Gay Bias Against Gays Who Come Out Late--Some Great facts!

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    Feb 19, 2015 5:54 PM GMT
    Hello,

    In the recent past, I was wrongly attacked about coming out late. The younger gay man, one who I was not flirting with at all, said I am lying about my "gay experiences" because I say I had absolutely no desire as a teen.

    Homosexual Gene

    The person then implied on Facebook that I said people were not "born gay." I am completely aware of the expert opinion that a homosexuality seems to be both environmental and genetic[1], but "environmental" can be extremely important. Although your genes allow us to, for example, build muscle and lose weight in a certain way, the genes also control, for example, our proportions (height, looks, fat distribution and storage, etc). Environmental factors (diet, exercise, etc) can have an affect on some human properties, but not others in normal environments (bone length, etc).

    Rather, I said I was not gay as a teen, humans are a part of a population, populations have descriptive statistics, and I came out recently even though I "should have come out" in the early to mid 2000s. I also said that an experience with a man in my early 20s caused me to realize I enjoyed 'same-sex" interaction, but I had stronger attraction to women at that time. Like other males, I am a part of an older population that come out late for one reason or another[4;5], but one thing is certain, all men did not say they had same-sex sexual attraction as adolescents-I am one. With that said, I am 100% gay now, I love men, I love tasty semen (eat your fruits and veggies men!), I love being inserted, and I mean I REALLY LOVE being inserted!--just true. I love the male physique, I love the penis, and I am VERY attracted to men! Yes, I am gay and I love being out!

    What is wrong is childish stigma.

    Quotes

    Quote: “It’s liberating and confusing at the same time,” said Kinsella, who came out in his 30s and is an organizer of a local social group for gay, bi, and trans men in that very situation. “You’re an adult, so people kind of expect you to have it together, but you’re thrust into this new community with norms you don’t get yet.”[5]

    Quote: “And there’s a little bit of bias against you with people who think you’re damaged goods because you came out so late. You talk to a 28-year-old, someone who’s younger than you, and they might look at you like ‘what’s wrong with you, I came out at 18."[5]

    Quote: "The concordance between early stage-sequential models and actual identity development is somewhat questionable. Emerging evidence indicates that some aspects of sexual orientation may be less stable than others (Diamond, 2008; Kinnish, Strassberg, & Turner, 2005), and that there is considerable variability in the timing and sequence in which sexual orientation milestones are experienced (Friedman, Marshall, Stall, Cheong, & Wright, 2008; Savin-Williams, 1998 ). For example, Floyd and Stein (2002) used cluster analysis to examine underlying developmental patterns in adolescents and young adults. They identified five patterns of development—one pattern in which milestones occurred early and participants came out in adolescence; two patterns in which attraction and self-identification occurred early (but with differences in levels of same-sex sexual experience and coming out status); and two patterns characterized by experiencing milestones in adulthood (but differing according to level of GLB community involvement). Floyd and Stein’s findings indicate that there may be considerable heterogeneity in the timing and sequence of milestones, with some evidence of very early developmental trajectories."[4]

    Quote: "The presence of these multiple factors may pattern sexual orientation identity development differently for adolescent developers in comparison to adult developers—who experience sexual minority identity development later in life and likely under different circumstances (e.g., following other-sex sexual and romantic relationship experiences)."[4]

    Quote: "Members of the early trajectory were younger than participants in the other trajectory groups, and reported experiencing attractions before age 10 and first disclosure prior to turning 18. Members of the middle trajectory tended to experience the milestones two to three years later than the early trajectory, and members of the late trajectory (the smallest group) experienced milestones two to 10 years later than the early trajectory (not coming out until their late 20s). Their results underscore the considerable diversity in timing of sexual orientation milestones. Further, Friedman et al. (2008 ) found that early development was associated with greater rates of victimization, depression, suicidality, and HIV-risk."[4]

