Can open relationships ever become seriously monogamous (closed) relationships?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 26, 2014 10:55 AM GMT
    I'm just wondering...
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 26, 2014 12:16 PM GMT
    If both guys are on the same page and want it, why not?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 26, 2014 12:22 PM GMT
    Think it's called dating, or why you date.

    The guy at the top of the rotation drops the "L" bomb and boom goes the monogamy.
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    Aug 26, 2014 12:49 PM GMT
    Your placement of the word seriously "Can open relationships ever become seriously monogamous (closed) relationships?" makes the question look a bit loaded, being so close to saying "...ever become a serious relationship" implying that monogamy is a more serious relationship than is an open relationship which is often smeared as judgmentalism.

    Not having experience with every combination of people (and not that I haven't put in a damned good try) but just one two-year and two 10-year relationships, I'd say, based upon that, how the sexuality between people might evolve depends entirely on both the individuals, their chemistries together and outside circumstances. Otherwise, completely predictable.

    My two-year, had the guy not left me for someone who turned out to be a mistake for him, that might have gone from open to monogamy were we completely sexually compatible, but we were not. He was into anal. No thank you. My 1st 10-year with a practicing bi probably would have evolved into a mmw ltr and that could have turned monogamous within that grouping. I still lust for him and our chemistry was undeniable, so fun. My 2nd 10-year guy would never have changed from open to closed, but we'd have remained partnered for life, as we did.

    So your answer might lie anywhere on a spectrum from, say, two guys on sexual overdrive in their 20s who sexually slow down a tad in their 60s and they simply stopped hooking up with others because the bar scene got so awful with everyone on their phones, to a monogamous couple where one guy winds up on meds in his 60s making sex impossible and insisting that his partner go out and get some sexual satisfaction so he doesn't feel guilty about not being able to satisfy his partner or not wanting his partner to lose out on that part of living just because he did.

    And every combination in between.

    Tomorrow's story is as yet untold, never foretold, not even by what someone tells you. I've found that most people will say anything while they believe it.
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    Aug 26, 2014 12:52 PM GMT
    bhp91126 saidIf both guys are on the same page and want it, why not?


    This. Every relationship is all about authentic conversations with mutual understandings. Ideally, there are clearly articulated agreements.
  • Destinharbor

    Posts: 4435

    Aug 26, 2014 4:28 PM GMT
    Sure. The sign of a mature relationship, a partnership, is that each partner knows and respects the other's needs and tries to make them happy. That's what love is about. But it is finding the correct balance for both that can be tricky. The best way to accomplish that is to not be judgmental or rigid. Most dating starts out open, then, as the relationship gets more serious, it becomes monogamous. But it can go back open as both become comfortable with the solidity of the relationship. And it can close again. If both parties trust each other and communicate, agree on the deal, and keep the communication open, whether you are open or monogamous is simply for you to agree upon. I think the best way to keep a relationship vital is to assume nothing is carved in stone forever but instead, everything is open for conversation. Trust your partner. And sometimes bend your preferences to accommodate his needs. Trust he would do the same for you.
  • Aleco_Graves

    Posts: 708

    Aug 26, 2014 5:48 PM GMT
    I feel like you could be serious in an open relationship and not have it monogamous, I don't even know where I stand on the subject of open relationships themselves...

    I totally get how it can be acceptable in certain situations or when dealing with a specific dynamic, but on the other hand I keep thinking: "I love you so much and you totally turn me on, but sometimes I just want to but my dick in someones hole because it feels good. Nothing intimate, just me exposing my body to someone. Taking someone in my mouth, the same one I kiss and compliment you with".

    I get it, people should stop saying it's wrong and then comparing it to a monogamous relationship. That's just terrible debating skills, as they're separate things.

    I just don't know if i can see an open relationship as an Ideal, more a compromise. I'm an open minded guy, so feel free to shed some light on it and i might just alter my opinion
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 26, 2014 6:35 PM GMT
    Only if you have a mortgage together.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 26, 2014 8:26 PM GMT
    Sure it can happen. In order for it to happen though both have to commit....to each. Just the two of them.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 26, 2014 8:49 PM GMT
    Sure. After you two have gone through everyone in your town.
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    Aug 26, 2014 9:17 PM GMT
    UndercoverMan saidSure. After you two have gone through everyone in your town.


    Haha I'm not going through the town.

    We've been flirting around the idea of seeing each other for ages and kinda have on/off but I don't want to have sex atm and it's wrong to expect him not to have sex so I suggested he can have sex/hook up with others so long as it's no-one I know and I don't want to hear about it.

