Do the poor have it easy?

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    Jan 09, 2015 8:12 PM GMT
    Do the poor have it easy? Pew's controversial study


    According to the report, 36 percent of the most financially secure respondents are described as having "consistently liberal" or "mostly liberal" views. Fully 40 percent are described as "mostly conservative" or "consistently conservative," while another 24 percent are described as being "mixed" between liberal and conservatives.

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/economy/do-the-poor-have-it-easy-pews-controversial-study/ar-AA7Ydp2

    GET TO WORK!!
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    Jan 09, 2015 8:21 PM GMT
    Uh, no. Not even a little bit. What a ridiculous premise. It is, however an illustration of how the well-off are tone-deaf.

    The article glosses over some very odd and significant data choices. For instance:

    ArticleWhat's more, only about a third of those labeled "financially secure" make more than $100,000 a year; 23 percent make less than $50,000a year. That's hardly wealthy in most parts of America. Likewise, some of those making $100,000 or more were included among the least financially secure.


    Huh? The median household income (household! not even individual) is around $50,000 per year. Two individuals making $50,000 a year (at the 23rd percentile of wealth in their study) would be a household income of $100,000, vastly higher than the median. So the "financially secure" is tremendously skewed towards high incomes. And the phrase "hardly wealthy in most parts of America" is meaningless and misleading because it is so much higher than average.
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    Jan 10, 2015 2:36 PM GMT
    pazzy saidwhat it sounds like is that americans in general are not even educated about how their own system works especially in terms of government programs and "welfare". in fact, most people don't even know that the "government handout program where folks get a check every 1st and 15th for life" done died off back in 1996. that's usually the only "welfare" that folks talk about. you also have the same folks, notice that i said folks NOT whites or blacks or asians and etc, ready to pull the "race card" talking about black people are the biggest users of "welfare" when it's always been whites. folks probably don't even know what the fuck TANF is. folks probably think "welfare" is the WIC program. icon_lol.gif in fact, "welfare" is a broad ass spectrum and one of the biggest actually was the creation of the suburbs and the nasty history associated with that including institutionalized racism.

    if folks really were educated about the history of the government, social welfare programs and etc, they might not be too pleased that they themselves are second hand beneficiaries of it or benefitted more from the government "welfare" than the folks that they frown down on "welfare" ever had. folks don't realize that financial aid and home loans from the government is "welfare".
    I think its funny how most of the time you have clearly no idea what you are talking about. How much of the shit that you write do you pull from your ass? Just wondering. Is diarrhea of the mouth considered welfare also?
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    Jan 10, 2015 6:25 PM GMT
    bk11789 said
    pazzy saidwhat it sounds like is that americans in general are not even educated about how their own system works especially in terms of government programs and "welfare". in fact, most people don't even know that the "government handout program where folks get a check every 1st and 15th for life" done died off back in 1996. that's usually the only "welfare" that folks talk about. you also have the same folks, notice that i said folks NOT whites or blacks or asians and etc, ready to pull the "race card" talking about black people are the biggest users of "welfare" when it's always been whites. folks probably don't even know what the fuck TANF is. folks probably think "welfare" is the WIC program. icon_lol.gif in fact, "welfare" is a broad ass spectrum and one of the biggest actually was the creation of the suburbs and the nasty history associated with that including institutionalized racism.

    if folks really were educated about the history of the government, social welfare programs and etc, they might not be too pleased that they themselves are second hand beneficiaries of it or benefitted more from the government "welfare" than the folks that they frown down on "welfare" ever had. folks don't realize that financial aid and home loans from the government is "welfare".
    I think its funny how most of the time you have clearly no idea what you are talking about. How much of the shit that you write do you pull from your ass? Just wondering. Is diarrhea of the mouth considered welfare also?


    ^+1! Simply, if not Swiftly, put, he does appear to have a taste for scat, given his repeated references to "shit" and "broad ass spectrums," if not rectums. And substantively, his stats are meaningless because they deal in raw numbers, not percentages of the groups he lists.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14342

    Jan 10, 2015 6:53 PM GMT
    bk11789 said
    pazzy saidwhat it sounds like is that americans in general are not even educated about how their own system works especially in terms of government programs and "welfare". in fact, most people don't even know that the "government handout program where folks get a check every 1st and 15th for life" done died off back in 1996. that's usually the only "welfare" that folks talk about. you also have the same folks, notice that i said folks NOT whites or blacks or asians and etc, ready to pull the "race card" talking about black people are the biggest users of "welfare" when it's always been whites. folks probably don't even know what the fuck TANF is. folks probably think "welfare" is the WIC program. icon_lol.gif in fact, "welfare" is a broad ass spectrum and one of the biggest actually was the creation of the suburbs and the nasty history associated with that including institutionalized racism.

