Je suis Charlie

  • PE_Mike

    Posts: 75

    Jan 10, 2015 9:26 AM GMT
    tpt2z__span.jpg

    We should know all about the suppression of dissent, with implied or actual violence - when was the last time you self edited your thoughts to 'keep the peace' at work, with family ?

    What is your perspective on Islam extremism - are we too politically correct and busy promoting Palestine liberation to care about the risk to our own precarious and very sketchy freedoms around the world?

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?

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    Jan 10, 2015 2:43 PM GMT
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    Islam considers homosexuality sin, and teaches any homosexuals caught doing homosexual activity they will be stone to death. Shari'ah laws states murderer,apostate,adulterer, and homosexual will get death penalty.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 10, 2015 3:06 PM GMT
    Ronaldo619 said
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    Islam considers homosexuality sin, and teaches any homosexuals caught doing homosexual activity they will be stone to death. Shari'ah laws states murderer,apostate,adulterer, and homosexual will get death penalty.

    Just like Christians! Go figure.

    Religion is evil.icon_evil.gif
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    Jan 10, 2015 4:27 PM GMT
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg
    What is your perspective on Islam extremism - are we too politically correct and busy promoting Palestine liberation to care about the risk to our own precarious and very sketchy freedoms around the world?

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    Hell, yes! It's absurd that we have to murmur our "respect" for the 1,300 yea old hate filled sayings of some bipolar desert nomad, when we're only just starting to have SOME rights. I don't care if it's their "religion," they have no right to murder me OR shove me back in a closet. These people are simply primitive and so primitive things like force need to be used to protect my rights -- like the right to life. When the peoples of that region join their elites in modernity, less force will be needed.
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    Jan 10, 2015 5:51 PM GMT
    Writing off people for how they identify is a very simplistic and ignorant way of seeing diversity in people. You'd think that a website that is full of guys who try not to fall under gay stereotypes would have a bit of understanding for what it's like to be condemned for being something that you are not.

    In other words, learn to disassociate Extremists with Muslims. Despite what your opinions may be about Islam, the greater Muslim population does not consider these people to be true Muslims. They incorrectly justify their actions with their religion, similarly to how a few Christians incorrectly justify murdering their loved ones as "sacrificing" them to God.

    But I feel like I know the RJ community fairly well, and this will go over most people's heads.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 10, 2015 5:58 PM GMT
    go_dreaming saidWriting off people for how they identify is a very simplistic and ignorant way of seeing diversity in people. You'd think that a website that is full of guys who try not to fall under gay stereotypes would have a bit of understanding for what it's like to be condemned for being something that you are not.

    In other words, learn to disassociate Extremists with Muslims. Despite what your opinions may be about Islam, the greater Muslim population does not consider these people to be true Muslims. They incorrectly justify their actions with their religion, similarly to how a few Christians incorrectly justify murdering their loved ones as "sacrificing" them to God.

    But I feel like I know the RJ community fairly well, and this will go over most people's heads.

    You're being arrogant. Anyone has the right to call religion fake if they believe it's believe it's fake, and I do.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 10, 2015 7:39 PM GMT
    pouncer saidEven more moving imo is the tweet being sent by French Muslims:

    "I am not Charlie, I am Ahmed the dead cop. Charlie ridiculed my faith and culture and I died defending his right to do so."

    That's actually true. It's just terrible that terrorists kill people over offensive cartoons.
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    Jan 10, 2015 7:45 PM GMT
    I've never gotten the impression that Muslims and Arabs are actually doing anything to curb Muslim terrorists. Some talking and hand waving and hand wringing but not really doing anything.
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    Jan 10, 2015 7:48 PM GMT
    "Deliver me from evil."

    Apparently, the newspaper wasn't Christian or well-educated.

    The Koran clearly instructs its readers how dangerous Muslims can be. Their God made them dangerous.

    We've heard of the ugly American.
    Let's now say Ugly Western Civilization.

    The newspaper felt it did not have to respect Islam.
    Again, The Koran warns us how dangerous Muslims can be.

    Ugly Western Civilization, diversity appreciation.

    Second, even with a fair recognition of who and what the prophet and the religion is, teaching via sacrilege is a no-no.

    The newspaper would not heed the reality of their being a nuisance. So, they bullied from their bully pulpit.

    If Jesus said, "don't use swords," a cartoon of Jesus and an army and the Caiaphas and an army, at war, trying to defeat each other would be an insulting cartoon.

    A cartoon of a gay man kissing a woman, in the style of the cartoon, would be an insulting cartoon.

    A cartoon of two heterosexual men kissing each other, in the style of the cartoon, would be an insulting cartoon.

