Proposal to split California into six states will appear on 2016 ballot

  • metta

    Posts: 39165

    Jul 14, 2015 12:16 AM GMT
    Proposal to split California into six states will appear on 2016 ballot

    http://boingboing.net/2014/07/15/proposal-to-split-california-i.html


    http://www.sixcalifornias.com/

    http://www.fixcal.org/


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  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jul 14, 2015 12:25 AM GMT
    I'd laugh my ass off if I wasn't so horrified...

    ...the news articles are dated July 14-15 of last year...

    So bizarre...
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    Jul 14, 2015 12:30 AM GMT
    Proponents say the division would ... solve the state’s water issues


    /facepalm
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jul 14, 2015 2:15 PM GMT
    That is too many divisions but LA with its huge population has been calling the shots for the north for far too long. Imagine New York ruling South Carolina. It would function better as two or three states. The north and south and the third being the southern Central Valley.
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    Jul 14, 2015 2:25 PM GMT
    And 'we' could pick up a net gain of two republican seats in the senate depending how #2 goes. That possibility is enough to make most of RJ take a 'number 2'.
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    Jul 14, 2015 4:22 PM GMT
    https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articleiv
    ...no new states shall be formed or erected within the jurisdiction of any other state; nor any state be formed by the junction of two or more states, or parts of states, without the consent of the legislatures of the states concerned as well as of the Congress.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Californias#Analysis
    The political makeup in Washington D. C. at the time of approval, may determine the success or failure of six California's. Twelve Senators would result from six Californias, as well as a probable change in total house House seats and their electoral votes. According to Amar, expects that, "we could expect four [Senators] (from Silicon Valley and West California) to consistently be Democrats, and four (from Jefferson and Central California) to lean Republican, with the other four (from Northern California and South California) harder to predict".
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    Jul 14, 2015 4:54 PM GMT
    theantijock saidhttps://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articleiv
    ...no new states shall be formed or erected within the jurisdiction of any other state; nor any state be formed by the junction of two or more states, or parts of states, without the consent of the legislatures of the states concerned as well as of the Congress.


    Thank you, Hidden. I guess this little fact escaped the bold and innovative worldview of this Silicon valley huckster.
    OTOH, what really needs to be split into at least two is the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals.
  • FRE0

    Posts: 4865

    Jul 14, 2015 4:58 PM GMT
    Surely few would expect the proposal to go any place. There have also been proposals to divide Texas.
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    Jul 14, 2015 5:08 PM GMT
    MGINSD said
    theantijock saidhttps://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articleiv
    ...no new states shall be formed or erected within the jurisdiction of any other state; nor any state be formed by the junction of two or more states, or parts of states, without the consent of the legislatures of the states concerned as well as of the Congress.


    Thank you, Hidden. I guess this little fact escaped the bold and innovative worldview of this Silicon valley huckster.
    OTOH, what really needs to be split into at least two is the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals.


    I had gotten distracted while posting. Added to it.

    What came to my mind is that Puerto Rico hasn't even gotten in yet. Key West tried succeeding. So it seemed to me not simply something Californians get to vote on so I thought I'd look that up.
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    Jul 14, 2015 6:33 PM GMT
    This is about as serious as the plan to create Cascadia out of BC, Washington and Oregon.

    Just think of all the song references to California that would no longer apply.
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    Jul 14, 2015 7:00 PM GMT
    If this happens, I could see the whole political landscape changing and what a mess this would be.
  • Hypertrophile

    Posts: 1021

    Jul 14, 2015 7:57 PM GMT
    I think we need fewer states, not more. We already look at US economics in terms of regions. Several states in each region could combine resources to make one large state. Industries could be moved as needed to give each of the new larger states a solid economic base that doesn't compete with other states.
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    Jul 15, 2015 1:12 AM GMT
    FRE0 saidSurely few would expect the proposal to go any place. There have also been proposals to divide Texas.


    Dividing Texas is a completely separate issue, as I recall. When Texas entered the Union, one of the provisos of its entry was its option to divide itself into as many as five states. Exactly where this is located in the requisite legal document(s), I do not know nor do I care enough to research it. Perhaps someone else recalls the details of the entry of Texas into the Union.

    The proposal to divide California into six states is ludicrous on its face. There is a very emotionally satisfying idea to divide the state into its existing de facto emotional divide, namely Southern California (south of the Tehachapis) and Northern California (everything north of the Tehachapi Mountains). If there were some way to let the resulting Northern California to keep its water and restore the "stolen" water (see the movie "Chinatown") to the once lovely Owens Valley, then the two states would be great. However, then California would not be California any more!
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Jul 15, 2015 5:52 AM GMT
    Sulla said
    Dividing Texas is a completely separate issue, as I recall. When Texas entered the Union, one of the provisos of its entry was its option to divide itself into as many as five states. Exactly where this is located in the requisite legal document(s), I do not know nor do I care enough to research it. Perhaps someone else recalls the details of the entry of Texas into the Union.


