Why do alcoholics and drug addicts get so much support from society

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    Jan 17, 2009 1:12 AM GMT
    but people whose drug is food are ridiculed?
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    Jan 17, 2009 2:28 AM GMT
    Because the people that admit they have a drinking/drug problem (who you would be referring to) are already on step 2 on their way towards recovery? I'd imagine a fat person at the gym would be given that same support. That would be my guess at least.
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    Jan 17, 2009 2:29 AM GMT
    Well there are people who greatly look down, and judge people who are drug addicts, or alcoholics. However A LOT of people have been there, and so they may know what its like, and how hard it is to want to get better, which is the key word, those who are trying to get better, not the ones who deny they have a problem, and allow it to continue to ruin their life, and others around them.

    There are people who treat those who are addicted to food the same way, and from what I know sometimes its a gland problem, but I suppose those who look down on it are the same as the ones who look down on those with the drug/alcohol problems, they view them as being weak with no self control, or respect, and or gluttons.
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    Jan 17, 2009 2:32 AM GMT
    society supports drug addicts in recovery who are reforming, those that relapse are not given nearly as much support just like those with a food addiction
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    Jan 17, 2009 2:34 AM GMT
    Your point is well taken. Of course, up until fairly recently, society seemed to suggest it was an OK, almost positive and manly thing for a guy to go out and get plastered. I'll never understand that kind of thinking, but there you have it.

    And not to depart too far from your question. . . but as a child, I endured daily abuse from drunken parents (both!) So I am one of those who has a very low opinion of alcoholics and my sympathy for them is quite limited.
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    Jan 17, 2009 2:47 AM GMT
    The fact is over-eaters don't drag down the lives of people around them as do substance abusers. I don't believe society is particularly supportive of drug addicts or alcoholics. They are just more aware of the damage their addiction has on others. That is why they want them to reform.

    There has been a big movement to address obesity in this country as we have finally awoken to the cost that it has to our society. There are over-eaters anonymous and other support groups for people with eating disorders. I find it just as ignorant to ridicule someone with an eating disorder as someone with a substance abuse problem. Nevertheless you can find people who do both.
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    Jan 17, 2009 3:02 AM GMT
    If you have ever seen a rehab center, you would realize they don't get a lot of support. Overcrowded, understaffed, underfunded, and those that are not serviced are sent to prison where you can do as much time as a murderer.

    Over the last year at least you have been a member of this community and have gotten support from most people when you write about your experience trying to get in better shape. So, which society are you talking about?
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    Jan 17, 2009 3:04 AM GMT
    Good point. Food addiction, alcoholism, and drug addiction (as well as other addictions) all comprise the same disease which is addiction. Sugars, white flours, and other things companies add to their foods are addictive as hell. Sugars are actually classified as a drug in the same category as caffeine and nicotine.

    Learn what your support sources are. Addiction Counselors, rehabilitation programs, and 12 step support groups are available for food addicts. If you think you can stop the pattern on your own, you might check out resources for overeaters anonymous meetings in your area. You'll just have to do a bit of googling.



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    Jan 17, 2009 3:09 AM GMT
    I think society has to respect and take seriously ALL types of addiction.

    Food
    Drugs
    Shopping
    Sex
    Alcohol
    Smoking
    Pedophilia (yes, even that... Psycholgists believ they have found a genetic link to pedophilia)

    It is sad though that fat people seem to be rediculed a lot by the gay community--certainly not everyone.

    Someone recently wrote this in another thread.

    "this pisses me off, no one is saying we should get rid of fat gays like you! i mean, sure, you walk around the world comsuming more than the rest of us. you take up more space, sweat too much and smell of ketchup and hot dogs...icon_evil.gif

    i love how fat cowboy just sent me an e-mail telling me i was fat... um... im not a the geriatric fat guy wearing cowboy hats... who the hell does that? someone took that mountain movie with the recently dead guy seriously. NO! that fact is, you open your fat mouth and typed with your stubby fat man fingers too soon. now you have this entire thread against you (:

    ps, if im fat you're an obese troll! now go away and eat a busted egg roll! ugh... and while you're add it, go find a different gimmick! no one thinks cowboys hats are hot... but thats okay, we all know you're just trying to hide that receding hairline (: my suggestion is a cute little boston or nyc baseball cap... its cute subtle and up to date. "


    I honestly couldn't believe it! The guy he insulted isn't even overweight... he'd be cleared by doctors in a second.

