Jealous of support given to younger generation

  • craycraydoesd...

    Posts: 596

    Jan 03, 2015 11:58 PM GMT
    I was having drinks with a few friends yesterday when a younger friend of a friend expressed regret at not letting his parents help him buy a condo in Toronto during college (he's now mid 20's I think). He knew it was a good time to buy 7 years ago but didn't tell his family (who lives in Pittsburgh) because he didn't want to commit to a mortgage while closeted and was convinced that they wouldn't support him if they knew he was gay.

    He came out to them recently and though the parents are fiercely against it for religious reasons, it was they who later brought up the subject and insisted on helping him buy a condo, only to find out that their son's closeted years made them miss an opportunity as prices have gone way up since then.

    I reacted with a bit of a diatribe about first world problems, and may have lost my temper at one point, but i couldn't believe how spoiled some kids are these days. I was kicked out of the house at 19 and had to make a living for myself all these years. It makes one wonder at all the possibilities that could've been if some of us older gays had a more supportive network when we were young...
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 04, 2015 12:35 AM GMT
    You can't really blame younger people for having it easier in terms of being gay. That was always the goal. Anyway, today's first world problems are kind of disturbing in some respects. Only time will tell how this all turns out.
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    Jan 04, 2015 5:08 AM GMT
    If you're strictly referring to financial support, then consider yourself lucky (I'm talking about you, OP) because people who struggle at a young age are most likely the ones to learn self-responsibility at a fast pace. They also gain a strong sense of independence and do not rely on others for financial help.

    I actually feel sorry for those who remain financially spoiled way into early adulthood. Those are the people who struggle the worst when something goes wrong.
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    Jan 04, 2015 5:09 AM GMT
    I'm still mad at my parents for not buying THIS Manhattan condo at The Ansonia in the early '90s when I was already out:

    69qgdt.jpg
    My being gay wasn't the issue (though my married PREGNANT sister got $), but being absentee landlords even with me in residence paying rent with a roommate, and hating real estate investment, was. That enormous, gutted lofty one bedroom penthouse with an elliptical foyer with mirrored, concave french doors, a football field sized living room, eat-in kitchen and round bedroom with a leaky ceiling under the tower cupola was only $300K or so then (the rent was $300/mo pending condo conversion) and is now worth very easily at least ten times that.

    They wouldn't even help with the downpayment for a then-$150K sponsor-renovated small one-bedroom unit with an oval living room and fireplace, which looked similar to this Ansonia apartment, albeit smaller and not as well renovated, now worth well over $800K:

    102mhas.jpg

    2afy2de.jpg

    So yeah. I'm jealous.
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    Jan 04, 2015 5:10 AM GMT
    I don't think OP's scenario is common. Lots of young guys struggle and have to work for things. This seems more like #RichPeopleProblems.
  • metta

    Posts: 39134

    Jan 04, 2015 5:12 AM GMT
    I don't feel jealous. Not everyone has those kinds of opportunities but I'm happy for those that do have them.


    My father died when I was 18, as freshman in college. We all have to make decisions based on our own situations. I chose to change colleges to a less expensive one and work my way through school. I graduated without any debt. I had to work my butt off for everything that I have and I don't regret that. I don't base my life on what other have or were given. I could not imagine even asking my parents for anything. Not because they wouldn't if they could...but because I felt it was wrong to even ask given the situation my parents were in with my father dying of cancer and having to close down his offices.

    I do feel very fortunate that my parents did do all that they could for their children while they could. Not everyone is that lucky.
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    Jan 04, 2015 5:52 AM GMT
    eagermuscle saidI'm still mad at my parents for not buying THIS Manhattan condo at The Ansonia in the early '90s when I was already out:

    69qgdt.jpg
    My being gay wasn't the issue (though my married PREGNANT sister got $), but being absentee landlords even with me in residence paying rent with a roommate, and hating real estate investment, was. That enormous, gutted lofty one bedroom penthouse with an elliptical foyer with mirrored, concave french doors, a football field sized living room, eat-in kitchen and round bedroom with a leaky ceiling under the tower cupola was only $300K or so then (the rent was $300/mo pending condo conversion) and is now worth very easily at least ten times that.

