Folsom Street Fair... uhh what?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 01, 2009 2:05 PM GMT
    In another blog someone posted a link to the Folsom Street Fair--something a have never heard about until today.

    I have learned speaking my mind can get me into trouble: making enemies, unknowingly condemning people or unknowingly "acting" morally superior to those who disagree with me.

    I'd rather not have that happen here or start a flame war.

    So I will ask a neutral question. I looked on the internet at pictures of the FSF and was shocked that there was public nudity and borderline sexual kinky acts being done in the open.

    (don't get me wrong, kinky stuff can be hot, in my eyes, and I'd love to be submissive me thinks... especially at the hands of some of your here!:twistedicon_smile.gif

    Question:

    How is that legal to do out in the open? I mean do they close off the street completely--which I’d actually be fine with... so long no minors or fundamentalists could peak at the festival... this would be equivalent to having the fair indoors in an enclosed building. I'm just wondering how it is legal... you know public dress codes and crap like that.

    PS: I'm an ignorant "gay Puritan" who does not know all of the stuff about gay culture yet. Catholic Guilt has warped my mind--but I do try to be open... it may take a while and some information. Main point: don't get offended by this thread--cope with my ignorance just until I have more info. icon_biggrin.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 01, 2009 3:58 PM GMT
    I don't know the legalities of it. It is the largest street festival in the country so this isn't exactly flying under the radar of city government. Like that other debauched festival, Mardi Gras, the fest organizers have to apply for a license and have the affair approved by city hall. There are indoor events like this all around the country that are far, far worse in terms of public decency. Convention halls host furries, swingers, kinksters, of every shape and size.

    But, if this sort of kinky goodness can't happen in the heart of the capital of the queer empire then this world just isn't worth living in.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 01, 2009 5:32 PM GMT
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folsom_Street_Fair

    "Children attend, usually with parental supervision, as city laws require public access to all city streets."

    Fundies also attend: http://americansfortruth.com/news/tolerance-gone-wild-in-san-francisco-as-cops-stand-by-amidst-folsom-street-fairs-public-perversions-and-widespread-nudity.html
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 01, 2009 6:12 PM GMT
    paradox saidhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folsom_Street_Fair

    "Children attend, usually with parental supervision, as city laws require public access to all city streets."

    Fundies also attend: http://americansfortruth.com/news/tolerance-gone-wild-in-san-francisco-as-cops-stand-by-amidst-folsom-street-fairs-public-perversions-and-widespread-nudity.html

    Thanks for the pertinent link. "Americans for Truth About Homosexuality" is an example of why I am not a big fan of nudity and sexually suggestive behavior at public gay events. These things become ammunition for our enemies, and I have no doubt that in California, where some of the wildest street behavior occurs, they played at least some part in the passage of Prop 8. I'm sure that for some voters, the anti-gay election propaganda seemed validated by this kind of questionable public gay conduct.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 01, 2009 7:47 PM GMT
    some of our friends in SF might shed some light on the legalities of it all, but from my experience, San Francisco is a very tolerant, live-and-let-live sort of city.

    I attended my first Folsom this past year. I can say it's a big ADULT festival. Not a GAY festival. Not a LEATHER-ONLY festival. I saw straight people, I saw gay people, I saw bi people, I saw everyone.

    Not crazy public debauchery everywhere; a little here and there. Lots of incredible costumes.

    SF police were there monitoring the crowds.

    It's as dirty as you want to make it. Paradox noted children attend from the Wikipedia article, my experience I saw no kiddos. It was certainly an adult event and there was nudity and I saw some limited sex acts. (Honestly, after a while, it wasn't "shocking" to see someone naked I was more like "oh look, another peen...")

    to the OP. Never worry about speaking your mind. You have an opinion, you are as entitled to it as someone is entitled to disagree respectfully with you.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 01, 2009 11:51 PM GMT
    paradox saidhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folsom_Street_Fair

    "Children attend, usually with parental supervision, as city laws require public access to all city streets."