    Also, I have seen several other threads of Youtube clips of overweight people dancing or singing... or doing sexual acts.

    Comment from RJers included: "I'm gonna vomit know" "She's the abomination" "Thanks for showing that clip, I needed a laugh"

    My own theory for overweight people will come another day. But I think most in the gay community as a whole a.) find overweight people replusive, b.)do not understand that hardships overweight people go through, c.) do not understand how hard it is for some people to lose weight, d.) have a hard time believeing not all overweight people are "lazy" or "pigs" who ate themselves into misery... some gain wight from medications, genetic defaults and/or medical issues, and e.) do not respect the fact that overweight people can't lose weight overnight and make stubble or relapse.


    NoNameGuy, it took courage to write about this topic... especially on a site like this.
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    Jan 17, 2009 5:37 AM GMT
    Erikk saidBecause the people that admit they have a drinking/drug problem (who you would be referring to) are already on step 2 on their way towards recovery? I'd imagine a fat person at the gym would be given that same support. That would be my guess at least.


    So, a person who uses food the way an alcoholic uses alcohol just needs to go to the gym?
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    Jan 17, 2009 5:55 AM GMT
    Watch the south park episode about Stan's dad when he goes to AA meetings Classic.
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    Jan 17, 2009 5:56 AM GMT
    There are support groups for over eaters! Are you kidding me! The later are ridiculed as well have you met everyone in recovery...I think NOT!
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    Jan 17, 2009 6:26 AM GMT
    I know this is harsh, but it sounds like someone is having a pity party. The tools and support are everywhere you look. Take this site for example. Look how many programs, support groups, books and tv shows there are out there dedicated to changing a food addict's life. I think you're just looking for reasons to not do anything about it and feel sorry for yourself.
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    Jan 17, 2009 6:42 AM GMT
    THere is a big difference between drug/alcohol addiction and addiictions such as food.

    Drug/alchohol addiction are a physiological addicition that has a psychological component. Food addiction is not physiological. Total cessasion of addictive drugs (done properly) will not kill you and you can live the rest of your life without ever having to drink alcohol or take an addictive drug again. This cannot be done with food. You must eat.

    Food addiction is purely behavioral as are many other addictions. This kind of addiction is manifested by food, or sex or other behavioral activities. If the behavior isn't addressed, the addiction continues or shifts to a different behavior. You can't turn someone without the manifesting behavioral problems into a food addict by eating. Even forcing them to eat to much will not create the behavioral problem.

    A narcotic, given to ANYONE for a sufficient period of time will cause an addiction. This is purely physiological. It will happen to everyone given a sufficient quantity over a finite period. With alcoholism, the physiological propensity to develop alcoholism through a genetic structure which allows a change in brain chemistry and physical dependency is the reason that some are likely to develop alcoholism where others will not in similar conditions.

    The problem comes when there is overlap of genetics with behavioral problems. Since these differences are rarely distinguished (largely due to cultural issues), they are often clumped together.

    While there may be similarities in treatment, they shouldn't be considered the same. A 'food addict' cannot give up food and live. They must learn to control it through behaior modification and/or psychological therapy/treatment. A drug addict/alcoholic, on the other hand, must stop ingetion entirely, Controlled intake is ineffective (except in those cases where the component is purely behavioral - although total abstinence is certainly an effective treatment) since any amount will start the destructive metabolic effects of the drug addiction.

    The societal lack of acceptance of one addiction over another is based on staggered cultural recognition and knowledge of the problems. Alcoholism has been recognized and defined for almost a century, drug addiction far longer, while food addiction has only been defined as such for a few decades. The stigmas of each are different. Since they are stigmas as determined by society, they are not equal for they are based on fear and ignorance.
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    Jan 17, 2009 8:58 AM GMT
    There are weight loss support groups out there. Would you rather be shunned like a crack head or shunned like a fatty? I think I'd rather be a fatty...
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    Jan 17, 2009 10:41 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite saidI know this is harsh, but it sounds like someone is having a pity party. The tools and support are everywhere you look. Take this site for example. Look how many programs, support groups, books and tv shows there are out there dedicated to changing a food addict's life. I think you're just looking for reasons to not do anything about it and feel sorry for yourself.


