Asia is about to topple North America as world’s richest region

  • metta

    Posts: 39099

    Jun 16, 2015 1:05 AM GMT
    Asia is about to topple North America as world’s richest region


    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/story?guid=3a20eb34-1377-11e5-bb38-92d8ae503437&storyguid=3a20eb34-1377-11e5-bb38-92d8ae503437&siteid=nwhpf
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 1:17 AM GMT
    Only because we give them all our money for tech products. icon_wink.gif
  • metta

    Posts: 39099

    Jun 16, 2015 1:29 AM GMT
    ^
    Countries like China are investing tons of money into infrastructure, technology, etc. while we keep cutting back. It is only a matter of time. While China is building things like mass transit around the entire country, we are barely maintaining the old systems we have. Look at Amtrak vs. the train systems being built in many countries around the World.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 1:42 AM GMT
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 6:21 PM GMT
    Not shocking, since they steal valuable information from major US corporations by the hour. The Chinese government has 10,000 hackers employed for this sole reason.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 6:44 PM GMT
    I remember when liberals were outraged in the 1980's because American athletic shoe makers were paying Asians workers $1.00 per day. I remember thinking that with billions working that would soon add up to create a booming economy. Had the Marxist won the argument China would still be poor like Africa.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 7:10 PM GMT
    Silly liberals, worrying about worker exploitation. Much easier to be a conservative without a conscience.

    Anyway, China has moved on from shoe making and has become a victim of its own success. There are not enough qualified workers to go around, causing rampant poaching and extremely fast wage inflation. China is definitely not the cheapest place to produce any more.

    China also has other risks, particularly a lack of protection for intellectual property rights. Stories abound of foreign investors in China finding local companies churning out identical goods to their own, but under a different brand. For that reason a number of companies have instead set up shop elsewhere, where intellectual property laws are tighter. Often these products are capital-intensive, so labour costs are less important than strong intellectual property laws.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 7:21 PM GMT
    An intentionally misleading headline that doesn't account for geo-political realities.

    Not all Asians are allies of one another. "Asia" does not form the same sort of cultural-economic block that the US, Canada, Western Europe, and Australia does. "Asia" does not all descend from a common cultural heritage, whereas the aforementioned all share a Latin Christianity and Enlightenment heritage that binds the one to the others. Japan, Korea, and Taiwan are more capitalist countries and are our allies and share our same geo-political goals. India and China are not allies and in fact seem to share similar ambitions that will inevitably hinder both from accomplishing these same ends.

    All this to say that the fact proposed is not meaningful. One cannot sever America and Canada from their allies across the Atlantic and Pacific, and one cannot bind India and China, Japan and Afghanistan together. The only reason Metta and other liberals propogate and latch onto headlines like these is that it allows them to follow up with an immediate, "Oh look at how the Chinese pour national tax money into all of this infrastructure, education, technology, and medicine. We need to become more like them so that we don't get overtaken by them." The Right uses nonsensical "Asia" facts like these too, except usually to the end of increased military spending.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 8:56 PM GMT
    The Chinese Real Estate Bubble as reported by Liberals at CBS:

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2015 8:56 PM GMT
    The Chinese Real Estate Bubble as reported by Liberals at CBS:

  • Apparition

    Posts: 3521

    Jun 17, 2015 12:04 AM GMT
    I have always looked at it like this, there is money and tech, and then there is DEPTH of that money and tech. For instance, china has a whole lot of nice factories much nicer than ours, with robots and such, and dollar for dollar, they will have more now or soon, so on the surface they look like they are surpassing everyone, you check off all the boxes, and get more or better tech, more billionaires, but there is a second column that they are scoring almost ZERO in.

    That is the "depth" issue.

    Their tech may be the latest and greatest, but there really are no "custodians" of the tech. For instance, in WWII they found hot air balloons from japan with bombs on them crash landed on the west coast of N. America. Now if that happened the other way around, say balloons crashed in Beijing from N. America, they would see the English on the writing and think..oh, americans did that. Whereas, in the original case, the Westerners, just didnt see japanese writing and say OHH japanese, sheesh, that was close, NO, they grabbed the sand bags and sent them to a "Custodian of Tech", in this case Some old british guy. We will call him NIGEL. Nigel took the sand put it on a slide looked at it in a microscope, and said...oh yes...nice pink sand, carborundum, tokoyite, and nitrobium...now let me think...oh yes...(walks over to some victorian cabinet with a thousand drawers)...THIS IS IT. The balloons came from THIS ONE MILE STRETCH at coordinates 120.987987W 37.98797N and then the westerners BOMBED the launch site. The Asians have no CONCEPT of this kind of depth in their science, nor the people with the knowledge or capability, or sheer COLLECTION mass, that the west has, that has even BEGUN to be mined yet, and they never will. Just britain alone, has science and measurement data, on every damn country in the world on some dust shelves. Every animal, every artifact, every language, every weather station data, going back 500 years. This is invaluable data the East will never possess, because yes they have the money to do the recent stuff, but there is no possible way to replicate 500 years of science, EVER.