    Table 3:
    "Demographic Characteristics of the Latent Profiles of Gay Men, Lesbians, and Bisexuals in the California Quality of Life Surveys I & II" Available from: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3210896/table/T3/

    References:

    [1] Crew, Bec. (2014, Nov. 18 ). Largest study yet points to genetic factors in male homosexuality. Retrieved (2014, Nov. 17). sciencealert[online]. Available from: http://www.sciencealert.com/largest-study-yet-identifies-genetic-factor-in-homosexuality

    [2] Daily Mail Reporter. (2011, Oct. 21). More than half of women are attracted to other women-and it gets more pronounced as they get older. Retrieved (2014, Sep. 24). dailymail.co.uk[online]. Available from: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2051284/More-half-women-bi-curious-attracted-women.html

    [3] Golbeck, Jennifer, PhD. (2014, Sep. 10 ). Internet Trolls are Narcissists, Psychopaths, and Sadists. Retrieved (2014, Oct. 21). psychology today[online]. Available from: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/your-online-secrets/201409/internet-trolls-are-narcissists-psychopaths-and-sadists

    [4] Calzo, Jerel, P.; Antonucci, Toni C.; Mays, Vickie M; Cochran, Susan D. (2012, Nov. 01). Retrospective Recall of Sexual Orientation Identity Development Among Gay, Lesbian, and Bisexual Adults. Retrieved (2015, Feb. 17). Dev Psychol.[online]. vol. 47(6). pp. 1658-1673. Available from: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3210896/ ; PMCID: PMC3210896; NIHMSID: NIHMS324175; doi: 10.1037/a0025508

    [5] Pizzuti, Matt. (2014, Nov. 19). Late Bloomers--"When Gay, Bi, And Trans Men "Come Out Late" Retrieved from: http://www.pqmonthly.com/late-bloomers-gay-bi-trans-men-come-late/21076
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 19, 2015 6:39 PM GMT
    We are born with our sexual orientation determined from day one. We do not acquire it, nor choose it.

    What varies is the culture, environment, and other circumstances within which we're raised and live. These often determine how early we recognize our non-standard sexuality, in a world that is predominately heterosexual.

    Some realize their gay orientation very early in life, some very much later, like myself. But whenever we realize it, we were already gay from the moment we took our first breath.

    I do get a lot of flack here about coming out late, at 45. I'm accused of having been closeted, of hiding being gay, even persecuting other gays before then. All false inventions from the weird trolls you encounter online.

    I simply didn't know I'm gay. I honestly thought I was straight. Because I didn't fit any of the common stereotypical outward behaviors my generation identified as telltale gay markers. I knew I liked guys, and didn't have any interest in women, but I never guessed I had an option to chase guys. And so I did nothing. I figured I was kinda asexual or something. But did finally get married to please my family. icon_sad.gif

    Which is why I freely tell my story. Because I know there are other guys in a similar situation as I was, and they need to hear this. Not a lot of them, it's apparently not common, but I've learned I'm not the only one.
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    Feb 19, 2015 11:32 PM GMT
    At your age, and given when you came of age, it's very common or maybe even the rule for 'those days' . Given that I'm very close to your age, I also know many similar examples. A couple of those folks couldn't get answers or reconcile themselves with their attraction and took their life.

    I was very out to everyone as maybe a big F U to the world, and again not really knowing what it was. I wasn't really struggling with issue per se other than the desire to be different than everyone else.

    My one friend who took his life in the early 80s came out to me when I still lived back in Columbus. He was the high line used car dealer who I went to the auctions with nearly weekly (Mannhein and Atlanta).

    For driving cars to the sale or getting a car back home or even driving an 18 wheeler loaded with cars, he would let me use his dealer's license to get something for myself. He's the one who enabled me to buy and later sell the huge number of cars I had back then.

