When Mexicans crossed our border to feed Americans in need

  • metta

    Posts: 39099

    Aug 31, 2015 2:47 AM GMT
    When Mexicans crossed our border to feed Americans in need


    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/when-mexicans-crossed-our-border-to-feed-our-hungry/2015/08/28/347342e4-4cee-11e5-84df-923b3ef1a64b_story.html
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    Aug 31, 2015 3:13 AM GMT
    This is just the type of story SB was looking for while mimicking you earlier today. I don't know how he missed it!
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    Aug 31, 2015 4:00 PM GMT
    Sorry, but when compared to MX's overall history of relations w/ this US, this barely makes a dent. Should we dredge up stories of Pancho Villa to rebut this? How about its reneging on its agreement to allow the Shah of Iran to return to MX after he underwent surgery in NYC shortly before he died? No, either would be equally absurd and anachronistic, as well as off-issue. The issue has been and remains MX's willingness to serve as a conduit, if not an express elevator, for millions of illegal aliens - not all of whom are "in need," whatever that simpering euphemism means today - to sneak into and remain in the US, which US citizens are feeding at their expense w/o having to cross any borders at all.
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    Aug 31, 2015 4:30 PM GMT
    MGINSD saidSorry, but when compared to MX's overall history of relations w/ this US, this barely makes a dent. Should we dredge up stories of Pancho Villa to rebut this? How about its reneging on its agreement to allow the Shah of Iran to return to MX after he underwent surgery in NYC shortly before he died? No, either would be equally absurd and anachronistic, as well as off-issue. The issue has been and remains MX's willingness to serve as a conduit, if not an express elevator, for millions of illegal aliens - not all of whom are "in need," whatever that simpering euphemism means today - to sneak into and remain in the US, which US citizens are feeding at their expense w/o having to cross any borders at all.

    Precisely. Don't forget how they kept the US Marine who was detained for a long time after making an innocent mistake. And how the crap administration wouldn't even make a call on his behalf - members of Congress did.
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Aug 31, 2015 5:01 PM GMT
    Most Mexicans are actually quite conservative, and really don't give a fuck about each other

    They have no problem burying 50 of their countrymen in the desert to make $5000 dealing meth and heroin

    I've seen it in Arizona and California and New York - it's all about themselves and screw you
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    Aug 31, 2015 5:35 PM GMT
    MGINSD saidSorry, but when compared to MX's overall history of relations w/ this US, this barely makes a dent. Should we dredge up stories of Pancho Villa to rebut this? How about its reneging on its agreement to allow the Shah of Iran to return to MX after he underwent surgery in NYC shortly before he died? No, either would be equally absurd and anachronistic, as well as off-issue. The issue has been and remains MX's willingness to serve as a conduit, if not an express elevator, for millions of illegal aliens - not all of whom are "in need," whatever that simpering euphemism means today - to sneak into and remain in the US, which US citizens are feeding at their expense w/o having to cross any borders at all.


    The author isn't asking you to get down on your knees and give solemn thanks to the Mexican nation. He is simply offering an alternative perspective to Trump's anti-Mexican scorn.
  • RainOnFire

    Posts: 28

    Aug 31, 2015 7:06 PM GMT
    A few thoughts in response to this post and some RJers comments:

    * The total amount of immigrants of Mexican origin (by birth) peaked in 2007 and has gone down since then. Meaning, that there are less illegal Mexicans in the U.S. right now than 8 years ago.
    http://www.pewhispanic.org/2014/12/11/unauthorized-trends


    * There have been more deportations and separation of families under the Obama administration than under any other president before him. Never forget that being an illegal immigrant (of any national origin) in the U.S. is no picnic. They have very limited access to bank services and credit, as well as healthcare; many don't want to go to a hospital if they feel sick or get into an accident for fear of being identified. They send their hard-earned money (which they labored for) back home and, thus, give up many basic commodities here by living in cramped quarters, eating poorly, and not spending their money on entertainment, clothing or small luxuries. They know they can be deported any day for any reason, and be separated from their family (if they have established one in the U.S.)


    * The argument of having U.S. citizens "feed" illegal immigrants is absurd. Ilegal immigrants cannot apply for welfare or social security, yet they still have to pay sales tax on everything they buy at a store. Not to mention, if you went to an American high school and asked how many students would like to pick strawberries or grow corn for a living to feed their own population... do you think you would have many hands raised?


