"I'm Christian, so I really don't believe it's a good thing." - on repealing DADT

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    Jan 21, 2009 11:30 PM GMT
    http://uk.reuters.com/article/wtMostRead/idUKTRE50K2KC20090121?pageNumber=1&virtualBrandChannel=0By Tim Cocks

    BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Many U.S. troops in Iraq were overjoyed to see President Barack Obama take his oath, but some were unhappy about one thing the Democrat has promised to do: permit gay and lesbian soldiers to serve openly.

    Obama said during his campaign he opposed a 1993 law stating that homosexuals are not eligible to work in the U.S. military, widely referred to as the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" rule.

    This month, Obama spokesman Robert Gibbs, when asked whether the new administration planned to scrap the law, replied on the president's transition website: "You don't hear politicians give a one-word answer much. But it's 'yes'."

    But some of the 140,000 troops still in Iraq almost six years after the 2003 U.S.-led invasion to topple Saddam Hussein appear uneasy about the prospect.

    Specialist Joseph Watson, from Texas, was "pretty excited" to see America's first black president sworn in, he said, after watching Obama's inauguration on a big TV screen at the dining hall of Forward Operating Base Prosperity, in Baghdad.

    But the 30-year-old was a lot less excited about Obama's inclination to repeal the ban on gay men and women serving.

    "Ah, I think that might cause a lot of problems," he said. "It's a big moral issue. It's giving the OK, saying that being gay is alright. Personally, I don't think being gay is OK."

    Each year, the U.S. military kicks out hundreds of soldiers for "homosexual conduct," although numbers have fallen from 1145 in 1998 to 627 in 2007, according to its own figures.


    Click on the link to read the rest of the article written by Mr. Cocks

    When people start out with "As a Chisttian...", I usually feel sorry for them.
    It's not a moral high ground declaration. It's admitting of believing in fairy tales.

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    Jan 21, 2009 11:38 PM GMT
    As long as starting with "I'm a Christian..." ends with "...so I find my religion is a convenient justification for hating anything I find uncomfortable" then they're being honest.

    Maybe it could also end with "...so I'm accustomed to getting my way and stomping on anyone with beliefs that differ from my own."

    People are of course entitled to their beliefs, as dumb as they might be... but they're not entitled to exclusivity of belief nor to have their beliefs endorsed and mandated by the state. This is why we have the First Amendment-- to make it clear that nobody can use the government to mandate their personal point of view.

    It's a pity that so many Christian Supremacists don't see it that way and can't allow anyone to be anything else.
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    Jan 21, 2009 11:57 PM GMT
    spatula saidAs long as starting with "I'm a Christian..." ends with "...so I find my religion is a convenient justification for hating anything I find uncomfortable" then they're being honest.

    Maybe it could also end with "...so I'm accustomed to getting my way and stomping on anyone with beliefs that differ from my own."

    People are of course entitled to their beliefs, as dumb as they might be... but they're not entitled to exclusivity of belief nor to have their beliefs endorsed and mandated by the state. This is why we have the First Amendment-- to make it clear that nobody can use the government to mandate their personal point of view.

    It's a pity that so many Christian Supremacists don't see it that way and can't allow anyone to be anything else.

    I like the term "Christian Supremacists" instead of "Christian Fundamentalists" because that's really what they're all about. Like the Taliban, they tolerate only their own religious view, and no other, and will oppose any that is different, even if it means perverting the US Constitution to do it.
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    Jan 22, 2009 12:30 AM GMT
    And like White Supremacists, they feel a sense of intrinsic superiority and that anyone dissimilar must be subjugated and/or destroyed.
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    Jan 22, 2009 12:37 AM GMT
    Maybe somebody should remind people that christians used the Bible to justify slavery.

    noahs_curse.jpg

    Oh yes, according to this interpretation, Noah condemned Africans to be slaves to all other races.
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    Jan 22, 2009 12:51 AM GMT
    spatula saidAs long as starting with "I'm a Christian..." ends with "...so I find my religion is a convenient justification for hating anything I find uncomfortable" then they're being honest.


    Amen.

    The real reason is probably really 'I'm a jerk and I like making fun of people different from me'.
  • DiverScience

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    Jan 22, 2009 1:53 AM GMT
    This article isn't news and is rather... pointless. There's no trends, no numbers, nothing useful.

    You can find people in the military who don't think black people should be fighting, or that women should be allowed in, or atheists for that matter...

    JUST like you can find those same people, *or any other opinion you like* if you look hard enough and ask the right people.

    "Some military people aren't happy with allowing gays" Uh... huh. Some non-military people aren't happy with allowing people to have cats too. Your point,Mr Cocks? They're people like the rest of people.
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:02 AM GMT
    Sad times.

    http://tank.nationalreview.com/post/?q=ZDVlN2FiZjhhNTA3N2JkNjJiM2ExNDAxNjJmMDFhOGE=

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    Jan 22, 2009 2:06 AM GMT
    Many times, people feel the "As a Christian..." line is a trump card that gives them a pass for being a bigot and exempts them from treating others (with a disapproved "lifestyle") with basic civility.
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:12 AM GMT


    It wasn't just Christians, Caslon.
    http://autocww.colorado.edu/~blackmon/E64ContentFiles/AfricanHistory/SlaveryInAfrica.html


    as a christian, I find it sad that all christians be boiled in oil because of the actions and beliefs of some and many.

