WALTER SCOTT: Another black man shot in cold-blood by a white officer

  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Apr 09, 2015 12:09 AM GMT
    The cop flat-out LIED in his report. The cop tried to plant a taser on the dead body moments after unloading his clip in Walter Scott. Mr. Scott was unarmed, and a fleeing suspect. Under Garner precedent, you may only shoot a fleeting suspect if he is a "threat."

    Mr. Scott was not perfect, but he was not a threat. The real bombshell here is that a 3rd party caught the TRUTH on camera, and exposed the lies of the cops--which are systematic across the "blue line" and occur everyday in various (and thankfully usually less dramatic) fashion.

    This is a race issue, and this is primarily an EXCESSIVE FORCE issue. The police should serve the community, not kill it or tax it via trumped up tickets. icon_rolleyes.gif


    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/09/us/walter-scott-north-charleston-residents-express-disgust-but-not-surprise.html?_r=0
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    Apr 09, 2015 12:37 AM GMT
    I can think of no job more difficult or frightening than raising a black son in the USA.
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Apr 09, 2015 12:47 AM GMT
    @Wyndahoi, amen. The ratio of black teens to white teens killed by cops is 30 to 1.5. That's so beyond the standard deviation as to be jaw-dropping.

    Thank God, at least this time, we have video.

    You'll notice the conservative posse be quiet. This is because they're myopic in their use of examples. What matters are the trends, statistics and facts. Individual stories simply help to illustrate truths.

    Remember when the Garner case "collapsed" according to conservatives? Because Garner was deemed to be a threat (an assessment I still disagree with), they then in a non-sequitor manner attempted to "prove" that all issues of racism in policing are invalid, exaggerated and don't exist.

    But liberals aren't as myopic. I don't use one clear cut example of racism and excessive force to, in a similarly non-sequitor way, prove that all claims of racism and excessive force are valid. That's illogical. But the conservatives don't care about higher truths, only debunking claimed individual cases of racism and excessive force one at a time, and then gloating in their "rightness."

    It's sad really. So racism and excessive force was not an issue a month ago because Garner was the figuredhead, but now it is? I hate conservative "logic" and their nasty gloating when one particular case proves less than useful in advancing the cause that--does, in fact--exist.

    Sigh icon_cry.gif
  • KissTheSky

    Posts: 1980

    Apr 09, 2015 1:44 AM GMT
    If the video didn't exist, everyone would believe the cops' version of the story which is now shown to be a complete LIE.
    Now the killer cop is being tried for murder. I hope justice is served here, for a change.
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Apr 09, 2015 7:33 AM GMT
    KissTheSky saidIf the video didn't exist, everyone would believe the cops' version of the story which is now shown to be a complete LIE.
    Now the killer cop is being tried for murder. I hope justice is served here, for a change.


    Amen. My only wish is that this story had played out WITHOUT the video for a solid week or so, so all the usual pro-police conserva-posse could really dig in their heels defending this POS cop, and then.....BAM....the gotcha moment of the truth and the video.

    As it is, we'll hear NOTHING from the conservatives and those who started the threads debasing and denigrating Michael Brown, et al.

    As if this nation's racism and excessive force problem hinges on the validity of any single incident.
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    Apr 09, 2015 3:03 PM GMT
    Svnw688 said
    KissTheSky saidIf the video didn't exist, everyone would believe the cops' version of the story which is now shown to be a complete LIE.
    Now the killer cop is being tried for murder. I hope justice is served here, for a change.


    Amen. My only wish is that this story had played out WITHOUT the video for a solid week or so, so all the usual pro-police conserva-posse could really dig in their heels defending this POS cop, and then.....BAM....the gotcha moment of the truth and the video.

    As it is, we'll hear NOTHING from the conservatives and those who started the threads debasing and denigrating Michael Brown, et al.

    As if this nation's racism and excessive force problem hinges on the validity of any single incident.