    He started 'hanging' at whatever the bathhouse was in Columbus and engaing in activity and bringing guys home when his wife was gone. After just a few times his wife found a men's watch on her side of the bed on the nightstand, and confronted John. He admitted it and the divorce was on.

    Bar scene was really active back then, but he wasn't that type of homosexual that was ever a good fit. It just really tore him apart and one night he pulled his old Volvo into the garage, closed the door and hooked a vacuum cleaner hose from the exhaust to the interior of the car and he was gone. I feel somewhat responsible that I encouraged him to come out. He clearly wasn't ready.

    I mean what frame of reference did we have back then? What on earth was being 'gay'. Few knew.

    I was a huge proponent of same-sex relationships and it was a very long time before I knew what it really was. 'Gay' meant happy in those days.
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Feb 20, 2015 12:18 AM GMT
    Nobody should judge you or have bias against you because you chose to come out later in life--rather than earlier.

    However, don't expect a pat on the back like MANY young, vulnerable children do deserve when they come out (perhaps unwisely) at the risk of being shunned by their family, kicked out of their house and made homeless, or otherwise beaten and bullied.

    Coming out when you're young, in certain circumstances, merits commendation--a veritable merit badge of courage and perseverance.

    Coming out as a grown man, not so much.

    Coming out, whenever you do it, is life changing and wonderful. It's each individual's choice when to come out (unless you're actively working against gays, then it's "outing" time). Nobody should ever be judged because they delayed it. But some individuals, circumstances warranting, should be commended for coming out early.
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    Feb 20, 2015 1:37 AM GMT
    the OP is assuming there is science where they may not be "genetic factors in male homosexuality". The researcher in his field may have a technical understanding of things. The average joe has his belief system.

    we are still defining what gender is:
    http://www.towleroad.com/2015/02/intersexuality-could-be-more-common-than-previously-thought.html
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    Feb 20, 2015 4:17 AM GMT
    Svnw688 saidNobody should judge you or have bias against you because you chose to come out later in life--rather than earlier.

    However, don't expect a pat on the back like MANY young, vulnerable children do deserve when they come out (perhaps unwisely) at the risk of being shunned by their family, kicked out of their house and made homeless, or otherwise beaten and bullied.

    Coming out when you're young, in certain circumstances, merits commendation--a veritable merit badge of courage and perseverance.

    Coming out as a grown man, not so much.

    Coming out, whenever you do it, is life changing and wonderful. It's each individual's choice when to come out (unless you're actively working against gays, then it's "outing" time). Nobody should ever be judged because they delayed it. But some individuals, circumstances warranting, should be commended for coming out early.


    It is like Dalton's Law of Partial Pressures! ∑pi = Ptotal

    Work Pressure

    As a pharmaceutical whistle-blower who reported illegal activity[6;7], I have experienced horrific experiences in my life, including being called gay. I have had many people, for example, throw rocks at me and other emotional/physical abuse. icon_sad.gif So, I appreciate the following logical excerpt from a quote I supplied above:

    Quote: "Further, Friedman et al. (2008 ) found that early development was associated with greater rates of victimization, depression, suicidality, and HIV-risk."[4"[Exponential]

    Intra-Gay Bias Pressure

    I just ask younger gays to recognize that many older men are in great emotional pain because they "cannot" come out at that time (children involved, career, etc.). Yes, you can argue that the older man was not as "brave," but, in truth, the older man might have very serious responsibilities to other people that could be drastically affected by coming out. So, the older man or woman might wait until the time was more right. I am an example of the latter. Still, I honestly had no attraction to same-sex before the US Army in Germany, early 20s. The person who attacked me said I lied, but I didn't. Many men don't like feeling as if they are living a lie, but many men might wonder, because they did not have attraction as a teen, if the desire will fade. If it does, coming out would be a problem. We all have different genetics, and, as found in one of the above research studies, environment is an important factor in when a man or woman might realize their desire for same-sex. Please remember, though, older men commit suicide too:

    Quote From Above: " It just really tore him apart and one night he pulled his old Volvo into the garage, closed the door and hooked a vacuum cleaner hose from the exhaust to the interior of the car and he was gone."[FREEDOMISNTFREE]

    I would not bash a early bloomer because it can cause suicide, and I would not bash a late bloomer because, as seen above, it can cause suicide too. In fact, I have read literature where experts state the same. icon_smile.gif Why create tension?

