Bareback with someone from Craigslist and over the counter hiv testing.

  • Bryan800

    Posts: 2

    Nov 03, 2014 11:31 PM GMT
    My boyfriend and I have been together for almost ten years now. We are both tops so we don't really have sex any more. We decided that we should find a bottom so we could satisfy our sexual urges without cheating. So we found this guy through craigslist and had been messing around with him for a few months. Recently this guy and my boyfriend have become close, they text all evening (and day I assume). Apparently a conversation was about getting hiv testing done to eliminate the use of condoms. I was not a part of the conversation. Well this guy got a over the counter hiv test. It came up negative so my boyfriend decided it would be a good idea to have sex bareback. I had asked him to put a condom on but he felt it was ok to still do it bareback. I was naturally upset about it. I don't know if the test was legit or not I never seen it.
    So now our relationship is on the rocks, my boyfriend had hung out with him one day last week while I was at work. I came home they were talking in the living room. I sat down and joined the conversation. After talking a bit we got onto the topic of over the counter drug tests. This guy doesn't trust over the counter drug tests, so why would he trust an over the counter hiv test?
    My boyfriend and I have done some talking about the topic, and my boyfriend said that he has thought about breaking up for a few months now, but says he want to make it work and get past this.
    I have no idea what to do here. Any advice would be great.
  • Destinharbor

    Posts: 4435

    Nov 04, 2014 12:14 AM GMT
    I'd ask him to give me a year of monogamy. That he seems overeager to be with others and is taking risks. That isn't good. Tell him at the end of the year, you'll discuss opening things back up but for now, you'd appreciate a year. That assumes you do want to keep it together. If you aren't sure, or still want to find a bottom who you two can be with you together, you need to set the rules and be pretty clinical about it. But right now, it sounds like you need a demonstration of his commitment in order to feel right again. What do you want?
  • theonewhoknoc...

    Posts: 714

    Nov 04, 2014 12:23 AM GMT
    lol craigslist
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 04, 2014 12:48 AM GMT
    Simply put, you need to find another boyfriend.


    The fact that they excluded you from the conversation makes it sound like this guy just turned into a full blown home-wrecker and it's just a matter of time before you're the weakest link.
  • Bowyn_Aerrow

    Posts: 357

    Nov 04, 2014 12:52 AM GMT
    Let me lapse scriptural...

    Matthew 6:24

    No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other.

    That was written about 1950 or so years ago... The same wisdom holds true, no man can serve two other men without problems cropping up.

    The issue of HIV isn't the real issue here. Now is it?

    The issue is that in your mind this bare-backing business has more significance, and all of this 'chatting on the side' is pointing at a lapse in your relationship and your partner becoming to attached to you all's 'toy boy'.

    The test is only a symbol of other issues here, and you need to see those issues for what they are.

    You and your BF have been together since you were 18, both of you are closing in on 30 and that means you have about a decade of real living in the world as an adult. BOTH of you have changed a great deal since you were 'just kids'. You both no doubt have changed your perspectives on a lot of issues.

    I honestly don't know how two tops can have a lovers relationship. Being 'top' usually carries more to it than who penetrates who. Things like who is the decider, who is the big spoon, who is the little spoon - all of these minor aspects of a Top/bottom relationship most likely have not been completely resolved to both of your 'top' satisfaction.

    The introduction of a bottom for 'just sex' had its merits, but apparently you kept on bringing this guy back again and again. Sex is not just about lust and pleasure, it has a lot of other stuff connected to it, it is apart of the socialization that takes place between bonding mates. Humans have understood this on one level or another which is why so many insist on the monogamy sort of thing even though lifelong monogamy is not natural for humans.

    Serial monogamy is what best addresses human mating relationships. This is why so many marry, have kids and end up divorcing after a while. While together they were monogamous and it wasn't a bit deal, then suddenly one, or both are no longer fulfilled with the relationship and the need to go out and find a new mate hits.

    It is biological, and DNA demonstrates that its how we evolved.

    I say all of this to hopefully give you much needed clarity on what is really happening here. There are forces at work which are resetting your relationship and presenting you both with some choices.

    While he may be saying he wants to start again, and put this behind you all, it may be he is saying this because he thinks that that is what is suppose to happen.

    I don't know what is suppose to happen, but I do think you two have several serious underlying issues which need to be addressed before you two can actually make informed choices on how things go from here.

