Republicans losing it over new Obamacare data: Why their position is collapsing

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 27, 2014 2:43 AM GMT
    Obamacare enrollment could hit 7 million before the midterms; meanwhile, GOP still has no answer for beneficiaries

    http://www.salon.com/2014/03/25/republicans_losing_it_over_new_obamacare_data_why_their_position_is_collapsing/

    I think the biggest problem for Republicans is the one we started with before Obamacare. The majority of Americans want affordable healthcare and Republicans aren't offering an alternative.
  • creature

    Posts: 5197

    Mar 27, 2014 11:23 PM GMT
    WASHINGTON -- The number of people who have chosen a health care plan through a state or federal exchange topped 6 million on Thursday, putting the administration ahead of revised projections with several days before the enrollment deadline.


    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/27/obamacare-enrollment_n_5044003.html

    You're right, CarolinaMan, 7 million looks attainable before the mid-terms.
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 27, 2014 11:46 PM GMT
    The irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.
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    Mar 27, 2014 11:50 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    CarolinaMan saidObamacare enrollment could hit 7 million before the midterms; meanwhile, GOP still has no answer for beneficiaries

    http://www.salon.com/2014/03/25/republicans_losing_it_over_new_obamacare_data_why_their_position_is_collapsing/

    I think the biggest problem for Republicans is the one we started with before Obamacare. The majority of Americans want affordable healthcare and Republicans aren't offering an alternative.


    3% of the uninsured have signed up.

    48 million uninsured
    +5 million who lost their insurance plans
    =53 million uninsured

    6 million signups, of which 25% were previously uninsured = 1.5 million previous uninsured signed up.

    A primary goal of Obamacare was to get the 48 million uninsured to be insured. Anyone who thinks 3% = success has very very very low standards.

    Oh, and by the way, 100% of the uninsured are REQUIRED to sign up for health insurance by March 31, 2014 (now pushed back to "sometime in April, 2014").


    "+5 million who lost their insurance plans"

    I'm one of them. $2,943 for the old plan and $8,609 for the new, which I can't afford consistently month after month so now I'm uninsured.
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    Mar 27, 2014 11:52 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.


    Really. All Conservatives? 80%? 43%? 10%? 2.5%?


    "conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money"

    Such as Truman, JFK and LBJ?
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    Mar 28, 2014 12:01 AM GMT
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.

    Republicans are merely obeying their corporate campaign donors, who for various selfish (and mostly misguided) reasons think universal health care is not in their best short-term bottom line interests.

    Plus at the moment the Republican Party is obliged to dance to the Tea Party tune, of no government support for anyone. Not Social Security, not Medicare, not social services, not anything. Unless these programs can be made into profitable enterprises for corporations, who will in turn contribute money to Republicans. A cozy vicious circle.

    The neocons gave us war with Iraq & Afghanistan, and you see the tragic and national debt-causing results. Now they want war with Syria, North Korea, and possibly Russia as well.

    It was a Republican President, Dwight Eisenhower, who warned us about the dangers of the military-industrial complex. Ironic that Republicans remain slaves to that matrix.
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    Mar 28, 2014 12:06 AM GMT
    ART_DECO said
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.

    Republicans are merely obeying their corporate campaign donors, who for various selfish (and mostly misguided) reasons think universal health care is not in their best short-term bottom line interests.

    Plus at the moment the Republican Party is obliged to dance to the Tea Party tune, of no government support for anyone. Not Social Security, not Medicare, not social services, not anything. Unless these programs can be made into profitable enterprises for corporations, who will in turn contribute money to Republicans. A cozy vicious circle.

    The neocons gave us war with Iraq & Afghanistan, and you see the tragic and national debt-causing results. Now they want war with Syria, North Korea, and possibly Russia as well.

    It was a Republican President, Dwight Eisenhower, who warned us about the dangers of the military-industrial complex. Ironic that Republicans remain slaves to that matrix.


    "no government support for anyone. Not Social Security, not Medicare, not social services"

    Yeah, when did we say that?

    "Now they want war with Syria"

    Obama was a Republican?

    "Unless these programs can be made into profitable enterprises for corporations, who will in turn contribute money to Republicans"

    So you really want to talk about labor unions and democrats? Seriously?