    Community Pressure

    Personally, I have been called gay since near 2001 by various people. I admitted to my family and close friends in 2007 that I had "homosexual tendencies" and that I had anal masturbated with a "very large dildo" many times. I had admitted the same to my physicians and other medical professionals. I was anal masturbating when I was married and dating my wife (1996-2006), and, later in the marriage, I I could only stay erect with my wife when I thought about a man inserting me as I inserted her. That, by the way, does NOT work well, and, as such, I failed with relationship problems. This was near my early 30s.

    In my early 20's, a same-sex experience had left me wanting to be a bottom. I am versatile, but mostly a bottom. Still, I was VERY attracted to women. This is not uncommon according to research[1-2], and there appears to be a clear demarcation between, for example, Heterosexual, Mostly Heterosexual, Bi-sexual, Mostly Gay/Lesbian, and Gay/Lesbian[1-2] but some are fluid. Also, research has shown that women can "develop" same-sex desire at a later age that did not exist when younger[3]. Interestingly, research has shown that medication can "develop" same-sex felling as well in animal models[References Available].

    Quote: “In a study carried out by Boise State University found that out of a group of 484 heterosexual women, 60 per cent were sexually attracted to other women; 45 per cent had kissed a woman and 50 per cent had fantasies about the same sex.”[3]

    The Hole

    In addition to trying to reduce or eliminate internal bias, I have been writing and supporting gays all my life. My mother's favorite family member was gay. He died of old age in the 1990s I believe, and he obviously endured hell by many. One of my gay male Facebook friends, a high school peer, did not see that I had posted a coming out message, but the next morning he sent me a detailed private message about us meeting in public and he seducing me! Yum! Why? He is gorgeous, he has a great body, he is intelligent, he is successful, he is honest, etc. He was also married before he came out. Why did he feel so safe contacting me?

    I asked if he had seen me coming out the night before, near midnight my time and much later his time, and he said no. He just said he knew I was "gay friendly" and I would not freak. He was right. Rather, my Dermatome S5 area started glowing madly, I got an erection, and I was in set into major heat because, in truth, HE IS GORGEOUS! icon_smile.gif

    My support is seen in my writing, and I have sent extensive letters to politicians in any State (Republican included) when I lived in a state. I just had so many other things going on in my life that I had no time for any relationships, including sexual really.

    So, I just wish people would think before they assume their coming out was harder than mine. I am not saying my situation was worse. Rather, mine has been fine really, but I think that is because everyone was like---"Duh!!"--when I admitted it. icon_smile.gif I am not the older gay male that committed suicide, but I have had life experiences, whistle-blower, that almost caused me to take my life. It is that experience, believe it or not, that makes my coming out so much easier!

    Anyhow, you all know my name, Chris Harding. I realize many might believe that is stupid because of safety, but I am completely out, I am open, and I am very careful and aware of my environment. Still, I use it as an example of my "courage" even though I am always out. Still, I do not diminish the courage of young gay men at all, because victimization is obviously cumulative. icon_sad.gif

    References:

    [1] Harding, Chris. (2014, Sep. 30). Correlates of Same-Sex Sexuality in Heterosexually Identified Young Adults. Retrieved (2014, Sep. 30). Available from: https://www.facebook.com/notes/chris-harding/correlates-of-same-sex-sexuality-in-heterosexually-identified-young-adults/10152492591103477

    [2] Harding, Chris. (2014, Oct. 01). Mostly Heterosexual and Mostly Gay/Lesbian: Evidence for New Sexual Orientation Identities. Retrieved (2014, Oct. 01). Facebook.com[online]. Available from: https://www.facebook.com/notes/10152494536333477/

    [3] Daily Mail Reporter. (2011, Oct. 21). More than half of women are attracted to other women-an
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    Feb 20, 2015 4:31 AM GMT
    Svnw688 said
    Coming out when you're young, in certain circumstances, merits commendation--a veritable merit badge of courage and perseverance.