    You say "pro-police" like it's a bad thing. The vast majority of law enforcement officers are honest, principled, honorable, hard-working public servants doing their best in a difficult profession. I will proudly call myself pro-police.
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    Apr 09, 2015 4:20 PM GMT
    "EXCESSIVE FORCE" seems understated.

    I watched that vid and verbally screamed "holy crap" or whatever came out of me at that time while watching on the puter.

    In fact the whole rest of the time I was watching the vid after the gunshots, I worried for the person with the camera. He's a hero. That cop easily could have turned on him to destroy the evidence.

    I am still stunned by what I saw.
  • tazzari

    Posts: 2929

    Apr 09, 2015 5:22 PM GMT
    "Shot in the back while trying to escape/resisting arrest." Stalinism, anyone? Totalitarianism? That heaven this was caught on video!

    But: there are complex issues here which probably will not be addressed: "The vast majority of law enforcement officers are honest, principled, honorable, hard-working public servants doing their best in a difficult profession," is very true, especially in the violent, gun-soaked, paranoid culture we have become. This in no way excuses excessive police force, but it helps explain it. And I doubt very much that anyone will have the political balls to address it, at least as long as the GOP-NRA complex rules such a large part of our politics.

    (Before the abovementioned complex rips into me: I am a gun owner from a family of gun owners and gunsmiths.)
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    Apr 09, 2015 5:57 PM GMT
    KissTheSky saidIf the video didn't exist, everyone would believe the cops' version of the story which is now shown to be a complete LIE.
    Now the killer cop is being tried for murder. I hope justice is served here, for a change.

    I have no confidence it will be. Cops are almost always acquitted, or given a slap on the wrist. The rare exceptions prove the rule.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Apr 09, 2015 6:22 PM GMT
    Wyndahoi saidI can think of no job more difficult or frightening than raising a black son in the USA.


    Channeling Mayor De Blasio today?

    I suppose you have a point though. Raising a mixed race son in the 1970s/80s would have frightened some, especially after age 12. That's when he was outgrowing shoes and pants every 4 months, orthodontist bills, then the dermatologist... Car pooling to get him to ball practice for the 6 years before he could drive... a broken arm in 6th grade and broken leg in 8th...


    Svnw688 said@Wyndahoi, amen. The ratio of black teens to white teens killed by cops is 30 to 1.5. That's so beyond the standard deviation as to be jaw-dropping.


    Here's some more jaw dropping figures to go with the single one you picked out.
    FBI Crime Stats for 2010

    90% of blacks are murdered by blacks
    83% of whites are murdered by whites.
    there are 14.82 murders per 100K by blacks versus 2.17 per 100K for whites.
    Per capita, blacks commit 7x more murders than whites
    the leading cause of death for young black males is black males with guns. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/10/leading-cause-of-death-young-black-men-homicide_n_3049209.html
    the leading cause of death for white males in the same age group is "accidents" including traffic accidents.

    1,148 people killed by cops last year, 26 percent were black. 298 black vs 850 all other races.
    http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/map-shows-exact-location-every-black-person-killed-cops-2014

    Taking all the figures into consideration the figure Svnw gave on police shootings of black men do not look so out of line.

    One things is for sure FEWER INNOCENT BLACK MEN ARE SHOT BY POLICE THAN BY OTHER BLACK MEN.

    From all appearances, this most recent shooting seems to be a clear case of a cop gone wrong, However there is dash cam and other video yet to be released. If there were any lessons to be learned from Michael Brown and Eric Gardner, it would be wise for everyone to wait for it before jumping to conclusions.







  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Apr 09, 2015 8:10 PM GMT
    I already SAW, with my own eyes, the video of the cop gunning down Mr. Scott who was fleeing. I don't care how many more angles or cameras there are, I only need the one to know the cop shouldn't have unloaded his entire clip into that man.

    This SAME video I saw has also proven that the officer LIED--flat out lied--in his official report.

    This SAME video I saw has also led to the highly likely conclusion that the cop planted a taser on the victim, and then the cop who arrived later told the cop/gunman to, effectively, pick that up because he wasn't going to cover for him like that (i.e., with a planted taser).