    All politically incorrect, violating social contracts. The Koran IS a line in the global social contract. The newspaper violated the social contract.

    Yes, there are laws on the books that need to be removed; but, lines in the Koran have not yet been removed.

    The three faiths of Abraham, in my opinion, need to remove lines from their sacred scripture. Certain statements are not historically accurate, not scientifically accurate, not good for society.

    Je ne suis pas Charlie.
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    Jan 10, 2015 8:25 PM GMT
    The newspaper violated nothing but what some would call 'good taste'. It was the murdering bastards who went in shooting that broke the 'social contract'.
  • ASHDOD

    Posts: 1057

    Jan 10, 2015 9:01 PM GMT
    pouncer saidEven more moving imo is the tweet being sent by French Muslims:

    "I am not Charlie, I am Ahmed the dead cop. Charlie ridiculed my faith and culture and I died defending his right to do so."


    you forgot to blame israel
  • nicebritguy

    Posts: 31

    Jan 10, 2015 9:02 PM GMT
    UKgunz saidThe newspaper violated nothing but what some would call 'good taste'. It was the murdering bastards who went in shooting that broke the 'social contract'.


    What are you basing this on? Maybe you should take 2 minutes to look at some of their previous front covers before you claim they merely violated good taste.

    During the Arab Spring, one particular day, 1000 Egyptians were slaughtered by the US backed government. That hideous magazine laughed in the face of a thousand people fighting for their freedom - google image search it to see it for yourself.

    The Booka Haram incident similarly, hundreds of young girls kidnapped. Again, Charlie Hebdo published the most disgusting response you could imagine.

    One needs to consider what satire is: to afflict the comfortable, while comforting the afflicted. Charlie Hebdo did the precise opposite of this. Charlie Hebdo victimised those most marginalised in society and encouraged the social oppression that makes many muslims life in France a misery.

    No one deserves to die for drawing something or expressing a point of view. Lets recognise the magazine for what it was though. I racist, bigoted publication that made money from targeting those most vulnerable in society.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 10, 2015 9:47 PM GMT
    nicebritguy said
    UKgunz saidThe newspaper violated nothing but what some would call 'good taste'. It was the murdering bastards who went in shooting that broke the 'social contract'.


    What are you basing this on? Maybe you should take 2 minutes to look at some of their previous front covers before you claim they merely violated good taste.

    During the Arab Spring, one particular day, 1000 Egyptians were slaughtered by the US backed government. That hideous magazine laughed in the face of a thousand people fighting for their freedom - google image search it to see it for yourself.

    The Booka Haram incident similarly, hundreds of young girls kidnapped. Again, Charlie Hebdo published the most disgusting response you could imagine.

    One needs to consider what satire is: to afflict the comfortable, while comforting the afflicted. Charlie Hebdo did the precise opposite of this. Charlie Hebdo victimised those most marginalised in society and encouraged the social oppression that makes many muslims life in France a misery.

    No one deserves to die for drawing something or expressing a point of view. Lets recognise the magazine for what it was though. I racist, bigoted publication that made money from targeting those most vulnerable in society.

    The trouble with the US is that the Christians are in holy war mode. Cable news has declared it. Last night, they barely fell short of calling for the eradication of Islam. They say Obama is weak because they're terrified out of their minds that they're losing this one.

    I feel that the US is used to racism, and that by itself is so bad that sometimes it's hard to believe the country sticks together. But with religion it's even harder to get through to people. They can accept another race they can accept gay people, even if it's unequal, because that can fit into the narrative, but terrorists killing in the name of a foreign religion is holy war. I think you have to give up religion altogether to see the folly of this mass deathtrap.

    I think this is a religious/race war, which means those are the sacred dragons we must slay. I think that's what the comics wanted to do.

    What the world needs is desegregation, equality, tolerance, love, peace, and everyone's identity will be based on what they're really about, art, music, sports, spirituality. Fine. We all have a heritage. But so what? We all deserve the riches we all deserve the love. No one is better, and that's all we need to know in this life. The rest can happen after we're dead.
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    Jan 10, 2015 9:56 PM GMT
    nicebritguy said

    One needs to consider what satire is: to afflict the comfortable, while comforting the afflicted. Charlie Hebdo did the precise opposite of this.

    = = =

    Respect your good point.
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    Jan 10, 2015 10:04 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    Ronaldo619 said
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    Islam considers homosexuality sin, and teaches any homosexuals caught doing homosexual activity they will be stone to death. Shari'ah laws states murderer,apostate,adulterer, and homosexual will get death penalty.

    Just like Christians! Go figure.

