Iowa Governor Signs Away Separation of Church and State

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    Apr 12, 2014 10:49 PM GMT
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    There is apparently no separation of church and state in Iowa, at least according to Governor Terry E. Branstad (Republican of course), who signed a proclamation “in the name and by the authority of the State of Iowa,” inviting “all Iowans who choose to join in thoughtful prayer and humble repentance according to II Chronicles 7:14 in favor of our state and nation to come together on July 14, 2014.”
    Of course, you can’t do that. But Branstad did it anyway:



    It turns out that no matter what the United States Constitution promises, Republicans will ignore it at every opportunity, if not actively attempt to overturn it. And there isn’t much the federal government can do about it. If the federal government were to send the troops in every time a Republican governor or legislature got out of hand, we would have to bring all the boys and girls home from overseas. That’s how bad nullification efforts have gotten. And of course, you know you can’t count on the courts. Even if a lower court rules against the Republicans, they’ll take it to the Supreme Court and you know what that means.



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    Apr 12, 2014 10:58 PM GMT
    Interesting they're doing it on French Bastille Day. Are they planning to guillotine dissenters? The French Revolution did a more effective job of establishing the separation of Church & State than our own US Constitution has done.
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    Apr 13, 2014 5:59 AM GMT
    Eck

    Token little boy for camera.
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    Apr 13, 2014 12:05 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Scruffypup saidthumbnail
    There is apparently no separation of church and state in Iowa, at least according to Governor Terry E. Branstad (Republican of course), who signed a proclamation “in the name and by the authority of the State of Iowa,” inviting “all Iowans who choose to join in thoughtful prayer and humble repentance according to II Chronicles 7:14 in favor of our state and nation to come together on July 14, 2014.”
    Of course, you can’t do that. But Branstad did it anyway:



    It turns out that no matter what the United States Constitution promises, Republicans will ignore it at every opportunity, if not actively attempt to overturn it. And there isn’t much the federal government can do about it. If the federal government were to send the troops in every time a Republican governor or legislature got out of hand, we would have to bring all the boys and girls home from overseas. That’s how bad nullification efforts have gotten. And of course, you know you can’t count on the courts. Even if a lower court rules against the Republicans, they’ll take it to the Supreme Court and you know what that means.







    Even if a lower court rules against the Republicans, they’ll take it to the Supreme Court and you know what that means.

    True. Look how Roberts basically rewrote Obamacare so it would pass "Constitutional muster." So I guess we DO know "what that means" if the Republicans take it to the Supreme Court. icon_rolleyes.gif


    And look at how the Supreme Court struck down DOMA.
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    Apr 13, 2014 4:38 PM GMT
    It's a "proclamation" with no force of law. It's merely ceremonial.

    Pick a better battle, this one will go nowhere.
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    Apr 13, 2014 4:41 PM GMT
    Art_Deco saidInteresting they're doing it on French Bastille Day. Are they planning to guillotine dissenters? The French Revolution did a more effective job of establishing the separation of Church & State than our own US Constitution has done.


    You're certifiably insane, dude. You don't seem to know much about the French Revolution, with blood flowing down the streets, and women and children hoisting up the gory entrails of political enemies like flags for "the glory of the Revolution."
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    Apr 13, 2014 4:52 PM GMT
    May 7, 1998:

    WASHINGTON (CNN) -- As proclaimed by President Clinton [A DEMOCRAT], Thursday is a national day of prayer -- a time set aside to call attention to religious faith. But as CNN Correspondent Jonathan Karl reports, not all Americans think it's necessary to make prayer a public event.

    http://www.cnn.com/US/9805/07/national.day.of.prayer/

    Now shut it.
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    Apr 13, 2014 4:58 PM GMT
    Shut yer hole once again.

