Somebody I know is having problems with what Paul thought Jesus was versus what the disciples thought Jesus was.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 08, 2015 4:31 AM GMT
    Somebody

    This is bugging me. Paul clearly thinks Jesus was the son of God and Lord(what exactly does Paul believe? His Christology is confusing) who pre existed in some sense but the disciples were with Christ the whole time and didn't believe he was God (which makes sense because if he did go around saying he was God during his lifetime the least that would happen is Jesus+disciples get stoned to death by the Jews and story over.)

    So how on earth did that interaction between Paul and disciples go down? Did the disciples he met worship Christ by this time (which is weird...because they were never told to worship Jesus..)??

    If James and Peter worshiped Christ by the time Paul met them then doesn't this mean pretty much every single Christian without exception worshipped Christ at this early period? How on earth did Ebionites exist afterwards? Why would there be later disagreement in Cristology if the very leaders of the Christian movement after Christ soon worshipped him?

    If James and Peter didn't worship Christ by the time they met Paul then the story gets strange...REALLY strange....because then the biggest thing they would disagree about and the only point of disagreement we would know about is Paul vs. Disciples: Who is Jesus? Not a discussion on the law or salvation but the biggest issue of all....is there any record of a discussion between Paul and the disciples as to the nature of Christ?

    Part of me thinks the answer may be to obvious to be asked but I don't feel like I will find it just reading and not talking to anyone because I am clearly missing something!!! Somebody help me.....I think my next question is WHEN did Jesus worship begin....

    Thank you for your help. This curiosity is burning me on the inside and I have know.


    = = =

    Steefen thinking through somebody's question

    Somebody

    Paul thinks Jesus was the son of God.
    The disciples were with Christ the whole time and didn't believe he was God.

    Steefen

    The way you are setting up your argument does not produce a discrepancy.

    You need to state and quote scripture where Paul thinks Jesus is God. Pre-existence does not mean God. There are plenty of reincarnated human beings who pre-existed. That does not make them God. That makes them old souls.

    What I see follows.

    Paul thinks Jesus was the son of God. (So you say, please quote scripture.)

    Did the disciples think he was the son of God? (I ask to test alignment or discrepancy.)
    Matthew 16:16, Peter says Jesus is the Christ, the son of the Living God.

    So far we do not have a discrepancy.

    Next, did Jesus teach his disciples publicly or secretly that he pre-existed? Obviously if it were secretly, we would not know; but, without explicitly knowing the secrets (there are secret gospels, is it there) is there an implicit argument that can be made?
  • AMoonHawk

    Posts: 11406

    Jun 08, 2015 5:56 AM GMT
    "And Jesus went out, and his disciples, into the towns of Caesarea Philippi. And in the way, he asked his disciples, saying to them: Whom do men say that I am? Who answered him, saying: John the Baptist; but some Elias, and others as one of the prophets. Then he saith to them: But whom do you say that I am? Peter answering said to him: Thou art the Christ. And he strictly charged them that they should not tell any man of him."

    The answer is; why were (and still are) the Jews waiting for the Christ and who is this Christ to them?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 08, 2015 12:35 PM GMT
    Somebody

    So,Paul believes Jesus is the son of God in the way Jews used the term? Like the non divine sense but just to express some sort of close relationship?

    Steefen

    How is Peter’s declaration (Jesus is Christ, son of the Living God) different from all of what Paul is saying?

    Here is a good list of what Paul said about Jesus Christ. The person who wrote it is asking what Paul meant, also.

    http://www.answering-islam.org/authors/shamoun/moreproof_paulinechristology.html