneness for ease of conceptualizing and lack of better words, then universe arises spontaneously simply in, inconceivably to our minds, knowing itself. For in knowing itself is a delineation of the self which then is in that moment no longer the un-delineated oneness.

    So what you might view as the universe "getting to know yourself" might simply be variations, even celebrations--if not demonic delusions haha--of expression.

    And then how humanity relates to that might be clarified by the Toltec view of universe being these innumerable strands of consciousness and of humans being the energy balls with an assemblage point riding those waves of consciousness.

    So then it is not the ego of our ever awakening awareness which makes universe conscious, but as you jest, that we're simply late to the party. Though that scheduling might conflict with evolving random mutations.

  • OMGitsRoy

    Posts: 277

    Dec 09, 2013 2:47 AM GMT
    Thanks for that. Very cool! Really puts things in perspective icon_biggrin.gif
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    Dec 09, 2013 2:54 AM GMT
    Honestly, for me, all this talk of how our human consciousness had made the universe aware of itself is just another feeble attempt by our ego to try to make our place in the universe seem more important than it is actually is. If there is one key takeaway from the website link is that we are an insignificant and tiny part of the universe, but for our egos this is really hard to accept.
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    Dec 09, 2013 2:56 AM GMT
    There were quarks but no gluons! icon_cry.gif
  • ThatSwimmerGu...

    Posts: 3755

    Dec 09, 2013 3:01 AM GMT
    awesome!
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    Dec 09, 2013 3:24 AM GMT
    unfounded7 saidThere were quarks but no gluons! icon_cry.gif

    Are gluons those sparkly things that strippers put on their nipples?
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    Dec 09, 2013 3:44 AM GMT
    Lumpyoatmeal said
    Are gluons those sparkly things that strippers put on their nipples?


    icon_eek.gif
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    Dec 09, 2013 4:01 AM GMT
    Read this Three Body Trilogy.
    This book has a very deep thinking about the universe, different cultures and ourselves. It will make a great great sci-fi movie because it's deep and has many novel thoughts.

    http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/18245965-the-three-body-problem
    18245965.jpg
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    Dec 09, 2013 6:22 AM GMT
    Cool! Thanks for sharing.
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    Dec 09, 2013 6:27 AM GMT
    unfounded7 saidThere were quarks but no gluons! icon_cry.gif


    Don't be sad. Perhaps you just can't see them because they hadronized into colorless particles. (A little geek humor. Now back to our regular programming.)
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    Dec 09, 2013 6:33 AM GMT
    Well that kept me entertained for a long time. Thanks
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