Colorado: Gay Bar Told It Violated State Law By Turning Away Man in Drag

  • metta

    Posts: 39159

    Aug 08, 2014 1:36 AM GMT
    Gay Bar Told It Violated State Law By Turning Away Man in Drag

    Nearly a year after being refused entrance to a popular Denver gay bar, a state regulatory agency has ruled in favor of 27-year-old Vito Marzano.


    http://www.advocate.com/politics/2014/08/07/colorado-gay-bar-told-it-violated-civil-rights-law-turning-away-man-drag
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    Aug 08, 2014 4:45 PM GMT
    Good!

    Now they should do more than just "telling" the oh-so-manly gay bar.

    AdvocateThe Department of Regulatory Agencies ruled in favor of Marzano, ordering the bar to enter mediation with him. "At face value, the [bar's] policies appear legitimate and nondiscriminatory," Steven Chavez, director of the Civil Rights Division, wrote in the ruling, obtained by The Denver Post. "However, the evidence indicates that the [bar] uses its policies to select patrons whose appearance is masculine, whether or not they are male or female, for entry into its club."

    While Marzano does not identify as transgender, he said he's acutely aware of how the treatment he faced could be applied to transgender individuals, especially those unable to update their legal identification to reflect their gender identity and expression.

    "I believe this policy is rooted in misogyny and transphobia equally," Marzano told The Advocate last year. "Nevertheless, [Wrangler manager] Phil [Newland] did make it clear that if someone transitioned from female to male, they would be able to partake in Beer Bust. That being said, there is still the issue of how [the Wrangler] allows in patrons. Just because someone is transitioning and would be allowed to partake doesn't mean they would be able to get through the first hurdle of getting into the bar."

    Earlier this year, a Portland, Ore., bar shut its doors after a group of transgender women and gender nonconforming individuals were told by owners that they were no longer welcome, citing concerns that their presence was driving customers away.
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    Aug 08, 2014 5:05 PM GMT
    There was a bar in PS, DINKs that did the same thing. It's closed now!

    "Marzano was denied entry because they were unable to use photo identification to verify that he was the person he said he was or that he is of legal drinking age."

    On the face of it it does sound legitimate. But women can look very different from their photo, hair color, style, make-up, etc. Halloween is another time of course....faces could not be covered in the bar I worked at. We all have "facial recognition" ability.

    Dress codes are another matter. "No Shirt, No shoes, No service". No open toed shoes. No cologne.
    At a country club I go to you must wear a collared shirt.
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    Aug 11, 2014 1:14 AM GMT

    good to know, in case I ever decide to open a gay bar
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    Aug 11, 2014 2:30 AM GMT
    And yet there's still the issue of dress codes that require men to have sleeves, while women can wear spaghetti strap tops.

    Oh well, one step at a time I guess.
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    Aug 11, 2014 4:43 AM GMT
    paulflexes saidAnd yet there's still the issue of dress codes that require men to have sleeves, while women can wear spaghetti strap tops.

    Oh well, one step at a time I guess.



    um most straight bars have some kind of dress code especially the larger clubs, gay bars and clubs are, come as you are, at least that is what I have experienced.

    Except maybe beach community where shorts and sandals are common among straight bars, or the EDM party, but not any large classic 'velvet rope' club venue.

    To see these men and women dancing fully dressed, especially the guys with long sleeves must be hotter than hell, we as gay men get to take our shirts off, that is part of our culture....icon_razz.gif
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    Aug 11, 2014 4:49 AM GMT
    I don't know how I feel about this. Certainly I'd have issues if there was some sort of masculinity test to get thru a door. And I'd certainly have issues about any sort of discrimination particularly in non-leather gay bars.

    But leather bars often have some backroom activity and even if not, guys might be getting into some pretty heavy petting at the bar. That's not really where you want your mom walking in.