    Coming out as a grown man, not so much.

    Coming out, whenever you do it, is life changing and wonderful. It's each individual's choice when to come out (unless you're actively working against gays, then it's "outing" time). Nobody should ever be judged because they delayed it. But some individuals, circumstances warranting, should be commended for coming out early.

    I agree totally.

    I often mention my own story of coming out late, but as an example for those who might be hanging back. It was actually very easy, only took a day, a story I've told here numerous times. Not for the courage of it, but just the unusual instantaneous nature of it.

    Which, BTW, I'll be celebrating in March, my 20th anniversary. I consider it my second birthday, when my second life began. A happier life in many ways than I had previously. And a decision I've never regretted, not from the first day I finally realized I was gay, and that I wasn't going to deny or hide it. I expect to be having a nice celebration. icon_biggrin.gif

    Gosh, 20 years. Amazing to me it's been that long, so much of it seems like yesterday. And so much that happened during those years, in addition to my prior 25-year military career, and my life before that. It's like I've had at least 6 lives.

    Not famous or with great accomplishments, but just colorful, I guess the word could be. Or as I like to call my experiences, my "adventures", along with an almost equal number of "misadventures".
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Feb 20, 2015 4:59 AM GMT
    @Exponential

    I wish you no harm. We're on the same "team." But you fundamentally took a different course in life than I did, and I took a different course than my younger peers.

    I knew I was a homo when I was 8ish or so. But I chose to hide it. I lived the "straight" life, had girlfriends, and partook in straight life. While it was stressful and I was torn up inside, it wasn't all bad. I got a lot of the perks, benefits, privileges, and accoutrements of "straight life" until I decided to come out in college.

    Once I came out, I was not at risk. I was at college. I was independent. IF my family banished me (they didn't), I wouldn't be homeless. I couldn't be bullied by the same kids everyday in high school.

    Younger kids who come out are more vulnerable and open to those unfortunate possibilities. I was "on our team's side" too while I was hiding, and acting straight before I came out. I advocated for "our side" while I was hiding and lying. But far be it from me to take advantage of the life I choose, a compromised life with its drawbacks and perks, and then equate my experience to that of a scared 11 year old in Nebraska who risks everything--regardless of his family and larger communities reaction.

    I understand times change. I understand it's easier now for an independent 20 year old to come out today than a 20 year old in 1960. But it's STILL difficult for a person under 18 to come out. THIS fact is why young kids who come out while exposing themselves to rejection and homelessness and hate (public school, family, etc.) are stronger than you and I put together. While we should commend ourselves for finally coming out, we should never begin to equate our living a life and then fessing up once we were safe and "had it made" to a scared 11 year old discovering himself/herself who risks everything.

    The two are incomparable. Neither your nor my coming out is worthy of praise. We shouldn't be pilloried, but praise is out of the question. Those who actually risk something are worthy of praise. Grown men deciding to be truthful is the baseline, what we should have been all along.
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    Feb 20, 2015 8:07 AM GMT
    Svnw688 said@Exponential

    I wish you no harm. We're on the same "team." But you fundamentally took a different course in life than I did, and I took a different course than my younger peers.

    I knew I was a homo when I was 8ish or so. But I chose to hide it. I lived the "straight" life, had girlfriends, and partook in straight life. While it was stressful and I was torn up inside, it wasn't all bad. I got a lot of the perks, benefits, privileges, and accoutrements of "straight life" until I decided to come out in college.