    Its clear to me he has become emotionally attached to the third party here. I have to wonder how honest he is about that with himself. I would also imagine that just throwing that away may not work well.

    My suggestion is couples therapy/counseling. You two have to address things.

    For instance the situation that prompted bringing in a Craigslist person... Did the two tops with no sex situation get resolved here? No. you are both still two tops who now have discovered that third member doesn't work too well. Now what do you do? Give up sex completely? Honestly how well will that work out?

    If you two are not satisfied in bed, what about other aspects of the relationship? Are those problems too but you two just point at the sex bit because its the most obvious? Don't sit there and say 'oh its only the sex'. clearly his attachment to this boy indicates he wants or needs more.

    A therapist will help you two figure out everything that troubles your relationship, perhaps even figure out if you two have grown out of this relationship and are just serving the memory of 'us'. That does happen a lot, few people understand or even knows when it happens.

    So perhaps you two may find that parting company as lovers is actually what both of you need. The opportunity to find another may be healthier for both of you.

    I'm sorry for the pain that this situation is giving you.
  • Destinharbor

    Posts: 4435

    Nov 04, 2014 1:15 AM GMT
    I wouldn't run to counseling. It elevates things to a point few return from. Just try to talk it through. And to Bowyn_Aerrow, you say that you "honestly don't know how two tops can have a lovers relationship" but yet your profile says you don't like or do anal sex. What is the distinction between them and you? I completely disagree that top/bottom carries with it a pile of other role play requirements. Everything is fluid and negotiable in a loving relationship.

    Bryan, I'm sure you're deeply hurt. Don't move quickly. Think through what you want and talk through it with your boyfriend. You may even end up in a shouting match. But that doesn't mean you don't love each other and that things can't be fixed. Good luck,man.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 04, 2014 1:15 AM GMT
    BlackCat saidSimply put, you need to find another boyfriend.

    The fact that they excluded you from the conversation makes it sound like this guy just turned into a full blown home-wrecker and it's just a matter of time before you're the weakest link.

    The OP and his BF are already effectively broken up. He just doesn't know it yet.

    As far as OTC HIV testing, it tells the person his status roughly 3 months ago, not today. But in any case, the OP should dump this guy. He's moved on.

    And he's an HIV & general STD risk. I advise the OP to get tested for STDs immediately. And stay away from his obviously ex-BF.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 04, 2014 1:21 AM GMT
    BlackCat saidSimply put, you need to find another boyfriend.


    The fact that they excluded you from the conversation makes it sound like this guy just turned into a full blown home-wrecker and it's just a matter of time before you're the weakest link.

    Sad but true.
    What part of you being excluded did you not understand?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 04, 2014 1:28 AM GMT
    The good news:
    You're 28

    The bad...he's been thinking about breaking up a lot longer than a few months.
    Do you have a network of friends or family to lean on or has your life revolved around him for 10 years--10 years and 28; for real?
  • Bowyn_Aerrow

    Posts: 357

    Nov 04, 2014 6:39 AM GMT
    Destinharbor saidI wouldn't run to counseling. It elevates things to a point few return from. Just try to talk it through. And to Bowyn_Aerrow, you say that you "honestly don't know how two tops can have a lovers relationship" but yet your profile says you don't like or do anal sex. What is the distinction between them and you? I completely disagree that top/bottom carries with it a pile of other role play requirements. Everything is fluid and negotiable in a loving relationship.



    Anal and me. Oh well I know exactly how that one works, it falls within the parameters of my personal experience. I do know that I'm passive/submissive which works into the side of 'bottom' of things.... Since you read my profile then surely you got that at the bottom (pardon) of that section.icon_wink.gif


    I have never been in a two top relationship, I still don't know how that works.


    I used the word usually since always would be a fallacy:

    MyselfBeing 'top' usually carries more to it than who penetrates who. Things like who is the decider, who is the big spoon, who is the little spoon - all of these minor aspects of a Top/bottom relationship most likely have not been completely resolved to both of your 'top' satisfaction.


    And "most likely" over 'this has' because the behaviors of the partner here strongly suggest that he is seeking to satisfy something besides getting off. Its more probable this problem is not simply a sexual one, but other emotional needs are not being met and this third party has satisfied them.