    The "proviso" is not granted by the United States and is not legally binding. It's made up language by the Texas state constitution, which is not the authority on its statehood entry.
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    Jul 15, 2015 12:15 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    What came to my mind is that Puerto Rico hasn't even gotten in yet. Key West tried succeeding [sic]. So it seemed to me not simply something Californians get to vote on so I thought I'd look that up.

    No, the Key West creation of the Conch Republic (Konk) was symbolic, to protest the Reagan Administration's blocking the only road to the Keys, to conduct vehicle searches for drugs & illegals. Thereby seriously damaging the tourist trade on which the Keys depend. The roadblock was subsequently removed. Key West has continued the practice as a tourist gimmick to illustrate its remoteness & uniqueness, and other Keys have joined a loose confederation with them.

    In the 1990s the Conch Republic even declared "war" on the US, promptly surrendered after 1 minute, and then asked for $1 billion in reparations. Similar to the plot in the Peter Sellers comedy movie The Mouse That Roared. So you see it is largely tongue-in-cheek, although born out of making a political & economic statement.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14380

    Jul 15, 2015 12:44 PM GMT
    Actually California is more than just a US state, it is truly a binational region shared by the U.S. and Mexico. In the US, we have the present state of California which was originally Alta California during Spanish colonial times. In Mexico, they have Baja California which is split into two sovereign states, Baja California del Norte and Baja California del Sul. Please excuse me if I get the official Spanish spellings wrong. So even if this inane proposal to split up the old Alta California from the one sovereign state of California into six separate sovereign states, it still does not change the fact that no matter how you dice it, slice it, and divide it up, California is still a binational region and that will never change.
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    Jul 15, 2015 1:24 PM GMT
    Wyndahoi saidThis is about as serious as the plan to create Cascadia out of BC, Washington and Oregon.

    Just think of all the song references to California that would no longer apply.


    You'd make John Mayall not very relevant anymore

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    Jul 15, 2015 2:54 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    theantijock said
    What came to my mind is that Puerto Rico hasn't even gotten in yet. Key West tried succeeding [sic]. So it seemed to me not simply something Californians get to vote on so I thought I'd look that up.

    No, the Key West creation of the Conch Republic (Konk) was symbolic, to protest the Reagan Administration's blocking the only road to the Keys, to conduct vehicle searches for drugs & illegals. Thereby seriously damaging the tourist trade on which the Keys depend. The roadblock was subsequently removed. Key West has continued the practice as a tourist gimmick to illustrate its remoteness & uniqueness, and other Keys have joined a loose confederation with them.

    In the 1990s the Conch Republic even declared "war" on the US, promptly surrendered after 1 minute, and then asked for $1 billion in reparations. Similar to the plot in the Peter Sellers comedy movie The Mouse That Roared. So you see it is largely tongue-in-cheek, although born out of making a political & economic statement.


    Oh, so they were just kidding! They didn't really think they'd get away with it? Well, no shit, Sherlock. And you felt you had to sic instead of just correcting a spelling? Way to be a petty fuck. Congrats.
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    Jul 15, 2015 3:08 PM GMT
    KyMaverick saidIf this happens, I could see the whole political landscape changing and what a mess this would be.


    What strikes me as the mess would be how this could turn into gerrymandering at a national scale, even as it could correct what might have already become an issue, rural areas being more Republican though less populated while each state gets the same number of Senators.

    We'd see states pulled apart and pieced together and rolled up in to a little ball and stretched out like silly putty depending on who had control of Congress at the time, on which party the change would advantage. So to me it sounds not just messy but dangerous.

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    Besides, no one really wants to bother with redesigning the flag.

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  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14380

    Jul 16, 2015 2:43 AM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    Sulla said
    Dividing Texas is a completely separate issue, as I recall. When Texas entered the Union, one of the provisos of its entry was its option to divide itself into as many as five states. Exactly where this is located in the requisite legal document(s), I do not know nor do I care enough to research it. Perhaps someone else recalls the details of the entry of Texas into the Union.


    The "proviso" is not granted by the United States and is not legally binding. It's made up language by the Texas state constitution, which is not the authority on its statehood entry.
    However most Texans think that their state constitution supercedes the U.S. Constitution and most support the idea of secession from the U.S.

    Probably the biggest mistake the U.S. made was allowing those lowly, scumbag Texans into the union.