'It's Okay to Be Gay, So Long As You're White'

  • metta

    Posts: 39133

    Aug 11, 2015 5:20 PM GMT
    It's Okay to Be Gay, So Long As You're White


    "Are we as a country advancing rights for all minorities equally, or are we just reshaping whiteness?"


    "And while I'm thrilled and joyful about being able to get married anywhere in these United States, I recognize that it's another privilege added to my substantial pile. It's another victory, made within the established system, which makes my life that much easier. It's almost as if I have been made whole once again. It's that one path in life that was closed to me before that now is open. It's the sense that, "I'm just like everyone else now."

    But when I'm honest with myself, "the everyone else" isn't everybody. It's all of those straight white people I know.

    "I can't even talk about Sandra Bland anymore," I said to a black friend recently.

    She responded, "That's your privilege. That's your luxury. You don't have to read about her or think about her or relate to her at all."

    The Mountain of Whiteness, once reclaimed, is an easy and comfortable refuge from the foundational injustice of America.

    But what price do you pay for staying on the Mountain?"

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/adam-kirk-edgerton/its-okay-to-be-gay-as-lon_b_7943240.html



  • AttisXVI

    Posts: 293

    Aug 11, 2015 5:55 PM GMT
    I for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?
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    Aug 11, 2015 6:23 PM GMT
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?
    +1

    The only way to increase skin-color equality is to think of people equally to begin with, and call out those who use racial slurs. As more people do this, it'll eventually work it's way into the social fabric and open the door for more equality.

    However, the best way to keep "white privilege" in place is to pretend to feel "white guilt" and expect sympathy for being white. That's just stupid.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 11, 2015 6:31 PM GMT
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, but you could at least give a damn.
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    Aug 11, 2015 6:41 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?

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    Aug 11, 2015 7:01 PM GMT
    That article seems to only compares white gay men to black gay men. And thank god for keeping the rest of the minorities out of it. Many of us are not interested in such debate or discourse. And I take it that the reason why the author wrote the article is because many people are pissed off that the new Stonewall movie is featuring a white guy as the protagonist.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 11, 2015 7:11 PM GMT
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    Well, take Bernie Sanders. Recently one of his nearly all white democratic rallies was interrupted by activists from the Black Lives Matter movement. Why, you might ask. He's a democrat. He can't be racist.... But he must be tone deaf. If he seriously wants to be the next Obama he should have invited them in the first place and staffed BLM activists in his campaign. Racial equality is LONG overdue, and apathetic white people who don't get it aren't fit to lead such a diverse nation.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 11, 2015 7:15 PM GMT
    Erik101 saidThat article seems to only compares white gay men to black gay men. And thank god for keeping the rest of the minorities out of it. Many of us are not interested in such debate or discourse. And I take it that the reason why the author wrote the article is because many people are pissed off that the new Stonewall movie is featuring a white guy as the protagonist.

    The old Stonewall movie also featured a white protagonist.icon_confused.gif
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    Aug 11, 2015 7:26 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    Erik101 saidThat article seems to only compares white gay men to black gay men. And thank god for keeping the rest of the minorities out of it. Many of us are not interested in such debate or discourse. And I take it that the reason why the author wrote the article is because many people are pissed off that the new Stonewall movie is featuring a white guy as the protagonist.

    The old Stonewall movie also featured a white protagonist.icon_confused.gif


    Then let's think about the reason why people are pissed off at this particular movie:

    1. Transgender awareness is on the rise with the media....check.
    2. The director is openly gay.....check.
    3. The lead character is still white.....check.
    4. Social media is where anyone can vent their frustrations....check!
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    Aug 11, 2015 7:35 PM GMT
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?



    Exactly. Am I supposed to apologize to every person in a wheelchair because I can walk? This whole idea of White Privilege is absolutely retarded.
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    Aug 11, 2015 7:39 PM GMT
    Erik101 saidThat article seems to only compares white gay men to black gay men. And thank god for keeping the rest of the minorities out of it. Many of us are not interested in such debate or discourse. And I take it that the reason why the author wrote the article is because many people are pissed off that the new Stonewall movie is featuring a white guy as the protagonist.