    if folks really were educated about the history of the government, social welfare programs and etc, they might not be too pleased that they themselves are second hand beneficiaries of it or benefitted more from the government "welfare" than the folks that they frown down on "welfare" ever had. folks don't realize that financial aid and home loans from the government is "welfare".
    I think its funny how most of the time you have clearly no idea what you are talking about. How much of the shit that you write do you pull from your ass? Just wondering. Is diarrhea of the mouth considered welfare also?
    icon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jan 11, 2015 2:54 AM GMT
    Syllogism.
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    Jan 11, 2015 3:22 AM GMT
    I spent most of my life below poverty level. I couldn't even afford to shop at Goodwill. I was never homeless but the majority of my furniture and clothing came from what other people threw out. Raman Noodles were a staple of my diet to the point the MSG really started to affect my health and made my heart flutter. You have to think very hard about every penny you spend. I got very good at scanning the sidewalk for change. If there was a nickel or a dime on the ground, I would find it. I kept a wooden bowl on my mantle where I collected change. Although I was eligible for food stamps I never got them because I just couldn't bring myself to do it. Looking back I probably should have because I see a lot of people much better off that I was using them. Saving money is next to impossible because there is never anything left over. But over time I learned what worked and what didn't. Now that I can afford basically anything I want, I never forget where I came from. In a weird way I'm glad I experienced poverty because I really appreciate everything I have now.
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    Jan 11, 2015 3:33 AM GMT
    Is there a sci-fi where society works like you all start out poor and are forced to appreciate all that they work for, and as they get older they get richer?

    If not, someone should. Also, we should have that society.
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    Jan 11, 2015 3:57 AM GMT
    That article is horse shit.
    First, not all poor people use the system (pride), and for the ones that do, plenty of them are raising families and working full time for a better future. That horse shit of an article insinuates that poor people don't work hard. Fuck outta here with that, not all poor people are destined to be poor for the rest of their life. People born into wealth have it easier PERIOD.
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    Jan 11, 2015 4:04 AM GMT
    [quote][cite]BP201 said[/cite]That article is horse shit.
    First, not all poor people use the system (pride), and for the ones that do, plenty of them are raising families and working full time for a better future. That horse shit of an article insinuates that poor people don't work hard. Fuck outta here with that, not all poor people are destined to be poor for the rest of their life.





    People born into wealth have it easier PERIOD...


    Um no! Sorry, wealth or having it means nothing. You can be disinherited for anything. Gay is one of them!

    I knew this and didn't want. I set my own path simply and worked my ass off on very little.

    Dedication will get you a long way with your GOALS accomplished, not a trust fund!
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    Jan 11, 2015 4:12 AM GMT
    2bnaked said[quote][cite]BP201 said[/cite]That article is horse shit.
    First, not all poor people use the system (pride), and for the ones that do, plenty of them are raising families and working full time for a better future. That horse shit of an article insinuates that poor people don't work hard. Fuck outta here with that, not all poor people are destined to be poor for the rest of their life.





    People born into wealth have it easier PERIOD...


    Um no! Sorry, wealth or having it means nothing. You can be disinherited of anything. Gay is one of them!

    I knew this and didn't want. I set my own path simply and worked my ass off on very little.

    Dedication will get you a long way and your GOALS accomplished, not a trust fun!



    This isn't about self worth. You posted an article from MSN Money
    It's called the struggle for a reason when one is poor. You struggle until you are successful. It's not always easy and not everyone succeeds.

    Those born into wealth are just spoiled, they have their own set of problems but at least they don't have to stress the receipt.
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    Jan 11, 2015 4:21 AM GMT
    BP201 said
    2bnaked said[quote][cite]BP201 said[/cite]That article is horse shit.
    First, not all poor people use the system (pride), and for the ones that do, plenty of them are raising families and working full time for a better future. That horse shit of an article insinuates that poor people don't work hard. Fuck outta here with that, not all poor people are destined to be poor for the rest of their life.





    People born into wealth have it easier PERIOD...


    Um no! Sorry, wealth or having it means nothing. You can be disinherited of anything. Gay is one of them!

