Gaysians, let's get our shit together


  • Sep 23, 2015 8:42 PM GMT
    I wanted to post this because the topic of gaysian rejection keeps popping up time and time again, and frankly, it's getting really tiring.

    As a gaysian myself, I 100% empathize and regularly deal with all the issues related to having my race be an issue within the gay dating market.

    Most of the advice given tends to tackle the issue on an individual basis, rather than dealing with it as a systemic issue that has to do with culture and media portrayal.

    Suggested solutions and points that I don't agree with from other gaysians and non-gaysians include:

    1. You don't need to be with someone who is racist and doesn't give you the time of day in the first place.
    2. Build yourself and wait. You can't look for love, the universe will provide you with a partner when you're ready.
    3. Everyone has their preferences, it's human nature to veer towards what they're familiar with. You can't be upset at someone for being inherently human.
    4. Build up your self esteem. People with low self confidence don't get partners. And no one wants a partner with mental issues.
    5. I've never had to deal with this. All the non-gaysian people I know are colorblind and accepting. You're obviously bitching and whining and probably very ugly by Asian standards too and pulling the race card.

    All of the above, in variations too, place the burden of having to deal with this issue as an individual. It removes the responsibility of confronting racial politics from the society and frankly, this style of thinking also bleeds into mainstream Asian American society in that, as youth, we're discouraged by our peers and society from social activism or political engagement. "Worry about yourself first, take care of your family first, etc."

    Sure you've got activists at liberal colleges and cities, but they are marginalized within their own communities.

    Here are my rebuttals to the above points:

    1. Sexual racism isn't just an issue of getting laid. In the gay world, sexual capital also translates to social capital. Gay men can be really shallow and groups can definitely socialize with individuals based off of perceived sexual value. Imagine a group of cute bottoms who want everyone in the group to look alike so they can go to the club together as a clique. The lack of sexual capital gaysians face also translates to a loss in social capital.
    2. Telling someone to invest in themselves and wait is akin to perpetuating the very stereotype that makes other men look down on gaysians in the first place: submissiveness. This also tells us to have a fatalistic view of the universe and takes away our agency of free will and choice.
    3. WRONG WRONG WRONG. Patterns of human interaction and mate selection, especially for people of color, has always been affected by cultural factors.
    Did you know that Hawaiian men were seen as hypersexual threats to white women during America's colonial period?
    Or that white men were seen as smelly, unkempt barbarians in China and Japan during initial colonial contact?
    Social policies, as well as agents of exposure between cultures, as well as colonial legacies have always affected, social mentalities, especially those relating to endogamy.
    In Spanish colonies, the casta paintings portrayed a system where to marry someone indigenous would consign your child to a lower social status, while someone of mixed blood could bring up a family’s social status by progressively whitening the gene pool with Spanish partners. Respectable young white men were expected to marry a white girl from the old continent, while the locals were either relegated to concubines or mistresses. This legacy is still prevalent in Latino media where beautiful men and women are portrayed as having Western European features, whilst Black and Indigenous characters are typically the objects of ridicule and derision.
    Brazil, on the other hand, had a legacy of race mixture that makes them the most mixed country on the planet. It’s not like they don’t have their race problems, but at least interracial sex/dating is less taboo.
    4. Crazy, low self esteemed people get laid too! Some of them even get into relationships! Most people don’t care as long as they’re hot and that’s why they don’t bother to change or improve their mental situation.
    5. Someone is lucky enough to live in a bubble. Just because you didn’t have that experience doesn’t make it invalidated. Especially if you’ve culturally assimilated. If threads by people experiencing sexual racism keep popping up, it’s still a problem. This also connects with point 2. which falls in line with the logic of respectability politics that Black Americans have been urged, often by conservative media, to follow. They are told: if you act white, if you come off as respectable, if you assimilate and work hard, speak American English, get educated, you will have the same opportunities and be treated as an equal. The burden in both cases is placed on the minority group instead of the dominant society the morph and adapt. And look how well that turned out? Black UVA student still slammed to the ground by police for having a fake ID.

