Euthenasia or 'Mercy Killing' - What are your views?

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    Aug 31, 2015 11:27 AM GMT
    For some this may be a sensitive subject: There is a clinic in Switzerland, that offers patients who are terminally ill the option of Euthenasia. If a Specialist or Doctor has given you the verdict that your illness has limited your life-span, and in let's say six to eight months the illness would take it's toll on your body, what would you do? With you ending up in extreme pain and in the throng's of death. If you could afford it, would you opt for Euthenasia. The Scientist who runs the clinic says it is painless and patients are allowed a peaceful passing, with or without family members present. All they give you are two red capsule's. Each capsule contains, a strong pain relief and a sedative strong enough to put down an Elephant. Within a few hours, after taking the medication it is all over. Some European Countries have already legalized Euthenasia. What are your views?
  • tj85016

    Posts: 4123

    Aug 31, 2015 2:44 PM GMT
    I think it's a good and fair idea
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    Aug 31, 2015 3:19 PM GMT
    What is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?
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    Aug 31, 2015 4:18 PM GMT
    KyMaverick saidWhat is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?

    Hospice Care, is when you have a Living Will stating that 'In the event of death, no medication of any means or by way of machine's shall be used to prolong your death'. The Patient is then placed in a Hospice and given only the necessary treatment and if need be medication to relieve pain. Euthenasia is where the Patient has chosen he/she, is not prepared to suffer with the pain in their dying days.
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    Aug 31, 2015 4:36 PM GMT
    Hospice care means that in the cases where the disease will basically turn you into a vegetable, you have no pain, but you live the knowledge that eventually you'll be just like a baby, having family and staff have to feed you, change your diaper, etc.


    I have *never* understood the logic of people who refuse to accept the concept of euthanasia, but who would charge you with animal cruelty if you didn't put down an animal that was suffering. Apparently, the quality of life/suffering of an animal is more important that that of people in their minds.

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    Aug 31, 2015 5:47 PM GMT
    Doctor9 saidHospice care means that in the cases where the disease will basically turn you into a vegetable, you have no pain, but you live the knowledge that eventually you'll be just like a baby, having family and staff have to feed you, change your diaper, etc.


    I have *never* understood the logic of people who refuse to accept the concept of euthanasia, but who would charge you with animal cruelty if you didn't put down an animal that was suffering. Apparently, the quality of life/suffering of an animal is more important that that of people in their minds.


    I sat here pondering your question between Animal sufferage and Human. With Animals, there seems to be very few people involved who would object or advocate on the animal's behalf. Where as with humans involved; family, relatives, spouse and children whom will have different feelings, opinions, and could advocate- if they have not reach a concesus on what to do, then legal issue arrises. I bet in some respects that is why it is easier to Euthenize an animal than a human. but which to beg this question; do animals have medical rights?

    On a previous response to my post regarding difference Hospice and Euthenasia, I have recently exp hospice for a loved one. Altho' the one doctor thought it was too early, they went ahead and put person in hospice, at that time they stop all antibiotic, and treatment. Had this person decided to stay in treatment care and not hospice, they would have had a little longer 2 weeks. The person passed just 3 days after being admitted to hospice care.
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    Aug 31, 2015 6:17 PM GMT
    I went through a related experience. The State court had granted me emergency full guardian rights, as my partner had medically passed into dimentia, and was legally incompetent. Setting a legal precedent for a gay couple in that State, BTW.

    As his health continued to fail the doctors asked me for permission to take him off life support, and to let him die, his condition medically hopeless. Now THAT'S a tough one.

    I got several opinions, and then gave permission for them to "pull the plug". He died within 24 hours, literally in my arms, with our 3 best friends also at his bedside.

    Obviously it traumatized me, and still haunts me. The arranged death of a loved one, for whatever reason and by whatever means, is an ordeal I hope others never need to face.
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    Aug 31, 2015 6:40 PM GMT
    Art_Deco saidI went through a related experience. The State court had granted me emergency full guardian rights, as my partner had medically passed into dimentia, and was legally incompetent. Setting a legal precedent for a gay couple in that State, BTW.