    Further, asian is one hell of a MONOCULTURE, as far most individual countries goes. The west has done ALL of the heavy lifting as far as that goes, taking in refugees, etc, as that is the responsibility of the rich countries. Sure china has a lot of new billionaires, but they have almost no concept of social friction, and especially with immigrants. Imagine Tokyo being burdened with say 20million muslim refugees in the next decade, or beijing trying to educate 50 million non-chinese immigrants who have no concept of Confuscian methods, and are rebellious. The costs of EVERYTHING they do would skyrocket. Add to that, China's politcal system is juvenile, and the hope of china not breaking into several dozen pieces, as they accumulate say 10 or 20 times the wealth of american in the next century, are zero. Add to that the environmental disaster that most of Asia is, you have a recipe for war, death, and destruction, and htey wealth will instantly flee at the first sign of trouble. This trouble is inevitable. It is even more likely with the possibility of AI and automation. Suddenly the billion plus workers are completely useless and a few hundred rich people own everything and a billion have zero, and no hope of change, since there is nothing left to do. Let them eat cake, ring a bell. Let the slaughter begin.

    There is also the sexual revolution to be had....


    Japan is toast as everyone is a senior citizen.

    China is not far behind but with sheer numbers, there are lots to take their place, but the future there in the long term is BLEAK, even though the next two generations will be ok for now. Quantum encryption will be massively bad for the government there as the public is suddenly able to have free expression and all the bribes and corruption will be laid bare, in a way that will make washington look like a lemonaid stand.

    Another problem, is one that is peculiar to Asia, is that they have absolutely no sense of LETTING THINGS GO, history wise. Every slight is remembered, and is grounds for revenge until the umpteen generation. The western countries have been competing so long that they are like old drinking buddies recounting their wars like recounting good farts, like WWII was just a frat party that got out of hand, or old HENRY that fat bastard taking over Paris...good times..chug chug. China has no "friends". They are completely surrounded by people who, like one with "little man syndrome" can have, they absolutely want revenge on. China has been the laughingstock of the world for millenia, and they are out to prove themselves, now that the situation is right. They will never forgive japan for NANJING, india is a mortal enemy forever, russia is like one of those belligerent drunks that live next door that they need to keep a few other countries at bay, and southeast asia would cut their throats and take their wallets given the chance economically, and their relationship with AUSTRALIA is like that of an ugly hooker and an even uglier John. One has some money and the other the goods an neither want to actually TOUCH each other because of all the VD so to speak. Every negotiation with china is along the lines of "YOU SHOULDNT DO THAT we may not trade with you...see how rich we are sort of" they have no concept of soft power, and actually nothing of value to offer other countries except "hey we cheaper shiny toys" notice how you havent seen the latest rock band from Beijing, or that cool SCI FI movie burning up the charts, or the new translation of that cool romance out of ChenZen. Chinese culture is a one trick pony of martial arts emperor historical fantasy fight movie. Which is truly appalling since with all those people there should have been "THOUSANDS" of breakthroughs by now.

    Asia has a lot of growing up to do, and I dont think it will happen in our lifetimes.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2015 4:05 AM GMT
    metta8 said^
    Countries like China are investing tons of money into infrastructure, technology, etc. while we keep cutting back. It is only a matter of time. While China is building things like mass transit around the entire country, we are barely maintaining the old systems we have. Look at Amtrak vs. the train systems being built in many countries around the World.


    Interesting. Maybe that's why a lot of people I work with are Chinese and decided to move to the US. It's just that wonderful there.

    It would also be best to understand that many people in the US can afford a car. A large country like the US cannot realistically have a good train system when everyone chooses to drive.
  • jjguy05

    Posts: 459

    Jun 17, 2015 5:11 AM GMT
    Alpha13 saidI remember when liberals were outraged in the 1980's because American athletic shoe makers were paying Asians workers $1.00 per day. I remember thinking that with billions working that would soon add up to create a booming economy. Had the Marxist won the argument China would still be poor like Africa.


    1. China still ranks pretty low in per capita GDP

    2. "Liberals" were "outraged" in the 80s because China's lower cost of living made it impossible for American workers to compete under tariff-free trade deals.

    3. Workers in Chinese factories work in very difficult conditions that would resemble the US 100 years ago. Unless you'd be okay to work in that sort of environment, don't celebrate it when others have to do so.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2015 5:49 AM GMT
    Apparition saidI have always looked at it like this

    ...

    Asia has a lot of growing up to do, and I dont think it will happen in our lifetimes.


    I don't necessarily agree with everything you say, but this is a FANTASTIC rant! icon_biggrin.gif
  • selim

    Posts: 158

    Jun 17, 2015 10:16 AM GMT
    no, not yet!
    there´s still long way to go!icon_lol.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2015 6:40 AM GMT
    Alpha13 saidI remember when liberals were outraged in the 1980's because American athletic shoe makers were paying Asians workers $1.00 per day. I remember thinking that with billions working that would soon add up to create a booming economy. Had the Marxist won the argument China would still be poor like Africa.