    I have no clue if it's going to work because we only made the deal a few days ago lol.
  • Aidenz

    Posts: 46

    Aug 26, 2014 9:28 PM GMT
    I think per agreement a couple becomes an open relationship for many reasons. Sometimes as long as both parties practice safe sexy the couple doesn't mind that their other half has other sexual encounters so long as it doesn't inhibit them from having sex. I think it would happen if both agreed to be in an open relationship but one partner abstained because either he sexually wasn't interested in pursuing anyone else or they simply are tired of playing the field. In that case it becomes the decision of the more sexually active partner as to how much the commitment means to them. If they continue to have sexual ventures protected or not you always risk catching an std. In that case you endanger both you and your partner. So I think both parties need to consider that factor as well and how much they are willing to put their partner at risk. Often times open relationships are looked down upon because they don't seem quite as committed or faithful, but a relationship is whatever two people agree for it to be. So an open relationship can absolutely become closed and vice versa

  • Aug 26, 2014 10:51 PM GMT
    I seriously think it is possible, because I am not not one to cheat or play around. I am completely monogamus when in a relationship. However finding a partner that is as honest with me as I am them is another story. I have only been with one person in the last 10 years. I like it this way because I know them and they know me.

    Statistically open relationships do not work. There are many complications, a partner gets jealous, some one gets an std, etc.

    I want someone who desires me, will be there for me, keep me warm at night, act out fantasies with (I like to pretend I am a tough guy), and I want to feel loved. These things are hard to acheive in an open relationship. Also while one is going out all the time, the other is often handeling the resposibilities (i.e. cleaning house, working to pay bills, etc)
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    Aug 26, 2014 10:56 PM GMT
    Open relationships are actually more conducive for "accidental monogamy" than a closed relationship. The reason is that humans naturally want what they can't have...if they can't have another partner, they'll be more likely to want one. If they can, the excitement of cheating is gone.
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    Aug 27, 2014 12:13 AM GMT
    http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/love-without-limits/201304/the-truth-about-polyamory
    There is no evidence that monogamy is better in terms of relationship longevity, happiness, health, sexual satisfaction, or emotional intimacy.

    An article reviewing scientific evidence addressing the question of whether monogamous relationships are superior to other types of relationships has concluded that there is no empirical basis for the common assumptions about the benefits of monogamy. The fact that this article was published in the peer reviewed Personality and Social Psychology Review (Nov 2012), suggests that research and logic are finally influencing scientific thinking on this subject.


    http://thecouplesstudy.com
    Beyond
    Monogamy
    Lessons from Long-Term Male Couples
    In Non-Monogamous Relationships


    http://www.livescience.com/27129-polyamory-good-relationships.html
    New Sexual Revolution: Polyamory May Be Good for You











    http://psr.sagepub.com/content/early/2012/11/21/1088868312467087.abstract
    We conclude that evidence for the benefits of monogamy relative to other relationship styles is currently lacking, suggesting that, for those who choose it, consensual non-monogamy may be a viable alternative to monogamy

    http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/fam/26/5/669/
    We found that sexual arrangements were not associated with sexual satisfaction, communication, or frequency. However, monogamous men reported significantly higher levels of sexual jealousy. Our findings indicate that gay men engage in a range of relationship agreements, and nonmonogamous agreements are associated with levels of sexual relationship quality equivalent to monogamous agreements

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1530-2415.2012.01286.x/full
    ...CNM (consensually non-monogamous) relationships were strongly stigmatized and a substantial halo effect surrounded monogamous relationships...

    ...research shows that those in CNM relationships report high degrees of honesty, closeness, happiness, and communication and low degrees of jealousy...

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 27, 2014 12:49 AM GMT
    This subject has been explored a lot lately however I can understand it continuing as their is no real answers ever put forward. A link which states the obvious that here is no evidence of Polyamory being worse than monogamous relationships.

    There is some truth In that statement however it's a half truth. The saying goes 'the absence of evidence is not evidence of absence' or in other words just because something new hasn't had recorded horror stories doesn't make it good.

    As a university qualified sociologist myself forever curious about human behaviour I find it interesting that older gay men who should know better are jumping to conclusion that are at best half truths while some of the younger members are still asking what and why, at least the intelligent ones are.

    Two people who are on the same page can make an open relationship a monogamous 180 Deg turn however it is difficult. Truth hurts but open relationships are rarely serious and even more rarely able to go the distance.

