Disappointments is dating and pursuing guys

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 10:52 AM GMT
    I need to vent and hopefully some insight(not advice per say) about what seems to be the issues with gay men in general when it comes to connections beyond sexual attraction and commitment issues that so many seem to have.

    I recently had to cut ties with a guy that I was talking with over text and phone. WE met a few years ago and some wild terms, but after I became recently single, we reconnected and had been texting and talking on the phone. We talked about a number of issues regarding relationships, commitment and what we wanted from one and possibly from each other.

    We are both in rough spots in out lives right now, and I understand that the timing may have not been right, but we still had agreed to take things slow and meet for coffee a few times and talk about possibly dating.

    It was all fine and good until last Thursday he invited me over for drinks and to spend the night. I thought I was just gonna go over there and then either cuddle with him and sleep. He had work the next morning, so I didn't think anything of it. That was obviously a very poor decision on my part. We ended up drinking and having sex, and it was terrible because I have performance anxiety the first time if I'm having high expectations put on me and even worse when I'm drunk to tipsy.

    I didn't sleep well that night and had to leave early with him the next morning to go home so he could drop his kid off at day care and then go to work.

    Here's where I'm just really confused and fed up:

    Why is it that gay men do this? Why do they play games like this, and why do they lead people on and then lie just to get some action? Why can't they just be honest and upfront from the get go? What's the issue?

    I've been upfront with this guy from day one, and he has never reciprocated any of the communication that I gave him. That was also another red flag, and I brushed it off because maybe he was really shy or just didn't know what to say right away. I was understanding to a fault, but he took full and clear advantage of it, and of me, especially that night when we were drunk.

    Why do gay men do this?

    All I wanted was an honest connection and clear reciprocated communication, and all I got was standoffish one worded answers every time.

    It seems like every time I try to presue someone I like, they effectively blow me off and play these fucking games with me. I"m too old for this shit. I'm almost 30, and I don't have time for this shit anymore. What the fuck is wrong with people these days!?

    I've cut him off, and I will not presue him anymore, and will also not do the same with anyone else anymore. I also don't want to hear this bullshit about how it's me not trying hard enough, or there are more guys out there, or what the fuck ever bullshit can be spewed at me because I've heard it all and believe me, It's old as fuck to me now.

    I'm tired of being blown off, lied to, led on, and not having reciprocated communication.

    Did I do something by being forward and direct with this guy, did I scare him off, or is he just too immature and insecure about himself?

    The "I'm very busy bullshit" doesn't cut it with me anymore, either.

    So yeah, thought, comments, etc?

    GO!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 1:46 PM GMT
    Some (but not all) gay guys are selfish and self-centered. They focus on what feels good to them and often they fixate on the "now" with very little regard for what might happen in the future. Their principal concern is what will satisfy their needs at the moment, and damn the potential consequences. There are, of course, gay men who embody the characteristics that we all look for in a potential partner: self-discipline, empathy, respect, honesty, integrity, etc. These gay men are hard to find, but they exist.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 1:54 PM GMT
    Date straight guys. Problem solved.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 2:52 PM GMT
    Lol! You fell for the old Let's Cuddle line. Don't you know cuddle is gay speak for I'm Going To Get you Home, Tipsey, Naked, and Horizontal with Your Legs in The Air Faster Than A New York Minute?

    Besides, he has a kid. You don't need that at your age.

    Lesson learned. Move on and don't look back.

    P.S. The word is "pursue" not "presue."
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 3:22 PM GMT
    UndercoverMan saidLol! You fell for the old Let's Cuddle line. Don't you know cuddle is gay speak for I'm Going To Get you Home, Tipsey, Naked, and Horizontal with Your Legs in The Air Faster Than A New York Minute?

    Besides, he has a kid. You don't need that at your age.

    Lesson learned. Move on and don't look back.

    P.S. The word is "pursue" not "presue."