    I’m proposing a multi-pronged approach of how to collective deal with this problem:
    Support or start an organization that supports getting Asian faces, especially male faces, in different roles in movies, especially sexy and romantic one, as well as other media outlets. The fact of the matter is, as an ethnic group we earn more than any other, it’s about time we funneled that financial capital into organizations that supported Asian-American professionals in the arts. If you say, “we can’t convince these studio executives to do it, Hollywood has a race problem that it’s not willing to confront”. Well a large portion of movie profits come from abroad nowadays, and no doubt having Asian leads will boost box office performance in places like China.
    As a community, gaysians have to support each other when we DO try to go outside the box and craft non-stereotyical identies. On a personal note, recreationally I love to dance to salsa and African music (traditional percussion and afro-pop), and professionally I want to be an entrepreneur or politican and I get the side eye from my own community like ”How interesting…” or “Why is an Asian doing XYZ?” “Worry about stability first and then your dreams. If there are gaysians trying to break the box that keeps us all in, why on earth would you discourage them?
    We need more Asian men in porn. Peter Le is already doing it with Peter Fever but the fact of the matter is, for lots of new gays exploring their sexuality, pornography is the initial foray and exposure to gay sexuality. It has an outsized effect on our preferences. And it has to mainstream American porn. None of that blurred out shit with the actors wearing swimming goggles. And fetishized sites just exacerbate the issue.
    We need to be open to dating non-white people too. Nothing worse than perpetuating the crap that is placed on oneself. I see Asian men who crave white guys, get pissed because they can’t get any, but don’t give other men of color the time of day. What do they say when called out on their hypocrisy? “Just a preference.” They themselves never question where how their own racially based sexual attractions were formed. But you know what? “No fats, no femmes, no Blacks, no Asians” is all in the same sentence. If they won’t fuck with us, why not fuck each other? Personally, I’m a musically inclined person who NEEDS to dance, and if I have partners from cultures where dancing and musical expression is prominent, all the better. For all you doubters, yes, I have hooked up and almost dated black men, and yes BBC with a TAA* was a match made in heaven. Beyond the sex, we connected on cultural matters too as educated POCs. And yes I know you shouldn’t fetishize and not all black guys are big, but this about keeping one’s options open.
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    Sep 23, 2015 9:38 PM GMT
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    Sep 24, 2015 12:48 AM GMT
    Your multi-prong approach is worthless without the most important point, which is Asians need to stop settling for older or uglier just to get a white guy.

    And Asians who say they "never noticed this" are just pretending to be "white enough". Anyone who's been in the scene for five minutes would know.
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    Sep 24, 2015 12:54 AM GMT
    Aqueerius saidYour multi-prong approach is worthless without the most important point, which is Asians need to stop settling for older or uglier just to get a white guy.

    And Asians who say they "never noticed this" are just pretending to be "white enough". Anyone who's been in the scene for five minutes would know.


    Yes, there is truth in this. There are a lot of Asians who will demoralize themselves to either blend in mostly in white culture or settle for less then what they deserve.

    Honestly they need to find their self worth before they start to complain that why doesn't "X" race find them attractive.
  • SilverRRCloud

    Posts: 873

    Sep 24, 2015 4:36 AM GMT
    I somehow strongly doubt the idea that a guy wakes up in the morning, says, I am gay Asian/Black/Caucasian/college student/farm hand or whoever, and I want to get OUR shit together.

    A dude gets up in the morning, and says, I want to get laid with a guy I, (as in 'I PERSONALLY') find attractive. Now, let's see how do I go about doing this?

    Telling anyone that they should not go for whom they find attractive but for whom it would be easier/more productive/more efficient, etc., from YOUR point of view is really not helpful.

    The idea that our taste in men may be engineered by the prevailing porn, societal attitudes, politics, history, colonialism, etc., may, in itself, be true. But a guy is a guy. He likes who he likes, and there is little anyone can do about it. A dude knows whom he finds attractive, and he wants to mess around with this dude. Trying to re-wire his taste in men is futile.

    No one out there is telling anyone that they have to like the stereotypes created by the porn industry. And, if you go around, you'll see that some dudes do, and some dudes don't.

    Few guys are going to mess around with someone just because they see that they will be helping an imaginary global shift in the subject 'taste in men'. You hook up with a dude because you find him attractive, and because you believe that the sex, relationship, friendship, etc., will suit you.

    Sex is deeply personal.

    SC
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Sep 24, 2015 6:04 PM GMT
    I thought the OP had some interesting insights. The naysayers are just not going to acknowledge that a trend is also like a social movement, in which individual tastes are shaped by social biases.

    @Aqueerius, didn't you start a thread in which you justified dating a younger guy? I know you're not as old as the "old guys" you're referring to, but you're not dating guys your own age either. Is there an age at which you'll start being more scrupulous?
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    Sep 24, 2015 7:55 PM GMT
    Also, please stop using the word "gaysian". It further segregates and stereotypes gay Asians.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Sep 24, 2015 8:30 PM GMT
    xrichx saidAlso, please stop using the word "gaysian". It further segregates and stereotypes gay Asians.

