Economists Agree: Obama Stimulus Boosts Economy

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    Jul 29, 2014 11:59 PM GMT
    NYT: Here’s a simple case study making the point that our political debates about economics have become largely unhinged from those among actual economists. Take the Obama stimulus plan, known as the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act. If you took your cues from the political rhetoric in Washington — or even from the occasional virulent debate in the economics blogosphere — you would think the whole question of fiscal stimulus is highly contested.

    But it’s not. There’s widespread agreement among economists that the stimulus act has helped boost the economy.

    Recently each eminent economist was asked whether the unemployment rate was lower at the end of 2010 than it would have been without the stimulus bill. Of the 44 economists surveyed, 37 responded, yielding a healthy response rate of 84 percent.

    Among those who responded, 36 agreed that the stimulus bill had lowered the unemployment rate, while one disagreed.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/30/upshot/what-debate-economists-agree-the-stimulus-lifted-the-economy.html
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 30, 2014 12:11 AM GMT
    lol, didn't Keynes write about this in 1930?

    in 1943 they just called it World War 2

    and the US warfare state hasn't changed since
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    Jul 30, 2014 12:31 PM GMT
    You're correct, the stimulus did help boost the economy--- of China and Europe.
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    Jul 30, 2014 1:18 PM GMT
    The party of trickle-up economics.

    $1 trillion to banks (not people, each American could have received $3,333)
    $1 trillion to transportation, "green energy," and contractor companies in the stimulus (Bringing the total to $6,666)
    $400 million to build a semi-functional website
    Billions in food stamps which go directly to well-connected grocery chains
    Billions in healthcare subsidies going to insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies
    A $700 billion health care law written with a stamp of approval from those who will profit most.


    Since when did "trickle-up" equal "corporate bailout"?

    With JUST the health care law, stimulus and TARP $2.7 trillion dollars of new money (It never existed before, they didn't even bother to print it) and assets now exists in the U.S. economy.

    It wasn't produced thanks to hardworking citizens, just thanks to the stroke of a pen. It all went to the richest Americans (inevitably) and then Democrats bitch that the pay gap is too wide and that income inequality is on the rise.

    Go figure.
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    Jul 30, 2014 1:41 PM GMT
    U.S. Economy Grew at 4% Rate in Second Quarter, Beating Expectations

    NYT: The increase exceeded economists’ expectations and further cemented their views.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/31/business/economy/us-economy-grew-4-in-second-quarter.html
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    Jul 30, 2014 1:42 PM GMT
    BROTIE saidThe party of trickle-up economics ... go figure


    trickle-up or trickle-down is still a trickle

    the deeply divided US government will not do much but follow the rest of the world economy.


    BIG news: politics between the pot and the kettle
  • mybud

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    Jul 30, 2014 7:12 PM GMT
    I just witnessed a speech from President Obama at our Uptown Theater here in Kansas City about an hour ago...The GDP is over 4%, unemployment steady at 6.1%...The republicans want to sue our president using our tax dollars...And The RJ conservative hordes of these subjects??????? *Crickets*.
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    Jul 30, 2014 7:21 PM GMT
    mybud saidI just witnessed a speech from President Obama at our Uptown Theater here in Kansas City about an hour ago...The GDP is over 4%, unemployment steady at 6.1%...The republicans want to sue our president using our tax dollars...And The RJ conservative hordes of these subjects??????? *Crickets*.


    "RJ conservative hordes"

    4 guys(even with multiple accounts) is NOT a horde.

    The only thing going down faster than the unemployment numbers is the number of Republican apologists.
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    Jul 30, 2014 8:00 PM GMT
    Determinate said
    mybud saidI just witnessed a speech from President Obama at our Uptown Theater here in Kansas City about an hour ago...The GDP is over 4%, unemployment steady at 6.1%...The republicans want to sue our president using our tax dollars...And The RJ conservative hordes of these subjects??????? *Crickets*.


    "RJ conservative hordes"

    4 guys(even with multiple accounts) is NOT a horde.

    The only thing going down faster than the unemployment numbers is the number of Republican apologists.


    "even with multiple accounts"

    This ^^^^ from YOU is a little rich.
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    Jul 30, 2014 8:03 PM GMT
    Let me see....

    1 out of 6 people in America going hungry.
    1/3 of people in certain areas living with extremely high debt levels.
    Most of the job creation being part time and or temporary for the working class.

    I would disagree with the economists.
  • mybud

    Posts: 11819

    Jul 30, 2014 8:19 PM GMT
    homejames saidLet me see....

    1 out of 6 people in America going hungry.
    1/3 of people in certain areas living with extremely high debt levels.
    Most of the job creation being part time and or temporary for the working class.