    Well, let's be real for a minute here. Most other minorities don't get caught up in that blame game and just focus their sights ahead and work for what they desire in life. I rarely hear Asians or Hispanics complain about anything. They come over here with just the clothes on their backs and within a couple of years they own their own business.
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    Aug 11, 2015 7:42 PM GMT
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    I was wondering what "giving a damn" was.
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    Aug 11, 2015 7:50 PM GMT
    Some people will get it, and some people won't
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    Aug 11, 2015 7:51 PM GMT
    Great article, thanks for sharing it, Metta 8! By the way, if you scroll down a little more after that article, there are ten cartoons of quotes from famous women titled "10 Reasons Why Feminism Matters". The quotes are quite thought-provoking, insightful and they shed light to the subject of male privilege.

    As of how some readers may interpret this article in terms of trying to induce "white guilt", I do not see it that way at all. What I think the author is saying is that both larger society and the larger LGBT community needs to do a much better job in including LGBT of color (especially black/African American and Latinos) in both social narratives and opportunities. If we dig a little into the history behind Stonewall, we will find that LGBT of color played a crucial part in the spark of the more recent LGBT history.

    It's interesting that some people seem to think that any critique of any social privilege (White/European American,and/or male, and/or middle/upper socio-economic class, and/or "able bodied") as either an attack or "guilt-inducing" gesture on them. Folks, it is about fairness, pure and simple! Why should a woman worry about equal pay and/or promotion because of her gender when I don't have to as a male? Why should a person of darker skin color be worried about being detained or even shot by the police when I as a light complexion person don't have to?

    Being concerned about these issues is not about feeling "guilty" of who you are, it's about doing the right thing and extending both recognition and opportunities to everyone. The last time I checked, our Constitution states that, in theory, everyone is equal under the law. We still have a long way to go to make that a reality. Fortunately, authors like the one from this article reminded us of that even if it may make some of us a little uncomfortable. This is a good thing, because discomfort can and often is a good catalyst for change.
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    Aug 11, 2015 7:54 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    Well, take Bernie Sanders. Recently one of his nearly all white democratic rallies was interrupted by activists from the Black Lives Matter movement. Why, you might ask. He's a democrat. He can't be racist.... But he must be tone deaf. If he seriously wants to be the next Obama he should have invited them in the first place and staffed BLM activists in his campaign. Racial equality is LONG overdue, and apathetic white people who don't get it aren't fit to lead such a diverse nation.

    Gotcha, my next democratic rally I will invite some BLM activists.

    That was easy
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 11, 2015 8:15 PM GMT
    bhp91126 saidHottJoe said
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    Well, take Bernie Sanders. Recently one of his nearly all white democratic rallies was interrupted by activists from the Black Lives Matter movement. Why, you might ask. He's a democrat. He can't be racist.... But he must be tone deaf. If he seriously wants to be the next Obama he should have invited them in the first place and staffed BLM activists in his campaign. Racial equality is LONG overdue, and apathetic white people who don't get it aren't fit to lead such a diverse nation.

    Gotcha, my next democratic rally I will invite some BLM activists.

    That was easy

    It actually is easy and more informative, exciting and forward-thinking to be more inclusive. Less friction, more voters, more support.

    And I'm not just talking about Sanders anymore. The gay community would have more integrity and purpose it we could make the movement be not just inclusive, but have inclusiveness itself be a priority we all share.
  • AttisXVI

    Posts: 293

    Aug 11, 2015 8:15 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, 1. but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    Well, take Bernie Sanders. Recently one of his nearly all white democratic rallies was interrupted by activists from the Black Lives Matter movement. Why, you might ask. 2.) He's a democrat. He can't be racist.... But he must be tone deaf. If he seriously wants to be the next Obama he should have invited them in the first place and staffed 3. BLM activists in his campaign. Racial equality is LONG overdue, and apathetic white people who don't get it aren't fit to lead such a diverse nation.