    Fundies also attend: http://americansfortruth.com/news/tolerance-gone-wild-in-san-francisco-as-cops-stand-by-amidst-folsom-street-fairs-public-perversions-and-widespread-nudity.html


    Uh Wow. Jeeze. The religious Right has the key to passing the federal Marriage Admendment right on the streets of SF. I'm not saying their accusations are truthful/untruthful or biased/unbiased, but that site "Americans for Truth about Homosexuality" has the ability to use the Folsom Fair against the larger gay community.

    I need someone to talk to now... I feel sick to my stomach lol
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 12:06 AM GMT
    Yes if we are all just good little boys and girls then straight people will respect us and allow us to share in their state-sanctioned pagan rites and tax schemes.

    There are those of us still alive (wheeling around oxygen bottles) who remember the Folsom Street Fair for what it once was. Likewise some of us remember events like Southern Decadence from when it was, well, decadent.

    Personally, I refuse to live a heteronormative life built on the false belief that institutions...........................oh well, after thirty years of hearing this argument played out I don't even think I will bother to go on typing. Fuckit.
  • dfrourke

    Posts: 1062

    Jan 02, 2009 12:13 AM GMT
    COJock has for the most part captured the essence of this city...another example...Marijuana [and I don't use it]...although illegal, city supervisors have passed legislation mandating the police put enforcement of marijuana laws as one of their last priorities [meaning focus on the big stuff]...

    ...we have a number of street fairs almost every other week in the late summer and early fall months and there are ALWAYS at least one or two naked people in attendance...Folsom Street Fair, which is in its 25th Year in 2008, focuses much more on 'show and tell' kind of things...and the number of butts, chaps, and nakedness is much more prevalant...

    ...the gay community [thanks to Harvey Milk] has a great deal of political clout...if that fair was modified for anything other than safety reasons, the gay community would be in an uproar...which is why it persists...

    ...the quirky SF politics are one of the reasons I love living here...

    - David icon_wink.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 12:24 AM GMT
    ursamajor saidYes if we are all just good little boys and girls then straight people will respect us and allow us to share in their state-sanctioned pagan rites and tax schemes.

    There are those of us still alive (wheeling around oxygen bottles) who remember the Folsom Street Fair for what it once was. Likewise some of us remember events like Southern Decadence from when it was, well, decadent.

    Personally, I refuse to live a heteronormative life built on the false belief that institutions...........................oh well, after thirty years of hearing this argument played out I don't even think I will bother to go on typing. Fuckit.


    Good points, yes. But do yopu think publicity over Folsom would hurt our equal rights agenda, do nothing, or benefit our equal rights agenda.

    I'd love to go one day, but why can't it be held indoors someplace? Why did I see a pic of a kid, who looked like he was in Junior High, looking on at a sexual event at a bathhouse booth/stage. And how is it legal for men and women to walk around naked.

    My only concern: Will publicity over Folsom hurt our cause even more.

    Some say, well the religious right hated us before Folsom. Ture, but why give them extra fire power.

    usamajor:
    What did you mean by heteronormative life built....I have always seen Str8s and gays as the same... except for sexual preference. is there more of a difference?

    PS: I don't want this to turn into a flame war--so do not take any comments I write to heart. I'm a loser virgin lolicon_wink.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 12:29 AM GMT
    I've lived in SF for 18 years now. When I first attended Folsom, it was pretty shocking. That wears off after a while (oh yeah, another guy in nipple clamps getting spanked...yawn). But after having lived here for so long, I realize it's just a part of what makes this city what it is. SF is by far the most open and tolerant city in the US, not just for gays but for anybody. When I moved here, my brother said, "Oh, you just moved there because of the whole gay thing.". I told him that I moved here because being gay is NOT an issue. That I'm treated like anybody else and feel perfectly comfortable in any neighborhood (and most of the Bay Area, for that matter) with my boyfriend, being my own gay self.

