WHAT ABOUT CONDOMS?

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    May 03, 2015 8:38 PM GMT
    "By 1992, we had a very clear understanding of how HIV was spread, and how condoms could prevent transmissions. The exact stats were always sketchy, but my early training taught they were “about 98%” effective if used consistently and correctly. With that in mind, I began volunteering for an organization that was running a “100%” campaign, handing out condoms, lube, pins, and pamphlets, on street corners and in bars, that said “100%”. The intention of this marketing tool was to let people know that if everyone used condoms 100% of the time—everyone who is HIV-positive, everyone who is HIV-negative, everyone who is having sex at all—then we would eradicate this epidemic by the year 2000. We had people wear the shirts and pins as a sign of their commitment to 100% condom use. It made perfect sense."


    But.......


    http://www.positivelyaware.com/articles/what-about-condoms
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    May 03, 2015 8:52 PM GMT
    Condoms can also prevent urinary tract infections, which can be painful.
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    May 03, 2015 9:40 PM GMT
    the OP on this topic has just hit what I said on another thread about forgetting what the gay world has gone through over the past 35 years......AIDS is still with us, but for some unknown reason to me, this horror either seems to have skipped a generation or they just don't give a fuck.....again I will ask the older of you guys out there....where tf are you in mentoring about safe sex????

    Putting AIDS aside, think of the bacterial risk just in anal sex alone...bareback.....geez can a condom be that bad compared to the consequences? The old saying that two minutes of glory isn't worth a lifetime of suffering should ring strong and loud and no one seems to be manning the bell.
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    May 03, 2015 9:45 PM GMT
    2452North saidthe OP on this topic has just hit what I said on another thread about forgetting what the gay world has gone through over the past 35 years......AIDS is still with us, but for some unknown reason to me, this horror either seems to have skipped a generation or they just don't give a fuck.....again I will ask the older of you guys out there....where tf are you in mentoring about safe sex????

    Putting AIDS aside, think of the bacterial risk just in anal sex alone...bareback.....geez can a condom be that bad compared to the consequences? The old saying that two minutes of glory isn't worth a lifetime of suffering should ring strong and loud and no one seems to be manning the bell.


    Things have changed, 2452North. Today the advent of prep, etc has many considering the disease no worse than diabetes. I don't agree with that comparison, but then I'm old.
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    May 03, 2015 9:51 PM GMT
    disease is disease and this one is a devil in sheeps' clothing, yes maybe the times have changed, but THINGS have not....it just isn't a disease that is camp anymore and so no one understands it like we did way fucking back then...and now fucking people joke about it? fuck me to tears...
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    May 03, 2015 9:57 PM GMT
    ^^ yes ^^ we are a slow to learn group on this earth....if it feels good fuck the consequences.....its human and doesn't boil down to sexual orientation.....we claim to be the smartest, only rational being on earth....but we would rather jerk, fuck and whatever and damn the torpedos.....so are we really that advanced.....how fucking many of you have seen the horrors of AIDS?? but ya, hey this is 2015, things are different....up your ass I say.(npi)
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    May 04, 2015 12:08 AM GMT
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said
    2452North saidThe old saying that two minutes of glory isn't worth a lifetime of suffering should ring strong and loud and no one seems to be manning the bell.


    Two minutes?!?!

    Try two hours. And actually three would be even better. icon_lol.gif

    Not funny, considering you have HIV.
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    May 04, 2015 1:51 AM GMT
    Import said
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said
    2452North saidThe old saying that two minutes of glory isn't worth a lifetime of suffering should ring strong and loud and no one seems to be manning the bell.


    Two minutes?!?!

    Try two hours. And actually three would be even better. icon_lol.gif

    Not funny, considering you have HIV.


    Why, because someone who is POZ shouldn't enjoy sex, or even have sex??

    MMTM is undetectable. Do some research (less than six years old....information has changed rapidly.)
    Start with the Swiss Statement.

    The author said: "...he thought there would be confetti in the streets when the FDA approved Truvada for PrEP. So did I! I thought, “Finally, what we’ve been waiting for all these years. It’s like a vaccine against HIV.”
    He is on PrEP and is Negative.

    http://positivelyaware.com/blogs/tell-it-to-enid

    I just wanted to discuss PrEP for Negative men. If I could turn back the clock to 1984 I would have taken PrEP in a heartbeat. But I was probably POZ even then. I would have insisted my ex take it. I know he would have. He was a Navy Dentist with 2 master degrees. Getting HIV has nothing to do with intelligence. He became POZ after we broke up.

    The author was part of the 100% condom use group. But many of them became POZ.

    To the guys on here who don't do PrEP, why not?
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    May 04, 2015 2:14 AM GMT
    IAmazeMyself saidAlong with the effective treatments for HIV, the drug companies are selling a product they need to market as desirable:
    The Positive Lifestyle.

    I'm glad that HIV-survivors can feel more powerful than their disease.

    But there's nothing positive about being infected with a virus.

    I may contract HIV someday or I may acquire some virus that none of us have yet heard of. I'm not smug about being negative.

    But as a public health message we need to do a better job of telling the youthful and sexually inexperienced that HIV is still a disease that will have a huge negative effect on their lives.



    So are you on PrEP or not? Why are you or why not?

    They aren't marketing a Positive Lifestyle. PrEP is the opposite of that. So a drug company that makes a 96-100% effective prevention drug that isn't desirable? They do make hefty profits....it's obscene IMHO. I understand they need to make a profit, but at who's expense?

    50,000 people will acquire HIV this year again. Ask the 50,000 from last year if they wished they were on PrEP.
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    May 04, 2015 2:16 AM GMT
    Condoms are not a panacea.

