Why Art Deco say's I'm a "danger" and a "menace"

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    Feb 23, 2015 3:04 AM GMT
    From this thread:


    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/1370002#874854_4009396_name

    People like Art Deco and Larry Kramer have a disconnect with the modern world. Medical science and HIV prevention in particular.

    I'm a danger and a menace by Art Deco's statements. People are "Truvada Wholes" if they take PrEP according to Mr. Kramer.

    Deco:
    And BTW, you are a danger here to gay men, by endorsing unsafe gay sex. I state & repeat what the US CDC states, and all other competent medical authorities on the subject. Rather, no one here in their right mind should rely on anything YOU have to say about HIV and strategies to remain negative and STD free. Sorry, but you're a menace to gay men's health.

    I'm rarely so blunt, but I don't want to see another single person contract HIV. HIV/AIDS killed my first partner, it killed my husband's partner. I spend all my limited money to educate and work against the ignorance you and a few others display here


    Ah the same stupid opinions AND ASSUMPTIONS, that makes an ass out of you. The definition of "safe sex"....by the CDC no less, has changed.

    Why the CDC Stopped Calling Sex Without a Condom ‘Unprotected Sex’

    In January, the CDC announced on a call with more than 80 advocates that it would indeed change the decades-old language. Now, instead of referring to “unprotected sex” to mean sex without a condom, the CDC will refer simply refer to it as “condomless sex.”

    http://rhrealitycheck.org/article/2014/02/24/cdc-stopped-calling-sex-without-condom-unprotected-sex/

    Today, more tools than ever are available to prevent HIV. In addition to limiting your number of sexual partners, never sharing needles, and using condoms correctly and consistently, you may be able to take advantage of newer biomedical options such as pre-exposure and post-exposure prophylaxis.

    http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/basics/prevention.html


    Read ACON (I agree with it 100%). If you make any more assumptions about me, read ACON before you reply with something stupid.....again.

    ‘Safe sex’ for gay men and other homosexually
    active men (GHAM), in terms of HIV prevention, is no
    longer restricted to binaries of condomless sex or sex with condoms. In regard to HIV, ‘safe sex’ refers to sex with a very low likelihood of transmission.

    http://www.acon.org.au/sites/default/files/What-is-Safe-Sex-Position-2014.pdf

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    Feb 26, 2015 3:11 PM GMT
    There was a man in the 80s. He was a flight attendant. He spread a gay cancer among the gay population wherever he went. He knowingly had it and still had unprotected sex.

    A close friend of mine had sex with someone who he said he had known for years and considered as a good friend. That guy he slept with ended up dying due to complications from hiv. It wasn't until that guy died did my friend find out and then also found out he had contracted hiv from him.

    If you have it and want unprotected sex you should tell the other person. You're heartless, cruel, and selfish if you don't. IT Does Not matter if you are undetectable. You carry an obligation as someone with an illness to communicate to the other person and give them a choice.

    A choice you may not have had but would have wanted...wouldn't you have wanted to know and been given a choice?

    Hiv isn't a death sentence. Normal and regular life with just a pill a day in some cases. But it is still something that has to be discussed.
    My two cents thats all.
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    Feb 26, 2015 3:16 PM GMT
    And if you care to know. That friend of mine. He killed himself. He couldn't handle it. His first 6 months of being gay and he got hiv from an older guy who he trusted. So don't give me some self-righteous speech that barebacking is okay. Liars out there infect people and are just trying to justify it in some sick perverted way.
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    Feb 26, 2015 7:31 PM GMT
    Like Art Deco you made a LOT of stupid assumptions about me.

    1) That I don't disclose I do. Even on here.

    2) That I think condomless sex is OK for everyone.
    If you read the ACON statement you'd of known better.

    So how did your friend know him for years and trust him. yet was only out for 6 months and got AIDS?

    Do you know that "Patient Zero" by Randy Shilts was manufactured?

    "Club Baths, San Francisco, November 1982 . . . When the moaning stopped, the young man rolled over on his back for a cigarette. Gaetan Dugas reached up for the lights, turning up the rheostat slowly so his partner's eyes would have time to adjust. He then made a point of eyeing the purple lesions on his chest. "Gay cancer," he said, almost as if he were talking to himself. "Maybe you'll get it too."

    -- Randy Shilts, And the Band Played On

    That a GAY MAN wrote this, some true and some lies about Gaetan Dugas only to help sell a fucking book is disgusting.