    I hate being gay sometimes. This has caused so much confusion between me and other gay guys. I say what I actually mean. If I say I want to cuddle that's what I want. I accidentally led this guy on because I had just taken a lot of massage continuing education hours. I wanted to practice some new techniques on a non paying subject so I would be free to mess up and learn. Turns out he thought I was inviting him over for sex.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 3:29 PM GMT
    I'm sorry to hear this buttercup. It happens a lot in life. There is a saying that its easier to apologize than to ask for permission. Its easier to mislead and hurt others to get what you want and then apologize if the truth is ever brought up, than it is too be upfront and face possible frustration.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 3:30 PM GMT
    DOMINUS saidSome (but not all) gay guys are selfish and self-centered. They focus on what feels good to them and often they fixate on the "now" with very little regard for what might happen in the future. Their principal concern is what will satisfy their needs at the moment, and damn the potential consequences. There are, of course, gay men who embody the characteristics that we all look for in a potential partner: self-discipline, empathy, respect, honesty, integrity, etc. These gay men are hard to find, but they exist.


    When we do find them we find something wrong so we can't date them.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 3:45 PM GMT
    YOu know a couple of years back dating was really hard for me. Not for the fact that I couldn't land any dates, but the fact that I did not know the true intentions of the men that wanted to date me. Did they just want sex? or were they looking for something more long term such as myself?

    I understand where the OP is coming from, I feel that while I may look young, I'm too old to be playing these fickle games with gay men.

    I've dated younger guys, and guys even twice my age. And let me tell you, there is nothing you can say or do that will ever change a guy. Men never change regardless of age and the only ones that can change them, is themselves. So you can cut out all the bullshit, and the sweet talk when you guys are first talking. If they really like you, they will do everything they can to keep in contact with you. If they want more then sex from you, they will talk to you on a daily basis via text, calls, and just simply ask you how your day is. If a man only wants sex, he will make sure that the enviorment is set up for it. (Night time, his place/or yours), drinking, all signs of dead give aways.

    To the OP I've struggled with the dating world and trust me when men whine on how they can't get dates, I kind of envy thoes guys because the guys that do manage to get to go on dates is like jumping in shark infested waters. If you have your heart bleeding all over your sleeve trust me, those men won't give a damn about you, or your feelings. And those men wear many faces, guys you would think that would never hurt a fly could unintentionally lead you on.


    My best advice for you OP is find someone that is willing to date you in broad day light, on multiple dates, not at his house, or yours, and cut the liquor on the dates. Find a guy that is excited to talk to you as you are excited to talk to him. A relationship can't develope if only one person is putting all the effort. And if you are ever feeling like that then you know that this guy isn't the one. You're only hurting yourself if you keep trying to make believe it is.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 3:58 PM GMT
    jjohnson88 said

    Here's where I'm just really confused and fed up:

    Why is it that gay men do this? Why do they play games like this, and why do they lead people on and then lie just to get some action? Why can't they just be honest and upfront from the get go? What's the issue?


    Very confused about your whole post to be honest. He invited you over to stay the night and you thought you were just going to cuddle. Where is the game playing you're talking about? If you invite someone over to stay the night, it's not unreasonable to think that sex might be involved. You were presumably a willing participant in the sex so I don't see where he has lied and played games?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 3:59 PM GMT
    6a00d8341c795b53ef0133ec49b56e970b-800wi
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 4:16 PM GMT
    PulseFit said
    jjohnson88 said

    Here's where I'm just really confused and fed up:

    Why is it that gay men do this? Why do they play games like this, and why do they lead people on and then lie just to get some action? Why can't they just be honest and upfront from the get go? What's the issue?


    Very confused about your whole post to be honest. He invited you over to stay the night and you thought you were just going to cuddle. Where is the game playing you're talking about? If you invite someone over to stay the night, it's not unreasonable to think that sex might be involved. You were presumably a willing participant in the sex so I don't see where he has lied and played games?


    There is a huge difference between might and expected. There is a difference between inviting someone over to spend time with and thinking you might have sex than inviting someone over for the sole purpose of having sex without making tat explicit.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 4:33 PM GMT
    that evening two men had slightly different needs and hopefully you two were able to meet mid way. So no one was 100% ok, how romantic.

    for a loving situation:
    -your performance anxiety should have been his concern too.
    -his daycare & work schedule was your schedule too.

    in a relationship there is this third person, the sum of everything that is seldom fulfilled.

    So my question is would you date this person again knowing you will not get all you want but nothing lost, two lives are incrementally better.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 4:50 PM GMT
    MrFuscle said
    There is a huge difference between might and expected. There is a difference between inviting someone over to spend time with and thinking you might have sex than inviting someone over for the sole purpose of having sex without making tat explicit.