    Once I came out, I was not at risk. I was at college. I was independent. IF my family banished me (they didn't), I wouldn't be homeless. I couldn't be bullied by the same kids everyday in high school.

    Younger kids who come out are more vulnerable and open to those unfortunate possibilities. I was "on our team's side" too while I was hiding, and acting straight before I came out. I advocated for "our side" while I was hiding and lying. But far be it from me to take advantage of the life I choose, a compromised life with its drawbacks and perks, and then equate my experience to that of a scared 11 year old in Nebraska who risks everything--regardless of his family and larger communities reaction.

    I understand times change. I understand it's easier now for an independent 20 year old to come out today than a 20 year old in 1960. But it's STILL difficult for a person under 18 to come out. THIS fact is why young kids who come out while exposing themselves to rejection and homelessness and hate (public school, family, etc.) are stronger than you and I put together. While we should commend ourselves for finally coming out, we should never begin to equate our living a life and then fessing up once we were safe and "had it made" to a scared 11 year old discovering himself/herself who risks everything.

    The two are incomparable. Neither your nor my coming out is worthy of praise. We shouldn't be pilloried, but praise is out of the question. Those who actually risk something are worthy of praise. Grown men deciding to be truthful is the baseline, what we should have been all along.


    I think my coming out at age 16 was easier because it was 1970 and it seemed that no one had any idea what I was talking about .... even me. I think 1980 or so would have been much tougher.

    I had a really torrid relationship with the 16 yr old next door. I had just gotten my license in early summer 1970 and by August we had both convinced our parents to let us take our first road trip without parents.

    Relationship was pretty much non sexual, but we were intensely in love. The ultimate night was the one we spent in the Le Chateau Frontenac in old Quebec City. I was so in love I thought I was going to explode.

    True, puppy love, but it all convinced me that same sex relationships were something to cherished, maybe even above opposite sex relationships. This is what got me going and encouraged me to come out to the entire school just a few months later and then to my church the Sunday after.

    I got great pleasure from shocking people so I was a little let down by the reaction I got, which wasn't much of anything.

    However, the kid's mother got real concerned and she did everything she could to break us up including sending him to live with an aunt out in California to finish school. That worked.
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    Feb 20, 2015 9:01 AM GMT
    You all:

    I am so sorry, I typed my response in a hurry, and I believe my autofill must have changed IMPORTANT areas of my comment. I am sorry. It made parts difficult to read and other parts seem bellicose. I really am neither. I just need to proof read before I post.

    Start Quotes: I meant to say, as seen above,

    Quote: "That, by the way, does NOT work well, and, as such, I failed with relationship problems. This was near my early 30s."[See above corrected post]

    Quote:"So, I just wish people would think before they assume their coming out was harder than mine. I am not saying my situation was worse. Rather, mine has been fine really, but I think that is because everyone was like---"Duh!!"--when I admitted it. icon_smile.gif I am not the older gay male that committed suicide, but I have had life experiences, whistle-blower, that almost caused me to take my life. It is that experience, believe it or not, that makes my coming out so much easier!"[See Above].

    End Quotes.

    You have a nice day, and I absolutely mean no harm to you either. Pain is cumulative, you came out young, and I really understand teen issues. As an example, I use to share the following references and other references all the time during advocacy[1;2;3;others]. icon_smile.gif

    I like to share notes on Facebook[see below], I want to share them here as well, and I might as well just use my Facebook notes. They allow much more text than here, and I like using references. It is my past academic life. icon_smile.gif

    References:

    [1] Bochenek, Michael; Brown, Widney, A.; Breen, Melanie; Campbell, Rook; David, Sam; Henkle, Derek R.; Jesrani, Tejal; Lnzertti,Rachel; McArthur, Kerry; Rozario, Shalu; Zea, Sadie. Hatred in the Hallways, Violence and Discrmination Against Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender Students in U.S. Schools. Human Rights Watch [online]. 2001. Available from: http://www.hrw.org/legacy/reports/2001/uslgbt/toc.htm