    My feeling might be something like, well, discrimination is wrong, but the guy's a douche for pushing that on the leather community. And I'm not leather community--I kind of think of that as its own sort of drag--so I'm not taking this personally, just looking at it. I have been in leather bars plenty and even if just standing there, that whole man on man mystique of the place would certainly be disrupted by any sort of feminine dress, either real tits or some guy stuffed.

    I'd tell him to stuff it or I'd simply walk out. Drag in a leather bar? You don't even wear white sneaks.

    Though, I must say, the very funniest fucking thing I ever saw was at Tacky's, a Lauderdale leatherbar long defunct, when a busload of leather clad square dancers descended upon the place just in time for Sunday T dance. Big hairy bears skipping dosey doe in pleated leather mini skirts. I still laugh when I remember it.
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    Aug 11, 2014 5:08 AM GMT
    I believe the decision by the state agency was based on the club using a dubious reason (ID problem) to bar the drag queen. I don't know if they answered the question of whether enforcing a strict leather code would be permitted or not. A lot of these leather bars says they do, but they really don't.

    I went to a restaurant just a couple of months ago in Delray that required coat & tie for men. Or else you would be denied entry. Could that be challenged in court? I dunno.

    There's another beachfront restaurant here that requires a collared shirt for men, and no flip-flops. Though as paulflexes observes, women get to wear sleeveless tops with spaghetti straps, and also open sandals that are no better than flip-flops. I guess female shoulders and feet are special exceptions.
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    Aug 11, 2014 5:14 AM GMT
    I once went to a leather bar that wouldn't let my date in because he was Asian. At least they had the drill down. "Sir, I cannot allow you entrance in your present state of intoxication."
    (FYI: I'd been with him all evening. All he had was tea.)
    You just have to use the right code words. icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Aug 11, 2014 5:22 AM GMT
    mindgarden saidI once went to a leather bar that wouldn't let my date in because he was Asian. At least they had the drill down. "Sir, I cannot allow you entrance in your present state of intoxication."
    (FYI: I'd been with him all evening. All he had was tea.)
    You just have to use the right code words. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Use code words, or slip the security some money.

    But that's disgusting. Is it a bar still open today?
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    Aug 11, 2014 6:00 AM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    mindgarden saidI once went to a leather bar that wouldn't let my date in because he was Asian. At least they had the drill down. "Sir, I cannot allow you entrance in your present state of intoxication."
    (FYI: I'd been with him all evening. All he had was tea.)
    You just have to use the right code words. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Code words, or slip the security some money.

    But that's disgusting. Is it a bar still open today?


    Not sure... that location is a yuppie shoe store now. Another "Eagle" is open a couple of miles away.
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    Aug 11, 2014 2:50 PM GMT
    mindgarden said
    Art_Deco said
    mindgarden saidI once went to a leather bar that wouldn't let my date in because he was Asian. At least they had the drill down. "Sir, I cannot allow you entrance in your present state of intoxication."
    (FYI: I'd been with him all evening. All he had was tea.)
    You just have to use the right code words. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Use code words, or slip the security some money.

    But that's disgusting. Is it a bar still open today?

    Not sure... that location is a yuppie shoe store now. Another "Eagle" is open a couple of miles away.

    BTW, while I'll use a tip to grease security, I've also rewarded security, for questioning me!

    One time was Rich's in Houston, when it was gay owned in 2002. Closed now I think. Well, among all the people lined up to enter that night I was the only one I saw get carded for age. I was 53!!!

    In their defense I was wearing a motorcycle jacket, a Harley baseball cap pulled low, my sunglasses on because it was summer with the sun still up when I parked my bike, while the entrance passageway was dimly lit.

    Rather than being insulted and making a scene I was incredibly flattered. And so I thanked the cute security guy and tipped him $5, and told him he could card me for age anytime he wanted. He always knew me on sight after that. icon_biggrin.gif

    Some door guys are security Nazis on a power trip. And perhaps obeying discriminatory management policies. I can usually find a "work around" if I really want in.