  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 12:27 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.


    Really. All Conservatives? 80%? 43%? 10%? 2.5%?


    Comprehension skills lacking on this one.
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 12:31 AM GMT
    freedomisntfree said
    southbeach1500 said
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.


    Really. All Conservatives? 80%? 43%? 10%? 2.5%?


    "conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money"

    Such as Truman, JFK and LBJ?


    kind of hard to wage a war when you're dead. And about LBJ...

    http://www.lbjlib.utexas.edu/johnson/archives.hom/Dictabelt.hom/highlights/janapril1968/dirksenD1641-2/13706.mp3
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 12:36 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    coolarmydude said
    southbeach1500 said
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.


    Really. All Conservatives? 80%? 43%? 10%? 2.5%?


    Comprehension skills lacking on this one.


    You bolded All Conservatives so I'm guessing you mean all Conservatives believe in indefinite wars etc.

    It's disappointing that in this day and age people still paint with a very broad (and incorrect) brush.


    Those were your words, and the bold was a contrast to the part that I said, which is also in bold.

    Comprehension skills...

    "that conservatives" is a general statement that doesn't mean "all conservatives."
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    Mar 28, 2014 12:39 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.


    Really. All Conservatives? 80%? 43%? 10%? 2.5%?


    I think the true number of conservatives who oppose the Affordable Care Act are very few. Conservatives also don't support wars over healthcare.

    Republican political strategists are playing their usual games but smart conservatives know that getting more Americans insured is a wise and conservative plan. That's why I think more and more conservatives won't fall for the Republican bullshit much longer.
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 12:44 AM GMT
    coolarmydude saidAnd about LBJ...

    http://www.lbjlib.utexas.edu/johnson/archives.hom/Dictabelt.hom/highlights/janapril1968/dirksenD1641-2/13706.mp3

    And more:

    http://www.lbjlib.utexas.edu/johnson/archives.hom/Dictabelt.hom/highlights/janapril1968/nixonD1202-15/13710.mp3

    Hindsight, surprise, has pretty much shown that Nixon was being less than truthful with the old man on that day. What we know is that Nixon had campaigned on the promise that he had a “secret plan” for ending the war; meanwhile, GOP activists worked behind the scenes to convince Vietnamese diplomats that “Nixon will do better by you” if they only delayed peace talks until Nixon was in office (whether Nixon orchestrated this subterfuge is the rub of the dispute in the phone conversation between the two titans and has been contentious ever since). A Nixon supporter, Anna Chennault, apparently played a key role:

    Wikipedia summarizes from Christopher Hitchens’ book “The Trial of Henry Kissinger”:

    Chennault played a crucial role on behalf of the Nixon campaign in the wrecking of the 1968 Paris peace talks which could have ended the Vietnam War. She arranged the contact with South Vietnamese Ambassador Bui Diem whom Richard Nixon met in secret from July 1968 in New York. It was through Chennault’s intercession that Nixon advised Saigon to refuse participation in the talks, promising a better deal once elected. Records of FBI wiretaps show that Chennault phoned Bui Diem on November 2 with the message “hold on, we are gonna win.” President Nguyen Van Thieu obliged and the talks achieved almost no progress by the time Johnson left office.


    http://parallelnarratives.com/audio-lbj-and-nixon-on-vietnam-and-1968-presidential-election/
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    Mar 28, 2014 1:00 AM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree said
    southbeach1500 said
    coolarmydude saidThe irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money, yet don't have the patience for people to get health insurance and think that not having it is okay.


    Really. All Conservatives? 80%? 43%? 10%? 2.5%?


    "conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money"

    Such as Truman, JFK and LBJ?


    kind of hard to wage a war when you're dead. And about LBJ...

    http://www.lbjlib.utexas.edu/johnson/archives.hom/Dictabelt.hom/highlights/janapril1968/dirksenD1641-2/13706.mp3


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Of_Tonkin
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 1:03 AM GMT
    freedomisntfree said
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Of_Tonkin


    And he was trying to end the war by 1968, on his watch. That's not an indefinite war.
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    Mar 28, 2014 1:17 AM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree said
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Of_Tonkin


    And he was trying to end the war by 1968, on his watch. That's not an indefinite war.