    They wouldn't even help with the downpayment for a then-$150K sponsor-renovated small one-bedroom unit with an oval living room and fireplace, which looked similar to this Ansonia apartment, albeit smaller and not as well renovated, now worth well over $800K:

    102mhas.jpg

    2afy2de.jpg

    So yeah. I'm jealous.


    I know that building VERY well- the tower cupola ( which would have still been an empty shell at the time, just like the twin to the north) was added on to the apartment below and made into a double height library with an astrological theme. The apartment last sold for about 10 million dollars several years ago. That amount of money now buys a badly (albeit expensively) renovated covertable 3 bedroom combo on a lower floor.
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    Jan 04, 2015 5:56 AM GMT
    Ah, there have always been trust-fund babies around. Jealousy is a waste of life.

    And besides, you know, the 0.1% will be probably go to the guillotine in the revolution. Jealous of that?
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    Jan 04, 2015 6:32 AM GMT
    When you're good they want to feed and stuff you. However, when they find out your bad they will cut you off and ignore you!

    Family can be a nightmare. I choose to not discuss any of my personal OR interpersonal business with them.

    My parents want to see me as the good little boy they always knew. I am not going to shatter that. I am still that and much more!

    I don't need from them or anyone. If they wish to keep me in the the family trust or disinherit me... it's up to them.

    Being independent like those who posted and who have gained strength from learning how to be self-reliant is a very powerful thing!

    No need to be Jealous. Set your own path!
    Cheers to all and Happy New Year.
  • AMoonHawk

    Posts: 11406

    Jan 04, 2015 8:31 AM GMT
    No use in being jealous ... Everyone has their own path they must travel
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    Jan 04, 2015 6:00 PM GMT
    Sad actually
    Sad, that you don't see the irony--first world problems indeed.
    Had I not been closeted I'd so bought in on "Jerry and David's Guide to the World Wide Web".
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    Jan 04, 2015 6:52 PM GMT
    Cash said
    eagermuscle saidI'm still mad at my parents for not buying THIS Manhattan condo at The Ansonia in the early '90s when I was already out:

    69qgdt.jpg
    My being gay wasn't the issue (though my married PREGNANT sister got $), but being absentee landlords even with me in residence paying rent with a roommate, and hating real estate investment, was. That enormous, gutted lofty one bedroom penthouse with an elliptical foyer with mirrored, concave french doors, a football field sized living room, eat-in kitchen and round bedroom with a leaky ceiling under the tower cupola was only $300K or so then (the rent was $300/mo pending condo conversion) and is now worth very easily at least ten times that.

    They wouldn't even help with the downpayment for a then-$150K sponsor-renovated small one-bedroom unit with an oval living room and fireplace, which looked similar to this Ansonia apartment, albeit smaller and not as well renovated, now worth well over $800K:

    102mhas.jpg

    2afy2de.jpg

    So yeah. I'm jealous.


    I know that building VERY well- the tower cupola ( which would have still been an empty shell at the time, just like the twin to the north) was added on to the apartment below and made into a double height library with an astrological theme. The apartment last sold for about 10 million dollars several years ago. That amount of money now buys a badly (albeit expensively) renovated covertable 3 bedroom combo on a lower floor.


    Last thing I saw on the webz it was listed for $1.895. 1250 sq. ft.
    Building and taxes a total of $2600/mo.
    Not sure how a $300k loan or even a $240k loan translates to $300 a month...especially in the early 90's...

    Also not sure how an oval living room is 20X20...? Still, quite a lovely property.
    http://ansoniarealty.com/apt-3-75
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    Jan 04, 2015 6:56 PM GMT
    All I'm hearing is some parents missing out on some great investment opportunities, and some irrelevant information. Don't feel sorry for yourself, feel sorry for them.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 04, 2015 7:06 PM GMT
    Ohno saidAll I'm hearing is some parents missing out on some great investment opportunities, and some irrelevant information. Don't feel sorry for yourself, feel sorry for them.