    I suppose the only other parallel you can draw in terms of the US straight world and it's own debauchery is New Orleans. It's a live and let live city and its reputation is built on that. Mardi Gras stands out as well. If you want to talk about public nudity just look at those videos of girls flashing their tits to the passing floats...all for some cheap Mardi Gras beads.

    All in all I really don't care what the religious right thinks of us or our city. There are just as many examples in the straight world of "immoral" activity. They just conveniently choose not to focus on them.


  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 12:42 AM GMT
    cjcscuba1984

    "Good points, yes. But do yopu think publicity over Folsom would hurt our equal rights agenda, do nothing, or benefit our equal rights agenda."

    Rights are existential, they do not depend upon dress codes or behavioral specifications that fail to offend the sensibilities of X group of people. Someone, somewhere, is always going to be offended when people exercise their rights.

    That is why it says in the Declaration of Independence "We hold these truths to be self evident".

    Whatever agenda isn't worth anything at all until people are free to be who they really are, and that includes leather dykes, transgendered folk, everybody.

    To specifically answer the question, I think events like Folsom help. As you see from the replies here, everyone who has been around this event for awhile ends up thinking YAWN.


  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 12:47 AM GMT
    dfrourke saidCOJock has for the most part captured the essence of this city...another example...Marijuana [and I don't use it]...although illegal, city supervisors have passed legislation mandating the police put enforcement of marijuana laws as one of their last priorities [meaning focus on the big stuff]...

    ...we have a number of street fairs almost every other week in the late summer and early fall months and there are ALWAYS at least one or two naked people in attendance...Folsom Street Fair, which is in its 25th Year in 2008, focuses much more on 'show and tell' kind of things...and the number of butts, chaps, and nakedness is much more prevalant...

    ...the gay community [thanks to Harvey Milk] has a great deal of political clout...if that fair was modified for anything other than safety reasons, the gay community would be in an uproar...which is why it persists...

    ...the quirky SF politics are one of the reasons I love living here...

    - David icon_wink.gif


    I guess... where I'm from, if someone walked in the streets naked (at a fair or not), s/he would be arrested lol So it's hard for me to understand how public nudity and some sexual activity can be tolerated in front of the cops

    Does the majority of the gay community support this fair... to the point where is Arnold banned it they would gather together and protest?

    I consider myself progessive. But is society ready for this? Public nudity and sexual acts. Fuck society? Okay, but most Americans may call that a radical view. Fuck the majority of Americans? Okay fine... but how many more states can we afford to lose the same sex marriage battle in?

    Yes on 8 used lies to win. What if they used Folsom? Would we have lost even more?

    I'm fine with public nudity--but a lot of others aren't I worry:
    1.) Will we lose the battle for gay marriage or have full equality delayed because some gay people are considered "radicals" in the eyes of more consevative people?
    2.) Are we asking society to tolerate too much too soon?
  • ajlclimber

    Posts: 337

    Jan 02, 2009 12:57 AM GMT
    Add to the fact that in the city of San Francisco public nudity is not in and of itself illegal. There are plenty of nudists in SF that aren't of the mind set to throw something on to go grab a drink or walk around the park.

    Generally playing with yourself in public is considered an illegal act.. however for this fair you are walking into an area that has been closed off to protect those that don't want to see the acts of a sexual nature. Once you go past the gates you are consenting to view many of these activities.

    Folsom has become a little on the commercial side. It is a spectacle for tourists and families. I have gone and was a bit wierded out that I actually tripped on a couple kids in strollers with their straight parents walking around.

    There is another fair that happens on Folsom that is smaller and lesser known by the general world called Dore/Up Your Ally fair. I personally prefer this fair due to there being less gawkers and more people that are truly into the scene. granted there is always the A&F boys that go buy a harness to fit in but will never wear the thing again. That always makes me chuckle.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 1:23 AM GMT
    ParadoxFundies also attend


    Yep...As I've mentioned here before, Jerry Falwell's biggest fund-raising tool of all time was "undercover" video of Folsom and gay leather clubs: gay porn for good Christians who like to hide their erections under Bibles.