    I knew this and didn't want. I set my own path simply and worked my ass off on very little.

    Dedication will get you a long way and your GOALS accomplished, not a trust fun!



    This isn't about self worth. You posted an article from MSN Money
    It's called the struggle for a reason when one is poor. You struggle until you are successful. It's not always easy and not everyone succeeds.

    Those born into wealth are just spoiled, they have their own set of problems but at least they don't have to stress the receipt.


    Yes, I know. Money never made up my so called "self worth" like you mentioned and I know it has a big effect on many,

    Just like that spoiled guy who killed his father over his allowance being cut off. His self worth was attached to what his daddy gave him.

    It's a trap for sure and it might cloud the minds of those who HAVE for sure.

    A message for those who have NOT?? Work, work and work even smarter. Dodge the idleness, leave the lazy and work as much as you can. Save! You will be surprised how quickly you can build your own wealth!
  • Unnamed6

    Posts: 1134

    Jan 11, 2015 4:37 AM GMT
    2bnaked saidDo the poor have it easy? Pew's controversial study


    According to the report, 36 percent of the most financially secure respondents are described as having "consistently liberal" or "mostly liberal" views. Fully 40 percent are described as "mostly conservative" or "consistently conservative," while another 24 percent are described as being "mixed" between liberal and conservatives.

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/economy/do-the-poor-have-it-easy-pews-controversial-study/ar-AA7Ydp2

    GET TO WORK!!


    I am familiar with these kind of studies, but let me just say that this is another example of very sloppy reporting by newsites like MSN who seem to only parse little pieces of data for whatever reason (which I could only guess why...) and somehow made sure to only have this information presented ad nauseum and commented upon by other written media, and of which will later on be presented in like manner by pundits on TV later...
  • Unnamed6

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    Jan 11, 2015 6:48 AM GMT
    BP201 saidThat article is horse shit.
    First, not all poor people use the system (pride), and for the ones that do, plenty of them are raising families and working full time for a better future. That horse shit of an article insinuates that poor people don't work hard. Fuck outta here with that, not all poor people are destined to be poor for the rest of their life. People born into wealth have it easier PERIOD.


    It may be likely that no one actually read the actual article in question in this thread (or read it incorrectly and reacted to it in whatever way they did), or for that matter even read the study it was based on (or it's appendix as well, which I did do!). Anyways, the article is "bad" for insinuating attitudes that the "financially secure" might have on the poor that they may not in fact have (that they believe that the "poor have it easy", and not so much as others in this thread have come to believe the article had said, that the "poor have it easy", as it was not referencing a supposed fact, but a sentiment, or a judgement made by the "financially secure"). Withstanding possible agendas, the MSN writer of this article clearly did not comprehend what the actual Pew study meant to say (revealing the nuanced political nature of financial security and insecurity, and how financial insecurity especially affected peoples voting) and it had very little to do with how the "financially secure" judged the "poor". Though he tries to interpret what the the study meant by the words, "financially secure", by mentioning income levels and access to things like a checking account, the way he mentioned such may have still lead his readers to conclude that to be "financially secure" was synonymous with being "rich" (a word of which other media outlets have stupidly used when describing the study themselves), and that such a group of people have judge the poor rather harshly (something that may actually be true, but this again is not the point of the study!). It's clear that "financial security" or "insecurity" doesn't actually mean income levels or wealth at all, but on one's capacity to have none or a given number of indicators on a scale of ten that makes one "financially insecure", and this scale can actually allow people who are typically judged as poor by most Americans, as people who can be "financially secure", and people who make high incomes, but are individuals who have liabilities and struggle financially, as people who are "financially insecure". The most "financially secure" Americans accordingly accounts for 25% of the American population while the least "financially insecure" accounted for another 20%, and the rest of the American population is divided variously among three groupings that are in between the two groups. When the article concludes with the statement, "in 2014, the Democratic Party left far more potential votes 'on the table' than did the Republicans", the study isn't making a statement about overall voting trends when it comes to "financial security" or "insecurity" and its potential for increased Democratic votes (and the writer may confuse readers by having it sound like a statement about voters who are "financial secure") but rather it's a statement about how otherwise "financially insecure" individuals, who also happened to be undecided or voters who had no political preference, if such a group of people were to turn out to vote, that the Democratic Party, naturally, and obviously, would capture voters from this category than would the Republicans.
  • Unnamed6