    Religion is evil.icon_evil.gif


    First of all I am not Christian and I am atheist. Modern Christianity today change from medieval times but Islam still the same. Do you know any Christian country today in Europe killing gays? The truth is only Islamic countries today enforce harshest and brutal anti-gay laws in the world. I mean living Russia is actually better than living in muslim shari'ah countries.The only muslim country is secular and gay friendly I know is Turkey.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 10, 2015 10:11 PM GMT
    Ronaldo619 said
    HottJoe said
    Ronaldo619 said
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    Islam considers homosexuality sin, and teaches any homosexuals caught doing homosexual activity they will be stone to death. Shari'ah laws states murderer,apostate,adulterer, and homosexual will get death penalty.

    Just like Christians! Go figure.

    Religion is evil.icon_evil.gif


    First of all I am not Christian and I am atheist. Modern Christianity today change from medieval times but Islam still the same. Do you know any Christian country today in Europe killing gays? The truth is only Islamic countries today enforce harshest and brutal anti-gay laws in the world. I mean living Russia is actually better than living in muslim shari'ah countries.The only muslim country is secular and gay friendly I know is Turkey.

    Christians have terrorist organizations and kill gays in Uganda. All that horror there is rooted in a perversion of a religion that never needed to be exported in the first place. It's just superstition.
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    Jan 11, 2015 1:41 AM GMT
    Ronaldo619 said
    HottJoe said
    Ronaldo619 said
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    Islam considers homosexuality sin, and teaches any homosexuals caught doing homosexual activity they will be stone to death. Shari'ah laws states murderer,apostate,adulterer, and homosexual will get death penalty.

    Just like Christians! Go figure.

    Religion is evil.icon_evil.gif


    First of all I am not Christian and I am atheist. Modern Christianity today change from medieval times but Islam still the same. Do you know any Christian country today in Europe killing gays? The truth is only Islamic countries today enforce harshest and brutal anti-gay laws in the world. I mean living Russia is actually better than living in muslim shari'ah countries.The only muslim country is secular and gay friendly I know is Turkey.



    I am Christian and can honestly say it has help me to be a better person. A true disciple of Christ would not Kill a gay person. I believe in the teachings of Christ and try to actually follow them. I am human however and have my OWN opinions.

    1. I would never convert to any MUSEUM FAITH.
    2. I do NOT believe it's the true word of God.
    3. I think the faith follows a false prophet and is corrupt.
    4. Corrupt? The father of all lies. SATAN!
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    Jan 11, 2015 7:40 AM GMT
    Lumpyoatmeal saidI've never gotten the impression that Muslims and Arabs are actually doing anything to curb Muslim terrorists. Some talking and hand waving and hand wringing but not really doing anything.


    This ^^^ absolutely! I have been looking in vain the last few days in our local newspaper and on our local mosque's website for a "Je suis Charlie" statement of some sort, any sort, unequivocally condemning the actions of these bloody terrorists. There has been none.

    It is the same as after nine eleven: blanket statements of condemnation were never forthcoming. After days some murmurs of equivocal disapproval were softly issued, not screamed from the minarets, BUT...there WERE loud selfish wails that they hoped their own lives wouldn't be disrupted because someone might mistake them for being a terrorist. Hello?? The leaderships of the Muslim world have an obligation, especially in today's 24-hour news cycle cum internet, a moral and practical responsibility to trumpet their condemnation and non-support of such terrorist acts, if for no other reason than selfishly not to be lumped into the same category. Their handling of these incidents is atrocious.
  • wesv

    Posts: 907

    Jan 11, 2015 7:44 AM GMT
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg

    We should know all about the suppression of dissent, with implied or actual violence - when was the last time you self edited your thoughts to 'keep the peace' at work, with family ?

    What is your perspective on Islam extremism - are we too politically correct and busy promoting Palestine liberation to care about the risk to our own precarious and very sketchy freedoms around the world?

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    In the cartoon, it says "love, stronger than hate."

    We need to not make a huge fuss over everything. Overwise, things like this happen. No one wants that.
  • Unnamed6

    Posts: 1149

    Jan 11, 2015 8:47 AM GMT
    PE_Mike saidtpt2z__span.jpg

    We should know all about the suppression of dissent, with implied or actual violence - when was the last time you self edited your thoughts to 'keep the peace' at work, with family ?

    What is your perspective on Islam extremism - are we too politically correct and busy promoting Palestine liberation to care about the risk to our own precarious and very sketchy freedoms around the world?

    What does Islam teach about homosexuals and homosexuality?