    * Andrew Paul Tahmooressi, the U.S. Marine that was detained in Tijuana, MX, crossed the border with over $2,500 dlls. worth of weapons and ammo, including a semi-automatic Spartan Alpha M6 .223 caliber rifle, a Benelli shotgun, a .45 caliber handgun, two .45 caliber magazines as well as .223 magazines that had a total of 398 rounds. He had crossed into Mexico before, so he knew where he was going, and there are plenty of signs on the freeway telling drivers that the "International Border" is coming up and that "Guns and ammo are illegal in Mexico." Do you think the United States would be merciful if a Mexican teenager crossed into the U.S. and was caught with a bag of weed? He'd be thrown in jail for it, just the same. It was never about the Mexican government being unfair; it's the country's law. Just exactly the same as how you cannot cross avocado or raw eggs from Mexico into the U.S. It's the law. Before you travel to another country, you should know their customs and border regulations.

    And, for the record, while violence in Mexico does exist, the general civilian population is not allowed to own handguns (just hunting rifles with permits). There has never been a mass shooting by an armed civilian at any school or academic institution or cinema in Mexico. Violence is gang- or cartel-related; Mexicans don't go out shooting innocent people senselessly.


    * While, yes, corruption is a big problem in Mexico, just like in many other developing countries around the world, it something that concerns internal country politics and has little to do with the U.S. Income inequality is rampant in Mexico... but take a look and you'll see the United States also has its 1%.


    * Finally, Mexico has, over the past 40 years, looked North for better opportunities. While illegal immigration from Mexico into the U.S. is a social and economic issue that should be addressed, it is not a new one. And it's not, unlike the media and Republican presidential candidates would like you to believe, a top problem for the country's economy or social fabric. Hatred and intolerance is. Because conservatives lost the battle against the gay, I believe they need another scapegoat for their problems: in this case, the Mexicans.

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    Aug 31, 2015 7:23 PM GMT
    RainOnFire said* Andrew Paul Tahmooressi, the U.S. Marine that was detained in Tijuana, MX, crossed the border with over $2,500 dlls. worth of weapons and ammo, including a semi-automatic Spartan Alpha M6 .223 caliber rifle, a Benelli shotgun, a .45 caliber handgun, two .45 caliber magazines as well as .223 magazines that had a total of 398 rounds. He had crossed into Mexico before, so he knew where he was going, and there are plenty of signs on the freeway telling drivers that the "International Border" is coming up and that "Guns and ammo are illegal in Mexico." Do you think the United States would be merciful if a Mexican teenager crossed into the U.S. and was caught with a bag of weed? He'd be thrown in jail for it, just the same. It was never about the Mexican government being unfair; it's the country's law. Just exactly the same as how you cannot cross avocado or raw eggs from Mexico into the U.S. It's the law. Before you travel to another country, you should know their customs and border regulations.

    The part I bolded is completely untrue. He had not driven that path before. Based on what he said, he walked into Mexico earlier. So unless you or your source can discount that, then you or your source are very dishonest. The initial sign to Mexico from where he was parked was small, unlit, and covered in graffiti. It also pointed north because the road looped around. After taking that turn, there was no way to turn back before reaching the border regardless of other signs. These facts have been documented by at least one news crew that created a video to demonstrate this. The Sargeant immediately notified the authorities at the border of his inadvertent crossing into Mexico. So if he knew where he was going, why would he have immediately told the authorities of his mistake. Funny how sometimes simple common sense and logic can dispel pure garbage.
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    Aug 31, 2015 8:00 PM GMT
    socalfitness said
    RainOnFire said* Andrew Paul Tahmooressi, the U.S. Marine that was detained in Tijuana, MX, crossed the border with over $2,500 dlls. worth of weapons and ammo, including a semi-automatic Spartan Alpha M6 .223 caliber rifle, a Benelli shotgun, a .45 caliber handgun, two .45 caliber magazines as well as .223 magazines that had a total of 398 rounds. He had crossed into Mexico before, so he knew where he was going, and there are plenty of signs on the freeway telling drivers that the "International Border" is coming up and that "Guns and ammo are illegal in Mexico." Do you think the United States would be merciful if a Mexican teenager crossed into the U.S. and was caught with a bag of weed? He'd be thrown in jail for it, just the same. It was never about the Mexican government being unfair; it's the country's law. Just exactly the same as how you cannot cross avocado or raw eggs from Mexico into the U.S. It's the law. Before you travel to another country, you should know their customs and border regulations.