    1. I do care. And do you know how I make a difference? By treating everyone with respect until they give me a reason not to. I do not give anyone special treatment for being a certain color. They all get treated equally well.

    2. I'm a Democrat and I don't really like when people don't speak English after living in an English-Speaking country for many many years. I have prejudice toward certain people especially after having worked in retail. But I still do my best to help everyone even if I can't understand because it's the right thing to do and they deserve the best from me.

    3. Are you referring to the group that only protests when white people are involved and don't mention at all the gross misconduct of Black Americans toward other Black Americans which is vastly more frequent than mistreatment from all other races combined? Why would anyone want them at their rally? Obviously those women cared nothing about the campaign and were blinded by the fact that he is a white politician.
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    Aug 11, 2015 8:19 PM GMT
    ^ I agree with this guy.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 11, 2015 8:28 PM GMT
    AttisXVI said
    HottJoe said
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, 1. but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    Well, take Bernie Sanders. Recently one of his nearly all white democratic rallies was interrupted by activists from the Black Lives Matter movement. Why, you might ask. 2.) He's a democrat. He can't be racist.... But he must be tone deaf. If he seriously wants to be the next Obama he should have invited them in the first place and staffed 3. BLM activists in his campaign. Racial equality is LONG overdue, and apathetic white people who don't get it aren't fit to lead such a diverse nation.


    1. I do care. And do you know how I make a difference? By treating everyone with respect until they give me a reason not to. I do not give anyone special treatment for being a certain color. They all get treated equally well.

    2. I'm a Democrat and I don't really like when people don't speak English after living in an English-Speaking country for many many years. I have prejudice toward certain people especially after having worked in retail. But I still do my best to help everyone even if I can't understand because it's the right thing to do and they deserve the best from me.

    3. Are you referring to the group that only protests when white people are involved and don't mention at all the gross misconduct of Black Americans toward other Black Americans which is vastly more frequent than mistreatment from all other races combined? Why would anyone want them at their rally? Obviously those women cared nothing about the campaign and were blinded by the fact that he is a white politician.

    I happen to speak English fluently, and by your tone it sounds like you have a problem with black people.
  • FitBlackCuddl...

    Posts: 802

    Aug 11, 2015 8:34 PM GMT
    Radd said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?



    Exactly. Am I supposed to apologize to every person in a wheelchair because I can walk? This whole idea of White Privilege is absolutely retarded.


    White Privilege is the DEFAULT in the United States.

    The average white man cannot see it because there has NEVER been a time when a white man had less, when the word and law spoken by a non-white man could affect your quality of life.

    But it has ALWAYS been the sole province of white men to create policy that regulated, that diminished the quality of life of others who are non-white in the US and elsewhere.

    How many times have any white men in here been turned away from an establishment or asked for multiple IDs because the QUOTA "for his kind" had been reached?

    *I* have--by "gay" white men.

    How many were ever told to enter through the back door or use a segregated public restroom?

    *I* have.

    If a "gay" white man and any Black or Asian person walked into many areas of the country where there is racial bias, the "gay" man would be fine because "being gay" cannot be seen, yet the black or Asian would be harmed.

    These DIFFERENCES are part of the mindset of non-whites, because they are reality.

    ...but not so white men.
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    Aug 11, 2015 8:40 PM GMT
    Race is one thing, but if your living in the first world pulling the race card on such trivial things than you might as well live off the earth and detach yourself from society. It's the culture we live in that separates us with labels, you either accept/defend these labels or simply just say fuck it all.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 11, 2015 8:49 PM GMT
    BP201 saidRace is one thing, but if your living in the first world pulling the race card on such trivial things than you might as well live off the earth and detach yourself from society. It's the culture we live in that separates us with labels, you either accept/defend these labels or simply just say fuck it all.