  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 04, 2014 6:01 PM GMT

    Bowyn_Aerrow said,

    "The introduction of a bottom for 'just sex' had its merits, but apparently you kept on bringing this guy back again and again. Sex is not just about lust and pleasure, it has a lot of other stuff connected to it, it is apart of the socialization that takes place between bonding mates. Humans have understood this on one level or another which is why so many insist on the monogamy sort of thing even though lifelong monogamy is not natural for humans."


    Yes.

    ...well waitaminnit, lol, "..the monogamy sort of thing even though lifelong monogamy is not natural for humans."

    Erm. Neither is communicating via electrically powered devices on an internet, or flying, etc etc etc. *runs away laughing*
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Nov 04, 2014 6:07 PM GMT
    Why are two tops in a sexless relationship when there are so many 1000s of eager bottoms just waiting in the wings?icon_eek.gif
  • MikemikeMike

    Posts: 6932

    Nov 04, 2014 6:29 PM GMT
    Wow 10 and over a Craig's whore. Why sexless? Both tops here and both satisfied.
    Time you find a better fit sorry for the pun.
    You will survive, they probably won't last and hopefully you will be onto better by then.
  • MikemikeMike

    Posts: 6932

    Nov 04, 2014 6:31 PM GMT
    Also your b/f knows nothing about HIV. Just because this guy is clear on his first test doesn't mean he's negative!icon_idea.gif

    Why grow old with an idiot like him!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 04, 2014 6:34 PM GMT
    This is a depressing thread on so many levels.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 04, 2014 6:37 PM GMT
    If you're going to open your relationship up to have sex with others like this, you should first establish ground rules.....such as not meeting behind your back and always practicing safe sex, etc. By not having any rules in place, you've opened yourself up to a world of hurt. There's nothing you can do now but leave him.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Nov 04, 2014 8:11 PM GMT
    sf_swimmer saidThis is a depressing thread on so many levels.

    You must get depressed way too easily! But fear not. The OP has one post to his name. He's probably already over his thread by now.
  • Bowyn_Aerrow

    Posts: 357

    Nov 05, 2014 2:58 AM GMT
    meninlove said

    Yes.

    ...well waitaminnit, lol, "..the monogamy sort of thing even though lifelong monogamy is not natural for humans."

    Erm. Neither is communicating via electrically powered devices on an internet, or flying, etc etc etc. *runs away laughing*


    The difference being that monogamy is not tool use, these other things ARE tool use. And humans have been using tools for far longer than they have been human.

    Tool using and emotional drives based on the need to procreate and insure the survival of the DNA come from two different (vastly different) parts of the human brain.


    The majority of couples (this is across the whole human race not just gay men) tend to place great store on the concept of life long monogamy - like wolves have, or albatrosses or gibbons. These species are naturally evolved to pick a mate and stick with them until death to them part.

    Death do us part, one of the fundamental concepts of Marriage. A high ideal, but not very realistic when we take into account that millions if not billions of years of evolution fly in the face of this concept.

    Humans are not a life long monogamous species. They are at best serial monogamists or polygynous monogamists. Humans are quite capable and typically rather happy with short term monogamy relationships. Typically between 6-10 years of 'marital bliss' is possible.

    The predominate reason is because human offspring are born weak and lazy, flat refusing to get up and walk as soon as they drop out of the birth canal, refusing to hunt or graze on their own for many years. This has lead to a strong need for a two parent system for the first decade of a child's life.

    An interesting side example is male testosterone levels which drops when the male become a father (yes even a foster or step father) to small children. And rises back up to optimal levels once the child is between 7-10 years of age.

    It also happens with meeting a potential mate, your testosterone drops, and will remain low for a couple to a few years depending on the viability of your potential mate. 3 years without offspring and the testosterone levels increase.

    Yes humans have a rather advanced fore-brain that allows us to reason and have some rational concepts and form long term goals. However the hind-brain, the animal brain which is the seat of emotions like lust, desire, love, and basic instinctual drives, hunger, thirst, the drive to pair off an insure the survival of the DNA via sex contrasts with our ideologies of love, marriage and relationships being just one individual for the rest of our lives.

    DNA, biology, Anthropology, sociology, psychology, physiology and various other sciences clearly demonstrate that humans are not naturally prone to life-long monogamy.