    But that's my point, unless I missed something the guy didn't explicitly state "I am inviting you over for non-sexual cuddles only" - the OP just thought that was the case. As it turned out, things developed into sex - well it takes two to tango, if he didn't want to have sex he didn't have to. I still see no evidence of game playing or lying.

    Nowhere does it say in the post that the guy said subsequently "Oh yeah I said to just come over but really I always planned to fuck you." If a grown man that you have had sex with previously invites you to sleep over it's not beyond the realm of possibility that sex is going to happen, unless he had clearly stated (and not just been assumed by the OP who again was in no way coerced into sex and seems to have been a willing participant) that sex was absolutely not going to happen while secretly planning that it would.

    It's just not clear to me that this guy lied or played any games at all, I'm not attacking the OP but it's not how I interpret the situation.
  • ai82

    Posts: 183

    Dec 07, 2015 4:54 PM GMT
    There are people who will manipulate you to get what they want. He wanted you... you wanted him... Is the problem that you had sex or that he isn't responding to you since you had sex?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 4:57 PM GMT
    ai82 saidThere are people who will manipulate you to get what they want. He wanted you... you wanted him... Is the problem that you had sex or that he isn't responding to you since you had sex?


    I think the OP's issue is the after fact. Yes he was dead set on that both of them wanted each other even after the fact sex was involved. OP's issue now is that the guy is being distant after sex insued. Which is not actually suprising at all. The distancing yourself after sex or what I like to call it "the fade away" is not something the OP should be suprised about. At least it's better then the vanishing act where the guy just never contact you at all ever, after it happens.
  • SilverRRCloud

    Posts: 875

    Dec 07, 2015 5:19 PM GMT
    The OP reports going through a rough spot.

    The guy he went on a date with is apparently going through a rough spot, too.

    It may be true that 'misery loves company' but I would stop short of assuming that a reunion of the two guys with problems will result in a problem-free and blissful future for them.

    So, a good starter may be to sort out your issues first, and start looking for a good BF as soon as you happen to be relaxed, with your anxieties down, and with your life under control.

    Like the OP says, he almost 30.

    Either choose to adopt a positive attitude towards sex, and see it as something that adult gay men do for recreational purposes, and something that does not carry any meaning most of the time.

    Or

    Adopt a restrictive attitude, and embrace the heteronormative idea that sex has to have something to do with the veritable emotions of the people involved with it.

    Should you take the former path, do not worry about the people inviting you to spend overnight at their place. More likely than not, they mean sex. You are not 11 year old boys, after all.

    Should you choose to take the latter path, build up your defenses, and insist on meeting in coffee shops for long talks. Emulate the heteronormative experience, and you'll get all your prayers answered.icon_twisted.gif

    SC
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 7:16 PM GMT
    PulseFit said
    MrFuscle said
    There is a huge difference between might and expected. There is a difference between inviting someone over to spend time with and thinking you might have sex than inviting someone over for the sole purpose of having sex without making tat explicit.


    But that's my point, unless I missed something the guy didn't explicitly state "I am inviting you over for non-sexual cuddles only" - the OP just thought that was the case. As it turned out, things developed into sex - well it takes two to tango, if he didn't want to have sex he didn't have to. I still see no evidence of game playing or lying.

    Nowhere does it say in the post that the guy said subsequently "Oh yeah I said to just come over but really I always planned to fuck you." If a grown man that you have had sex with previously invites you to sleep over it's not beyond the realm of possibility that sex is going to happen, unless he had clearly stated (and not just been assumed by the OP who again was in no way coerced into sex and seems to have been a willing participant) that sex was absolutely not going to happen while secretly planning that it would.

    It's just not clear to me that this guy lied or played any games at all, I'm not attacking the OP but it's not how I interpret the situation.


    I can see where you are coming from. I guess I am reading too much of my past experience and some of the previous poster's views into it. You are right the OP had the option to say no. Sense he wasn't explicitly invited over for sex his host should have gracefully accepted that had he done so.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 7:24 PM GMT
    SilverRRCloud saidThe OP reports going through a rough spot.

    The guy he went on a date with is apparently going through a rough spot, too.

    It may be true that 'misery loves company' but I would stop short of assuming that a reunion of the two guys with problems will result in a problem-free and blissful future for them.