    His editor wanted the book to have a character to be the core of the story. So it became a novelization. He combined characters. He made up dialogue.

    http://www.hivplusmag.com/case-studies/activism/2013/07/10/patient-zero-speaks-never-seen-footage

    “there are no historical records that document exactly what Dugas thought or did in private.”1

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4046389/

    So what did we get? Draconian Laws that scapegoated men with HIV/AIDS, built on the premise it was being spread intentionally. And there is ZERO PROOF.


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    Feb 26, 2015 7:35 PM GMT
    pazzy said
    Chase646 saidAnd if you care to know. That friend of mine. He killed himself. He couldn't handle it. His first 6 months of being gay and he got hiv from an older guy who he trusted. So don't give me some self-righteous speech that barebacking is okay. Liars out there infect people and are just trying to justify it in some sick perverted way.


    yes..... thank you. some of the biggest enemies of the gay community are among us.


    And the biggest problem of HIV stigmatization is with the Gay community.


    Gay-on-Gay Shaming: The New HIV War


    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/peter-staley/gay-on-gay-shaming-the-new-hiv-war_b_4856233.html
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    Feb 26, 2015 8:39 PM GMT
    This thread is really about stigma.

    How else can someone say I'm "perverted" "self-righteous" "evil" and I must be stopped?

    Stigma doesn't just 'shoot the messenger' with bad news, it shoots even with GOOD news! PrEP is very effective (96+)! ART Therapy is very effective (probably ZERO chance of infection)! Condoms can be 94%! Add them together and there should be NO MORE INFECTIONS.

    Time and time again I've been talked down to (at best. worse......!) because I'm POZ/Undetectable. Somehow I've made a "mistake" when I became POZ and anything I provide can be thus be dismissed, ridiculed and I can be insulted at will.
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    Feb 27, 2015 6:51 AM GMT
    pazzy: "the thing that disturbs me about the whole "PreP is here so it's okay to have unprotected sex" talk is that it's coming from random people who are NOT medical professionals."
    ....is ridiculous.

    Although PrEP has been available in the US since 2012, England will be using it soon

    "(the) study in the UK found an 86% reduction in HIV transmission in those taking the drug Truvada makes it the most successful PrEP trial ever, and should now galvanise us into adding it to existing HIV prevention strategies.

    Proud was designed to try and evaluate the impact of PrEP in a high-risk group of gay men in a way that reflected “real life” use of the drug as closely as possible: 545 men were randomly allocated to either take Truvada straight away or to defer treatment for a year. Both groups then had regular three-monthly clinic visits, completed questionnaires on sexual behaviour and adherence to the medication, and were tested for sexually transmitted infections. The study found no difference in reports of condom use between the two groups and no difference in rates of other STIs either. This should lay to rest the view that access to PrEP would somehow encourage an increase in risky sexual behaviour."

    NOT medical professionals? Look up Dr. Anthony Fauci and Dr. Julio Montaner.

    Here's one, tell me if he's not "professional" enough!

    http://aids.about.com/od/hivpreventionquestions/a/Treatment-As-Prevention-tasp.htm

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    Feb 27, 2015 6:57 AM GMT
    pazzy said
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said
    pazzy said
    now you and mmtm talk about this whole "hiv undetected" shit.



    Don't drag my name into this.

    Your debating style is heavily flawed. You basically include my name in your loquacious rant and then have the audacity to mention lack of HIV disclosure as if to imply I'm putting others at risk by withholding my HIV status.

    You're the last person on the planet to be giving advice on matters pertaining to sex. The thirty year old virgin thinks he knows it all. icon_rolleyes.gif



    first off, since what i said flew over your head. i didn't say anything or imply that about you or timm are doing that in your sex lives. i said that you and him talk about the whole "hiv undetectable shit with the PreP and how it's okay for neg folks to have bareback sex with hiv positive persons as long as they're on the pill". you are one of the guys that runs around saying that and that is misinformation. that's what the issue is.

    you keep trying to twist folks criticisms about you speaking in favor of unsafe sex practices into people talking about what you do in the bedroom or your hiv status. you would have folks disagreeing with you even if you were negative. don't worry. you're not the only person that is running around saying the same thing misinforming people. i smh when i see porn stars saying the same thing on youtube.




    Again, out of step with reality.
    If condoms are your preference USE the damn things!