    The very shape of your penis tells us you are not part of a monogamous species. The head coupled with all of that pumping action acts like a plunger to 'suck out' potential competitor's semen.

    https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=penis+acts+like+a+plunger

    Just because you think that your part of a species that has evolved passed its basic programing doesn't mean you are not a primate. It only means you are very well deluded into thinking that your fore brain actually guides human actions, feelings and life situations.

    Blame about 5000 years of religious nut-jobbery for the concept that humans are not animals and thus immune to their baser drives, motivations and instincts.




  • MikemikeMike

    Posts: 6932

    Nov 05, 2014 4:44 AM GMT
    Bowyn_Aerrow said
    meninlove said

    Yes.

    ...well waitaminnit, lol, "..the monogamy sort of thing even though lifelong monogamy is not natural for humans."

    Erm. Neither is communicating via electrically powered devices on an internet, or flying, etc etc etc. *runs away laughing*


    The difference being that monogamy is not tool use, these other things ARE tool use. And humans have been using tools for far longer than they have been human.

    Tool using and emotional drives based on the need to procreate and insure the survival of the DNA come from two different (vastly different) parts of the human brain.


    The majority of couples (this is across the whole human race not just gay men) tend to place great store on the concept of life long monogamy - like wolves have, or albatrosses or gibbons. These species are naturally evolved to pick a mate and stick with them until death to them part.

    Death do us part, one of the fundamental concepts of Marriage. A high ideal, but not very realistic when we take into account that millions if not billions of years of evolution fly in the face of this concept.

    Humans are not a life long monogamous species. They are at best serial monogamists or polygynous monogamists. Humans are quite capable and typically rather happy with short term monogamy relationships. Typically between 6-10 years of 'marital bliss' is possible.

    The predominate reason is because human offspring are born weak and lazy, flat refusing to get up and walk as soon as they drop out of the birth canal, refusing to hunt or graze on their own for many years. This has lead to a strong need for a two parent system for the first decade of a child's life.

    An interesting side example is male testosterone levels which drops when the male become a father (yes even a foster or step father) to small children. And rises back up to optimal levels once the child is between 7-10 years of age.

    It also happens with meeting a potential mate, your testosterone drops, and will remain low for a couple to a few years depending on the viability of your potential mate. 3 years without offspring and the testosterone levels increase.

    Yes humans have a rather advanced fore-brain that allows us to reason and have some rational concepts and form long term goals. However the hind-brain, the animal brain which is the seat of emotions like lust, desire, love, and basic instinctual drives, hunger, thirst, the drive to pair off an insure the survival of the DNA via sex contrasts with our ideologies of love, marriage and relationships being just one individual for the rest of our lives.

    DNA, biology, Anthropology, sociology, psychology, physiology and various other sciences clearly demonstrate that humans are not naturally prone to life-long monogamy.

    The very shape of your penis tells us you are not part of a monogamous species. The head coupled with all of that pumping action acts like a plunger to 'suck out' potential competitor's semen.

    https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=penis+acts+like+a+plunger

    Just because you think that your part of a species that has evolved passed its basic programing doesn't mean you are not a primate. It only means you are very well deluded into thinking that your fore brain actually guides human actions, feelings and life situations.

    Blame about 5000 years of religious nut-jobbery for the concept that humans are not animals and thus immune to their baser drives, motivations and instincts.






    So are you saying your story is a fake and you made it up to prove your point!
  • Bowyn_Aerrow

    Posts: 357

    Nov 05, 2014 5:28 AM GMT
    MikemikeMike said




    So are you saying your story is a fake and you made it up to prove your point!


    I strongly suggest you take a few courses in psychology, or human sexuality. Perhaps a few lectures in theology for the counterpart.

    Or you can start Googling. We have this wonderful thing called the 'internet' which, amongst pornography and images of nude men there is also a vast wealth of human knowledge available 24/7 for you to learn all manner of things.

    To touch on a few things here:

    Monogamous nature of humans - not:
    https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=are+humans+monogamous+or+polygamous+by+nature

    Influences of children on male testosterone
    :

    http://healthland.time.com/2011/09/13/why-do-dads-have-lower-levels-of-testosterone/

    7 and 2 year itch:
    [url]
    http://www.wealthysinglemommy.com/forget-the-seven-year-itch-science-proves-love-fades-after-two/[/url]

    and then there are whole books on the subject of human sexuality.

    http://www.amazon.com/Human-Sexuality-Fourth-Edition-Looseleaf/dp/0878936106

    I'm sorry if my knowledge scares you, or if I burst some bubble that you are an animal that reasons.

