Retired priest: ‘Hell’ was invented by the church to control people with fear

  • metta

    Posts: 39134

    Jul 03, 2015 5:40 AM GMT
    Retired priest: ‘Hell’ was invented by the church to control people with fear





    http://deadstate.org/retired-priest-hell-was-invented-by-the-church-to-control-people-with-fear/
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Jul 03, 2015 6:57 AM GMT
    Holy shit, this is even bigger than the Snowden Revelations. We're immortal and we can't be punished??? Mwahahaha!!!icon_lol.gificon_twisted.gif
  • AMoonHawk

    Posts: 11406

    Jul 03, 2015 7:09 AM GMT
    The Mind In Its Own Place And In Itself Can Make A Heaven Of Hell And A Hell Of Heaven. --John Milton
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    Jul 03, 2015 7:28 AM GMT
    I have to watch the following video later:

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    Jul 03, 2015 7:31 AM GMT
    metta8 saidRetired priest: ‘Hell’ was invented by the church to control people with fear





    http://deadstate.org/retired-priest-hell-was-invented-by-the-church-to-control-people-with-fear/


    Someone needs to read Journey of the Souls by Michael Newton. Something does happen to really bad people.

    Second, "as above, so below": hell is experienced in the place of the spirits connected to human incarnations.
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    Jul 03, 2015 2:52 PM GMT
    I like how he says God is not a parent figure that is somewhere up in the sky but He emerges through human consciousness. Yes, I agree Father. He is a product of your imagination. He is man made.

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    Jul 03, 2015 3:05 PM GMT
    I enjoyed this. Something will need to replace our collective dependency on the thousands of years of mythology we've constructed. Not sure what that will be, but I hope it's more productive than the oppressive, draconian, fear-based system we've espoused for millennia.

    Nevertheless, when I consider that the overwhelming majority of mankind's greatest artistic and intellectual triumphs have been in the service of religion, I worry a little about what will drive impassioned dedication to greatness. If we're not driven to make beautiful things in the name of God, what will compel us? I guess we gave that up a long time ago, though. Not much art or design is being produced in service to God these days, unless you count this:

    jesus_football.jpg

    The interviewer is one of the more entertaining aspects of this. I can't tell whether his dumbfounded facial expressions and idiotic questions, stated with raised eyebrows and perplexity rivaling a four-year-old ("But wait a minute. You’re saying that Hell, the idea of a place under the earth or somewhere you’re tormented for an eternity – is actually an invention of the church?") are a foil for the good father or the true thoughts of a middle aged child.
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    Jul 03, 2015 3:28 PM GMT
    Corriamo saidNevertheless, when I consider that the overwhelming majority of mankind's greatest artistic and intellectual triumphs have been in the service of religion, I worry a little about what will drive impassioned dedication to greatness. If we're not driven to make beautiful things in the name of God, what will compel us?


    I can't know for certain whether you're saying what I see you've typed--but if you're talking about, as an example, artists from the Renaissance (Michelangelo, Raphael, and the other ninja turtles), then I'll point out: artists need to be paid. Money is required. And who, particularly in the time of the Renaissance, had the big money? Usually it was the Church.

    I'd ask instead: can you even imagine what kind of beautiful art we might have in our museums today, if it were not the religious stories artists had painted in their day; rather they had created art focused on other subjects from life, and their imagination? We will never know, but there is nothing saying it wouldn't have been even more beautiful than the imagery we see today, from that time period.
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    Jul 03, 2015 4:21 PM GMT
    Like that's a news flash.. haha..
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    Jul 03, 2015 5:00 PM GMT
    This explains the republican, its right wing party and cabal, control by fear. They are not called the evil empire for nothing you know. Extreme abuse of power is an understatement. I know some of you may not understand this illustration, but that is their secret and always has been



    What they are, Fear

    Emperor_RotJ.png



    What they use, Control

    bigeye.jpg



    What we need, Protection

    anderson_raphael.jpg




  • AMoonHawk

    Posts: 11406

    Jul 03, 2015 5:13 PM GMT
    it's call the abyss for a reason
  • LJay

    Posts: 11612

    Jul 03, 2015 6:59 PM GMT
    Jack Spong, the speaker, has been rattling cages for decades. He is a very bright and thoughtful guy who is very good at making people think. Look up John Shelby Spong if you like. He is a delightful antidote to the fundamentalist crap we so often see quoted here as "religion."
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    Jul 03, 2015 7:11 PM GMT
    Kodiak said
    Corriamo saidNevertheless, when I consider that the overwhelming majority of mankind's greatest artistic and intellectual triumphs have been in the service of religion, I worry a little about what will drive impassioned dedication to greatness. If we're not driven to make beautiful things in the name of God, what will compel us?


    I can't know for certain whether you're saying what I see you've typed--but if you're talking about, as an example, artists from the Renaissance (Michelangelo, Raphael, and the other ninja turtles), then I'll point out: artists need to be paid. Money is required. And who, particularly in the time of the Renaissance, had the big money? Usually it was the Church.