    What you consider safe sex isn't all that safe. You only consider one thing. Good luck with that.
    THIS is the most up to date protocol:



    http://www.acon.org.au/sites/default/files/What-is-Safe-Sex-Position-2014.pdf

    http://www.acon.org.au/sites/default/files/Position-Statement-Undetectable-Viral-Load-2014.pdf
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    Feb 27, 2015 7:13 AM GMT
    Please answer me this, timmm55, which you've dodged before:

    How do you know for certain an HIV+ guy is on PrEP or any other therapy, and how effective it is with him? Because he TELLS you it is???

    Did he show you his lab work done that same day? Because viral loads fluctuate.

    And ANY viral load is a risk for barebacking. We can argue about lowered risks, but there's still a risk. I don't think most negative guys will wanna take that chance, especially younger men who will have to live for many decades (if they survive) with the daily demands of HIV treatment, and the constant fear of an uncertain future.

    So you can take your barebacking propaganda and shove it up your own ass, because nobody wants to go there. Nor are reasonable guys here buying your dangerous self-serving misinterpretations of the medical science.

    I'm sorry if you have HIV, my beloved late partner did, too, as do some of my close friends. I don't discriminate against those with HIV, but neither does anyone want to get it from you or someone else through unsafe sex practices.
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    Feb 27, 2015 7:31 AM GMT
    pazzy said
    timmm55 said
    pazzy said
    Chase646 saidAnd if you care to know. That friend of mine. He killed himself. He couldn't handle it. His first 6 months of being gay and he got hiv from an older guy who he trusted. So don't give me some self-righteous speech that barebacking is okay. Liars out there infect people and are just trying to justify it in some sick perverted way.


    yes..... thank you. some of the biggest enemies of the gay community are among us.


    And the biggest problem of HIV stigmatization is with the Gay community.


    Gay-on-Gay Shaming: The New HIV War


    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/peter-staley/gay-on-gay-shaming-the-new-hiv-war_b_4856233.html


    NOBODY is dissing anybody who has HIV or any disease for that matter.

    we're talking about guys who have viruses such as HIV or any contagious virus that know they have it and intentionally spread that to others by means of NOT informing them that they have it.



    Maybe you missed the part about the FABRICATED story of "Patient Zero".

    THAT story of intentional infections are still with us today. It's in laws that have been enacted....more to punish Gays for being positive than actual transmission. A misdemeanor can go to a felony if you are POZ (spitting at a cop in TX I believe).

    Some people have gone to prison for decades even without transmitting HIV.
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    Feb 27, 2015 8:27 AM GMT
    Art_Deco saidPlease answer me this, timmm55, which you've dodged before:

    How do you know for certain a HIV+ guy is on PrEP or any other therapy, and how effective it is with him? Because he TELLS you it is???

    Did he show you his lab work done that same day? Because viral loads fluctuate.

    And ANY viral load is a risk for barebacking. We can argue about lowered risks, but there's still a risk. I don't think most negative guys will wanna take that chance, especially younger men who will have to live for many decades (if they survive) with the daily demands of HIV treatment, and the constant fear of an uncertain future.

    So you can take your barebacking propaganda and shove it up your own ass, because nobody wants to go there. Nor are reasonable guys here buying your dangerous self-serving misinterpretations of the medical science.

    I'm sorry if you have HIV, my beloved late partner did, too, as do some of my close friends. I don't discriminate against those with HIV, but neither does anyone want to get it from you or someone else through unsafe sex practices.


    Fuck you. I'm sooooo tired of you dragging your dead ex out. You've worn out that sympathy card. You've lied about his diagnosis before and God knows what else. If he knew what an ass you were he'd be rolling in his grave.

    Did you read the ACON statement? Of course not. You'd rather characterize me as a whatever you want....that's stigma.

    You idiot, an HIV+ person isn't on PrEP.

    You asked 4 questionable questions. The underlined below answers that.

    I haven't dodged anything (another lie from you).
    In your characterization it's the POZ guy who is lying. Another subtle form of stigma.

    Here's what ACON says:
    "ACON does not endorse serosorting in casual sexual encounters as an effective HIV prevention
    strategy for HIV negative men,
    on the grounds that ascertaining the current HIV negative status of
    even a familiar casual partner is
    inherently unreliable."

    (Notice they don't blame anyone, unlike you)

    http://www.acon.org.au/sites/default/files/What-is-Safe-Sex-Position-2014.pdf

    The same goes for anyone you don't know. But if a guy says he's POZ or POZ/U he probably IS! It's the untested "NEG" ones who are the danger. And the largest group who are transmitting HIV.