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2013/05/01/presidential-proclamation-national-day-prayer-2013

    BARACK OBAMA

    [A DEMOCRAT]

    Presidential Proclamation -- National Day of Prayer, 2013

    NATIONAL DAY OF PRAYER, 2013

    - - - - - - -

    BY THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

    A PROCLAMATION

    Americans have long turned to prayer both in times of joy and times of sorrow. On their voyage to the New World, the earliest settlers prayed that they would "rejoice together, mourn together, labor, and suffer together, always having before our eyes our commission and community in the work." From that day forward, Americans have prayed as a means of uniting, guiding, and healing. In times of hardship and tragedy, and in periods of peace and prosperity, prayer has provided reassurance, sustenance, and affirmation of common purpose.

    Prayer brings communities together and can be a wellspring of strength and support. In the aftermath of senseless acts of violence, the prayers of countless Americans signal to grieving families and a suffering community that they are not alone. Their pain is a shared pain, and their hope a shared hope. Regardless of religion or creed, Americans reflect on the sacredness of life and express their sympathy for the wounded, offering comfort and holding up a light in an hour of darkness.

    All of us have the freedom to pray and exercise our faiths openly. Our laws protect these God-given liberties, and rightly so. Today and every day, prayers will be offered in houses of worship, at community gatherings, in our homes, and in neighborhoods all across our country. Let us give thanks for the freedom to practice our faith as we see fit, whether individually or in fellowship.

    On this day, let us remember in our thoughts and prayers all those affected by recent events, such as the Boston Marathon bombings, the Newtown, Connecticut shootings, and the explosion in West, Texas. Let us pray for the police officers, firefighters, and other first responders who put themselves in harm's way to protect their fellow Americans. Let us also pray for the safety of our brave men and women in uniform and their families who serve and sacrifice for our country. Let us come together to pray for peace and goodwill today and in the days ahead as we work to meet the great challenges of our time.

    The Congress, by Public Law 100-307, as amended, has called on the President to issue each year a proclamation designating the first Thursday in May as a "National Day of Prayer."

    NOW, THEREFORE, I, BARACK OBAMA, President of the United States of America, by virtue of the authority vested in me by the Constitution and the laws of the United States, do hereby proclaim May 2, 2013, as a National Day of Prayer. I join the citizens of our Nation in giving thanks, in accordance with our own faiths and consciences, for our many freedoms and blessings, and in asking for God's continued guidance, mercy, and protection.

    IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this first day of May, in the year of our Lord two thousand thirteen, and of the Independence of the United States of America the two hundred and thirty-seventh.

    BARACK OBAMA [A DEMOCRAT]
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    Apr 13, 2014 5:03 PM GMT
    Scruffypup saidthumbnail
    There is apparently no separation of church and state in Iowa, at least according to Governor Terry E. Branstad (Republican of course), who signed a proclamation “in the name and by the authority of the State of Iowa,” inviting “all Iowans who choose to join in thoughtful prayer and humble repentance according to II Chronicles 7:14 in favor of our state and nation to come together on July 14, 2014.”
    Of course, you can’t do that. But Branstad did it anyway:



    It turns out that no matter what the United States Constitution promises, Republicans will ignore it at every opportunity, if not actively attempt to overturn it. And there isn’t much the federal government can do about it. If the federal government were to send the troops in every time a Republican governor or legislature got out of hand, we would have to bring all the boys and girls home from overseas. That’s how bad nullification efforts have gotten. And of course, you know you can’t count on the courts. Even if a lower court rules against the Republicans, they’ll take it to the Supreme Court and you know what that means.





    Its especially disgusting that he put that little boy there as an image-enhancement. That little kid has no idea what that paper actually means
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    Apr 13, 2014 5:15 PM GMT
    O please, politicians use kids for photo-ops all the time. You think the little black boy that Obama posed with for the signing of the ACA had any idea what the fuck the ACA says? OBAMA doesn't even know what's in the bill.