    The part I bolded is completely untrue. He had not driven that path before. Based on what he said, he walked into Mexico earlier. So unless you or your source can discount that, then you or your source are very dishonest. The initial sign to Mexico from where he was parked was small, unlit, and covered in graffiti. It also pointed north because the road looped around. After taking that turn, there was no way to turn back before reaching the border regardless of other signs. These facts have been documented by at least one news crew that created a video to demonstrate this. The Sargeant immediately notified the authorities at the border of his inadvertent crossing into Mexico. So if he knew where he was going, why would he have immediately told the authorities of his mistake. Funny how sometimes simple common sense and logic can dispel pure garbage.


    When the facts don't meet someone's agenda, then damn the facts.
  • RainOnFire

    Posts: 28

    Aug 31, 2015 8:11 PM GMT
    Guess we all have our sources. (*my translation)

    "Andrew entered Mexican territory at 10:25 p.m. on March 31, 2014. His Ford F150 truck was loaded with his belongings. Large objects were visible from the truck's bed, including a ladder, some small mattresses, and other large objects.

    This drew the customs officers' attention at the border, who asked the U.S. citizen to drive into the secondary inspection area, even though moments earlier, the entry traffic light had allowed him an inspection-free access due to a green light."

    [*Let me explain this a bit-- At the Mexican border, you have two choices when you drive in: DECLARE and NOTHING TO DECLARE (labeled in English and Spanish). If you are bringing items that must be declared at customs, you drive into a special building designed for inspection and customs tax payments. If you choose to drive through the NOTHING TO DECLARE lanes, you willingly surrender to a quick random inspection. Your car is weighed instantaneously and the license plates are photographed by a computer, and the computer (sometimes at will and most times randomly) will decide whether to give you a green light or a red light. If you get a red light, you have to stop at a secondary inspection point. Sometimes, even if you get a green light, the customs officers may ask you to stop at secondary inspection. Tahmooressi's first suspicious act was that he did not drive into the DECLARE building; he drove straight through the NOTHING TO DECLARE lanes. It wasn't until the customs officers asked him to pull into secondary inspection that he had any interaction with them.]

    Article continues:

    "The vehicle, a 2003 model that only had a rear license plate issued by the state of Florida, 'seemed to have a heavy load and the driver had a suspicious attitude, one of nervousness,' would later recall a customs agent."

    FULL ARTICLE (in Spanish):
    http://zetatijuana.com/noticias/ezenario/5150/ex-marine-no-ingreso-a-mexico-por-error
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Aug 31, 2015 11:24 PM GMT
    socalfitness said
    RainOnFire said* Andrew Paul Tahmooressi, the U.S. Marine that was detained in Tijuana, MX, crossed the border with over $2,500 dlls. worth of weapons and ammo, including a semi-automatic Spartan Alpha M6 .223 caliber rifle, a Benelli shotgun, a .45 caliber handgun, two .45 caliber magazines as well as .223 magazines that had a total of 398 rounds. He had crossed into Mexico before, so he knew where he was going, and there are plenty of signs on the freeway telling drivers that the "International Border" is coming up and that "Guns and ammo are illegal in Mexico." Do you think the United States would be merciful if a Mexican teenager crossed into the U.S. and was caught with a bag of weed? He'd be thrown in jail for it, just the same. It was never about the Mexican government being unfair; it's the country's law. Just exactly the same as how you cannot cross avocado or raw eggs from Mexico into the U.S. It's the law. Before you travel to another country, you should know their customs and border regulations.

    The part I bolded is completely untrue. He had not driven that path before. Based on what he said, he walked into Mexico earlier. So unless you or your source can discount that, then you or your source are very dishonest. The initial sign to Mexico from where he was parked was small, unlit, and covered in graffiti. It also pointed north because the road looped around. After taking that turn, there was no way to turn back before reaching the border regardless of other signs. These facts have been documented by at least one news crew that created a video to demonstrate this. The Sargeant immediately notified the authorities at the border of his inadvertent crossing into Mexico. So if he knew where he was going, why would he have immediately told the authorities of his mistake. Funny how sometimes simple common sense and logic can dispel pure garbage.