    I don't need to withhold judgment after this irrefutable video evidence. Unless you care to delve down the rabbit hole of this being a photoshoped or otherwise unauthentic video. If the video is real, the only question that remains is whether the cop should get the death penalty or life imprisonment. I'm in principle opposed to the death penalty, so I'd favor life.

    Sad situation all around. Dead man, another man's life ruined. Such a waste, and a direct result of a trigger happy police force.
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    Apr 09, 2015 9:02 PM GMT
    tazzari said"Shot in the back while trying to escape/resisting arrest." Stalinism, anyone? Totalitarianism? That heaven this was caught on video!

    But: there are complex issues here which probably will not be addressed: "The vast majority of law enforcement officers are honest, principled, honorable, hard-working public servants doing their best in a difficult profession," is very true, especially in the violent, gun-soaked, paranoid culture we have become. This in no way excuses excessive police force, but it helps explain it. And I doubt very much that anyone will have the political balls to address it, at least as long as the GOP-NRA complex rules such a large part of our politics.

    (Before the abovementioned complex rips into me: I am a gun owner from a family of gun owners and gunsmiths.)


    I do wonder if the cop, instead of applying common sense and professional judgment to the situation, did not simply go into some sort of trained escalation-of-force mode (albeit he applied it in the most horrendously inappropriate way possible). Notwithstanding any initial struggle and deployment of the taser, once Mr Scott was running away, the officer should have re-assessed the situation in terms of the diminishing threat the apparently unarmed Mr Scott was now posing to him and to the public.

    Is the message not being sufficiently drilled into some police officers during initial training and continuation training, that the taser and gun (that are so easily accessible to officers) are meant to be tools of last resort, to be used when non-violent tactics fail or are not an option?
  • conservativej...

    Posts: 2465

    Apr 09, 2015 9:08 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    KissTheSky saidIf the video didn't exist, everyone would believe the cops' version of the story which is now shown to be a complete LIE.
    Now the killer cop is being tried for murder. I hope justice is served here, for a change.

    I have no confidence it will be. Cops are almost always acquitted, or given a slap on the wrist. The rare exceptions prove the rule.


    How the defense and prosecution proceed will depend on the additional video that has appeared showing the altercation prior to the shooting. If the initial confrontation can be construed as an assault on the officer, then he likely will not be convicted based upon South Carolina law.

  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Apr 09, 2015 10:02 PM GMT
    Svnw688 said@Wyndahoi, amen. The ratio of black teens to white teens killed by cops is 30 to 1.5. That's so beyond the standard deviation as to be jaw-dropping.


    Here's some more jaw dropping figures to go with the single one you picked out.
    FBI Crime Stats for 2010

    90% of blacks are murdered by blacks
    83% of whites are murdered by whites.
    there are 14.82 murders per 100K by blacks versus 2.17 per 100K for whites.
    Per capita, blacks commit 7x more murders than whites
    the #1 cause of death for young black males is black males with guns. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/10/leading-cause-of-death-young-black-men-homicide_n_3049209.html
    the leading cause of death for white males in the same age group is "accidents" including traffic accidents.

    1,148 people killed by cops last year, 26 percent were black. 298 black vs 850 all other races.
    http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/map-shows-exact-location-every-black-person-killed-cops-2014

    Taking all the figures into consideration the figure Svnw gave on police shootings of black men do not look so out of line.

    One things is for sure FEWER INNOCENT BLACK MEN ARE SHOT BY POLICE THAN BY OTHER BLACK MEN.

    From all appearances, this most recent shooting seems to be a clear case of a cop gone wrong, However there is dash cam and other video yet to be released. If there were any lessons to be learned from Michael Brown and Eric Gardner, it would be wise for everyone to wait for it before jumping to conclusions.
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Apr 09, 2015 10:12 PM GMT
    @Bob3

    I'm not going to engage in a cherry-picking statistics session with you. Stay focused. This case involved a cold blooded killing of a "suspect" (he had a broken tail light) who was fleeing and running AWAY from the officer.