    After 6 months of being undetectable <50 there still may be some blips, but typically the viral load will increase from undetectable up to 100 or 200 copies/ml (the OLD standard of undetectable BTW) before going back down to undetectable on the next test. Over time fluctuations and blips decrease.


    Read ACON. You'd learn something....and you won't sound so fucking stupid.
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    Feb 27, 2015 8:36 AM GMT
    Deco, if you really do have friends that are Poz/undetectable ask them about ACON, Partners, and other studies and protocols. Discuss it with them.

    Your hostility towards me is blinding you.
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    Feb 27, 2015 9:39 AM GMT
    timmm55 said
    Fuck you. I'm sooooo tired of you dragging your dead ex out. You've worn out that sympathy card. You've lied about his diagnosis before and God knows what else. If he knew what an ass you were he'd be rolling in his grave.

    I've lied about nothing. My partner died of AIDS-PML (progressive multifocal leukoencephalopathy). It's not sympathy, but first-hand experience I want to share for the benefit of others.

    Anyone who listens to your misinformation here regarding transmittable sexual diseases is risking their health. You obviously have a personal agenda in wanting to continue barebacking for your own selfish pleasure, but endangering others is something that needs to be challenged on this site.
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    Feb 27, 2015 9:43 AM GMT
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said
    Art_Deco said

    How do you know for certain an HIV+ guy is on PrEP or any other therapy, and how effective it is with him? Because he TELLS you it is???


    The use of prEP is for HIV- men to help them remain HIV-. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Correct, I misstated that. But I still want to know how a guy knows a poz guy is "undetectable". Does that make it impossible for him to infect someone? And how does doing PrEP make a man totally immune from contracting HIV?
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    Feb 27, 2015 4:29 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    timmm55 said
    Fuck you. I'm sooooo tired of you dragging your dead ex out. You've worn out that sympathy card. You've lied about his diagnosis before and God knows what else. If he knew what an ass you were he'd be rolling in his grave.

    I've lied about nothing. My partner died of AIDS-PML (progressive multifocal leukoencephalopathy). It's not sympathy, but first-hand experience I want to share for the benefit of others.

    Anyone who listens to your misinformation here regarding transmittable sexual diseases is risking their health. You obviously have a personal agenda in wanting to continue barebacking for your own selfish pleasure, but endangering others is something that needs to be challenged on this site.


    You said he died while HIV+. You said anyone who was HIV+ could catch anything at anytime and die. You said his blood work was "good". I was the one who pointed out that PML was very rare and only people with a severely compromised immune system (ie AIDS) got it.

    That's 3 lies.


    Art_Deco said

    "So all this BS about sex being safe with an undetectable poz guy is just medical talk dealing with controlled conditions. That has no application, bearing or relevance to the real world situations in which you & I actually operate. And such basic medical research shouldn't be misinterpreted to be providing guidance as to how gay men should behave sexually with each other. "

    Another 3 lies. Every time you say I have a "BB agenda" is a lie.....add another 20+.

    If I were Negative I wouldn't have anal sex AT ALL. Not even with condoms, with any person, unless monogamous and tested together over several months.

    With your naive grasp of what PrEP is for (if an HIV+ person takes it, it can lead to drug resistance, it's for NEGATIVE people only!) and your misunderstanding of "medical talk" you have ZERO comprehension of modern medicine.

    Awhile back you said Dr. Fauci was "in" on my BB Agenda. (another 2 lies BTW). If you had bothered to see who he was you wouldn't have looked so foolish. It's real easy, with your cursor highlight "Dr. Fauci" right click 'search google for "Dr Fauci". Your research would have taken 5 minutes. But you are willfully stupid.

    Stupidity and stigma go hand and hand. By not doing even basic background research, you are willfully ignoring the truth. An HIV+ person is forever locked into your preconceived bias and fear.

    This just in (I check HIV news every day).

    Zero HIV transmissions so far in Opposites Attract study


    (This is a GAY study, for all those who say the heterosexual studies don't apply)

    HIV-positive gay men who are on treatment and have an undetectable viral load are not transmitting the virus to their partners, two years into the Opposites Attract study.