    Give it up, this one will go nowhere.
  • wellwell

    Posts: 2265

    Apr 13, 2014 6:56 PM GMT
    ...As these churches are doing more & more political endorsements & campaigning; the Governor, should have revoked all these churches "tax-exempt" status!
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Apr 13, 2014 7:12 PM GMT
    wellwell said...As these churches are doing more & more political endorsements & campaigning; the Governor, should have revoked all these churches "tax-exempt" status!



    +1

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    Apr 13, 2014 7:22 PM GMT
    This has nothing to do with separation of church and state.
    The separation of church and state issue that you are trying to raise is found nowhere in the Constitution of the U.S.

    For many years congressional sessions as well as many government meetings were opened with prayer beginning with the founders. If you bothered to learn and understand American history you would know that many of the founders spoke of attending Church services that were held in the chambers of the capitol with rotating visiting pastors.

    The separation of church and state came up in letters between the Danbury Baptist Association and Thomas Jefferson. The DBA was concerned that since they were a religious minority in Connecticut that their religious liberties were not immutable rights, but privileges granted by the legislature. Jefferson's reply did not address their concerns about problems with the establishment of religion on a state level, but only on a national level. Jefferson's 1802 letter contains the phrase 'wall of separation between church and separation" and specifically refers to the establishment of an national religion as some European countries had/have.

    Maybe if the public schools taught from the actual words of the founders and instead of from the point of indoctrination you and others might actually know this.

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    Apr 13, 2014 7:27 PM GMT
    RoadsterRacer87 said
    Scruffypup saidthumbnail
    There is apparently no separation of church and state in Iowa, at least according to Governor Terry E. Branstad (Republican of course), who signed a proclamation “in the name and by the authority of the State of Iowa,” inviting “all Iowans who choose to join in thoughtful prayer and humble repentance according to II Chronicles 7:14 in favor of our state and nation to come together on July 14, 2014.”
    Of course, you can’t do that. But Branstad did it anyway:



    It turns out that no matter what the United States Constitution promises, Republicans will ignore it at every opportunity, if not actively attempt to overturn it. And there isn’t much the federal government can do about it. If the federal government were to send the troops in every time a Republican governor or legislature got out of hand, we would have to bring all the boys and girls home from overseas. That’s how bad nullification efforts have gotten. And of course, you know you can’t count on the courts. Even if a lower court rules against the Republicans, they’ll take it to the Supreme Court and you know what that means.





    Its especially disgusting that he put that little boy there as an image-enhancement. That little kid has no idea what that paper actually means


    You mean like in this photo op?
    I get it, try and explain how it is somehow different when the person doing it is someone you agree with.

    [url][/url]
  • AMoonHawk

    Posts: 11406

    Apr 13, 2014 7:31 PM GMT
    It is just a proclamation ... it is not a law. And it is just for a day July 14, 2014.

    Just like when a Governor or Mayor signs a proclamation declaring the day Gay Pride day .... does that mean everyone in the city has to attend or be part of Gay Pride? ... no it doesn't.
  • creature

    Posts: 5197

    Apr 13, 2014 7:39 PM GMT
    shybuffguy said
    RoadsterRacer87 said
    Scruffypup saidthumbnail
    There is apparently no separation of church and state in Iowa, at least according to Governor Terry E. Branstad (Republican of course), who signed a proclamation “in the name and by the authority of the State of Iowa,” inviting “all Iowans who choose to join in thoughtful prayer and humble repentance according to II Chronicles 7:14 in favor of our state and nation to come together on July 14, 2014.”
    Of course, you can’t do that. But Branstad did it anyway:



    It turns out that no matter what the United States Constitution promises, Republicans will ignore it at every opportunity, if not actively attempt to overturn it. And there isn’t much the federal government can do about it. If the federal government were to send the troops in every time a Republican governor or legislature got out of hand, we would have to bring all the boys and girls home from overseas. That’s how bad nullification efforts have gotten. And of course, you know you can’t count on the courts. Even if a lower court rules against the Republicans, they’ll take it to the Supreme Court and you know what that means.