    Insofar there's a larger argument, it isn't a meta-analysis of ALL crime against blacks, but a meta-analysis of black/police interactions, culture, and violence. In short, you're jumping too far.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Apr 10, 2015 1:37 AM GMT
    Svnw688 said@Bob3

    I'm not going to engage in a cherry-picking statistics session with you. Stay focused. This case involved a cold blooded killing of a "suspect" (he had a broken tail light) who was fleeing and running AWAY from the officer.

    Insofar there's a larger argument, it isn't a meta-analysis of ALL crime against blacks, but a meta-analysis of black/police interactions, culture, and violence. In short, you're jumping too far.


    He didn't decide to run to avoid a ticket about a tail light, did he? What were the reasons he decided to run? That subject still hasn't been fully addressed. Outstanding warrants? What was found in the car? There's more to this story and it's only wise to wait to know more to form opinions about it. Did you not learn that from Ferguson?

    All I'm attempting to do is keep things in perspective. This one single case is not representative of the majority of violent interactions between police and blacks and you know it. In fact you'd be hard pressed to make a case that 10% of the close to 300 black men supposedly killed by police each year fit the criteria of murders.

    I've seen the dash cam video. There's certainly nothing on it to warrant the use of deadly force. It doesn't look good but there's no reason to throw another Ferguson style party.
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    Apr 10, 2015 2:10 AM GMT
    bobbobbob said
    ...but there's no reason to throw another Ferguson style party.

    About what we could expect from you. The protests in Ferguson were a "party"?

    You reestablish your standing here as RJ's leading racist.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Apr 10, 2015 2:23 AM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    bobbobbob said
    ...but there's no reason to throw another Ferguson style party.

    About what we could expect from you. The protests in Ferguson were a "party"?

    You reestablish your standing here as RJ's leading racist.


    Nah, nasty fat ass lying queen. You've thrown the word racist around so much no one believes you.

    Don't you need to go add some more of your nastiness to your epic thread on how much your nasty hypocritical fat ass hates other fat people? Here's the address in case you got drunk and forgot it.

    [url]http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/461484?forumpage=0
    [/url]
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    Apr 10, 2015 2:24 AM GMT
    bobbobbob said
    Svnw688 said@Wyndahoi, amen. The ratio of black teens to white teens killed by cops is 30 to 1.5. That's so beyond the standard deviation as to be jaw-dropping.


    Here's some more jaw dropping figures to go with the single one you picked out.
    FBI Crime Stats for 2010

    90% of blacks are murdered by blacks
    83% of whites are murdered by whites.
    there are 14.82 murders per 100K by blacks versus 2.17 per 100K for whites.
    Per capita, blacks commit 7x more murders than whites
    the #1 cause of death for young black males is black males with guns. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/10/leading-cause-of-death-young-black-men-homicide_n_3049209.html
    the leading cause of death for white males in the same age group is "accidents" including traffic accidents.

    1,148 people killed by cops last year, 26 percent were black. 298 black vs 850 all other races.
    http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/map-shows-exact-location-every-black-person-killed-cops-2014

    Taking all the figures into consideration the figure Svnw gave on police shootings of black men do not look so out of line.

    One things is for sure FEWER INNOCENT BLACK MEN ARE SHOT BY POLICE THAN BY OTHER BLACK MEN.

    From all appearances, this most recent shooting seems to be a clear case of a cop gone wrong, However there is dash cam and other video yet to be released. If there were any lessons to be learned from Michael Brown and Eric Gardner, it would be wise for everyone to wait for it before jumping to conclusions.


    Repeating yourself in bigger text doesn't make your point anymore germane to the discussion. Cops shoot innocent black men (or choke them.) Black criminals shoot innocent black men. Yeah so? Because more black men are shot by other black men makes it OK that cops do it?!?? The two facts are not related at all!