    'The true risk of transmission could be anywhere between zero and 4.2% per year, with a very small chance that the per-year risk could be higher than 4.2%," said Professor Grulich.

    http://www.afao.org.au/news/zero-hiv-transmissions-so-far-in-opposites-attract-study#.VPCXgI70ePw

    I've been awaiting results from the Opposites Attract study for several reasons.
    1) It's all GAY, no heteros.
    2) Australia was initially AGAINST the ground breaking Swiss Statement. They have since gone 360 and fully embrace TasP.
    3) Australia's cascade ...the testing, to detection, to care, to undetectable, is already the best in the world at 63%
    4) ACON statement is the most modern protocol. And Opposites Attract is the most recent study.


    Anyone who preaches their knowledge of HIV, and only base their finding on 20 year old science is 1000% more dangerous than someone who's mind is open and learning.
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    Feb 28, 2015 11:27 PM GMT
    pazzy said
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said

    I never said it was "okay" for HIV- men to bareback HIV+ men. I said I support the use of prEP to help prevent the spread of HIV. You twisted my words around.



    icon_rolleyes.gif so what are you saying then? sounds like you're saying the SAME shit to me.

    answer this question then.

    do you think that someone who has HIV that's on PreP should wear a condom if they're having sex with someone else they're having sex with?

    i would like your response to this.



    Your as equally dense as Art Deco! PrEP is NOT for people who are HIV+.

    You are probably thinking about ART therapy and being undetectable.

    Again read the ACON statement, the answer is right there. It isn't "yes" or "no". Only a simpleton wold expect a simple answer.

    The whole "answer me this" attitude is arrogant.

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    Mar 01, 2015 12:07 AM GMT
    timmm55 said
    pazzy said
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said
    I never said it was "okay" for HIV- men to bareback HIV+ men. I said I support the use of prEP to help prevent the spread of HIV. You twisted my words around.

    icon_rolleyes.gif so what are you saying then? sounds like you're saying the SAME shit to me.

    answer this question then.

    do you think that someone who has HIV that's on PreP should wear a condom if they're having sex with someone else they're having sex with?

    i would like your response to this.

    Your as equally dense as Art Deco! PrEP is NOT for people who are HIV+.

    You are probably thinking about ART therapy and being undetectable.

    Again read the ACON statement, the answer is right there. It isn't "yes" or "no". Only a simpleton wold expect a simple answer.

    The whole "answer me this" attitude is arrogant.

    I do know the difference between PrEP and ART - I made a typo while writing quickly.

    I also know what the US CDC says about HIV prevention. They do mention the benefits of these approaches, but only in combination with condoms for anal or vaginal sex, when one partner is HIV+ or whose status is unknown. The CDC also stresses the importance of condom use to avoiding STDs. At no time have they minimized the need for routine condom use because of additional protections now available due to medical advances.

    "Pre-exposure prophylaxis, or PrEP, is a prevention option for people who are at high risk of getting HIV. It’s meant to be used consistently, as a pill taken every day, and to be used with other prevention options such as condoms. Find out if PrEP is right for you."

    http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/basics/prep.html
    (Site update Jan 15, 2015)

    http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/prevention/research/prep/
    (Site update Sep 30, 2014)

    As I demonstrate above with those links the CDC site for HIV/AIDS is updated every few months. That's my recent information source for much of this, not outdated info or medical science from 20 years ago as you implied some of are using. And I often do direct cut & paste quotes and links from the CDC for my RJ posts.
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    Mar 01, 2015 8:53 PM GMT
    Finally you are quoting the CDC! Congrats! Before you wouldn't quote anything. Just your hateful opinions.

    The problem with your quotes is it only applies to PrEP.

    Not too long ago.....

    Art_Deco said

    "So all this BS about sex being safe with an undetectable poz guy is just medical talk dealing with controlled conditions. That has no application, bearing or relevance to the real world situations in which you & I actually operate. And such basic medical research shouldn't be misinterpreted to be providing guidance as to how gay men should behave sexually with each other."

    This video Feb. 23, 2015, should help you understand the radical benefits of TasP......and that people who are undetectable are NOT the ones spreading HIV, (note that the latter figures include people who have gone off treatment for whatever reason and people who didn't wait 6+ months of undetectable to resume sex)



    Also from the CDC

    If I am living with HIV, how can I prevent passing it to others?