    As his health continued to fail the doctors asked me for permission to take him off life support, and to let him die, his condition medically hopeless. Now THAT'S a tough one.

    I got several opinions, and then gave permission for them to "pull the plug". He died within 24 hours, literally in my arms, with our 3 best friends also at his bedside.

    Obviously it traumatized me, and still haunts me. The arranged death of a loved one, for whatever reason and by whatever means, is an ordeal I hope others never need to face.


    I cant imagine the ordeal and heart ache you went thru. thanks for sharing.
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    Aug 31, 2015 6:47 PM GMT
    I consider for myself passing on even a decade or more of good living to prevent a following decade or more of suffering.

    Having one of eight great grandparents pass down Alzheimer's but with many of the bloodlines of the rest living well into their 90s, I'm approaching an odd juncture, wondering if I've another 40 years left of healthy living or only under 20 left with half that living demented which I find unacceptable.

    The problem being that you can't wait for the dementia to kick in full blown because then you miss your window of opportunity to escape suffering. Even in very early stages, with functionality fully or 99% intact, if you wait too long, you get lulled into it and then eventually you become unable to even complete the task.

    So sometimes it can be necessary to kill yourself when you are pretty much perfectly healthy, which even state sanctioned euthanasia would not allow.

    Should such compassion discriminate against what might seem a healthy body but is really a time bomb and a mind currently capable of making a decision only for a time?
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    Aug 31, 2015 7:42 PM GMT
    KyMaverick saidWhat is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?


    They are the same for non-religious institutions. Liberals like the PC term "hospice care" instead of euthanasia similar to calling abortion, "womens reproductive rights" or "womens healthcare".

    In American hospice care, patients are frequently given increasing doses of morphine (most often without informing loved ones or the patient) which depresses respiration and kills them.

    I know someone who was euthanized 3 hours after the first shot of morphine. Another person I knew, after a few days of morphine.
  • FitBlackCuddl...

    Posts: 803

    Aug 31, 2015 7:59 PM GMT
    Domino_dancer saidFor some this may be a sensitive subject: There is a clinic in Switzerland, that offers patients who are terminally ill the option of Euthanasia. If a Specialist or Doctor has given you the verdict that your illness has limited your life-span, and in let's say six to eight months the illness would take it's toll on your body, what would you do? With you ending up in extreme pain and in the throng's of death. If you could afford it, would you opt for Euthanasia. The Scientist who runs the clinic says it is painless and patients are allowed a peaceful passing, with or without family members present. All they give you are two red capsule's. Each capsule contains, a strong pain relief and a sedative strong enough to put down an Elephant. Within a few hours, after taking the medication it is all over. Some European Countries have already legalized Euthanasia. What are your views?


    Is a no-brainer. Let it be a clear option.

    Forget religion or the views of family, authority figures, etc...it is ALL ABOUT QUALITY OF LIFE. YOUR life.
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2605

    Aug 31, 2015 9:59 PM GMT
    A very difficult issue to decide upon, with problems on both sides.
    I`m sure there are situations where an assisted death might be the least worst option, but I`m skeptical that such a system could be codified in law that would allow people who wanted to die with dignity safely and clearly, yet at the same time protect the right to life of those who might have a low 'quality' of life(as judged by mainstream society).
    If the right to die came in, I fear for the latter group being gradually more and more forced by a mix conscious/unconscious social pressure to choose to die.
    Palliative care might also be undermined by this option of dying.
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    Aug 31, 2015 10:28 PM GMT
    mx5guynj said
    KyMaverick saidWhat is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?


    They are the same for non-religious institutions. Liberals like the PC term "hospice care" instead of euthanasia similar to calling abortion, "womens reproductive rights" or "womens healthcare".

    In American hospice care, patients are frequently given increasing doses of morphine (most often without informing loved ones or the patient) which depresses respiration and kills them.

    I know someone who was euthanized 3 hours after the first shot of morphine. Another person I knew, after a few days of morphine.