    And not on that RainOnFire forgot to mention Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico simply by getting in the wrong lane on the expressway that was barricaded on both sides not allowing lane changes. He politely asked to be allowed to turn around and admitted he had the weapons and never intended to cross the border.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Aug 31, 2015 11:52 PM GMT


    And here's some more totally runny cat shit fiction from RainOnFire.

    RainOnFire* The argument of having U.S. citizens "feed" illegal immigrants is absurd. Ilegal immigrants cannot apply for welfare or social security, yet they still have to pay sales tax on everything they buy at a store. Not to mention, if you went to an American high school and asked how many students would like to pick strawberries or grow corn for a living to feed their own population... do you think you would have many hands raised?


    Judicial Watch, 2011, from US Census Bureau dataThe highest rate of welfare recipients come from the Dominican Republic (82 %), Mexico and Guatemala (75%) and Ecuador (70%), according to the report, which says welfare use tends to be high for both new arrivals and established residents.

    http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2011/04/most-illegal-immigrant-families-collect-welfare/

    The New American 2012 quoting The Center of Immigrant Studies, US Census Bureau, Department of Homeland Security and Pew Hispanic Center.In Texas, for instance, 58 percent of illegal households collect some form of welfare, CIS reported, with 49 percent using food assistance and 41 percent using Medicaid. In California and Illinois, 55 percent use welfare. The list of states goes down from there. Nationally, 47 percent of illegals use welfare; 39 percent use food assistance and 35 percent use Medicaid.




    Brietbart 2014 quoting the same sources Based on the Census Bureau’s March 2013 Current Population Survey, the Center for Immigration Studies (CIS) reports that most legal and illegal immigrant heads of households from these three countries received benefits from at least one major benefit program like Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF), Supplemental Security Income (SSI), Special Supplemental Nutrition Program for Women, Infants, and Children (WIC), food stamps (SNAP), free/reduced lunch, pu
    blic/subsidized housing, and/or Medicaid.

    Some 57 percent of households headed by an El Salvadoran used one such major welfare program, as did 54 percent of Honduran households and 49 percent of Guatemalan households. By comparison, 24 percent of households headed by a native-born American used at least one of these programs. [/quote]
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    Sep 01, 2015 12:52 AM GMT
    What about these victims of illegal aliens:
    -Kate Steinle: murdered.
    -Marilyn Pharis: raped and murdered.
    -Starlett Pitts and her 27 week viable unborn baby: murdered.
    -Michael Kelly: murdered.
    -Dorla Pitts: murdered.
    -Maria Cruiz-Calvillo and her 3-year-old son,
    Luis Lopez-Cruz: burned to death.

    The cases below are listed as a demonstration that better prevention of illegal immigration is a public safety issue even though these cases are not representative of the illegal alien population in general. These cases refer to crimes other than terrorism.

    August 2015 — Jose Angel Villarreal-Sanchez, a 42-year-old illegal alien from Mexico, was convicted of possessing a firearm in Texas. According to federal law, illegal aliens are not permitted to possess firearms. Three baggies of cocaine were also found hidden in his backyard. Villarreal-Sanchez is expected to be sentenced in December. He could face up to 10 years in federal prison and a possible $250,000 fine. (U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, August 11, 2015)

    July 2015 — Ever Olivos-Gutierrez, an illegal visa overstayer, was convicted of second degree murder in Colorado for the death he caused while driving intoxicated. It was the fourth time since 2000 he had been arrested for DUI, but there was no record of immigration authorities ever being notified. He was sentenced to 40 years imprisonment. (Denver Channel 7)

    June 2015 — A Salvadoran, Mauricio Hernandez, convicted of rape and murder of the baby born to his victim was sentenced to 50 years in prison in Texas and faces deportation when he has served his sentence. (The Dallas Morning News, June 5, 2015)

    May 2015 — A Salvadoran, Julio C. Saravia, faces deportation following a prison sentence of 29 years for rape of a minor, to which he pled guilty in Virginia.