    It's hard to believe that, after nearly 20 years of Folsom, which is completely commercialized at this point, people are still complaining that it makes gay people "look bad."

    "Dear Folsom Visitor:

    "We regret to inform you that this year's festival has been discontinued because it offends the sensibilities of many people. Rather than ask the offended not to come to Folsom, we've decided to terminate the festival.

    "Part of our motivation of course is improving the image of gay people. By erasing from public view the more radical forms of sexual expression -- radical even though they are commercialized -- we believe that more mainstream Christians will greet the idea of men buttfucking one another with more enthusiasm. This in turn will lead to more acceptance of state-sanctioned marriage between those same butt-fuckers.

    "In effect, the more conventional we appear, the more acceptable our sinful style of sex and love will become. It's simple, really. "



  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 1:38 AM GMT
    So, if we all ditch the buttfucking and become leg-humping guh-zee-rhoids, the jeebus-worshiping masses will accept us?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 1:40 AM GMT
    Scuba, with all due respect, you need to get out some more and do a little learning before you get so worried about what hurts or helps gay rights. I recommend this thing called Wikipedia. I think it will chill you out a bit. Also, travel broadens the mind.

    You're a virgin who's JUST heard about Folsom. A fair that has been going on for 24 years. And you're freaked out that the right wing zealots might "use it" against us? It's freakin 24 years old.

    I'll quote a few other things from your posts that aren't going to win you any nominations for leading the gay rights movement, or any movement, for that matter:

    "Folsom Street Fair--something a have never heard about until today."
    "shocked that there was public nudity"
    "I'm an ignorant 'gay Puritan'"
    "I feel sick to my stomach"
    "why can't it be held indoors someplace"
    "how is it legal for men and women to walk around naked"
    "Are we asking society to tolerate too much too soon"
    "is society ready for this?"
    "where I'm from, if someone walked in the streets naked (at a fair or not), s/he would be arrested"

    While this kind of puritanical provincialism is certainly representative of a chunk of the country, and you have every right to hold these feelings, you need to check yourself when you start projecting your fears onto others who don't share your views. Some of us have been to Europe and South America where, horror of horrors, it's common to go to the beach naked, there are naked people on television, and in general, people are more afraid of guns and bombs then a bit of tit and ass. Here in America, of course, we love our guns and bombs, but are deathly afraid of tits and ass.

    One reason San Francisco is such a popular tourist destination for both US and non-US citizens, is that it's an island of European sensibility, from both it's pro-pedestrian, anti-car walkability, its fierce acceptance of all types of lifestyles, and its refusal to be afraid of the human body. As such, it is absolutely out of place is this uptight country.

    But should San Francisco (and it's scary "San Francisco Values") go back into the closet and become just like the rest of the uptight puritanical car-loving, obese, gun-loving, and endlessly "freaked out by everything" country, just because the rest of the country is "freaked out" by us? I'll answer that with some questions:

    Should black folks in the 60's have just sat at the back of the bus because white people were "freaked out" when they just took any available seat?

    Should women have just stayed at home in the 20's when everyone was "freaked out" that they might vote?

    Should Harvey Milk should have stayed in the closet in the 70's instead of running for San Francisco Supervisor as the first openly gay man to achieve public office in the United States because people were "freaked out"?

    You sir, can live a better life today because of all these people that fought against everyone who was "freaked out" by who they were. You sir, in your ignorance, are unaware that the people who put on Folsom are paving the way for YOU to be open and out about who you are wherever you are. You should thank your lucky fucking stars for San Francisco, Harvey Milk, and the fucking Folsom Street Fair because they are all fighting YOUR battles.

    This is why people like you cause flame wars because for decades, conservative people who are freaked out by things will ALWAYS choose the path that makes everyone feel comfortable. And that path leads to the back of the bus, to being barefoot and pregnant, and to the closet.