    Yeah, that might be less demeaning????icon_question.gificon_idea.gif
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    Sep 24, 2015 8:39 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    xrichx saidAlso, please stop using the word "gaysian". It further segregates and stereotypes gay Asians.

    Yeah, that might be less demeaning????icon_question.gificon_idea.gif


    Is Rice Queen still cool?

  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Sep 24, 2015 8:43 PM GMT
    dustin_K_tx said
    HottJoe said
    xrichx saidAlso, please stop using the word "gaysian". It further segregates and stereotypes gay Asians.

    Yeah, that might be less demeaning????icon_question.gificon_idea.gif


    Is Rice Queen still cool?


    No, it's so passe. If you're going to turn people into demeaning fetishes, at least go for something like bear fisting. Come on, gay community, it's time to raise the bar!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 24, 2015 8:52 PM GMT
    dustin_K_tx said
    HottJoe said
    xrichx saidAlso, please stop using the word "gaysian". It further segregates and stereotypes gay Asians.

    Yeah, that might be less demeaning????icon_question.gificon_idea.gif


    Is Rice Queen still cool?


    Only if they've been crowned queen of the rice festival.

    1919133_331023289074_2891484_n.jpg
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    Sep 28, 2015 6:49 AM GMT
    I haven't been on here for months... and Asian issues are still high on the dating section icon_lol.gif


    I do think that the OP did honestly hit on some good points. But i think that we (half like myself or full) Asians have to look at our community issues as well. The fact is a lot of Asians in America only go for white guys. That's just a fact I've learned especially here in Los Angeles!

    it's different when i was in Japan and in Thailand as well. The gay asian communities there were bigger obviously and not as mean to each other. Here i constantly hear ''i couldn't date another Asian guy it's like dating my cousin'' or ''all asians are ugly but i think I'm good looking for an Asian''

    I see asians hate on asians just as much as those ''grindr'' white people do. So i think that's something that i think should be at the front of the conversation as well. Cause it honestly makes me sad to see that happen...
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    Sep 28, 2015 6:46 PM GMT
    Well said by OP.
  • TealSock

    Posts: 30

    Oct 02, 2015 11:22 PM GMT
    It's just the way things are, I personally don't agree with it or think that being attracted to a race is an innate thing, I think everybody can be attracted to everyone.

    So you are just dealing with a society that has been brainwashed into thinking white is perfect, the whole world is like this, it'sbecause of the West's dominance in the media. White people are everywhere, even billboards in Asia.

    It doesn't mean we are better, it just means we were the first to start massive commercialization of our societies, and that's being spread to other countries.

    I was raised around a decent amount of Asians, I find them attractive, I literally find every race attractive, and do not understand it.
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    Oct 12, 2015 4:08 PM GMT
    Confident Asians never tend to date outside their own race, so not all Asians are what the OP speaks of. I find that only the Shallow and insecure Asian men are the ones who have this hang up. So you claim that they are racist that they don't find you attractive, but you aren't because you don't find the other races attractive but only white people. Hmm, yea it doesn't work like that.

    You are the one putting yourself in so much turmoil, no one else.
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    Oct 13, 2015 6:18 PM GMT
    I did not bother reading that badly written self hating gay asian intro, but I will say this about gay asians. Hairless and submissive, thank you jeebus.
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    Oct 13, 2015 6:39 PM GMT
    Mesmer saidConfident Asians never tend to date outside their own race, so not all Asians are what the OP speaks of. I find that only the Shallow and insecure Asian men are the ones who have this hang up. So you claim that they are racist that they don't find you attractive, but you aren't because you don't find the other races attractive but only white people. Hmm, yea it doesn't work like that.

    You are the one putting yourself in so much turmoil, no one else.
    You forgot to mention...let's do some Yoga!
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    Oct 13, 2015 8:47 PM GMT
    Fine_Young_Cannibal said
    Mesmer saidConfident Asians never tend to date outside their own race, so not all Asians are what the OP speaks of. I find that only the Shallow and insecure Asian men are the ones who have this hang up. So you claim that they are racist that they don't find you attractive, but you aren't because you don't find the other races attractive but only white people. Hmm, yea it doesn't work like that.

    You are the one putting yourself in so much turmoil, no one else.
    You forgot to mention...let's do some Yoga!


    I'd gladly do some yoga with you