    May 2015 — Two Mexicans, Juan Hernandez-Sanchez and (FNU) Canela-Perez, pled guilty in Portland, Oregon and were sentenced to seven years in state prison for distribution of methamphetamines and heroin. (Oregonian, May 14, 2015)

    May 2015 — Zeng Liang Chen and Dong Biao Lin, illegal aliens from China, were convicted of first degree murder and sentenced to life in prison in New Jersey. (NJ.com, May 5, 2015)

    May 2015 —Bernabe Flores, a Mexican illegal alien, pled guilty to first-degree rape in California and was sentenced to eight years in prison. (Times-Herald Record, May 7, 2015)

    April 2015 — Victor Garzon-Alvarez, a Mexican illegal alien pled guilty and was sentenced in New Jersey to 14 years in prison for murder. (NJ.com, April 22, 2015)

    April 2015 — Sergio Quezada Lopez, a Mexican illegal alien who had been deported four times, was sentenced in Oregon to 15 years in prison for a heroin overdose death. His brother, Gerardo Chalke Lopez, also a previously deported alien, was earlier sentenced to 18 years in prison on the same charges. (Oregonian, April 29, 2015)

    April 2015 — Three illegal aliens, Uriel Ramirez-Perez, Darwin Zuniga-Rocha, and Eliseo Mateo Perez, pled guilty to first-degree sexual abuse (rape) in New York and were sentenced to time served in jail and will be deported. (Daily News, April 29, 2015)

    March 2015 — Javier Guerrero Molina, a Mexican illegal alien, was sentenced in federal court in Jacksonville, Florida to 10 years imprisonment for attempting to transport a minor to engage in sexual activity. Guerrero said he had entered the United States illegally in 1999 or 2000. (Dept. of Justice, Middle District of Florida, March 30, 2015)

    March 2015 — An Idaho judge sentenced Phuong Hoang Le, a Vietnamese illegal alien, to prison for 36 months. Le was convicted of possession of a stolen car and stolen credit card. The judge commented, "Stealing cars and credit cards strike at the hearts of average middle class citizens." The prosecutor said that Le had 10 prior felony convictions, but that according to U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, he is not likely to be deported because if Le were to be deported to Vietnam "he would be killed." (http://magicvalley.com/news/local/mini-cassia/ — March 25, 2015)

    March 2015 — Luis Daniel Cabrera-Guzman, a Mexican illegal alien, was sentenced in Kansas City to two years in federal prison for conspiracy to produce and distribute false and counterfeit identification documents that were sold to illegal aliens. He had previously been deported twice in 2009. Four other Mexican illegal aliens have pled guilty to the same conspiracy and await sentencing. (Kansas City infozine, March 25, 2015)

    February 2015 — Sergio Cobaruvias-Romero, an illegal alien from Mexico, was convicted of possessing with intent to distribute drugs in Texas. He was found with 20 bundles of methamphetamine weighing 46 pounds and four bundles of heroine weighing 13 pounds. He was sentenced to 10 years in federal prison. (U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, February 17, 2015)

    January 2015 — Jaime Gerardo Serrano-Villegas, a 28-year-old illegal alien from Mexico, was convicted of transporting illegal aliens. He assisted in moving a boat filled with illegal aliens and faces up to 10 years in federal prison. (U.S. Department of Justice, Southern District of Texas, January 14, 2015)

    December 2014 — Two illegal aliens were arrested by Border Patrol agents in Laredo, Texas for illegally re-entering the United States. The illegal aliens were previously convicted of first-degree murder in Illinois, where they each served between 6 to 10 years in prison. They were departed back to Mexico upon completing their sentences. (Breitbart News, December 2, 2014)

    November 2014 — Abel Hernandez-Labra, a Mexican illegal alien living in Iowa, was convicted of the following charges: one count of making false statements in a passport application, one count of aggravated identity theft, one count of making a false claim of U.S. citizenship to register to vote, and one count of harboring an illegal alien. Hernandez-Labra was sentenced to 51 months in prison and fined $5,000. (U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, November 4, 2014)

    October 2014 — Freddy David Santos Campuzano, an illegal alien from Mexico, was sentenced to 57 months in prison for participating in a fraudulent document ring. The ring sold high-quality, fake identification documents in many states across the United States. 42 members of the organization have been convicted. (WTOP, October 17, 2014)