    So, a good starter may be to sort out your issues first, and start looking for a good BF as soon as you happen to be relaxed, with your anxieties down, and with your life under control.

    Like the OP says, he almost 30.

    Either choose to adopt a positive attitude towards sex, and see it as something that adult gay men do for recreational purposes, and something that does not carry any meaning most of the time.

    Or

    Adopt a restrictive attitude, and embrace the heteronormative idea that sex has to have something to do with the veritable emotions of the people involved with it.

    Should you take the former path, do not worry about the people inviting you to spend overnight at their place. More likely than not, they mean sex. You are not 11 year old boys, after all.

    Should you choose to take the latter path, build up your defenses, and insist on meeting in coffee shops for long talks. Emulate the heteronormative experience, and you'll get all your prayers answered.icon_twisted.gif

    SC


    You are way too hung up on your pure version of being sex positive or sex negative. Sex is complicated because it has so many roles. It can be fun, therapeutic, informative, provocative, transformative, emotional or even violent. Because sex is so many things it behooves people to be upfront when they want sex. It has nothing to do with being sex negative. Its about understanding that sex has many roles in human affairs and using it in the proper context. They should have both been more forthright about their expectations for the evening. Who knows being up front could have led to some bomb ass sex.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 7:51 PM GMT
    SilverRRCloud saidThe OP reports going through a rough spot.

    The guy he went on a date with is apparently going through a rough spot, too.

    It may be true that 'misery loves company' but I would stop short of assuming that a reunion of the two guys with problems will result in a problem-free and blissful future for them.

    So, a good starter may be to sort out your issues first, and start looking for a good BF as soon as you happen to be relaxed, with your anxieties down, and with your life under control.

    Like the OP says, he almost 30.

    Either choose to adopt a positive attitude towards sex, and see it as something that adult gay men do for recreational purposes, and something that does not carry any meaning most of the time.

    Or

    Adopt a restrictive attitude, and embrace the heteronormative idea that sex has to have something to do with the veritable emotions of the people involved with it.

    Should you take the former path, do not worry about the people inviting you to spend overnight at their place. More likely than not, they mean sex. You are not 11 year old boys, after all.

    Should you choose to take the latter path, build up your defenses, and insist on meeting in coffee shops for long talks. Emulate the heteronormative experience, and you'll get all your prayers answered.icon_twisted.gif

    SC

    Great! Everything related with keeping your dicks in pant is hetero-normative now? Ah! gay men.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 8:23 PM GMT
    why people can't be happy with what they have? why people build expectations and standards which leads to disappointment, why people cannot accept each other the way they are? And why you just cannot accept yourself ?
  • Oceans_of_Flo...

    Posts: 393

    Dec 07, 2015 8:58 PM GMT

    Please stop. Stop demonizing gay sex. He liked you, you liked him and the two of you had sex. If you wanted more, you should have been uncompromising. It wouldn't have done a bit of difference and you would have still wound up on your back sucking his fingers. Why? Because you like sex with men, there is nothing wrong with that. You say you'll wait now and you'll probably make it for a few days, then you'll get an itch you can't scratch, wind up on your back again, and after, feel guilty. Why feel guilty?

    Why do gay men do this? Why do gay men have you over, make you comfortable with a brew and soft music; why do they kiss you where you want to be kissed, touch you places you didn't know you wanted to be touched, and put you in positions that would make White House security blush? It's because they want to accommodate someone they fancy. It isn't untoward, it isn't evil. .... it isn't random or unprovoked either.

    He payed attention to you and read between the small talk. He got the message from you and threw down the gauntlet, one you picked up. You came over, you drank, you had consensual sex, and yet, he's a bad guy?

    If you like sex from this guy, I don't understand why you'd punish him for taking control. Yes, I know, an LTR. Are you certain that was in the cards - you even had prior dealings with this man and you'd talked yourselves blue.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 10:28 PM GMT
    Some guys are selfish and will play you like a fiddle to get what they want. Some guys aren't.

    The sooner you realize this, the easier it'll be for you. Always be vigilant, read between the lines. Do whatever you have to do to protect your heart.

    Live and learn from your experiences.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 10:45 PM GMT
    PulseFit said
    MrFuscle said
    There is a huge difference between might and expected. There is a difference between inviting someone over to spend time with and thinking you might have sex than inviting someone over for the sole purpose of having sex without making tat explicit.