    And? What's your repuke point?

    I wish we could line up you and the rest of your repuke ilk on this site and euthanize the lot of you. icon_cool.gificon_wink.gif
    ^^
    That sounds harsh right?
    Yet the party you align yourself with would like nothing more than to be able to legally do that to every Gay person they could find.
    But please....continue to vote for them and be one of them. icon_rolleyes.gif

    ******************************************************
    To the OP...Euthanasia is something that is completely overdue in this country. If the patient and the family agree, then it's no one's business but theirs.
    If the patient is incapacitated and has made his/her wishes quite clear that they are to be put down, then it should be done. It would save a ton of money and heartache for all involved.
  • stratavos

    Posts: 1831

    Sep 01, 2015 12:18 AM GMT
    Their body, their choice. Plain and simple. This is my opinion on piercings, tattoos, and pregnancy/abortion too. Unless there's something involving some issues with giving the consent in the first place, or they're not legally old enough, then I see no issues.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 01, 2015 12:42 AM GMT
    It should be legal everywhere.
  • metta

    Posts: 39165

    Sep 01, 2015 1:19 AM GMT
    California is currently working on a basic bill right now...


    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/4025541


    I hope it passes and wish that it allowed for people with dementia to choose to get it while they have the cognitive ability to make that decision.
  • metta

    Posts: 39165

    Sep 01, 2015 1:23 AM GMT
    KyMaverick saidWhat is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?


    In the US, hospice care is generally for people with an estimated less than 6 months to live. Hospice does not encourage death but they do not prevent it from happening either, unless that is the wish of the patient. The 6 months requirement is actually a recent requirement do to cuts in healthcare. Some people used to be on Hospice for as long as a couple of years.

    An advance health care directive, also known as a living will, is normally done so that they know what the persons wishes are as to when they do and do not want care.


    Voluntary euthenasia is the intentional practice of ending a life with the wishes of the patient. In Oregon for example, the patient is given prescription for lethal medication. And there are many steps that people have to take to get to that point. I have read that it is a lot of pills. The patients actually have to take the medication themselves.

    "The patient takes one of two kinds of barbiturates. Seconal costs about $125 for a lethal 10 gram dose, which comes in the form of 100 individual caplets that must be broken apart to produce about three tablespoons of powder. Nembutal comes in a more convenient liquid form. It costs more than $1,000 for a dose, though, and insurance almost never covers lethal drugs."

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2005/10/how_does_assisted_suicide_work.html
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 01, 2015 2:28 AM GMT
    Alpha13 saidIt's only an issue when someone other than the patient is paying the bill.
    And if the patient stays alive with meds and life support, on someone else's tab?

    Food for though. icon_idea.gif
  • Oceans_of_Flo...

    Posts: 393

    Sep 01, 2015 2:39 AM GMT

    KyMaverick saidWhat is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?


    Hospice care is terrible. They starve you and they allow family members to bicker, complain, and divvy up the belongings in your room. Then they entrust the fluffing of your final pillows and blankets to a nurse with her hair up in a bun and wearing silver eye shadow, pretty much insuring the last face you see will be fucking ugly, downturned, and illuminated by the ethereal glow of her Iphone.
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    Sep 01, 2015 2:44 AM GMT
    Musclefetish said
    mx5guynj said
    KyMaverick saidWhat is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?


    They are the same for non-religious institutions. Liberals like the PC term "hospice care" instead of euthanasia similar to calling abortion, "womens reproductive rights" or "womens healthcare".

    In American hospice care, patients are frequently given increasing doses of morphine (most often without informing loved ones or the patient) which depresses respiration and kills them.

    I know someone who was euthanized 3 hours after the first shot of morphine. Another person I knew, after a few days of morphine.


    And? What's your repuke point?