    [2] BullyingInfo.org. Home.Youth Topics. Bullying Prevention and Response. FindYouthInfo[online]. 2010. http://www.findyouthinfo.gov/topic_bullying.shtml?utm_source=BullyingInfo.org&utm_medium=Redirect&utm_campaign=BullyingSummitt

    [3] Wiener-Bronner, Danielle. Rutgers Student Believed To Have Committed Suicide After Classmates Allegedly Recorded Him In Gay Sexual Encounter. The Huffington Post [online]. 2010. Available from: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/09/29/dharun-revi-molly-wei-charged_n_743539.html

    [4] Stanford. Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy. Homosexuality. Stanford[online].2006. Available from: [http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/homosexuality/] Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy

    [5] Mills, Thomas C., MD, MPH; Stall, Ron, PhD, MPH; Pollack, Lance, PhD; Paul, Jay P., PhD; Binson, Diane, PhD; Canchola, Jesse, MS; Catania, Joeseph A. Health-Related Characteristics of Men Who Have Sex With Men: A Comparison Of Those Living in "Gay Ghettos" With Those Living Elsewhere. Am J Public Health. 2001. Vol. 91, pp. 980-983. Available from: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1446479/pdf/11392945.pdf

    [6] Harding, Chris. (2014, Sep. 30). Correlates of Same-Sex Sexuality in Heterosexually Identified Young Adults. Retrieved (2014, Sep. 30). Available from: https://www.facebook.com/notes/chris-harding/correlates-of-same-sex-sexuality-in-heterosexually-identified-young-adults/10152492591103477

    [7] Harding, Chris. (2014, Oct. 01). Mostly Heterosexual and Mostly Gay/Lesbian: Evidence for New Sexual Orientation Identities. Retrieved (2014, Oct. 01). Facebook.com[online]. Available from: https://www.facebook.com/notes/10152494536333477/

    [8] Harding, Chris. (2015, Feb. 02). Interpretation, The Bible, And Homosexuality. Received (2015, Feb. 02). facebook[online]. Available from: https://www.facebook.com/notes/chris-harding/interpretation-the-bible-and-homosexuality/10152776150348477


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    Feb 20, 2015 9:40 AM GMT
    You can't let yourself get so torn up over some AH's comment. He hasn't walked in your shoes. No need to defend yourself. There will always be shrill self righteous bitches. Just say FU and move on.
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    Feb 21, 2015 4:52 AM GMT
    strongbull saidYou can't let yourself get so torn up over some AH's comment. He hasn't walked in your shoes. No need to defend yourself. There will always be shrill self righteous bitches. Just say FU and move on.


    Oh, I really am not torn up. icon_smile.gif

    For me, I know that we are all humans (population with descriptive statistics) but we are also individuals. I was not offended at all by anyone here, but the person on Facebook was quite rude. I am no longer his friend, which is great because he didn't read anything I posted, etc. How can we each learn? I read the ones he posted. He told me that I would not find literature saying that I did not have attractions to women, but, as seen above, I did. Why does that matter?

    I am honest, educated, and I like using meta-analysis studies, Journal Reviews, National Academies, Universities, Governments, Trusted web sites (Web MD, Time, etc.), textbooks, etc. to support my discussions. They are trustworthy and available if another wants to read it as well. icon_smile.gif I just like to share but I realize some will disagree. That is completely fine with me because I often learn something from them as well!

    I am not saying I don't get mad, I do. I am NO where near perfect either! I am a divorced male after all, and, to be honest, my homosexuality wasn't our only problem! I just try to never get worked up over anything online. Rather, I get mad at illegal activity perpetrated by corporations, government, etc. icon_sad.gif

    Have a good night! icon_smile.gif

    Thanks everyone!