    I see again another expressed fantasy of heterosexual take up of non-monogamy, instead of me commenting let's consider this. Right wing backlashes happen when excesses start to become normalised just as any excess on the left does. To the older guys who don't get this think back to the GFC when you believed that eternal growth is possible, seems those same people believe that gay rights acceptance is on a similar curve that will never be in for a correction

    Let's see what happens guys save your usual vitriolic response for he big backlash resulting from the Gay push to impose values on the mainstream instead of just gaining acceptance for ourselves.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 27, 2014 12:54 AM GMT
    i'm thinking no, if it was there they would be doing it already.
  • Aleco_Graves

    Posts: 708

    Aug 27, 2014 2:18 AM GMT
    theantijock saidhttp://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/love-without-limits/201304/the-truth-about-polyamory
    There is no evidence that monogamy is better in terms of relationship longevity, happiness, health, sexual satisfaction, or emotional intimacy.


    http://psr.sagepub.com/content/early/2012/11/21/1088868312467087.abstract
    We conclude that evidence for the benefits of monogamy relative to other relationship styles is currently lacking, suggesting that, for those who choose it, consensual non-monogamy may be a viable alternative to monogamy

    http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/fam/26/5/669/
    We found that sexual arrangements were not associated with sexual satisfaction, communication, or frequency. However, monogamous men reported significantly higher levels of sexual jealousy. Our findings indicate that gay men engage in a range of relationship agreements, and nonmonogamous agreements are associated with levels of sexual relationship quality equivalent to monogamous agreements

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1530-2415.2012.01286.x/full
    ...CNM (consensually non-monogamous) relationships were strongly stigmatized and a substantial halo effect surrounded monogamous relationships...

    ...research shows that those in CNM relationships report high degrees of honesty, closeness, happiness, and communication and low degrees of jealousy...


    Interesting points made, but your argument seems somewhat Biased or lopsided at the best. You basically just said that in comparison no evidence has been given elevating one above the other in Happiness. The Comparison ends there as you start listing the benefits of a non monogamous relationship exclusively.

    You also mentioned polyamory. They aren't exactly the same thing, unless you are speaking under extremely broad terms.
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    Aug 27, 2014 3:07 AM GMT
    Aleco_Graves saidInteresting points made, but your argument seems somewhat Biased or lopsided at the best. You basically just said that in comparison no evidence has been given elevating one above the other in Happiness. The Comparison ends there as you start listing the benefits of a non monogamous relationship exclusively.

    You also mentioned polyamory. They aren't exactly the same thing, unless you are speaking under extremely broad terms.


    Was that me presenting an argument? Maybe so, but all I did was google-scholar "non-monogamy gay" to try and find peer reviewed articles since 2010 I think was the parameter to keep it current. I don't currently have university access to download articles for free so that's just from the abstracts. I did not know what I'd find before I searched, as is my usual approach to things, and I'd have presented evidence against what I even might prefer my own argument to be were that what the data to show. It just so happened that the current information available seems to agree with some of my attitudes about the topic.

    Keep in mind that we only got off the DSM since what like 1974ish so we don't yet have a lot of long term studies to give us definitive stats. I was hoping to find a longitudinal study but we may have to wait on that. Even so, the studies we do have seem to indicate that claims of any sort of superiority of monogamy over a CNM are absurd. While there are indications of the superiority of CNMs particularly with regard to jealousy issues.

    For me, that totally depends on what a person is comfortable with, even if they do have jealousy issues. While that might indicate other problems, it might cause more issues for that person to resolve their jealousies than to deal with whatever underlying or other issues might be, so you go with what you can be most comfortable with. For instance, a person might hold religious values highly and so for that person, monogamy might cause less conflict for them even if causing more jealousy issues.

    So we all have to find our own balances with that. And until we have better stats--maybe by the time you're my age, yikes, we might have more on that--that would currently be my only argument. My personal opinion is that I don't give a flying fuck how people live their lives, as long as they do their very best to not hurt others.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 27, 2014 4:30 AM GMT
    Can open relationships ever become seriously monogamous (closed) relationships?

    Sure...

    If everyone else on the planet dies.
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    Aug 27, 2014 6:55 PM GMT
    I think the use of the word serious did skew the question slightly but that's perhaps in built bias on my part. If I'm honest I would rather have it simply monogamous however due to the circumstances I think it's only fair at this moment for it to be open. We have been on/off relationship types as well as friends and then sometimes acquaintances for so long because we could never agree on what we wanted to do but now this may well be an ideal (for now) solution.

    As always thoughtful well presented info from antjock and sydneyrugbyjock icon_smile.gif
  • BloodFlame

    Posts: 1768

    Aug 28, 2014 3:41 AM GMT
    Sure, I think if both guys were wanting to close their relationship, it could happen.