    Arabs, as an ethnic group, and perhaps separated from their religion, have traditionally been associated with decadent sexuality. Even when plural marriage can be otherwise sanctified in Islam, for much of Arab history that also includes Islam, this also includes an affirmation of homosexuality. Islam might specify rules, customs, laws, behaviors that may appeal to the kind of system in which someone with Autism or Aspergers would want, but traditional Arab behavior stripped of Islam or even with it, is one where decadent mores reign supreme, which made some people who had observed a history of them doing that, quite jealous if they had been one to want such mores but couldn't act them out... The passion in activity, even murderous ones at times, may come from an aspect of being Arab than it is from being Islamic...
  • Unnamed6

    Posts: 1149

    Jan 11, 2015 9:04 AM GMT
    The face of homosexuality and sexual decadence in general in the 19th Century, if one had to attribute it to ethno-national groups were in fact Turkish and Arab, in much contrast to a Victorian Brit then...
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    Jan 11, 2015 4:48 PM GMT
    wesv

    In the cartoon, it says "love, stronger than hate."


    StephenOABC

    Love, stronger than hate should not be expressed by a French kiss with a person who does not want to be French kissed.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 11, 2015 5:25 PM GMT
    pazzy saidto me, it just seems like it was either cia type of shit to fuel some reason to go back to iraq, afganistan and finish off whatever or if what happened really happened, four crazy ass people that wanted to shoot shit up. it has nothing to do with islam. don't get why people are ready to blame religion or a book for the actions that someone elses choices as if that person and only that person should be held accountable for their actions. it's really silly, man. do folks blame satanism when you have these folks that happen to be satanists that kill off folks or christianity when folks would blow up abortion clinics?

    shit reminds me of how the us government was trying so hard to control the music industry where they would blame the death of cops on rap music when the music had nothing to do with someone choosing to shoot at the police for whatever reason.

    You make a really good point. Even though I don't believe in religion, I do agree that murderers can latch onto any ideology, be it contemporary music lyrics, or an old book, and that we can't hold everyone who listens to a certain music, or read a certain book accountable for crimes they didn't personally commit. I do think you're right that the terrorists are just a few killers who only represent themselves and not the whole religion.

    I am however blasphemous when it comes to sacred religions, starting with the one I was raised in. I condemn racism and bigotry, but religion isn't a race. It's an idea. And ideas are fair game for criticism, just like art is. A lot of people criticize popular music for violence or demeaning women. That's not just rap. That's just culture all around. Rap just happens to the most popular music in the US right now.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 11, 2015 6:17 PM GMT
    pazzy said
    HottJoe said
    pazzy saidto me, it just seems like it was either cia type of shit to fuel some reason to go back to iraq, afganistan and finish off whatever or if what happened really happened, four crazy ass people that wanted to shoot shit up. it has nothing to do with islam. don't get why people are ready to blame religion or a book for the actions that someone elses choices as if that person and only that person should be held accountable for their actions. it's really silly, man. do folks blame satanism when you have these folks that happen to be satanists that kill off folks or christianity when folks would blow up abortion clinics?

    shit reminds me of how the us government was trying so hard to control the music industry where they would blame the death of cops on rap music when the music had nothing to do with someone choosing to shoot at the police for whatever reason.

    You make a really good point. Even though I don't believe in religion, I do agree that murderers can latch onto any ideology, be it contemporary music lyrics, or an old book, and that we can't hold everyone who listens to a certain music, or read a certain book accountable for crimes they didn't personally commit. I do think you're right that the terrorists are just a few killers who only represent themselves and not the whole religion.

    I am however blasphemous when it comes to sacred religions, starting with the one I was raised in. I condemn racism and bigotry, but religion isn't a race. It's an idea. And ideas are fair game for criticism, just like art is. A lot of people criticize popular music for violence or demeaning women. That's not just rap. That's just culture all around. Rap just happens to the most popular music in the US right now.


    true.... it's all good if people wanna criticize the idea of religion, rap and etc. it seems like folks can't do that without attacking those that support the idea or live through it to the point where it goes beyond just them supporting the idea. it becomes a personal attack on them where that person gets judged unfairly or people assume that this person is a sort of way because they're of a certain belief or like a certain type of music and etc.

    I think faith and music and the lives we build in our minds are the places we all retreat to when times are hardest. If I was being persecuted it would be between me and God and the lyrics in my head. If you have no one then faith is where you turn.

    Religion and faith aren't the same thing. Faith is a choice we make for ourselves, religion is dictatorship. I think everyone should pick their music and their faith.... But picking one religion over another is like the Music Industry deciding what people listen to. It's not the music itself. It's the packaging. It's all the same as media brainwashing.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jan 11, 2015 6:29 PM GMT
    It's inevitable that there are different religions. Having only one religion would be like having only one kind of music. The music people listen to largely depends on where they are raised. But music has the power to unite the world, and religion doesn't, because religion only lets you pick one.