    Oh, and by the way, if you read your Wikipedia entry on Folsom, you'll see that attendance approaches half a million people. If you can find a nice secret indoor venue for that kind of crowd, where we can all hide from the people who are "freaked out" by us, let me know.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 1:45 AM GMT
    ObsceneWish said
    "Dear Folsom Visitor:

    ...

    "Part of our motivation of course is improving the image of gay people. By erasing from public view the more radical forms of sexual expression -- radical even though they are commercialized -- we believe that more mainstream Christians will greet the idea of men buttfucking one another with more enthusiasm. This in turn will lead to more acceptance of state-sanctioned marriage between those same butt-fuckers.




    * bows to OW's genius *
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 1:49 AM GMT
    I live on Folsom! It is always a great experience to go out to the street fair and see everyone there, including families. Personally, I love that it is outdoors and in the open rather than hidden and forgotten. Love and sex in all its spectacular variations is to be celebrated and witnessed.

    Chris, I'll gladly take you next year if you decide to go.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 2:14 AM GMT
    I went a couple years ago. It's not an "open in the street orgy" like the pics make it appear. Remember, people are taking pics of the extremities; just like the only think that ends up on the news from a Pride Parade are the drag queens and leather daddies (not normally dressed gays, the PFLAG parents, etc).

    Yes, the streets are blocked off. If I remember correctly, you have to show your ID to get past the barracades (but maybe that was get a "legal drinking age" wrist band).

    I did NOT see ANY children while I was there. I did see maybe 2-3 infants in strollers. But come on, they are too young to process the moral/social meanings of what they are seeing.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 2:48 AM GMT
    Sigh... here we go.
    iguanaSF saidScuba, with all due respect, you need to get out some more and do a little learning before you get so worried about what hurts or helps gay rights. I recommend this thing called Wikipedia. I think it will chill you out a bit. Also, travel broadens the mind.


    Fair enough. But asking questions is a way to get educated. Also, I'd rather hear from you guys than go to a site like Wikipedia--which i have come to distrust.

    [quote]You're a virgin who's JUST heard about Folsom. A fair that has been going on for 24 years. And you're freaked out that the right wing zealots might "use it" against us? It's freakin 24 years old.[/quote]

    Once again, I am ignorant on this subject. I just heard of Folsom TODAY. It did not make since to me... knowing the religious right has taken advantage of it.

    [quote]I'll quote a few other things from your posts that aren't going to win you any nominations for leading the gay rights movement, or any movement, for that matter:

    1.) "Folsom Street Fair--something a have never heard about until today."
    2.) "shocked that there was public nudity"
    3.) "I'm an ignorant 'gay Puritan'"
    4.) "I feel sick to my stomach"
    5.) "why can't it be held indoors someplace"
    6.) "how is it legal for men and women to walk around naked"
    7.) "Are we asking society to tolerate too much too soon"
    8.) "is society ready for this?"
    9. )"where I'm from, if someone walked in the streets naked (at a fair or not), 10.) s/he would be arrested"[/quote]


    I'll write some explainations, but first, I never asked or seeked-out a leadership position for the gay community. That is not what I wish to do with my life as it would take up a lot of time for my other life goals.

    1.) From what others have said, how does not hearing about an adult BDSM fair in SF disqualify me from becoming an influencial gay rights leader?

    2.) Not sure if you looked at my profile, but I am a Mainer... almost the farther place from SF you can be while still a part of the USA. How would I have any knowledge concerning this fair? Especially since I have only been out of the closet for 3 years, and have concerned myself mostly with the politics of the gay rights agenda and the religios right.

    3.) I'm ignorant--and have been called a gay Puritan. Mostly because things are new to me. I have a fairly progressive mind, yet some things still suprise me and may take time for me to adjust to new social experiences. You have faulted me for this. Yet I am not perfect, and came to this to learn more in a comfortable setting. However, i feel like I am being lectured by you because of my different worldview.