    Joseph Watson is not christian, he's a bigot calling himself a christian.
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:29 AM GMT


    working_out_f,

    you offend many here, including me. Please stop.
    Please do some research on the bible translations over the ages. Please take this kind of post to the spiritual forums.

    -Doug of meninlove
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:40 AM GMT
    I really can't wait for the day when Obama repeals the policy and all of the "Christians" are forced to just deal with it. Deal with it, just as we have been dealing with their shit for centuries.

    You are going to hear the usual worries about the showers, the foxholes- all of that. I think those worries are usually more about the soldier worried they'll like it, than "unit cohesiveness" or other bullshit.

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    Jan 22, 2009 2:40 AM GMT
    fire Pictures, Images and Photos
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:41 AM GMT
    Doug,

    You get offended way too easy.
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:46 AM GMT
    Hmm... Kindling!

    I uh -

    *sedates himself quickly and goes to sleepyland where people are never stupid*
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:49 AM GMT
    DiverScience saidThis article isn't news and is rather... pointless. There's no trends, no numbers, nothing useful.

    You can find people in the military who don't think black people should be fighting, or that women should be allowed in, or atheists for that matter...

    JUST like you can find those same people, *or any other opinion you like* if you look hard enough and ask the right people.

    "Some military people aren't happy with allowing gays" Uh... huh. Some non-military people aren't happy with allowing people to have cats too. Your point,Mr Cocks? They're people like the rest of people.

    And what is YOUR point? Gays in the military: yes or no?
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    Jan 22, 2009 2:55 AM GMT
    blinktwice4y saidDoug,

    You get offended way too easy.

    I disagree with you, blink. Doug is too kind. I think working_out_f's comments are totally unacceptable on a gay site.
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:06 AM GMT
    working_out_feels_awesome saidI know that God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah for being filled with homosexuality...

    Really? That's not what the Bible says. Ezekiel 16:49 says, "This was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had pride, excess of food, and prosperous ease, but did not aid the poor and needy."

    Your church told you Sodom was destroyed because of homosexuals? Guess what. Your church lied to you. Read the Bible and stop listening to misinterpretation and misinformation.

    I believe that homosexuality is wrong.

    I hope one day you'll be able to get over your brainwashing.
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:10 AM GMT
    The guy thinks homosexuality is wrong and is using religion to back up his statements. He's wrong to do so, but offensive? No.

    Explain why he's wrong if you know. Don't just walk away offended. How can someone so deluded offend? It's just silly.
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:16 AM GMT
    Blinktwice4y,

    "How can someone so deluded offend?" You've just delivered a put-down to working_out_f over what he believes.
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:18 AM GMT
    is Anyone else giggling about that guy Cocks writing an article about gay guys?
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:20 AM GMT
    the further we get from religion the better off society will be. Sure its great way to establish morals and whatnot, but honestly it'd be much easier without such extremists or just stupid people who think that any different is wrong.

    I think it should be more of a cultural aspect of one's live, and yes its nice to be 'spiritual' i believe religion is kinda a crock to be completely honest. I'm more of a science based person and think that god didn't create the world, or humans, and don't think theres a higher being. Science has explained the majority if not all of it, from creation, dinosaurs, evolution, molecular dating, etc.

    Now this isn't to go and say i'm atheist, I'm jewish, but again find it to be a more cultural aspect of my life. I like the traditions we have and some of the rules we practice, but believing in god and a few other things to me is just bs.

    just my opinion
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:23 AM GMT
    blinktwice4y saidThe guy thinks homosexuality is wrong and is using religion to back up his statements. He's wrong to do so, but offensive? No.

    Explain why he's wrong if you know. Don't just walk away offended. How can someone so deluded offend? It's just silly.

    Excuse me? I am offended when someone tells me that I am "wrong" for being gay, And a gay site especially is not a place to preach such blather. Members of RJ should not have to read such nonsense.
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:26 AM GMT
    Global_Citizen said
    working_out_feels_awesome saidI know that God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah for being filled with homosexuality...

    Really? That's not what the Bible says. Ezekiel 16:49 says, "This was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had pride, excess of food, and prosperous ease, but did not aid the poor and needy."

    Your church told you Sodom was destroyed because of homosexuals? Guess what. Your church lied to you. Read the Bible and stop listening to misinterpretation and misinformation.




    Yes. The early Christians all came from a nomadic tradition where a lack of hospitality to strangers was considered, if not an actual crime, being in stark contrast with the their core values. Large towns were relatively new and concepts of personal property, space and social responsibility began to change radically from what they had been in the past. Yes, homosexuality is mentioned in the story, but it's not what allegedly got God's panties in twist. Leviticus is more cut and dried on the issue of homosexuality, but the homo-butt-sex angle for Sodom's destruction is a purely manufactured one.
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    Jan 22, 2009 3:28 AM GMT
    meninlove said

    It wasn't just Christians, Caslon.

    This discussion is about Christians.