    But that's my point, unless I missed something the guy didn't explicitly state "I am inviting you over for non-sexual cuddles only" - the OP just thought that was the case. As it turned out, things developed into sex - well it takes two to tango, if he didn't want to have sex he didn't have to. I still see no evidence of game playing or lying.

    Nowhere does it say in the post that the guy said subsequently "Oh yeah I said to just come over but really I always planned to fuck you." If a grown man that you have had sex with previously invites you to sleep over it's not beyond the realm of possibility that sex is going to happen, unless he had clearly stated (and not just been assumed by the OP who again was in no way coerced into sex and seems to have been a willing participant) that sex was absolutely not going to happen while secretly planning that it would.

    It's just not clear to me that this guy lied or played any games at all, I'm not attacking the OP but it's not how I interpret the situation.


    We had talked weeks before and both stated that we didn't want to hook up and were done with it. I would assume after a bad marriage on his part that he would be understanding to that. I guess not. Yes, I was stupid to go over there, and I'm not denying that, but I also feel that he did lie, especially after I called him the next day to talk about what happened. He was unrelenting in his responses. I felt like I was talking to a wall. I feel that he did lie. We don't have to agree, but I feel like I was lied to because he did the opposite of what he had originally told me.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 10:47 PM GMT
    Oceans_of_Flowers said
    Please stop. Stop demonizing gay sex. He liked you, you liked him and the two of you had sex. If you wanted more, you should have been uncompromising. It wouldn't have done a bit of difference and you would have still wound up on your back sucking his fingers. Why? Because you like sex with men, there is nothing wrong with that. You say you'll wait now and you'll probably make it for a few days, then you'll get an itch you can't scratch, wind up on your back again, and after, feel guilty. Why feel guilty?

    Why do gay men do this? Why do gay men have you over, make you comfortable with a brew and soft music; why do they kiss you where you want to be kissed, touch you places you didn't know you wanted to be touched, and put you in positions that would make White House security blush? It's because they want to accommodate someone they fancy. It isn't untoward, it isn't evil. .... it isn't random or unprovoked either.

    He payed attention to you and read between the small talk. He got the message from you and threw down the gauntlet, one you picked up. You came over, you drank, you had consensual sex, and yet, he's a bad guy?

    If you like sex from this guy, I don't understand why you'd punish him for taking control. Yes, I know, an LTR. Are you certain that was in the cards - you even had prior dealings with this man and you'd talked yourselves blue.



    I was in a LTR for 2.5 years. I used to feel the same way you did about sex and whatnot related to the gay issues surrounding sex--I still have those views. I took a risk and a chance and got burned. I'll never do it again, and trust me. I am definitely not going to be scratching any itches for a while. gaychatroulette works wonders, so I'll be fine with that until I find the right guy.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Dec 07, 2015 10:51 PM GMT
    SilverRRCloud saidThe OP reports going through a rough spot.

    The guy he went on a date with is apparently going through a rough spot, too.

    It may be true that 'misery loves company' but I would stop short of assuming that a reunion of the two guys with problems will result in a problem-free and blissful future for them.

    So, a good starter may be to sort out your issues first, and start looking for a good BF as soon as you happen to be relaxed, with your anxieties down, and with your life under control.

    Like the OP says, he almost 30.

    Either choose to adopt a positive attitude towards sex, and see it as something that adult gay men do for recreational purposes, and something that does not carry any meaning most of the time.

    Or

    Adopt a restrictive attitude, and embrace the heteronormative idea that sex has to have something to do with the veritable emotions of the people involved with it.

    Should you take the former path, do not worry about the people inviting you to spend overnight at their place. More likely than not, they mean sex. You are not 11 year old boys, after all.

    Should you choose to take the latter path, build up your defenses, and insist on meeting in coffee shops for long talks. Emulate the heteronormative experience, and you'll get all your prayers answered.icon_twisted.gif

    SC


    I can only be so strict anymore. I had made plans with him before to just have coffee and get together and talk. We even talked on the phone for an hour the first night we talked.

    I am still going to stick to my guns when it comes to my attitudes towards sex nd dating because he played me and made me out to look stupid, and I'm not going to settle for that again.

    I've been through this enough to know that it doesn't seem to matter what I do anymore, guys are going to always choose the latter of sex and then fading away over anything else.