    1.) Yes you are right, that was quite harsh

    2.) I do not believe there is a pity party--I believe he brought up a good point: it is still acceptable to insult overweight people.

    3.) Tools are everywhere yes, but
    a.) Not all tools work for everyone
    b.) Not all tools are accessable to everyone equally
    c.) Not all tools are reasonable, economically, for everyone
    d.) Most use the tools improperly because of lack of proper knoweldge

    4.) Most overweight people ARE trying to lose weight. I wonder about your experience with addiction.

    People say "Well just stop eatting so much, get off the couch and go to the gym."

    It is not that easy--This is a Psychological, Genetic, and Behavorial issue. Have a heart and try to empathize with those who hate their lives because of how they feel, how they are treated, and the struggles they are going through... trying to be respectable in society's eyes.
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    Jan 17, 2009 10:56 AM GMT
    NoNameGuy saidbut people whose drug is food are ridiculed?


    drugs and alcohol make you feel great.

    being fat... not so much. icon_evil.gif
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    Jan 17, 2009 10:57 AM GMT
    bgcat57 saidTHere is a big difference between drug/alcohol addiction and addiictions such as food.

    Drug/alchohol addiction are a physiological addicition that has a psychological component. Food addiction is not physiological. Total cessasion of addictive drugs (done properly) will not kill you and you can live the rest of your life without ever having to drink alcohol or take an addictive drug again. This cannot be done with food. You must eat.

    Food addiction is purely behavioral as are many other addictions. This kind of addiction is manifested by food, or sex or other behavioral activities. If the behavior isn't addressed, the addiction continues or shifts to a different behavior. You can't turn someone without the manifesting behavioral problems into a food addict by eating. Even forcing them to eat to much will not create the behavioral problem.


    I was always taught that food addiction had a psychological, genetic, and behavorial component. I don't see how you can claim that there isn't a psychological component to over eating.


    bgcat57 saidA narcotic, given to ANYONE for a sufficient period of time will cause an addiction. This is purely physiological. It will happen to everyone given a sufficient quantity over a finite period. With alcoholism, the physiological propensity to develop alcoholism through a genetic structure which allows a change in brain chemistry and physical dependency is the reason that some are likely to develop alcoholism where others will not in similar conditions.

    The problem comes when there is overlap of genetics with behavioral problems. Since these differences are rarely distinguished (largely due to cultural issues), they are often clumped together.


    I guess I'm confused as to what you are implying here.

    bgcat57 saidWhile there may be similarities in treatment, they shouldn't be considered the same. A 'food addict' cannot give up food and live. They must learn to control it through behaior modification and/or psychological therapy/treatment. A drug addict/alcoholic, on the other hand, must stop ingetion entirely, Controlled intake is ineffective (except in those cases where the component is purely behavioral - although total abstinence is certainly an effective treatment) since any amount will start the destructive metabolic effects of the drug addiction.


    That is true, people need to eat. I don't see how that makes a difference though--if anything, it makes overcoming food addiction even harder tan expected.

    bgcat57 saidThe societal lack of acceptance of one addiction over another is based on staggered cultural recognition and knowledge of the problems. Alcoholism has been recognized and defined for almost a century, drug addiction far longer, while food addiction has only been defined as such for a few decades. The stigmas of each are different. Since they are stigmas as determined by society, they are not equal for they are based on fear and ignorance.


    I would disagree to a point. I think the lack of societal acceptance of overweight people has a lot to do with what soceity finds attractive.

    I made a poster of various male models in skimpy underwear and speedos. It is hanging in my room. When my mom first saw it (my mother is at a healthy weight) she couldn't believe it. She thought the guys, all 40ish except one, were way too skinny.