    I'd ask instead: can you even imagine what kind of beautiful art we might have in our museums today, if it were not the religious stories artists had painted in their day; rather they had created art focused on other subjects from life, and their imagination? We will never know, but there is nothing saying it wouldn't have been even more beautiful than the imagery we see today, from that time period.


    In music, Bach's art from religion is excellent.
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    Jul 03, 2015 7:18 PM GMT
    And the carry over from Bach's core into his secular music is great music as well. I am going to retract carry over and just say one cannot take away Bach's religious talent from his secular talent.



    And the Mozart of the C-Mass is the Mozart of Don Giovanni.
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    Jul 03, 2015 9:28 PM GMT
    StephenOABC saidSomeone needs to read Journey of the Souls by Michael Newton. Something does happen to really bad people.



    Really? I guess Michael Newton experienced it firsthand? He's the real deal, not like some of those other frauds?



    StephenOABC saidSecond, "as above, so below": hell is experienced in the place of the spirits connected to human incarnations.



    Right. We must continually believe things that have no evidence, witnesses or (godly) purpose.
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    Jul 03, 2015 9:46 PM GMT
    John Spong----retired Episcopal Bishop of Newark(NJ), pioneer in gay rights and life long Episcopalian, a church where you do not have to park your brain at the door! Same church that can boast of having the first out gay bishop in history, Gene Robinson.
  • LJay

    Posts: 11612

    Jul 04, 2015 12:09 AM GMT
    Good point about Bach and religion, Stephen. Bach is reputed to have defined music as "the glory of God and pleasant recreation."
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2605

    Jul 04, 2015 12:43 AM GMT
    I notice the priest is retired. It`d be more interesting to have a serving one say the same thing in public.
    It`s not a great revelation to say oppressive regimes, religious or secular, need some kind of bogeyman figure to corral the faithful and keep them in line.
    Much of what the man says sounds like generalized spirituality. In some ways he sounds more like a mystic than a priest; emphasising the non-human and unimaginable nature of god.
    I liked his line about Church firing its furnaces hotter than anyone else.
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    Jul 04, 2015 12:55 AM GMT
    I really have to take issue with the idea that our greatest achievements have been inspired by religion. Dennis Prager says this all the time and it drives me insane. Science has progressed DESPITE the influence of religion. It is true that some renaissance art was inspired by faith, but many times that was because of patronage. Very little great music can be tied to religion. This especially true of popular music in the 20th century. The blues, jazz, rock and roll, country cannot in any serious way be tied to faith. And yes Mr. Prager I think those genres produced some truly great art.
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    Jul 04, 2015 1:18 AM GMT
    Very few Episcopal priests have valid ordination.Any Christian who does does not believe in hell is a heretic.Our Lord was very clear in Scripture.This "priest" is 100% wrong!
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2605

    Jul 04, 2015 1:30 AM GMT
    Much great art has been directly or indirectly inspired by religion; even if it`s simply the artist raised and living in a religious/faithful society. This is true in Europe certainly, and I suspect, true in other faiths and cultures.
    Christianity, or more especially the Church, has a complex relationship with science. I think Copernicus, whilst not a priest, did earn a living from the Church in some professional capacity. Newton was a religious man and saw his scientific work as secondary to his religious studies.
    But I think with recent times more scientists are atheists or unconventionally religious/spiritual. Darwin was the former, Einstein the latter.
  • FRE0

    Posts: 4865

    Jul 04, 2015 1:42 AM GMT
    metta8 saidRetired priest: ‘Hell’ was invented by the church to control people with fear





    http://deadstate.org/retired-priest-hell-was-invented-by-the-church-to-control-people-with-fear/


    There are many Christians who don't believe in hell and who also do not believe in a literal devil. Christianity has never been monolithic.
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    Jul 04, 2015 1:45 AM GMT
    WickedRyan saidVery few Episcopal priests have valid ordination.Any Christian who does does not believe in hell is a heretic.Our Lord was very clear in Scripture.This "priest" is 100% wrong!


    Yeah I spotted that as well. So was Jesus wrong or is the Bible not accurate? Either choice is devastating for Christianity.

    Of course then at one point he says "God isn't Jewish, or Christian, or Muslim, etc." What a dbag.I really can't stand liberal theologians. They just make up whatever God they want to make up and think they're being sophisticated. At least the fundamentalists are serious about their faith.
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    Jul 04, 2015 3:59 AM GMT
    LJay saidGood point about Bach and religion, Stephen. Bach is reputed to have defined music as "the glory of God and pleasant recreation."


    Thank you.
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    Jul 04, 2015 4:10 AM GMT
    donj499 saidVery little great music can be tied to religion.


    I have to block your profile and ignore all your posts.

    I'm a former sacred music tenor. I'm not going to ask myself to fight this battle. If you don't see it, you don't. If you haven't heard it, you haven't heard it.