    I'm just here to steal stuff.

    (sorry that's a quote from RuPaul)icon_lol.gif
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    Jan 04, 2015 7:08 PM GMT
    ^^^

    Rapscallion!

    icon_evil.gif
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    Jan 04, 2015 7:22 PM GMT
    Not everyone who is in the "younger generation" has financial support from their parents.
    I think it just depends if you parents have money - and will spoil you, and make you work for nothing - or if they truly don't have any money and you need to make a life for yourself.

    For me my parents came here with no money at all, so I didn't have anyone to help pay for university, a car, or much. Just had a home to live in and had to figure out the rest myself, which may sound like I am complaining but that's the truth.
    I am lucky they came here in the first place, since we have the option for students loans, a easier chance to work your way up in here and it's landed me a good job now.

    But I did have to sacrifice my entire social life and every second of free time to get here so in one way or another I feel everyone needs to sacrifice something to truly find a good position in life. Wether it's relying on your parents for large amounts of money, a social life, or other things, they can all teach you lessons to become a better person.

    It makes me a little frustrated inside when people talk about kids getting brand new cars at 16 then trashing them so I understand where you're coming from for sure.
    Having their parents pay for their rent (or condos) or cars I feel is just a way for them to stop finding their own means for motivation. I feel like these things should be gained from individuality cause you feel proud once you've worked for it which is what drives motivation.


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    Jan 05, 2015 6:19 AM GMT
    Cash said
    eagermuscle saidI'm still mad at my parents for not buying THIS Manhattan condo at The Ansonia in the early '90s when I was already out:

    69qgdt.jpg
    My being gay wasn't the issue (though my married PREGNANT sister got $), but being absentee landlords even with me in residence paying rent with a roommate, and hating real estate investment, was. That enormous, gutted lofty one bedroom penthouse with an elliptical foyer with mirrored, concave french doors, a football field sized living room, eat-in kitchen and round bedroom with a leaky ceiling under the tower cupola was only $300K or so then (the rent was $300/mo pending condo conversion) and is now worth very easily at least ten times that.

    They wouldn't even help with the downpayment for a then-$150K sponsor-renovated small one-bedroom unit with an oval living room and fireplace, which looked similar to this Ansonia apartment, albeit smaller and not as well renovated, now worth well over $800K:

    102mhas.jpg

    2afy2de.jpg

    So yeah. I'm jealous.


    I know that building VERY well- the tower cupola ( which would have still been an empty shell at the time, just like the twin to the north) was added on to the apartment below and made into a double height library with an astrological theme. The apartment last sold for about 10 million dollars several years ago. That amount of money now buys a badly (albeit expensively) renovated covertable 3 bedroom combo on a lower floor.


    Yer killin' me, Cash! Though it wouldn't bother my folks one iota - a secure roof over my head now's as important to them as it was then. I'm assuming not only the cupola but the rooms to the west sunk into the mansard roof were also acquired so that when they turned the bedroom into a double height library they acquired a bedroom or two upstairs as well?

    bon_pan said

    Not sure how a $300k loan or even a $240k loan translates to $300 a month...especially in the early 90's...

    Sorry if I wasn't clearer. Back then developers gave incentives to sell units because they needed a certain percentage of "sold" units to convert. The incentive there was that they would "rent" the vacant units in rent stabilized buildings. Why were there so many vacant units to begin with? Landlords could legally warehouse empty units pending condo and coop conversions and in this case, the Ansonia's owner did just that, keeping them empty save for his forests of potted ficus trees (seriously!). Developers would then rent them at their STABILIZED rents (possibly putting them on the prime leases, I don't quite recall how that worked). The then-stabilized rent for that enormous penthouse was around $300 per month. If you were a buyer of that unit it was a win-win - you were put on the lease as a renter for $300 per month, and if it converted you could buy it for around $300K. If it didn't convert, you kept the prime lease and the unit for $300 rent per month.
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    Jan 05, 2015 5:36 PM GMT
    eagermuscle said
    Cash said
    eagermuscle saidI'm still mad at my parents for not buying THIS Manhattan condo at The Ansonia in the early '90s when I was already out:

    69qgdt.jpg
    My being gay wasn't the issue (though my married PREGNANT sister got $), but being absentee landlords even with me in residence paying rent with a roommate, and hating real estate investment, was. That enormous, gutted lofty one bedroom penthouse with an elliptical foyer with mirrored, concave french doors, a football field sized living room, eat-in kitchen and round bedroom with a leaky ceiling under the tower cupola was only $300K or so then (the rent was $300/mo pending condo conversion) and is now worth very easily at least ten times that.

    They wouldn't even help with the downpayment for a then-$150K sponsor-renovated small one-bedroom unit with an oval living room and fireplace, which looked similar to this Ansonia apartment, albeit smaller and not as well renovated, now worth well over $800K:

    102mhas.jpg

    2afy2de.jpg

    So yeah. I'm jealous.


    I know that building VERY well- the tower cupola ( which would have still been an empty shell at the time, just like the twin to the north) was added on to the apartment below and made into a double height library with an astrological theme. The apartment last sold for about 10 million dollars several years ago. That amount of money now buys a badly (albeit expensively) renovated covertable 3 bedroom combo on a lower floor.


    Yer killin' me, Cash! Though it wouldn't bother my folks one iota - a secure roof over my head now's as important to them as it was then. I'm assuming not only the cupola but the rooms to the west sunk into the mansard roof were also acquired so that when they turned the bedroom into a double height library they acquired a bedroom or two upstairs as well?

    bon_pan said

    Not sure how a $300k loan or even a $240k loan translates to $300 a month...especially in the early 90's...

    Sorry if I wasn't clearer. Back then developers gave incentives to sell units because they needed a certain percentage of "sold" units to convert. The incentive there was that they would "rent" the vacant units in rent stabilized buildings. Why were there so many vacant units to begin with? Landlords could legally warehouse empty units pending condo and coop conversions and in this case, the Ansonia's owner did just that, keeping them empty save for his forests of potted ficus trees (seriously!). Developers would then rent them at their STABILIZED rents (possibly putting them on the prime leases, I don't quite recall how that worked). The then-stabilized rent for that enormous penthouse was around $300 per month. If you were a buyer of that unit it was a win-win - you were put on the lease as a renter for $300 per month, and if it converted you could buy it for around $300K. If it didn't convert, you kept the prime lease and the unit for $300 rent per month.


    Yes, it was a combo of several units including some former servants rooms in the upper part of the Mansard Roof - where the porthole windows are. They actually included skylights so were actuallly very cool units. The uppermost part of the tower that extends above the roofline was also incorporated. It was just an empty shell (accessible from the roof if You knew how).so the upper part of the library was a real dome. There was a time that You could climb to the tops of both towers from the inside- there were originally large Greek inspired temple-like lanterns on top (much like the San Remo or El Dorado) but they were removed decades ago. I don't remember if the owners of the newly created Penthouse retained access to the top exterior "observatory" section of the tower roof.
  • Kinneticbrian

    Posts: 230

    Jan 05, 2015 10:56 PM GMT
    I don't think the notion of being spoiled is limited to the younger generation. While those of us north of 35 certainly didn't have the support that exists today, we still get to enjoy the benefits of it. There are still young people today who get kicked out, kicked around and have to struggle to make it every day.

    Like you, I always have had a problem with people who put on airs, which is exactly what it sounds like this guy did. A sense of entitlement (again, not just for the young) is one of the most despicable things in America that we not only tolerate, but seem to almost foster.

    I grew up in a relatively wealthy family, but have worked since I was 7 years old. I worked as a lifeguard in High School, long hours at a YMCA, was expected to still take care of my responsibilities at home and maintain my grades. In college I worked 2 jobs for the university and maintained my grades. I was determined to never allow my parents, who were very controlling of my brothers, to ever exert that control over me by lording their money over me.