    She thought this guy was sickly looking

    2679364331_3eaabbbef2.jpg
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    Jan 17, 2009 11:01 AM GMT
    rawr said
    NoNameGuy saidbut people whose drug is food are ridiculed?


    drugs and alcohol make you feel great.

    being fat... not so much. icon_evil.gif


    ... huh?
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    Jan 17, 2009 11:02 AM GMT
    cjcscuba1984 said
    rawr said
    NoNameGuy saidbut people whose drug is food are ridiculed?


    drugs and alcohol make you feel great.

    being fat... not so much. icon_evil.gif


    ... huh?


    Who knows? she's crazy.
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    Jan 17, 2009 11:19 AM GMT
    rawr said
    cjcscuba1984 said
    rawr said
    NoNameGuy saidbut people whose drug is food are ridiculed?


    drugs and alcohol make you feel great.

    being fat... not so much. icon_evil.gif


    ... huh?


    Who knows? she's crazy.


    Did you'd just insult my mudda!?! Grrrr.... lol
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    Jan 17, 2009 12:59 PM GMT
    In my experience many of the drug addicts and alcoholics in society are living on the streets freezing to death (at least in Toronto), or are in prison. It is true that if you are alchoholic or a drug addict you can go to rehab. but the number of spaces does not equal the demand in many places.



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    Jan 17, 2009 1:05 PM GMT
    SurrealLife saidIn my experience many of the drug addicts and alcoholics in society are living on the streets freezing to death (at least in Toronto), or are in prison. It is true that if you are alchoholic or a drug addict you can go to rehab. but the number of spaces does not equal the demand in many places.





    That is sad. I know how hard it is for those people. Perhaps we shouldn't compare. Instead we should talk about respecting all people with addiction and empathize and pity the--rather than cracking jokes at their expense just to make us feel better about ourselves.
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    Jan 17, 2009 1:19 PM GMT
    cjcscuba1984 said
    GuerrillaSodomite saidI know this is harsh, but it sounds like someone is having a pity party. The tools and support are everywhere you look. Take this site for example. Look how many programs, support groups, books and tv shows there are out there dedicated to changing a food addict's life. I think you're just looking for reasons to not do anything about it and feel sorry for yourself.


    1.) Yes you are right, that was quite harsh

    2.) I do not believe there is a pity party--I believe he brought up a good point: it is still acceptable to insult overweight people.

    3.) Tools are everywhere yes, but
    a.) Not all tools work for everyone
    b.) Not all tools are accessable to everyone equally
    c.) Not all tools are reasonable, economically, for everyone
    d.) Most use the tools improperly because of lack of proper knoweldge

    4.) Most overweight people ARE trying to lose weight. I wonder about your experience with addiction.

    People say "Well just stop eatting so much, get off the couch and go to the gym."

    It is not that easy--This is a Psychological, Genetic, and Behavorial issue. Have a heart and try to empathize with those who hate their lives because of how they feel, how they are treated, and the struggles they are going through... trying to be respectable in society's eyes.



    I never said it was easy. And I can empathize. I was 60 pounds overweight and on two different medications for depression until 5 years ago. I quit bemoaning the unfairness of it all and did something about it. It wasn't easy and I still struggle with keeping my weight under control.

    My point is this: I stopped complaining about how unjust society is and how people just didn't understand how it wasn't as easy as pushing yourself away from the table. Making the comparison to the way society looks upon and treats substance abuse is perfectly legitimate, but the OP has made several posts in the past leading up to this one that lead me to believe he is more interested in wallowing in self pity than taking responsibility for his own emotional well being. Whether that means hitting the gym and changing his eating habits, or not making society responsible for his personal happiness is his choice. As someone who has been there, however, I'm not inclined to sit back and give him a violin accompaniment to his tale of woe.
  • Koaa2

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    Jan 17, 2009 2:14 PM GMT
    I think as society begins to realize the cost, both financially and emotionally, of unhealthy food consumption, there will be increasing pressure, just like for illegal drugs, alcohol and tobacco, to do something about it. At this time the food industry, just like the tobacco industry, is denying the consequences of the unhealthy food it is delivering to the public.