    I would disagree with the economists.
    Produce your sources..and Fox news doesn't count.
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 30, 2014 8:37 PM GMT
    ^^

    77 million Americans have debt in collection status

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2014/07/29/a-third-of-consumers-had-debts-in-collections-last-year/?hpid=z4

    (GDP is not a good way to gauge the economic health of a nation, but it makes for an easy headline number to understand)

    Food%20stamps%20Aug.png
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    Jul 30, 2014 8:54 PM GMT
    Behind the Big Increase in Food Stamps

    NYT: Paul Krugman and others attribute essentially all of the food Stamps spending growth to the depressed economy caused by the Bush Administration at the end of 2007.

    http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/11/27/the-obama-spending-non-surge/

  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 30, 2014 9:10 PM GMT
    ^^

    lol, that blog is 3 years old
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    Jul 30, 2014 9:32 PM GMT
    ^ Same with the data of your graph: 2007-2011.
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 30, 2014 9:37 PM GMT
    June 2013 good enough? I don't see the numbers decreasing along with the wonderful Obama "recovery"

    Food-Stamps-Monthly.jpg
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    Jul 30, 2014 9:43 PM GMT
    NYT: Whatever you may think progress looks like — a rebounding stock market, a new house, a good raise — the governments of the world have long held the view that only one statistic, the measure of gross domestic product, can really show whether things seem to be getting better or getting worse. G.D.P. is an index of a country’s entire economic output — a tally of, among many other things, manufacturers’ shipments, farmers’ harvests, retail sales and construction spending. It’s a figure that compresses the immensity of a national economy into a single data point of surpassing density. The conventional feeling about G.D.P. is that the more it grows, the better a country and its citizens are doing.

    In the U.S., one challenge to the G.D.P. is coming not from a single new index, or even a dozen new measures, but from several hundred new measures: http://www.stateoftheusa.org

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/16/magazine/16GDP-t.html?
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 30, 2014 9:46 PM GMT
    ^^

    lol you have no opinion of your own based on the data, just more crap from NYT editors
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    Jul 30, 2014 9:50 PM GMT
    NYT: For now at least, G.D.P. holds almost unassailable sway, not only as the key national indicator for the economic health of the United States but also for that of the rest of the world’s developed countries, which employ a standardized methodology — there’s actually a handbook — to calculate their economic outputs. And, as it happens, there are some good reasons that everyone has depended on it for so long. “If you want to know why G.D.P. matters, you can just put yourself back in the 1930 period, where we had no idea what was happening to our economy,” William Nordhaus, a Yale economist who has spent a distinguished career thinking about economic measurement, told me recently. “There were people then who said things were fine and others who said things weren’t fine. But we had no comprehensive measures, so we looked at things like boxcar loadings.” If you compare the crisis of 1930 with the crisis of 2008, Nordhaus added, it has made an enormous difference to track what’s happening in the economy through indexes like G.D.P. Such knowledge can enable a quick and informed policy response, which in the past year took shape as a big stimulus package, for example. To Nordhaus, in fact, the G.D.P. — the antecedents of which were developed in the early 1930s by an economist named Simon Kuznets at the federal government’s request — is one of the greatest inventions of the 20th century.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/16/magazine/16GDP-t.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
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    Jul 30, 2014 9:59 PM GMT
    Long Run Impacts of Childhood Access to Food Stamps

    And there’s no puzzle why: it’s hard for young people to get ahead when they suffer from poor nutrition, inadequate medical care, and lack of access to good education. The antipoverty programs that we have actually do a lot to help people rise. For example, Americans who received early access to food stamps were healthier and more productive in later life than those who didn’t. But we don’t do enough along these lines. The reason so many Americans remain trapped in poverty isn’t that the government helps them too much; it’s that it helps them too little.


    http://www.nber.org/papers/w18535
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    Jul 31, 2014 12:30 AM GMT
    woodsmen saidU.S. Economy Grew at 4% Rate in Second Quarter, Beating Expectations

    NYT: The increase exceeded economists’ expectations and further cemented their views.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/31/business/economy/us-economy-grew-4-in-second-quarter.html


    Remember in Q1 when we were celebrating a +1%, only to find out later that it was actually -2.9%? So what will GDP "growth" actually be?
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 31, 2014 2:19 AM GMT
    ^^

    lol they'll print a +0.1% to avoid a technical recession number
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 31, 2014 4:53 AM GMT
    The growth is all a fantasy. It’s all a result of the assumption that there is no inflation, when there really is because what we have is inflation masquerading as economic growth. Inflation is actually more like 4-6%. But the bottom line is the economy is really contracting, that’s why the labor force is shrinking, that’s why we’re using less energy, that’s why the people’s standard of living is going down, and real incomes are falling and job opportunities are disappearing. It’s because we’re in a recession and no one wants to admit it.

    GDP calcs are the most convoluted nonsense imaginable, but if you want to keep believing this crap, be my guest.

    plus the Fed's balance sheet has grown from $500 billion to $4.5 TRILLION in just 5 years - if you can't fake growth with that, you;re toast
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    Jul 31, 2014 4:56 AM GMT
    GOP's Uncontrollable Urges: Inflation Is Here! Or Coming!

    NYT: In particular, it’s addicted to inflation — not the thing itself, but the claim that runaway inflation is either happening or about to happen.

    To see what I’m talking about, consider a scene that played out the other day on CNBC: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/rick-santelli-wrong-steve-liesman

    Rick Santelli, one of the network’s stars, is best known for a rant against debt relief that arguably gave birth to the Tea Party. On this occasion, however, he was ranting about another of his favorite subjects, the allegedly inflationary policies of the Federal Reserve. And his colleague Steve Liesman had had enough. “It’s impossible for you to have been more wrong,” Mr. Liesman declared, and he went on to detail the wrong predictions: “The higher interest rates never came, the inability of the U.S. to sell bonds never happened, the dollar never crashed, Rick. There isn’t a single one that’s worked for you.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/18/opinion/paul-krugman-addicted-to-inflation.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Jul 31, 2014 5:01 AM GMT
    ^^

    4-6% is not runaway inflation woody, so keep peddling crap you know nothing about