    September 2014 — Ivan Espinoza Villafana, a 24-year-old Mexican illegal alien, was convicted of possession of a firearm by an illegal alien, cultivation of marijuana, and depredation of public lands and resources. Villafana was caught growing marijuana on Mendocino National Forest land in Glenn County, California. He was sentenced to five years in prison. (U.S. Department of Justice, Eastern District of California, September 18, 2014)

    August 2014 — Merced Garcia, a 37-year-old illegal alien from Mexico, was sentenced to 180 days in jail for vehicular homicide and driving without a license. (WLWT Cincinanti, August 26, 2014)
    July 2014 — A Mexican illegal alien, Juan Bautista-Rubio, was convicted of one count of aggravated identity theft. He used a social security card and permanent resident card to obtain employment in the U.S. Bautista-Rubio has previously been deported. (U.S. Department of Justice, Northern District of Iowa, July 9, 2014)

    June 2014 — An illegal alien from the Dominican Republic, Renato de la Cruz, was convicted of theft of public money, use of a falsely obtained Social Security Number, and aggravated identity theft. He used a fake ID to receive unemployment benefits. De la Cruz faces a maximum sentence of 10 years and a fine of $250,000. (U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, June 24, 2014)
    May 2014 — Humberto Gonzalez, an illegal alien, was convicted in New Jersey of criminal assault and sentenced to 50 years in prison. The rape occurred in 2005 and Gonzalez was not identified until a DNA match was made following an arrest
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14336

    Sep 01, 2015 1:22 AM GMT
    robbaker saidDon't worry true Americans when donald trump becomes president he's going to build a great big wall greater than china's icon_mad.gif
    Oh shut the fuck up you blathering, bumbling blowhardicon_mad.gif
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    Sep 01, 2015 1:34 AM GMT
    All caucasians who live in the united states are the descendants of illegal immigrants.
    Mexicans always have and always will, have a better claim to the land that is now called the U.S. Today's mexicanos are the descendants of spaniards and the native american civilizations that pre-dated the european's arrival to the americas.
  • RainOnFire

    Posts: 28

    Sep 01, 2015 1:37 AM GMT
    The Center for Immigration Studies is mostly a Washington D.C. think-tank with a $2-million annual budget and 12 staffers that plays to the Tea Party, the far right, and an American nativist movement. It was founded by an ophthalmologist named John Tanton, who (according to the Southern Poverty Law Center) is known "for his racist statements about Latinos, his decades-long flirtation with white nationalists and Holocaust deniers, and his publication of ugly racist materials."

    John Tanton, according to the New York Times, was also directly involved in drafting the racially-biased Arizona SB-1070 law, which was deemed unconstitutional by the Supreme Court.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/17/us/17immig.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1


    The current director of the Center for Immigration Studies is Mark Krikorian who, according to the The Washington Post, describes himself as a "hack and a flack."

    "Since 1995, [Mark] Krikorian has run the Center for Immigration Studies, which is now housed in a small suite of offices on K Street. The tiny institute — about a dozen staffers operating on a $2 million annual budget, puny by comparison with the business interests and big liberal think tanks it duels — generates an astounding volume of studies and opinion pieces with the common themes that mass migration exacts a heavy economic and psychic toll on the United States. But Krikorian’s greatest platform may be the media, where he’s taken up permanent residence as the ever-reliable counterpoint in stories about efforts to change the immigration system and as a blogger at National Review Online. “I’m a hack and a flack,” Krikorian says, chuckling. “I give good quote."”

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/mark-krikorian-the-provocateur-standing-in-the-way-of-immigration-reform/2013/06/17/dff0bd52-d75e-11e2-a9f2-42ee3912ae0e_story.html


    Furthermore, a Senior Policy Analyst of CIS, Stephen Steinlight, was reported to have told a chapter of the Tea Party in Florida that Barack Obama should be "hung, drawn, and quartered."He also plays on the fear of a bloody latino uprising in the United States.