    I think it's mainly only white people that say this issue is trivial, which contradicts with how much white people overreact by the mere suggestion that.... black lives matter. If it were a trivial issue, or if white people were as color blind as they claim to be, then it wouldn't be such a seemingly daunting evergreen issue.
  • AttisXVI

    Posts: 293

    Aug 11, 2015 8:50 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI said
    HottJoe said
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, 1. but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    Well, take Bernie Sanders. Recently one of his nearly all white democratic rallies was interrupted by activists from the Black Lives Matter movement. Why, you might ask. 2.) He's a democrat. He can't be racist.... But he must be tone deaf. If he seriously wants to be the next Obama he should have invited them in the first place and staffed 3. BLM activists in his campaign. Racial equality is LONG overdue, and apathetic white people who don't get it aren't fit to lead such a diverse nation.


    1. I do care. And do you know how I make a difference? By treating everyone with respect until they give me a reason not to. I do not give anyone special treatment for being a certain color. They all get treated equally well.

    2. I'm a Democrat and I don't really like when people don't speak English after living in an English-Speaking country for many many years. I have prejudice toward certain people especially after having worked in retail. But I still do my best to help everyone even if I can't understand because it's the right thing to do and they deserve the best from me.

    3. Are you referring to the group that only protests when white people are involved and don't mention at all the gross misconduct of Black Americans toward other Black Americans which is vastly more frequent than mistreatment from all other races combined? Why would anyone want them at their rally? Obviously those women cared nothing about the campaign and were blinded by the fact that he is a white politician.

    I happen to speak English fluently, and by your tone it sounds like you have a problem with black people.


    You just put words in my mouth that were neither said nor implied. Your input is no longer constructive to this conversation.

    anigif_enhanced-21564-1404353360-19.gif
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    Aug 11, 2015 8:54 PM GMT
    FitBlackCuddler said
    Radd said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?



    Exactly. Am I supposed to apologize to every person in a wheelchair because I can walk? This whole idea of White Privilege is absolutely retarded.


    White Privilege is the DEFAULT in the United States.

    The average white man cannot see it because there has NEVER been a time when a white man had less, when the word and law spoken by a non-white man could affect your quality of life.

    But it has ALWAYS been the sole province of white men to create policy that regulated, that diminished the quality of life of others who are non-white in the US and elsewhere.

    How many times have any white men in here been turned away from an establishment or asked for multiple IDs because the QUOTA "for his kind" had been reached?

    *I* have--by "gay" white men.

    How many were ever told to enter through the back door or use a segregated public restroom?

    *I* have.

    If a "gay" white man and any Black or Asian person walked into many areas of the country where there is racial bias, the "gay" man would be fine because "being gay" cannot be seen, yet the black or Asian would be harmed.

    These DIFFERENCES are part of the mindset of non-whites, because they are reality.

    ...but not so white men.



    I'm sorry but I don't believe you have ever been asked to enter through the back door because you're black. icon_rolleyes.gif If there is white privilege, there is also black privilege. You can walk through any white neighborhood and not be assaulted however there are few black neighborhoods where a white person can go and not fear being assaulted or worse. Whites are targeted by black criminals however the opposite is rarely heard of.
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    Aug 11, 2015 8:56 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    bhp91126 said
    HottJoe said
    AttisXVI saidI for one do not subscribe to the idea that I should feel in the least bit sorry for the things that I have. I did not choose the color of my skin, my sexual orientation, my hair, my personality, my parents, or my parents background...any of it. I don't have to apologize to anyone for being who I am, nor do they need to apologize to me. Why should I and why should they?

    No one is asking for you to feel sorry, but you could at least give a damn.

    Serious question: what does 'give a damn' look like? What are Gay White Males supposed to do?


    Well, take Bernie Sanders. Recently one of his nearly all white democratic rallies was interrupted by activists from the Black Lives Matter movement. Why, you might ask. He's a democrat. He can't be racist.... But he must be tone deaf. If he seriously wants to be the next Obama he should have invited them in the first place and staffed BLM activists in his campaign. Racial equality is LONG overdue, and apathetic white people who don't get it aren't fit to lead such a diverse nation.


    If racial equality is the goal then liberals should not support Affirmative Action.

    Affirmative Action is NOT equality, its positive discrimination.