    Posts: 1134

    Jan 11, 2015 7:12 AM GMT
    And however poorly referenced the Pew study has been by the print media, and how I'm sure it would also be poorly discussed by pundits on TV, it's not so much about what the study can mean to people in general, or about those who have money and those who don't, but the extent in which having money, or not having it, goes into people's capacity to judge each other...or especially be judged well... If that made any sense, but I have to write my commentary on "judging" much much later, something that can take months or years to do, even if it's just a short essay, but it is easy to spend the next day or so to properly interpret and summarize this Pew study and dissect all other references and discussions of the study elsewhere like the MSN article (but I really have other things I want to do, like read and be lazy...).
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    Jan 11, 2015 4:59 PM GMT
    pazzy said
    bk11789 said I think its funny how most of the time you have clearly no idea what you are talking about. How much of the shit that you write do you pull from your ass? Just wondering. Is diarrhea of the mouth considered welfare also?


    this right here is why it's best to keep your mouth shut when you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. this is really some shameful shit. one thing that i have to say about the lgbt community is that folks think that they're EXEMPT from the same shit that everybody else has to follow such as being educated and informed about the world. they think that being gay will excuse them from facing the consequences of their actions or will give them a pass or sympathy for such as in this case, being stupid. we all have our dumbass moments BUT this is something else when you acting like you know something when you don't and pretending like you do where you're being prideful about it. since you and the other guy don't know what welfare is.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_programs_in_the_United_States

    and you want to know how i know about welfare... because back in college, i actually had a class about.... SOCIAL WELFARE and i learned that WELFARE was anything that involved government assistance such as financial aid, student grants, housing loans and etc.

    i understand if you admitted that you didn't know BUT DO NOT pop shit and try to say that i'm stupid for actually kicking knowledge while trying to boost your dumbass self up. actually, you made yourself look stupid and made me look good. thank you. icon_wink.gif as i said, most americans are not even educated about how their own system works and they willingly show it too despite looking stupid.
    Did they forget to teach you in college that Wikipedia should not be cited as a source for legitimate research?
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 11, 2015 7:47 PM GMT
    The US white middle class that sprang from the great depression and WWII was a product of welfare in a "white's only" era. Even though blacks and whites both fought for the USA in WWII, black people couldn't vote or get a home loan back then, and government backed home loans are a form of social welfare.
  • HottJoe

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    Jan 11, 2015 7:53 PM GMT
    Having unequal social welfare has created problems for countless generations.
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    Jan 11, 2015 10:26 PM GMT
    Of course the poors have it easy. Big screen TV, no debt, lots of time for cheap weed and getting laid and throw in some dogs, a classic car and cable tuned to Fox news and you have your great American dream thing going on.
  • HottJoe

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    Jan 11, 2015 10:37 PM GMT
    smartmoney saidOf course the poors have it easy. Big screen TV, no debt, lots of time for cheap weed and getting laid and throw in some dogs, a classic car and cable tuned to Fox news and you have your great American dream thing going on.

    Then they aren't "financially insecure." Unnamed6 explained it in his post.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14342

    Jan 17, 2015 4:28 PM GMT
    BP201 saidThat article is horse shit.
    First, not all poor people use the system (pride), and for the ones that do, plenty of them are raising families and working full time for a better future. That horse shit of an article insinuates that poor people don't work hard. Fuck outta here with that, not all poor people are destined to be poor for the rest of their life. People born into wealth have it easier PERIOD.
    Its not all horse shit. There is some limited truth to that article. There are the unmotivated urban poor who have taken advantage of the system over the years and milked taxpayers while sitting on their asses and screaming that there is no opportunity and that there is discrimination. That is baseless bullshit. Many of these so-called poor people have been given new housing that they destroyed in no time, offered many educational and employment opportunities that they either turned down or washed out of completely. These are the same unmotivated poor who just keep pumping out the out of wedlock kid and demanding more free government aid from taxpayers. That is wrong and it needs to stop. Granted a large majority of poor people work hard and long hours but they don't seem to be getting any of this government help mostly because they are employed. That needs to be changed. Hard working poor folks who are still having a difficult time should get the government aid and all the lazy welfare cheats should be permanently cut off from benefits. The welfare benefits should be reserved for the working poor and the disabled.
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    Jan 18, 2015 12:03 AM GMT
    not too be rude,but this is a dumb post. Lol the very meaning of the word poor is when you don't have enough of something usually things you need for survival.so no poor people don't have it easy or else problems like world hunger or welfare wouldn't even exist.