    Specifically, you can:

    Use ART. ART reduces the amount of virus (viral load) in your blood and body fluids. ART can keep you healthy for many years, and greatly reduce your chance of transmitting HIV to sex partners if taken consistently and correctly.
    If you are taking ART, follow your health care provider’s advice. Visit your health care provider regularly and always take your medicine as directed.
    Choose less risky sexual behaviors. Oral sex is much less risky than anal or vaginal sex. Anal sex is the highest-risk sexual activity for HIV transmission. During anal sex, it is less risky for your partner if you are the receptive partner (bottom) rather than the insertive partner (top). Sexual activities that do not involve the potential exchange of bodily fluids carry no risk for getting HIV (e.g., touching).
    Use condoms consistently and correctly.
    Talk to your partners about pre-exposure prophylaxis (PrEP), taking HIV medicine daily to prevent HIV infection. See the question “Can I take medicines to prevent getting HIV?” above.
    Talk to your partners about post-exposure prophylaxis (PEP) if you think they have had a possible exposure to HIV. An example of a possible exposure is you have anal or vaginal sex without a condom or the condom breaks and your partner is HIV-negative and not on PrEP. Your partners’ chance of exposure to HIV is lower if you are taking ART consistently and correctly, especially if your viral load is undetectable (see “Can I transmit HIV if I have an undetectable viral load,” below). Your partners should talk to their doctors right away (within 3 days) if they think they have had a possible exposure to HIV. Starting medicine immediately (known as post-exposure prophylaxis, or PEP) and taking it daily for 4 weeks reduces your partners’ chance of getting HIV.
    Get tested and treated for STDs and encourage your partners to do the same. If you are sexually active, get tested at least once a year. STDs can have long-term health consequences. They can also increase the chance of getting HIV or transmitting it to others. Find an STD testing site.

    You should also encourage your partners who are HIV-negative to get tested for HIV at least once a year so they are sure about their HIV status and can take action to keep them healthy. They may benefit from more frequent testing (e.g., every 3-6 months). (See “When should I get tested?” below). To find a testing site near them, they can call 1-800-CDC-INFO (232-4636), visit HIVtest.cdc.gov, text their ZIP code to KNOW IT (56694icon_cool.gif, or use a home testing kit.


    The model, says Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, is based on the observation that, "When you follow couples—one who's infected, the other who's not—the probability of infection diminishes when the viral load is very low," as when drugs have been administered. So, the study intends to get infected individuals' viral loads down to levels where they cannot infect their sexual partners#8212;even in the absence of a condom. "The philosophy," Fauci says, "is if you test everybody, and treat everybody who has HIV, you could use treatment as prevention."

    http://www.realjock.com/article/1546/

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    Mar 01, 2015 9:01 PM GMT
    Deco, have you bothered to read ACON yet?
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    Mar 01, 2015 9:09 PM GMT
    timmm55 saidFinally you are quoting the CDC! Congrats! Before you wouldn't quote anything. Just your hateful opinions.

    I'm sorry you haven't been paying attention. I've been quoting CDC here for 6 years, and posting links.

    And I have read ACON here. I am a fast & voracious reader of online postings & links. As guys here can tell you. Maybe one of the few guys who actually reads stuff in detail, and can reply to it.

    And nothing from ACON alters what I have posted. Please inform us of the specific conflicts between these 2 sources.
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    Mar 01, 2015 9:40 PM GMT
    Then if you agree with the following we don't have a problem then, do we?

    HERE:

    There are multiple benefits associated with obtaining and maintaining an UVL, especially for
    individuals but also for the broader community. These benefits are primarily improved health
    outcomes for people living with HIV (PLHIV)
    and a low risk of onward transmission of HIV.
    While gay and other homosexually active men (GHAM)
    in NSW have maintained high rates of condom
    use, sex without condoms still happens in our community, in a variety of contexts. ACON believes that achieving an UVL can significantly reduce the risk of onward transmission of HIV infection in situations where sex without condoms occurs.

    HERE:

    Transmission and the Law


    ACON does not support laws that explicitly criminalise HIV transmission, HIV exposure or failure to disclose HIV status, as they are counterproductive to public health outcomes. This is especially the case
    when dealing with cases of consensual private adult sex.