    Huh? Per capita- China is poor.


  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2015 6:44 AM GMT
    ant811 saidNot shocking, since they steal valuable information from major US corporations by the hour. The Chinese government has 10,000 hackers employed for this sole reason.


    A tradition started during the Clinton administration:
    http://www.nytimes.com/1998/05/25/opinion/essay-the-china-connection.html
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2015 6:49 AM GMT
    I've been reading up on this back and forth. It's only a matter of time before Asia take over as the richest region in the world. Not really surprising. If you think about it, it makes sense. Japan, S. Korea, Singapore, Hong Kong are all pretty first-world, most of these countries are rich, have something going for them. They dominate in techs, cars, movies, electronics,...etc. Now with the Chinese open market economy encouraging investors/companies from the US and Europe, China's getting stronger and richer every day. Look at cities like Shanghai, Beijing, X'ian, Nanjing. And most US companies outsource their production to China. Like when was the last time you see an I-phone or a lap-top made in the US??. And Vietnam's also coming on strong with their economy, it's one of the 10 new economies emerging to watch. Even though some of these countries are *communist, they embrace the free-trade capitalist ideals. They just don't want their citizens to butt in and tell the government how to do their job. If you really think about it, N. Korea, Laos and Cambodia are still pretty poor. So it's like all these other Asian countries vs. Canada/US and is Mexico rich?? lol

    (and oh yeah 4 of the world's top 10 most expensive cities are in Asia, Tokyo, Osaka, Singapore and Hong Kong, I believe. Beijing and Shanghai are like 22, 28, narrowly losing out to NYC and Los Angeles in some of the rankings. And yes, China steals some of our/US patent company secrets/trademark. Like you can get a fake Chinese made-Fendi Gucci bag for $100 instead of $1000). Lol

    (And this is a very random info, I saw on an interview, Mark Zuckerberg from Facebook in Palo Alto hired 20 new Chinese grad students fron X'ian University every year?? they start their internship and get paid a good hefty salary! Lol, like why can't Zuckerberg hire US citizens here or his own people? His reason being, he loves the Chinese culture and his wife is Chinese-American. lol)
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2015 2:37 PM GMT
    No surprise
  • ASHDOD

    Posts: 1057

    Jun 19, 2015 10:23 AM GMT
    not per capita,and that matters much more.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 19, 2015 1:28 PM GMT
    LAXWill10 said They just don't want their citizens to butt in and tell the government how to do their job.


    Oh... like that Tiananmen Square thingy in 1989? How inconvenient... Yup a worker's paradise.

  • metta

    Posts: 39099

    Jun 21, 2015 5:05 PM GMT
    Ecuador To Sell A Third Of Its Amazon Rainforest To Chinese Oil Companies


    http://www.businessinsider.com.au/ecuador-selling-its-rainforest-to-china-2013-3
  • sinfakos

    Posts: 43

    Jun 22, 2015 3:38 AM GMT
    metta8 said^
    Countries like China are investing tons of money into infrastructure, technology, etc. while we keep cutting back. It is only a matter of time. While China is building things like mass transit around the entire country, we are barely maintaining the old systems we have. Look at Amtrak vs. the train systems being built in many countries around the World.


    Good point. It was over half a century ago that Japan first rolled out the bullet train. And where are we now with rapid transit?
  • sinfakos

    Posts: 43

    Jun 22, 2015 3:39 AM GMT
    metta8 saidEcuador To Sell A Third Of Its Amazon Rainforest To Chinese Oil Companies


    http://www.businessinsider.com.au/ecuador-selling-its-rainforest-to-china-2013-3


    A very bad move on the part of Ecuador
  • sinfakos

    Posts: 43

    Jun 22, 2015 3:47 AM GMT
    desertmuscl said
    metta8 said^
    Countries like China are investing tons of money into infrastructure, technology, etc. while we keep cutting back. It is only a matter of time. While China is building things like mass transit around the entire country, we are barely maintaining the old systems we have. Look at Amtrak vs. the train systems being built in many countries around the World.


    Interesting. Maybe that's why a lot of people I work with are Chinese and decided to move to the US. It's just that wonderful there.

    It would also be best to understand that many people in the US can afford a car. A large country like the US cannot realistically have a good train system when everyone chooses to drive.


    Chinese people escape China if they can because they can't breathe, it's so polluted.

    We would be well-advised to develop a good transit system, too, & stop driving so much.

    I'm not that impressed with China's behavior, since they're buying up cars, using too much coal, vastly increasing their consumption of meat, building like maniacs, & damming & polluting all the major rivers, killing virtually everything in them. But they are doing some things better than the US, like building a great rapid transit system, & investing more in solar panels (except they're not very effective under skies blackened by pollution)