    Sorry, humans are animals capable of reasoning, but are still, sadly, creatures driven by the animal part of their brain, the emotional instinctual part.
    [url]
    http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/inside-the-mind/human-brain/brain4.htm[/url]

    I'm being kind when I use the words animal brain over reptilian brain.

    So no, I did not 'make up a story' nor am I lying. I am bringing at least 20 years of reading and study humans, sexuality, psychology.

  • highforthis

    Posts: 681

    Nov 05, 2014 5:51 AM GMT
    meninlove said
    Bowyn_Aerrow said,

    "The introduction of a bottom for 'just sex' had its merits, but apparently you kept on bringing this guy back again and again. Sex is not just about lust and pleasure, it has a lot of other stuff connected to it, it is apart of the socialization that takes place between bonding mates. Humans have understood this on one level or another which is why so many insist on the monogamy sort of thing even though lifelong monogamy is not natural for humans."


    Yes.

    ...well waitaminnit, lol, "..the monogamy sort of thing even though lifelong monogamy is not natural for humans."

    Erm. Neither is communicating via electrically powered devices on an internet, or flying, etc etc etc. *runs away laughing*


    It's the eternal struggle of humanity... angels vs demons, ego vs id, higher aspirations vs carnal desires. We want what isn't necessarily best for us. Monogamy isn't natural to us as animals, but we desire it for long term human happiness...

    There are gays who will insist that we're just animals and shouldn't deny our nature, but if the rule of law (ie no pedophilia) is the only constraint for our animal nature, nothing can save us from destroying ourselves.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 05, 2014 6:07 AM GMT
    It's becoming more and more obvious than some in our community like the law of the jungle approach which would mean of taken to it's fullest extent mean that homophobes could do what they like, treatment for HIV would be up to the individual to find and forget about marriage as very few would accept it if their were not laws for if. I sometimes want to say "F**k it let the mob of sheep get led to their slaughter" but that's not me.
  • Bowyn_Aerrow

    Posts: 357

    Nov 05, 2014 6:36 AM GMT
    highforthis said


    It's the eternal struggle of humanity... angels vs demons, ego vs id, higher aspirations vs carnal desires. We want what isn't necessarily best for us. Monogamy isn't natural to us as animals, but we desire it for long term human happiness...

    There are gays who will insist that we're just animals and shouldn't deny our nature, but if the rule of law (ie no pedophilia) is the only constraint for our animal nature, nothing can save us from destroying ourselves.


    When we grasp why it is we want what we want, we can better deal with that with reason.

    If we understand that monogamy runs counter to our biological drives, then we can begin to use reason and logic to counter those drives and strive toward reaching our goals when it comes to our philosophy.

    My point was to explain to the OP the potential drives and motivations at play, to step back, look at the overall picture then work on the problem to find a solution. We cannot solve a problem that we do not understand.

  • Apparition

    Posts: 3532

    Nov 06, 2014 5:08 AM GMT
    HottJoe saidWhy are two tops in a sexless relationship when there are so many 1000s of eager bottoms just waiting in the wings?icon_eek.gif


    hello +10000

    this is how your first date should have gone"

    1: want to go out?
    2: are you a top or bottom
    1: top
    2: me too, that sucks.
    1: well how about it
    2: how about what?
    1: going out with me..
    2: we are both tops, dont be an idiot.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 06, 2014 11:12 AM GMT
    reading that made me really sad inside.

    you never can tell just how long a relationship will last. my advice would be to maybe move on or at least sit down and properly talk to the guy. You obviously love him enough to consider the same role relationship.

    - talk to the bloke, as why he didn't induce you in the conversation
    - ask about how he feels about the other guy
    - inquire about the hiv testing; that is just as much your health as it is his or other other guys.
    - ask yourself how you feel. guys never take the time to really ask how they actually feel, they just think and do even if its the wrong way to behave or act.

    i can only give you this advice but you sound like a well grounded man. You deserve to fulfil your desires just as much as the next person but its they way you go about doing it; if you find that you want something else or find your boyfriends way of thinking a little hard to swallow then there needs to be some type of change.

    either in the immediate or near future.