    Its especially disgusting that he put that little boy there as an image-enhancement. That little kid has no idea what that paper actually means


    You mean like in this photo op?
    I get it, try and explain how it is somehow different when the person doing it is someone you agree with.

    [url][/url]


    Sorry, Shybuffguy, but at least we know why that boy is standing next to President Obama.

    That is 11-year old Marcelas Owen, who lost his 27-year old mother who died of pulmonary hypertension. She became too sick to work and lost her insurance as a result of losing her job.

    http://www.king5.com/news/local/Obama-pays-tribute-to-Seattle-boy-while-signing-health-care-bill-88923357.html

    So with the facts we have so far, we're pretty sure Owen has an idea of what that paper actually means. He has done several interviews with papers and has made television appearances as the health care law relates to his mother's struggle, and consequently his struggle as a result of losing her.

    185274_original.gif
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    Apr 13, 2014 7:42 PM GMT
    creature said
    shybuffguy said
    RoadsterRacer87 said
    Scruffypup saidthumbnail
    There is apparently no separation of church and state in Iowa, at least according to Governor Terry E. Branstad (Republican of course), who signed a proclamation “in the name and by the authority of the State of Iowa,” inviting “all Iowans who choose to join in thoughtful prayer and humble repentance according to II Chronicles 7:14 in favor of our state and nation to come together on July 14, 2014.”
    Of course, you can’t do that. But Branstad did it anyway:



    It turns out that no matter what the United States Constitution promises, Republicans will ignore it at every opportunity, if not actively attempt to overturn it. And there isn’t much the federal government can do about it. If the federal government were to send the troops in every time a Republican governor or legislature got out of hand, we would have to bring all the boys and girls home from overseas. That’s how bad nullification efforts have gotten. And of course, you know you can’t count on the courts. Even if a lower court rules against the Republicans, they’ll take it to the Supreme Court and you know what that means.





    Its especially disgusting that he put that little boy there as an image-enhancement. That little kid has no idea what that paper actually means


    You mean like in this photo op?
    I get it, try and explain how it is somehow different when the person doing it is someone you agree with.

    [url][/url]


    Sorry, Shybuffguy, but at least we know why that boy is standing next to President Obama.

    That is 11-year old Marcelas Owen, who lost his 27-year old mother who died of pulmonary hypertension. She became too sick to work and lost her insurance as a result of losing her job.

    http://www.king5.com/news/local/Obama-pays-tribute-to-Seattle-boy-while-signing-health-care-bill-88923357.html

    So with the facts we have so far, we're pretty sure Owen has an idea of what that paper actually means. He has done several interviews with papers and has made television appearances as the health care law relates to his mother's struggle, and consequently his struggle as a result of losing her.


    Like I said, try and go through the mental gymnastics to explain why using a child is different when it's someone you agree with. And right on target, you bit!
  • creature

    Posts: 5197

    Apr 13, 2014 7:50 PM GMT
    No, ShyBuffGuy. What Roadster brought up is that the kid next to the Iowa Governor likely has no idea of what's being signed, which would make him an empty prop. That's different from Owen who does know—it's actually something very close to him because of what happened to his mother. So at least there is some purpose of him being there.

    That is the distinction.
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    Apr 13, 2014 8:01 PM GMT
    creature saidNo, ShyBuffGuy. What Roadster brought up is that the kid next to the Iowa Governor likely has no idea of what's being signed, which would make him an empty prop. That's different from Owen who does know—it's actually something very close to him because of what happened to his mother. So at least there is some purpose of him being there.

    That is the distinction.



    Keep digging, I'm enjoying your ridiculous attempts at mental gymnastics to explain why the people you agree with are different than those you don't agree with.

    You really are quite entertaining this afternoon.
  • creature

    Posts: 5197

    Apr 13, 2014 8:10 PM GMT
    shybuffguy said
    creature saidNo, ShyBuffGuy. What Roadster brought up is that the kid next to the Iowa Governor likely has no idea of what's being signed, which would make him an empty prop. That's different from Owen who does know—it's actually something very close to him because of what happened to his mother. So at least there is some purpose of him being there.