    1148 people killed by cops last year? Where did you get that number? wherever you got it from its not accurate. There is no requirement for police departments to report killings so no one knows how many there are. And 'only' 26% of cop shootings have black victims? Well seeing as blacks make up 12% of the US population that means they are WAY over represented in that group. Unless you're trying to say blacks 'deserve' to be shot more than other groups because they're more violent.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Apr 10, 2015 3:39 AM GMT
    I gave links above.

    For the 1,148 figure I used the one from the liberal source, Alternet, from April 9th 2015. If you wish to dispute that number, contact them.
    [url]http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/map-shows-exact-location-every-black-person-killed-cops-2014
    [/url]

    Here are others from FBI.
    Race and Sex of Victim by Race and Sex of Offender, 2010 [Single victim/single offender]

    http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/tables/10shrtbl06.xls

    Justifiable homicides by law enforcement by weapon 2006-2010

    [url]http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/tables/10shrtbl14.xls
    [/url]

    Summary material on wikipedia
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_crime_in_the_United_States#Homicide

    My entire purpose is to insert perspective into this and hope for a conversation that will reflect the greater issues behind this violence and not concentrate on one event that doesn't address the 5000 pound gorilla in the room, but just dwells on the flea on his nose.
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    Apr 10, 2015 4:24 AM GMT
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    Apr 10, 2015 3:21 PM GMT
    JuanPablomv89 said
    Wyndahoi saidI can think of no job more difficult or frightening than raising a black son in the USA.

    What can I expect from a man who is dating a gay closeted man like you. Poor black people are victims and thats why most of the gangs and crimes are made by them


    Focus on the hell hole that is Mexico before you opine about race relations in the U.S. You don't see me harping about the U.K. or Canada do you? No, because I don't f-ing live there. Unless and until you take some vested interest in the US, back off with your baseless opinions that are likely formed from watching Hollywood movies 2 months after they're released here.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14328

    Apr 12, 2015 4:06 AM GMT
    Svnw688 said
    JuanPablomv89 said
    Wyndahoi saidI can think of no job more difficult or frightening than raising a black son in the USA.

    What can I expect from a man who is dating a gay closeted man like you. Poor black people are victims and thats why most of the gangs and crimes are made by them


    Focus on the hell hole that is Mexico before you opine about race relations in the U.S. You don't see me harping about the U.K. or Canada do you? No, because I don't f-ing live there. Unless and until you take some vested interest in the US, back off with your baseless opinions that are likely formed from watching Hollywood movies 2 months after they're released here.
    Well than you should focus on that rat infested, overbuilt, ultra liberal shithole of New York City and let the folks in South Carolina worry about this out of control cop.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14328

    Apr 12, 2015 4:10 AM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    bobbobbob said
    ...but there's no reason to throw another Ferguson style party.

    About what we could expect from you. The protests in Ferguson were a "party"?

    You reestablish your standing here as RJ's leading racist.
    There is absolutely nothing racist about what he said. I swear you are getting as dumb as that Minneapolis Motor Mouth. You are too liberal for your own good.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Apr 12, 2015 4:55 AM GMT
    Wyndahoi saidI can think of no job more difficult or frightening than raising a black son in the USA.


    Svnw688 said@Wyndahoi, amen. The ratio of black teens to white teens killed by cops is 30 to 1.5. That's so beyond the standard deviation as to be jaw-dropping.


    AS the father of a mixed race son, I have to agree with Wyndahoi. Raising a son of less than pure caucasian blood was difficult and an frightening.

    He grew so fast and was so rough on clothes and shoes it meant nearly a complete wardrobe replacement every 4 months after he was ten.

    Four years of orthodontist bills.

    At least Five years of appointments with dermatologists.

    Car pooling for nearly every month for twelve years to and from school and sports practices and games.

    PUBERTY!!!!!!!!!!!

    FOUR YEARS OF COLLEGE....

    in his teen and college days....
    Zero arrests, 3 speeding tickets, no F's 2 D's on report cards, one minor wreck, a broken arm and a broken leg. Mono, 20 stitches in a foot, food poisoning his first year of college...

    I don't know how I survived it.

    You did a good job channeling Mayor Di Blasio.