    4.) I feel sick to my stomach because I know the force behind the religious right. I also know I wish to be treated as an equal to str8 people. I felt sick becuase the words of the religious right HURT ME A LOT... personally. My worldview is always evolving... please do not mock me or lecture me becuase i am not as educated as you concerning the gay community.

    5.) 6.) 9.) 10.) I have no problem with the nude beaches you brought up becuase they are isolated or well labeled... for the most part. I guess it is hard for me to understand why they would have it outside when it could possible held indoors? Maybe the fair is too big for the indoors? Remember, where i am from, nudity is a crime. I never knew it was acceptable in SF.

    7.) This is the big question: Is society ready for public nudity? We have social norms and it is always good to push them--that is how change comes about. What I ask is are we pushing too much too fast for society to accept? If we are going to fast, will it backfire? I mean are there other Fairs like Folsom around the counrty? Or are they just in SF?


    [quote]While this kind of puritanical provincialism is certainly representative of a chunk of the country, and you have every right to hold these feelings, you need to check yourself when you start projecting your fears onto others who don't share your views. Some of us have been to Europe and South America where, horror of horrors, it's common to go to the beach naked, there are naked people on television, and in general, people are more afraid of guns and bombs then a bit of tit and ass. Here in America, of course, we love our guns and bombs, but are deathly afraid of tits and ass.[/quote]

    I agree actually

    [quote]One reason San Francisco is such a popular tourist destination for both US and non-US citizens, is that it's an island of European sensibility, from both it's pro-pedestrian, anti-car walkability, its fierce acceptance of all types of lifestyles, and its refusal to be afraid of the human body. As such, it is absolutely out of place is this uptight country.

    But should San Francisco (and it's scary "San Francisco Values") go back into the closet and become just like the rest of the uptight puritanical car-loving, obese, gun-loving, and endlessly "freaked out by everything" country, just because the rest of the country is "freaked out" by us? I'll answer that with some questions:

    Should black folks in the 60's have just sat at the back of the bus because white people were "freaked out" when they just took any available seat?

    Should women have just stayed at home in the 20's when everyone was "freaked out" that they might vote?

    Should Harvey Milk should have stayed in the closet in the 70's instead of running for San Francisco Supervisor as the first openly gay man to achieve public office in the United States because people were "freaked out"?[/quote]

    If the people of SF want to live a certain way... that's fine. Just realize that a large majority will oppose events like the fair.

    Now, your questions/examples do not work here according to me a t least. You gave examples of civil rights in your questions: being able to vote, run for public office, sit where you wish on a bus (desegregate the South) However, having an adult BDSM fair with public nudity--I think--would be a privilege... not necessarily a civil right. I am not a lawyer though.


    [quote]You sir, can live a better life today because of all these people that fought against everyone who was "freaked out" by who they were. You sir, in your ignorance, are unaware that the people who put on Folsom are paving the way for YOU to be open and out about who you are wherever you are. You should thank your lucky fucking stars for San Francisco, Harvey Milk, and the fucking Folsom Street Fair because they are all fighting YOUR battles.

    This is why people like you cause flame wars because for decades, conservative people who are freaked out by things will ALWAYS choose the path that makes everyone feel comfortable. And that path leads to the back of the bus, to being barefoot and pregnant, and to the closet.

    Oh, and by the way, if you read your Wikipedia entry on Folsom, you'll see that attendance approaches half a million people. If you can find a nice secret indoor venue for that kind of crowd, where we can all hide from the people who are "freaked out" by us, let me know.
    [/quote]

    Ouch Ouch and Ouch. Seriously, you really know how to make a guy understand where you are coming from. Bash me more why don't you... just because I grew up in a different part of the counrty. You act as though I am asking odd and stupid questions--I would think anyone would ask these questions... especially those who wish to progress equal rights for gays. You are more eager to say "fuck off" to the religious right. Which is admirable.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 2:51 AM GMT
    cjcscuba1984 saidMy only concern: Will publicity over Folsom hurt our cause even more.