    I wish we could line up you and the rest of your repuke ilk on this site and euthanize the lot of you. icon_cool.gificon_wink.gif
    ^^
    That sounds harsh right?
    Yet the party you align yourself with would like nothing more than to be able to legally do that to every Gay person they could find.
    But please....continue to vote for them and be one of them. icon_rolleyes.gif

    ******************************************************
    To the OP...Euthanasia is something that is completely overdue in this country. If the patient and the family agree, then it's no one's business but theirs.
    If the patient is incapacitated and has made his/her wishes quite clear that they are to be put down, then it should be done. It would save a ton of money and heartache for all involved.


    Here's where you can get the help you need:

    SAMHSA Treatment Referral Helpline – 1‑877‑SAMHSA7 (1‑877‑726‑4727)
    Get general information on mental health and locate treatment services in your area. Speak to a live person, Monday through Friday from 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. EST.

    http://www.mentalhealth.gov/get-help/immediate-help/
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 01, 2015 2:59 AM GMT
    KyMaverick said
    Art_Deco saidI went through a related experience. The State court had granted me emergency full guardian rights, as my partner had medically passed into dimentia, and was legally incompetent. Setting a legal precedent for a gay couple in that State, BTW.

    As his health continued to fail the doctors asked me for permission to take him off life support, and to let him die, his condition medically hopeless. Now THAT'S a tough one.

    I got several opinions, and then gave permission for them to "pull the plug". He died within 24 hours, literally in my arms, with our 3 best friends also at his bedside.

    Obviously it traumatized me, and still haunts me. The arranged death of a loved one, for whatever reason and by whatever means, is an ordeal I hope others never need to face.

    I cant imagine the ordeal and heart ache you went thru. thanks for sharing.

    Thanks for your sympathy. You really don't know what to do. Wait longer? Are you doing the right thing? You're holding a person's life in your hands.

    And not just any person, but your loving partner. I had researched PML online, talked with the doctors, knew it was 100% fatal. But the patient could have brief recoveries. I didn't want to lose him. You hope against hope.

    But the doctors all told me the same thing - he was dying, and I could see it. When he lapsed into a coma I knew that was it, and I said pull the tubes. The last words he ever spoke were "I love you." 24 hours later he was gone. Not easy, not easy at all.
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    Sep 01, 2015 3:06 AM GMT
    Oceans_of_Flowers said
    KyMaverick saidWhat is hospice care and is this defferent than Euthenasia?


    Hospice care is terrible. They starve you and they allow family members to bicker, complain, and divvy up the belongings in your room. Then they entrust the fluffing of your final pillows and blankets to a nurse with her hair up in a bun and wearing silver eye shadow, pretty much insuring the last face you see will be fucking ugly, downturned, and illuminated by the ethereal glow of her Iphone.
    You should be a writer. icon_lol.gif
  • 24hourguy

    Posts: 364

    Sep 01, 2015 3:37 AM GMT
    My dad has Alzheimer's and after living through this with him and seeing what this does to my mom, all i can say is if this ends up being my path too I want the option to end it all before it gets to the point where I can't function, and someone else has to feed me, bathe me, change my diaper...it is no way to live. Life at any cost, isn't always worth living.
  • metta

    Posts: 39165

    Sep 01, 2015 4:55 AM GMT
    ^
    I agree, however, the laws in the US don't allow for this. You have to be mentally competent to make such a decision in the few states that allow it, yet at the same time, only having 6 months or less to live.
  • oldfart

    Posts: 328

    Sep 01, 2015 5:52 AM GMT
    Hospice is meant to ease the patient to a natural death, usually with prescribed pain relievers to try to keep as comfortable as possible. We had excellent care, my late partner and I. He died not in a cold hospital but here in our home we built, in my arms.

    Euthanasia generally means actively inducing death, as with a pet. That's to avoid further, greater suffering. Choosing that for oneself is suicide - provided you take the drug, not a doctor or nurse or loved one doing it. The laws of the states are different, and rights for the dying are very much farther from simplicity - unfortunately - than gay rights. And most of us are likely to face these issues.

    Be acquainted with the opitions in your state. Usually good hospice care groups can help you learn.

    This something every rational adult should be ready to deal with.

    {I don't believe it: an RJ post that really is about life and death. Have I kept a civil tongue?}