    But condoms are great at reducing the risk for HIV and MANY OTHER STI/STDs.

    Wrap it up.
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    May 04, 2015 2:31 AM GMT
    No one should feel stigmatized about a positive diagnosis, but it's not like the disease should be just shrugged off as no big deal. You want to be healthy all around, not just from HIV, but from all STDs. Sure, medicine has made it possible to survive the disease, but if you have your druthers, most would prefer not to have to be on medication for the rest of their life. I have seizures that cannot be explained and have to take six pills a day just to keep from having any problems, which is not preferable, but it keeps me in good health.

    And for some guys, HIV meds are not cheap (especially for those without insurance), so you've got to factor in the financial aspect. Lots of guys who acquire HIV are not financially secure, which can make it a financial burden. Even if you consider PrEP as prevention, it's still more expensive than condoms and you can get condoms for free if you go to a testing center. Planned Parenthood gives me a ton of them when I go to test and that's a good thing.
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    May 04, 2015 2:48 AM GMT
    So now since everyone is such a good condom using Christian. What will happen when they find the cure for hiv/aids. Bareback parties raise with 500%?
  • Svnw688

    Posts: 3350

    May 04, 2015 3:11 AM GMT
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said
    JudasOfCrossfit saidSo now since everyone is such a good condom using Christian. What will happen when they find the cure for hiv/aids. Bareback parties raise with 500%?


    That number is somewhat inaccurate.

    The correct percentage is 567.98888%.

    When it comes to percentages and whorish exploits we must be precise.


    Lol icon_lol.gif
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    May 04, 2015 6:15 PM GMT
    Svnw688 saidCondoms are not a panacea.

    But condoms are great at reducing the risk for HIV and MANY OTHER STI/STDs.

    Wrap it up.


    But why not do both? If people are so worried about it, the extra protection of PrEP can not be denied. If, as the author states, condoms only have a 70% reduction in HIV...that's a big hole to entrust in condoms alone. It's not "so great".

    I wonder how many of the newly infected 50,000 every year entrusted condoms?

    If gay men who were Negative were serious about staying that way, I don't understand why they are not ON PrEP.
  • Svnw688

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    May 04, 2015 6:20 PM GMT
    ^^I agree, both Condoms AND PrEP are best. But PrEP does not protect against Hepatitis, gonorrhea, syphillus, HPV/warts, and other STI/STDs.

    Both are necessary, and both are best.
  • SilverRRCloud

    Posts: 871

    May 04, 2015 6:53 PM GMT
    Ultimately, each and everyone has to make a decision for themselves.

    I have started using condoms at the very onset of my sex life as a prevention against the Hep C. Little did I know that while trying to fend off a minor evil, I was actually saving myself from a greater one.

    Very few of the guys I have hooked up so far, gave up on having sex with me because I insisted on using a condom. I can live with their decisions, and wish them all the best anyway.

    I am not a medical professional, and cannot offer any qualified opinion on Truvada. I can imagine that a few guys will start feeling invincible just because of its efficiency.

    I will stick to my condoms, though. The inconvenience of arranging for medical exams, treatment, docs., etc., is simply not worth the trouble in my books.

    SC
  • Svnw688

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    May 04, 2015 7:13 PM GMT
    ^^Not to mention that, just like HIV was "new" at one point, so too could another disease that's a common household name in 10 years, be "new" and emerging now.

    Do we seriously think that "HIV" or a disease like it can only strike once? That we've reached the end game of "new" STD/STIs? We'd better get our head out of our rears and WRAP IT UP!
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    May 04, 2015 8:57 PM GMT
    MuchMoreThanMuscle said
    JudasOfCrossfit saidSo now since everyone is such a good condom using Christian. What will happen when they find the cure for hiv/aids. Bareback parties raise with 500%?


    That number is somewhat inaccurate.

    The correct percentage is 567.98888%.

    When it comes to percentages and whorish exploits we must be precise.


    Hmmm... judging that number professor Muscle I Think you forgot to add the eager bisexuals to your calculation
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    May 05, 2015 12:14 AM GMT
    Svnw688 said^^Not to mention that, just like HIV was "new" at one point, so too could another disease that's a common household name in 10 years, be "new" and emerging now.

    Do we seriously think that "HIV" or a disease like it can only strike once? That we've reached the end game of "new" STD/STIs? We'd better get our head out of our rears and WRAP IT UP!


    Sex has been an important part of human relations ....I'd guess since day 1 obviously.

    How do we know the next one won't be air born? Or by a simply touching? And all of mankind will be killed off?


    Syphilis used to kill.

    Gonorrhea used to kill.

    Kings and Dictators, and the average man, forgo condoms regardless of the potential disease. Are we to expect Gay men to do any different?

    [url]
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1233310/Syphilis-scourge-kings-dictators-old-surging-back.html[/url]

    As much as I think condoms were a good solution in the 80s and 90s in the early AIDS days (as I did use safe sex when I tested POZ). It was the ONLY solution at the time. As the author pointed out it was not sustainable on a societally/broad based level. Many of the "100%" group became positive.

    Condoms alone would not prevent syphilis or gonorrhea. It may for an individual, on a one term basis. Syphilis was 10-15% of the general US population in 1920 before penicillin.
    http://www.uri.edu/artsci/com/swift/HPR319UDD/Syphilis.html

    Drugs eradicate infectious diseases, not condoms. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eradication_of_infectious_diseases

    I will go one step further and say that only using condoms is selfish
    . It may be good for you
    if you can sustain it, and that is even questionable for many. But it does nothing for the rest of society.

    We are at a crossroads NOW to effectively eliminate HIV in this country. Arguing against medical treatment (ART, PrEP) is akin to arguing against penicillin or the polio vaccine.