    HERE:

    There are now at least five strategies that reasonably constitute
    ‘safe sex’, provided that certain parameters are met. They are:
    1.
    The use of Condoms during
    casual encounters between men of unknown or discordant serostatus.
    2.
    HIV negative men taking effective pre-exposure prophylaxis (PrEP).
    3.
    Men living with HIV who only have sex without condoms when they have a sustained undetectable viral load (UVL) and in the absence of sexually transmissible infections (STIs).
    4.
    Effective use of serosorting between HIV positive men. (ACON does not support sersorting between negative partners)
    5.
    Effective negotiated safety agreements




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    Mar 01, 2015 9:51 PM GMT
    below is another manifestation of your stigma and hatred. It's all utterly foolish.

    DECO said:

    "I think most of us have come to the conclusion that we we are dealing with an individual who wants to spread HIV, so we can all be like him. He's not the first and he won't be the first, but I think this is the worst case we've had on RJ.

    Unfortunately we're gonna hafta keep doing this again & again with him, because these threads are a moving train. People keep getting on and off, and haven't read the stuff that came before. And might actually believe the dangerous idiocy he persists in posting here.

    I really wish RJ Admin would exercise some community responsibility and zap this guy, who's putting out unqualified health misinformation that places guys at risk of their lives, but you know that won't happen."

    If you could read and comprehend you'd know that isn't true. Undetectable does not equal 'spreading' HIV. That statement is mean, wrong and stigmatizing.

    Maybe in your speed reading, as "I am a fast & voracious reader of online postings & links. As guys here can tell you. Maybe one of the few guys who actually reads stuff in detail, and can reply to it." (BTW what a self-aggrandizing piece of puffery! And in another piece you were "the one who got away!" Aren't you full of yourself! )....you should slow down!

    Reply....but not comprehend?
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    Mar 02, 2015 9:37 PM GMT
    Chase646 saidThere was a man in the 80s. He was a flight attendant. He spread a gay cancer among the gay population wherever he went. He knowingly had it and still had unprotected sex.

    A close friend of mine had sex with someone who he said he had known for years and considered as a good friend. That guy he slept with ended up dying due to complications from hiv. It wasn't until that guy died did my friend find out and then also found out he had contracted hiv from him.

    If you have it and want unprotected sex you should tell the other person. You're heartless, cruel, and selfish if you don't. IT Does Not matter if you are undetectable. You carry an obligation as someone with an illness to communicate to the other person and give them a choice.

    A choice you may not have had but would have wanted...wouldn't you have wanted to know and been given a choice?

    Hiv isn't a death sentence. Normal and regular life with just a pill a day in some cases. But it is still something that has to be discussed.
    My two cents thats all.


    Bloody well said !!
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    Mar 02, 2015 9:40 PM GMT
    Chase646 saidAnd if you care to know. That friend of mine. He killed himself. He couldn't handle it. His first 6 months of being gay and he got hiv from an older guy who he trusted. So don't give me some self-righteous speech that barebacking is okay. Liars out there infect people and are just trying to justify it in some sick perverted way.


    Those liars should be sent to medical researchers , they could for sure some human flesh to try their experiments , instead to use innocent pets !
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    Mar 02, 2015 10:33 PM GMT
    neffa said
    Chase646 saidThere was a man in the 80s. He was a flight attendant. He spread a gay cancer among the gay population wherever he went. He knowingly had it and still had unprotected sex.

    A close friend of mine had sex with someone who he said he had known for years and considered as a good friend. That guy he slept with ended up dying due to complications from hiv. It wasn't until that guy died did my friend find out and then also found out he had contracted hiv from him.

    If you have it and want unprotected sex you should tell the other person. You're heartless, cruel, and selfish if you don't. IT Does Not matter if you are undetectable. You carry an obligation as someone with an illness to communicate to the other person and give them a choice.

    A choice you may not have had but would have wanted...wouldn't you have wanted to know and been given a choice?

    Hiv isn't a death sentence. Normal and regular life with just a pill a day in some cases. But it is still something that has to be discussed.
    My two cents thats all.


    Bloody well said !!


    I actually agree that a POZ person should tell any partner. I believe in full disclosure. Without knowing that I do (even though I've posted it many times) saying "You're heartless, cruel, and selfish if you don't" seems like he presumes POZ people don't.




    CDC: HIV+ Out of Care Responsible for 91% of New Infections, says AHF

    According to an AIDS.gov blog post, the CDC study, first published in JAMA Internal Medicine on Monday, “…estimates that 91.5 percent of new HIV infections in 2009 were attributable to people with HIV who were not in medical care, including those who didn’t know they were infected. In comparison, less than six percent of new infections could be attributed to people with HIV who were in care and receiving antiretroviral therapy.” (not undetectable).