    And as for Judicialwatch.org, may I remind you that it is a heavily-biased, partisan watchdog website that plays on conspiracy theories and sells DVDs and books related to alleged government cover-ups. As gay men, we should not support or believe a skewed media outlet that came out in support of the Defense of Marriage Act back in June 2013 by writing, "As with many of the problems we currently face here in Washington, a significant part of the blame for how this all unfolded must be laid at the feet of Barack Obama and Attorney General Eric Holder. In 2011, the pair violated their oaths and abandoned the government’s defense of DOMA. And we are reaping the negative impact of this corrupt decision now."


    You should know who you're quoting, bobbobbob. Let's have an informed conversation when you have unbiased reporting from a professional news source or peer-reviewed academic articles.

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    Sep 01, 2015 1:38 AM GMT
    This man.....Pancho Villa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pancho_Villaconsidered a hero, to this day by most Mexican Nationals. Yet, his reign of destruction was to clean out the white settlers and other immigrants who made their home in Mexico. You see at the time these hard working settlers were industrious and highly successful. They gave jobs and employment to the indigenous Mexican people.
    Then someone got in a flurry of jealousy. A mad rage and felt that these people were taking over the country. So he started a robin hood style revolution and Killed, plundered and raped these people of everything!!

    How did this affect me? My grandmother was BORN in MEXICO. She and the rest of her/my FAMILY had to leave ASAP or BE KILLED!! They buried all they could thinking one day they would return. They never did. I heard all the stories first hand!! My great grandmother, who lived in Mexico lived to be 104. My Grandma, told my mom the truth!!

    Ask me if I care about Mexico?
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    Sep 01, 2015 1:50 AM GMT
    RainOnFire saidYou should know who you're quoting, bobbobbob. Let's have an informed conversation when you have unbiased reporting from a professional news source or peer-reviewed academic articles.

    The same applies to you, specifically stating that "Paul Tahmooressi,... knew where he was going..." clearly implying that he drove into Mexico deliberately.
  • RainOnFire

    Posts: 28

    Sep 01, 2015 1:56 AM GMT
    If we're going to delve into history and start listing crimes committed by illegal aliens or their descendants against the native population of the area, let's start here:

    Indian Removal Act of 1830, passed by the U.S. Congress and signed by then president Andrew Jackson.

    It led to the mass death of 3,000 to 5,000 Cherokee Indians as they fled their native lands, opening 25 million acres of land East of the Mississippi to white settlement and to slavery.

    ---

    What I mean by this is that U.S. history is laden with illegal immigration, including a rich history of English, Irish, Danish, German and French settlers that crossed the Atlantic from the 17th through early 20th centuries.

    It's 2015. So... NOW it's a problem?
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    Sep 01, 2015 2:09 AM GMT
    Ex_Mil8 said
    MGINSD saidSorry, but when compared to MX's overall history of relations w/ this US, this barely makes a dent. Should we dredge up stories of Pancho Villa to rebut this? How about its reneging on its agreement to allow the Shah of Iran to return to MX after he underwent surgery in NYC shortly before he died? No, either would be equally absurd and anachronistic, as well as off-issue. The issue has been and remains MX's willingness to serve as a conduit, if not an express elevator, for millions of illegal aliens - not all of whom are "in need," whatever that simpering euphemism means today - to sneak into and remain in the US, which US citizens are feeding at their expense w/o having to cross any borders at all.


    The author isn't asking you to get down on your knees and give solemn thanks to the Mexican nation. He is simply offering an alternative perspective to Trump's anti-Mexican scorn.


    Unlike the permissive, open borders crowd, who wants Trump and everyone else who believes in controlled immigration under the rule of law and ordered liberty to get down on their knees and repent for their supposed sin of adhering to these legal concepts. No, he's offering another item of irrelevantia to deflect from the controlling legal principles and the personal responsibility born by those who continue to ignore and willingly violate them.
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    Sep 01, 2015 3:31 AM GMT
    MGINSD saidSorry, but when compared to MX's overall history of relations w/ this US, this barely makes a dent. Should we dredge up stories of Pancho Villa to rebut this? How about its reneging on its agreement to allow the Shah of Iran to return to MX after he underwent surgery in NYC shortly before he died? No, either would be equally absurd and anachronistic, as well as off-issue. The issue has been and remains MX's willingness to serve as a conduit, if not an express elevator, for millions of illegal aliens - not all of whom are "in need," whatever that simpering euphemism means today - to sneak into and remain in the US, which US citizens are feeding at their expense w/o having to cross any borders at all.