    Key word "trying"

    but didn't.
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 1:19 AM GMT
    freedomisntfree said
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree said
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Of_Tonkin


    And he was trying to end the war by 1968, on his watch. That's not an indefinite war.


    Key word "trying"

    but didn't.


    Yeah, thanks to the REPUBLICANS WHO SABOTAGED HIS ATTEMPT FOR THEIR OWN ENDS.

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    Mar 28, 2014 1:22 AM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree said
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree said
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Of_Tonkin


    And he was trying to end the war by 1968, on his watch. That's not an indefinite war.


    Key word "trying"

    but didn't.


    Yeah, thanks to the REPUBLICANS WHO SABOTAGED HIS ATTEMPT FOR THEIR OWN ENDS.


    ALWAYS REPUBLICANS WITH YOU LEFTIES ISN'T IT? BIG BANG WAS THE FAULT OF REPUBLICANS WAS IT NOT?

    Naw, got better things to do ... like go work out.
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 1:23 AM GMT
    freedomisntfree said
    ALWAYS REPUBLICANS WITH YOU LEFTIES ISN'T IT? BIG BANG WAS THE FAULT OF REPUBLICANS WAS IT NOT?

    Naw, got better things to do ... like go work out.


    You're the one who brought up LBJ. icon_rolleyes.gif

    ...in an Obamacare thread. icon_redface.gif
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    Mar 28, 2014 1:24 AM GMT
    Why do republicans hate any American who is not super wealthy or a religiously based corporation?
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    Mar 28, 2014 1:24 AM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree said
    ALWAYS REPUBLICANS WITH YOU LEFTIES ISN'T IT? BIG BANG WAS THE FAULT OF REPUBLICANS WAS IT NOT?

    Naw, got better things to do ... like go work out.


    You're the one who brought up LBJ. icon_rolleyes.gif


    HOW MANY TIMES PER SECOND ARE YOU GOING TO SIT THERE AND POUND ON YOUR REFRESH? icon_rolleyes.gificon_rolleyes.gif

    and Truman and JFK
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    Mar 28, 2014 1:26 AM GMT
    Actually you brought it up

    "The irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money,"
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Mar 28, 2014 1:33 AM GMT
    freedomisntfree saidActually you brought it up

    "The irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money,"


    tumblr_inline_mpdleqmIKa1qz4rgp.gif

    I still didn't mention LBJ. Try again.

    And I merely pointed out the irony between war and healthcare, where one kills and the other saves lives.

    At least I connected my point to Obamacare, Genius.
  • PolitiMAC

    Posts: 728

    Mar 28, 2014 2:49 AM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree saidActually you brought it up

    "The irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money,"


    tumblr_inline_mpdleqmIKa1qz4rgp.gif

    I still didn't mention LBJ. Try again.

    And I merely pointed out the irony between war and healthcare, where one kills and the other saves lives.

    At least I connected my point to Obamacare, Genius.


    "Healthcare saves lives"

    Yet it is taking more money away from those who have less than it would have if they got their own healthcare.

    Why do you still think Obamacare is a good idea when it is PROVING to not be.
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    Mar 28, 2014 3:07 AM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    freedomisntfree saidActually you brought it up

    "The irony is that conservatives believe in indefinite wars that cost lives and money,"


    tumblr_inline_mpdleqmIKa1qz4rgp.gif

    I still didn't mention LBJ. Try again.

    And I merely pointed out the irony between war and healthcare, where one kills and the other saves lives.

    At least I connected my point to Obamacare, Genius.


    "Genius". Thanks. At least you got one thing correct.
  • creature

    Posts: 5197

    Mar 28, 2014 3:26 AM GMT
    According to a new Kaiser Family Foundation poll, nearly half would like for the health care law to stay and be improved upon:

    half-want-congress-to-keep-law-and-impro

    http://wonkwire.rollcall.com/2014/03/26/poll-let-obamacare-stay/

    Most Democrats want to keep the law and improve it.

    Most Independents want to keep the law and improve it.

    Most Republicans want to repeal and not replace, but the margin is not as wide as Democrats and Independents with their second choice. which for Republicans is to replace with the Republican version. But the third choice, which is to keep the law and improve it only trails by 1% to their second choice.