    So this 20-something got a break and his parents helped him buy a condo? Don't be jealous of him, pity him. His parents took away something that would have been a real accomplishment if he did it on his own. He probably, because of this, has no idea of the value of a dollar. Heaven help him if they ever lose their wealth and he has to actually earn something. If your parents have to help you buy a condo, they're probably enabling you to live beyond your means. Any wonder why credit card debt is soaring?

    As to possibilities if there was more support years ago? We have possibilities now. Maybe had there been more real support years ago, things like condos and cars would be diminished to the insignificant places they deserve. I wonder, if we took the passion we have in accumulating "stuff" and arguing about things like politics, how many suicides could we prevent? How many elderly people (gay or straight) wouldn't feel discarded, forgotten and alone? How much could we support those living with HIV, or autism?

    The reality of his condo is that someone has lived there before him and someone will after he isn't there. A house is a house. A human being is a person. There's a reason eyeglasses aren't made out of money, nor are windows... it's a poor prism through which to look.

    I understand your disgust, believe me. My college is building "student housing" that looks like it was outfitted by Hilton. Everything has to be "upscale" to compete. Things aren't easier today - they're just marketed that way. We've lost our focus and our priorities.
  • Tig3r

    Posts: 139

    Jan 06, 2015 1:31 AM GMT
    I used to wish that I was apart of this "Privileged Younger Generation", not have to worry about the cost of College, Cars, Housing, Food, or anything along those lines.

    Instead I was born number 3 in a line of 7 (Last 3 were adopted). My mother's annual income was about $16,000 a year, when I turned 15.5 I started holding a Pizza sign outside of a local restaurant. Every day after school I would stand there from 4pm until it got too dark to hold the sign, then I'd put the sign back, and walk home. This continued for half a year until I was old enough to work inside, at 16.

    30 Hours a week just to help pay bills as my mom struggled to find full time work. At 16.5 I saved enough money to buy my first car: a 1997 Dodge Dakota with 292,000 miles for $700. I was fortunate enough to get my Associates Degree at 18 for completely free.

    Everyday at University I would go to work on Campus or close-by, I had no "Care-Packages" in the mail waiting for me like other kids. Since I sold my vehicle (traded it eventually for a 94 Honda Civic) to pay for the first school payment, I had no nice car to take me home on the Holiday's. I had to hope a friend would drive me 15 minutes to the nearest Greyhound station where I would sit and wait for up to an hour in an empty (the homeless people always kept me company) bus station.

    There were days where my mom was concerned about the water bill or groceries, I would deposit as much money as I could spare to make sure everyone else was taken care of. I just graduated last month, but through all the work I put in not only did I graduate early, I also bought my first new car (2010 but it's the exact car I wanted so it's new to me),bought my sister her first car (99 Civic) and I'm typing this from my two-bedroom apartment, watching Bar Rescue off my 55' TV, thinking about good investments.

    I worked for everything I have, which makes me appreciate everything in my life.
  • metta

    Posts: 39134

    Jan 06, 2015 1:59 AM GMT
    Ohno saidAll I'm hearing is some parents missing out on some great investment opportunities, and some irrelevant information. Don't feel sorry for yourself, feel sorry for them.


    So tell us...what are these great investment opportunities. icon_smile.gif
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Jan 06, 2015 3:56 AM GMT
    This is hilarious. The OP, CrazyCrazyDoesDoes is complaining about "Spoiled Youths." and then says. "It makes one wonder at all the possibilities that could've been if some of us older gays had a more supportive network when we were young"

    You say you were kicked out of the house when you were nineteen. That would have been around 1988. To me you're one of the young people you are now jealous of. You weren't around in the days before Homosexuality was declassified as a mental disease. Back then families could go to a judge and have a gay son or daughter picked up and indefinitely shipped away to mental institutions. Once the American Psychiatric Association changed their stand on homosexuality mental institutions across the nation began slowly and covertly releasing gay patients, some over 60 who'd been locked up most of their lives.