    It is comical to think of some of these old ranting conservatives who will someday be grateful to have an immigrant nurse wiping the ass they can no longer reach.

    But on the point of immigration, I tend to agree with many of you foolish old farts. We need a means of controlling immigration!

    But let's be honest. The US has greatly benefited from the cheap labor we've blindly allowed to come.
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Sep 01, 2015 5:36 AM GMT
    SugarTits15 saidAll caucasians who live in the united states are the descendants of illegal immigrants.
    Mexicans always have and always will, have a better claim to the land that is now called the U.S. Today's mexicanos are the descendants of spaniards and the native american civilizations that pre-dated the european's arrival to the americas.


    lol that's complete crap, Spain invaded Mexico and killed most of the locals

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    Sep 01, 2015 7:24 AM GMT
    FitnessWorker said
    MGINSD saidSorry, but when compared to MX's overall history of relations w/ this US, this barely makes a dent. Should we dredge up stories of Pancho Villa to rebut this? How about its reneging on its agreement to allow the Shah of Iran to return to MX after he underwent surgery in NYC shortly before he died? No, either would be equally absurd and anachronistic, as well as off-issue. The issue has been and remains MX's willingness to serve as a conduit, if not an express elevator, for millions of illegal aliens - not all of whom are "in need," whatever that simpering euphemism means today - to sneak into and remain in the US, which US citizens are feeding at their expense w/o having to cross any borders at all.



    It is comical to think of some of these old ranting conservatives who will someday be grateful to have an immigrant nurse wiping the ass they can no longer reach.

    But on the point of immigration, I tend to agree with many of you foolish old farts. We need a means of controlling immigration!

    But let's be honest. The US has greatly benefited from the cheap labor we've blindly allowed to come.


    And Mexico and the rest of Latin America has benefited greatly from the money that is sent home by legals and illegals alike. Mexico and the others have nothing to gain in stemming the tide of illegal immigration.

    I have a problem with illegal immigration because illegals are taken advantage of. They aren't paid a fair wage. Do not get overtime, sick time or vacation days, they are often cheated out of wages and the have no recourse other than to accept this because they can't complain to authorities for fear of being deported.
  • bobbobbob

    Posts: 2812

    Sep 01, 2015 7:32 AM GMT
    tj85016 said
    SugarTits15 saidAll caucasians who live in the united states are the descendants of illegal immigrants.
    Mexicans always have and always will, have a better claim to the land that is now called the U.S. Today's mexicanos are the descendants of spaniards and the native american civilizations that pre-dated the european's arrival to the americas.


    lol that's complete crap, Spain invaded Mexico and killed most of the locals


    And the ones they didn't kill were enslaved within their own homelands. Saggytits completely fucked up with cherry picking the example of the Europeans treatment of of native Americans in terms of the history of how all civilizations have expanded. What happened in the Americas was no different than how Rome spread over the Meditteranean up to Germany and the British Isles or a few hundred civilizations that have expanded to new lands.

    If you're going to make an issue out of this go all the way back to the Mesopotamians and Egyptians and start your shrill bitching.
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    Sep 01, 2015 7:41 AM GMT
    bobbobbob said
    tj85016 said
    SugarTits15 saidAll caucasians who live in the united states are the descendants of illegal immigrants.
    Mexicans always have and always will, have a better claim to the land that is now called the U.S. Today's mexicanos are the descendants of spaniards and the native american civilizations that pre-dated the european's arrival to the americas.


    lol that's complete crap, Spain invaded Mexico and killed most of the locals


    And the ones they didn't kill were enslaved within their own homelands. Saggytits completely fucked up with cherry picking the example of the Europeans treatment of of native Americans in terms of the history of how all civilizations have expanded. What happened in the Americas was no different than how Rome spread over the Meditteranean up to Germany and the British Isles or a few hundred civilizations that have expanded to new lands.

    If you're going to make an issue out of this go all the way back to the Mesopotamians and Egyptians and start your shrill bitching.


    Yes, maybe ALL of mankind should migrate back to Africa where we ALL supposedly originated. icon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gif

    icon_rolleyes.gif