    Dude, I saw TWO public sex acts at the fair. One guy was blowing another guy, and another guy was jerking off. I was there for about 8 hours.

    That's it!

    It's really not that extreme! And, though I opted to "dress the part" in a harness, there were tons of people fully clothed.

    I think it may have maybe been a blurb on the local news; but to your own admission, the event is not publicized tremendously. I did not see a single group here in Denver protesting the event. No people picketing my departure gate at the airport. (No protesters at all when I was in San Fran either)

    As a lot of the guys on here have noted, SF is exceptionally tolerant. It's extremely diverse. Being different really isn't something of notice.

    Being gay in SF is normal. You'll see guys walking down the street - hand in hand - and not just in The Castro (they "gay-bor-hood") but in the Financial District!

    Straight people there go to gay bars. Gay people there go to straight bars.

    If you can swing it, I'd get yourself a ticket and experience Folsom in person. If not, then go on a quick vacation in SF. One thing I really love about the city is that you can BE who you are - no questions asked, no eyebrows raised.

    Feeling that freedom in SF has helped me live a more open and free life here in Denver.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 2:57 AM GMT
    Scuba, I need to keep taking my anti-bitch medicine. I should learn from the other nice guys here who offered to take you to the fair. I'll toss my hat in the ring as well and offer up my services as an SF tour guide on your visit out here.

    Apologies for getting so bitchy. I think I've seen too many threads on unrelated topics turn into a lot of tut-tutting about how gays are being "too gay" in all sorts of different ways and I just snapped over what I'm perceiving as creeping homophobia from homos here on RJ. I need to take another break from the forums, I think.

    BTW, my family is from Maine as well. Eagle Lake, where everyone speaks French. I'm sure they never heard of Folsom either icon_smile.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 2:59 AM GMT
    I don't think it is wrong to ask questions, because they come from a desire to understand. For me, understanding isn't so much cognitive as it is experiential. I'd offer that the best thing is to experience Folsom and the city of San Francisco to see what it is all about.

    It's usually hard for me to understand an experience or an emotion from the outside, but inside of it, I get a better perspective.

    [Again, if you ever want to go, I'll gladly play tour guide]
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 3:06 AM GMT
    iguanaSF saidScuba, I need to keep taking my anti-bitch medicine. I should learn from the other nice guys here who offered to take you to the fair. I'll toss my hat in the ring as well and offer up my services as an SF tour guide on your visit out here.

    Apologies for getting so bitchy. I think I've seen too many threads on unrelated topics turn into a lot of tut-tutting about how gays are being "too gay" in all sorts of different ways and I just snapped over what I'm perceiving as creeping homophobia from homos here on RJ. I need to take another break from the forums, I think.

    BTW, my family is from Maine as well. Eagle Lake, where everyone speaks French. I'm sure they never heard of Folsom either icon_smile.gif


    Haha No worries.. serious. And, I'd love to go...and should go.... some year with you and Brady57. Though I'm not takeing of my underwear and pants!

    Not for the reason you may think... but because I'd probably hard the hole time.. and would be embaraseed lol Like I said before too... I have BDSM fantasies/porn lol

    maybe you should shove me at some booth with a Saint Andrew's Cross... teach me a lesson for arguing with you.icon_twisted.gif

    (Wow this convo has taken a 180 degree turn lol)
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jan 02, 2009 3:06 AM GMT
    cjcscuba1984, your concern about it being outside or inside is moot. The entrance baracades are about a block away from the main strip. There's no way someone would just accidently "wonder in" to the street fair. It's a destination in itself.

    Additionally, [and the SF locals can help me out on this one] there is a more heterosexual-oriented street fair usually held the day before in a different part of SF. I can't remember the name of it, but there is almost as much nudity, and NO baracades, but not one seems to have a problem with them.