    You missed out on the days when in most medium to large cities at least 6 gay men a year were murdered by men who either didn't go to trial or were declared not guilty for having had to defend themselves from being attacked by gay men.

    You missed out on Anita Bryant's holy war on gays in late 1970s. No doubt you've never been in a gay bar that was raided by police and everyone hauled off to jail if they weren't already paying police protection money.

    You missed out on the first wave of the AIDS epidemic. Those of us who survived it lost as many as half our friends in less than four years.

    And you don't realize or appreciate how easy you've had it, but you find the need to be jealous of those who come after you.








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    Jan 06, 2015 4:09 AM GMT
    bobbobbob saidThis is hilarious. The OP, CrazyCrazyDoesDoes is complaining about "Spoiled Youths." and then says. "It makes one wonder at all the possibilities that could've been if some of us older gays had a more supportive network when we were young"

    You say you were kicked out of the house when you were nineteen. That would have been around 1988. To me you're one of the young people you are now jealous of. You weren't around in the days before Homosexuality was declassified as a mental disease. Back then families could go to a judge and have a gay son or daughter picked up and indefinitely shipped away to mental institutions. Once the American Psychiatric Association changed their stand on homosexuality mental institutions across the nation began slowly and covertly releasing gay patients, some over 60 who'd been locked up most of their lives.

    You missed out on the days when in most medium to large cities at least 6 gay men a year were murdered by men who either didn't go to trial or were declared not guilty for having had to defend themselves from being attacked by gay men.

    You missed out on Anita Bryant's holy war on gays in late 1970s. No doubt you've never been in a gay bar that was raided by police and everyone hauled off to jail if they weren't already paying police protection money.

    You missed out on the first wave of the AIDS epidemic. Those of us who survived it lost as many as half our friends in less than four years.

    And you don't realize or appreciate how easy you've had it, but you find the need to be jealous of those who come after you.










    /thread.
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    Jan 06, 2015 4:12 AM GMT
    New York hedge fund founder shot to death in apartment; son arrested

    BBhyCJc.img?h=352&w=624&m=6&q=60&o=f&l=f



    http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/son-arrested-on-murder-charge-in-hedge-fund-founder-shooting/ar-BBhxnCq
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    Jan 06, 2015 5:14 AM GMT
    eagermuscle said
    Cash said
    eagermuscle saidI'm still mad at my parents for not buying THIS Manhattan condo at The Ansonia in the early '90s when I was already out:

    69qgdt.jpg
    My being gay wasn't the issue (though my married PREGNANT sister got $), but being absentee landlords even with me in residence paying rent with a roommate, and hating real estate investment, was. That enormous, gutted lofty one bedroom penthouse with an elliptical foyer with mirrored, concave french doors, a football field sized living room, eat-in kitchen and round bedroom with a leaky ceiling under the tower cupola was only $300K or so then (the rent was $300/mo pending condo conversion) and is now worth very easily at least ten times that.

    They wouldn't even help with the downpayment for a then-$150K sponsor-renovated small one-bedroom unit with an oval living room and fireplace, which looked similar to this Ansonia apartment, albeit smaller and not as well renovated, now worth well over $800K:

    102mhas.jpg

    2afy2de.jpg

    So yeah. I'm jealous.


    I know that building VERY well- the tower cupola ( which would have still been an empty shell at the time, just like the twin to the north) was added on to the apartment below and made into a double height library with an astrological theme. The apartment last sold for about 10 million dollars several years ago. That amount of money now buys a badly (albeit expensively) renovated covertable 3 bedroom combo on a lower floor.


    Yer killin' me, Cash! Though it wouldn't bother my folks one iota - a secure roof over my head now's as important to them as it was then. I'm assuming not only the cupola but the rooms to the west sunk into the mansard roof were also acquired so that when they turned the bedroom into a double height library they acquired a bedroom or two upstairs as well?




    http://www.elliman.com/new-york-city/the-ansonia-2109-broadway-1616-manhattan-jcdgzgq