Why Arabs Lose Wars. Why Westerners fail to understand conflicts in the middle East.

  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Mar 28, 2015 2:09 AM GMT
    This is a 16 year old article I found cleaning out bookmarks but it's still very much as up to date as when it was written.

    In light of the spread of war in that region it's all the more worth reading in order to help put aside conventional western thinking in order to understand their problems from a more realistic perspective.


    http://www.meforum.org/441/why-arabs-lose-wars
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    Mar 30, 2015 8:56 AM GMT
    It's a pretty interesting read. It's definitely more informative and wholesome than all of the bullshit articles on the personal lives of porn stars, the questioning of the sexuality of some celebrity, etc. that are often posted. Thanks for sharing.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Mar 30, 2015 3:07 PM GMT
    volsfan315 saidIt's a pretty interesting read. It's definitely more informative and wholesome than all of the bullshit articles on the personal lives of porn stars, the questioning of the sexuality of some celebrity, etc. that are often posted. Thanks for sharing.


    my pleasure. It gives a small glimpse into how little we in the west really understand about the Arab/Muslim world... BUT that never stops people from developing full grown opinions about the issues there.
  • Destinharbor

    Posts: 4433

    Mar 30, 2015 4:52 PM GMT
    Ya, but I just don't see the policy prescription here. I don't disagree. Just don't see how useful it is except in reaction. And the same can be said about a lot of the far East.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Mar 30, 2015 5:26 PM GMT
    Destinharbor saidYa, but I just don't see the policy prescription here. I don't disagree. Just don't see how useful it is except in reaction. And the same can be said about a lot of the far East.


    This article points out one of the basic flaws of middle east culture. This "army" problem has been a part of their culture since the beginning of their culture. It is a reflection of their culture.

    More here.
    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/4028747#908880_4029369_name

    If you're wanting a 30 word synopsis/sound byte for this you'll be disappointed. It's complex and made five times more complex than it is due to western mindsets being unable to put aside conventional thinking in order to understand middle eastern/Arab issues at face value.
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    Mar 30, 2015 7:10 PM GMT
    The article was very interesting. However, the kinds of cultural changes that the author thinks would be required in order to alter this problem are both global in scale and apparently of no interest to the Arab ruling class. As an analysis, the article was very good. But it necessarily lacks any prescriptions.
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    Mar 30, 2015 7:38 PM GMT
    Part of it echos a theme in a book I read whose name I can't remember, or the author. The theme being that totalitarian governments are less likely to win wars because their military lacks the independent critical thinking that a democratic government's military has. I.e., under a democratic government the admirals and generals can discuss options and decisions with their leaders, and the lower ranking officers can similarly discuss things with their superiors.

    I found these 2 books fascinating in their analysis of Islamic culture. The later one (2nd link) repeats most of the stuff that's in the earlier one.

    What Went Wrong?: The Clash Between Islam and Modernity in the Middle East

    The Crisis of Islam: Holy War and Unholy Terror

  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Mar 30, 2015 8:35 PM GMT
    Lumpyoatmeal saidPart of it echos a theme in a book I read whose name I can't remember, or the author. The theme being that totalitarian governments are less likely to win wars because their military lacks the independent critical thinking that a democratic government's military has. I.e., under a democratic government the admirals and generals can discuss options and decisions with their leaders, and the lower ranking officers can similarly discuss things with their superiors.

    I found these 2 books fascinating in their analysis of Islamic culture. The later one (2nd link) repeats most of the stuff that's in the earlier one.

    What Went Wrong?: The Clash Between Islam and Modernity in the Middle East

    The Crisis of Islam: Holy War and Unholy Terror



    WOW!

    You're the 1st person I've met who's read anything by Bernard Lewis. I've read The Crisis of Islam and Islam the Religion and the People (which I DO NOT recommend as a 1st source)

    The history of the Arabic/Muslim armies and their abject incompetence is one of the flaws of their culture and more specifically the 170 specific bans on abrogations and mollifications of any part of Islam that prevent it from moving out of the 7th century towards the 21st. They are powerless within their culture and faith to modernize either of them in meaningful ways due to the superstitious dictates of Mohammed himself who forbids them to change one word of his Quran or Hadith. This is ingrained into their culture to a degree that is almost incomprehensible to people in the west...

    As ONE small example of their inability to alter their religion and culture......
    Mohammed told his followers that he was the the most perfect man ever to set foot on the earth and that they should live by his examples. To this day they do, regardless of the unbelievable consequences. Emulating their prophet Muslim traditions have for 1300 years led men to marry their own cousins as did Mohammed. In some nations congenital birth defects are 30 times the rates in western nations. In some nations, records of birth defects are state secrets.

    https://realityofislam.wordpress.com/marriage-with-cousins-in-islam/

    http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Cousin_Marriage_in_Islam

    http://counterjihadreport.com/2012/07/06/the-problem-of-inbreeding-in-islam/

    55% of Pakistanis in the UK are married to cousins... and the consequences are mounting up.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlIs4KcItmk


    remember.. this is just ONE face of this problem. There are many more. This should help you begin to understand how little Islam and Arabs have in common with us in the West...
  • ASHDOD

    Posts: 1057

    Mar 31, 2015 7:54 PM GMT
    very intresting.

    i would also recommend ''The Closed Circle: An Interpretation of the Arabs'' by David Pryce-Jones
    writen in the 80' its still very acurate.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Apr 02, 2015 6:50 PM GMT
    Ashdod saidvery intresting.

    i would also recommend ''The Closed Circle: An Interpretation of the Arabs'' by David Pryce-Jones
    writen in the 80' its still very acurate.


    Thanks for that Ashdod.

    I checked it out and it does look interesting. I was glad to see that there's another author aware of the effects of tribalism on the middle east and Arabs that have barely changed in over 3,000 years. Most authors overlook it.

    I just ordered a hardcover off Amazon.