    That is the distinction.



    Keep digging, I'm enjoying your ridiculous attempts at mental gymnastics to explain why the people you agree with are different than those you don't agree with.

    You really are quite entertaining this afternoon.


    That would make two of us who are entertained. Your failure to acknowledge militias yesterday was also good for a laugh.

    I don't know why you don't post more often. You can lighten up this place.
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    Apr 13, 2014 8:38 PM GMT
    Congress begins with prayer as does the Supreme Court.In our Pledge we say under God.As it was amended by President Eisenhower.The Ten Commandments are posted in the Supreme Court.Unless you are a militant atheist who wants to drive all religion from the public square...why not concentrate on more important things.I tell you if hell freezes over Americans will never tolerate a public square free of our Judeo Christian heritage.I would rather be celibate that allow the leftist atheist movemtn of today to succeed.Better to have another civil war and split into 2 nations.icon_smile.gif Ryan.
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    Apr 14, 2014 1:32 AM GMT
    creature said
    shybuffguy said
    creature saidNo, ShyBuffGuy. What Roadster brought up is that the kid next to the Iowa Governor likely has no idea of what's being signed, which would make him an empty prop. That's different from Owen who does know—it's actually something very close to him because of what happened to his mother. So at least there is some purpose of him being there.

    That is the distinction.



    Keep digging, I'm enjoying your ridiculous attempts at mental gymnastics to explain why the people you agree with are different than those you don't agree with.

    You really are quite entertaining this afternoon.


    That would make two of us who are entertained. Your failure to acknowledge militias yesterday was also good for a laugh.

    I don't know why you don't post more often. You can lighten up this place.


    A distinction without a difference. They are kids, used for photo-op purposes. As long as their parent/parents/guardian/guardians are ok with it, then I don't give a fuck.

    One kid got to meet the President; another got to meet the Governor. Awesome.

    Back the original bitchfest. Not a violation of the Constitution. Now shaddap.
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    Apr 14, 2014 1:39 AM GMT
    Jack_NNJ said
    Art_Deco saidInteresting they're doing it on French Bastille Day. Are they planning to guillotine dissenters? The French Revolution did a more effective job of establishing the separation of Church & State than our own US Constitution has done.

    You're certifiably insane, dude. You don't seem to know much about the French Revolution, with blood flowing down the streets, and women and children hoisting up the gory entrails of political enemies like flags for "the glory of the Revolution."

    I know the French Revolution quite well, thank you. And it was that irony in referencing it, thanks to Iowa having this religion day on Bastille Day, that I was relying upon.

    I wouldn't bandy the "insane" label around too freely if I were you, "dude". Not when your irrational knee-jerk response to my post reveals so much about your own state of mind. icon_wink.gif
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    Apr 14, 2014 1:30 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    Jack_NNJ said
    Art_Deco saidInteresting they're doing it on French Bastille Day. Are they planning to guillotine dissenters? The French Revolution did a more effective job of establishing the separation of Church & State than our own US Constitution has done.

    You're certifiably insane, dude. You don't seem to know much about the French Revolution, with blood flowing down the streets, and women and children hoisting up the gory entrails of political enemies like flags for "the glory of the Revolution."

    I know the French Revolution quite well, thank you. And it was that irony in referencing it, thanks to Iowa having this religion day on Bastille Day, that I was relying upon.

    I wouldn't bandy the "insane" label around too freely if I were you, "dude". Not when your irrational knee-jerk response to my post reveals so much about your own state of mind. icon_wink.gif


    If you had stopped after that first sentence, I'd believe you. But now you're reverse-engineering your story:

    The French Revolution did a more effective job of establishing the separation of Church & State than our own US Constitution has done.

    If that was irony, then I stand corrected and am duly chastised. But I don't believe it was.