New Study Finds Gay Ageism Linked Depression Is Rampant in the Mature LGBT Community

  • metta

    Posts: 39165

    Dec 17, 2015 6:09 AM GMT
    New Study Finds Gay Ageism Linked Depression Is Rampant in the Mature LGBT Community


    http://www.back2stonewall.com/2015/12/study-finds-gay-ageism-linked-depression-rampant-mature-lgbt-community.html
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    Dec 17, 2015 12:42 PM GMT
    Interesting study. I can understand why some of us in my age bracket would feel that way. Oddly enough, I haven't personally encountered much ageism in NYC. I started to feel invisible in the Midwest as I grew older, but my 40s and 50s have been great so far in NY. Perhaps a total middle-age life change and career change helped.
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    Dec 17, 2015 2:24 PM GMT
    If I've been subjected to gay ageism locally in person I'm hardly aware of it. But then I don't go out of my way to socialize with much younger guys, so maybe that's a form of reverse ageism on my part. I've got a busy social life within my own age range and am quite "visible", and if younger guys are snubbing me I wouldn't notice it.

    And I really don't expect young people to hang out with oldsters, anyway. They have their own lives & interests and I have mine. We mix pleasantly enough at social functions but that's enough for me.

    In fact, the only ageism I encounter is right here on RJ. Almost every guy who insults & bashes me drags my age into it, as though that proves their superiority and right to criticize.

    Honestly I'd think the exact opposite would be true, that youth & inexperience undermines their arguments on many topics we discuss here, and they'd be better off not to emphasize it. But I suppose unsupportable prejudice would be a common component of ageism.
  • jeepguySD

    Posts: 651

    Dec 17, 2015 3:09 PM GMT
    Ageism in the Southern California gay community certainly exists. Having just returned from 3 years in the DC area, ageism exists there too. I also find that most (not all) younger guys here on RJ won't even say "thank you" for a polite and sincere compliment.
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    Dec 17, 2015 3:16 PM GMT
    Sure it exists, and I've certainly encountered it firsthand as much as anyone my age (63), but I believe that investing too much in what calls itself "the gay community" only heightens exposure to it. The last thing I need or want is some DB 25+ years younger than I telling me how to live my life. I encounter it among straights as well, but to a much lesser degree and in much less harsher terms of delivery. One nice thing about growing older is experiencing the camaraderie that "older folks" seem to share, and much more spontaneously than their younger counterparts. Perhaps we appreciate each other more because we are, in a sense, survivors.
  • JackNNJ

    Posts: 1051

    Dec 17, 2015 4:16 PM GMT
    Fatism is more constructive. No one can be shamed into being younger. But the opportunities are wide open to shame piewagons into good health.

    The wideloads fail to understand the aesthetic scourge they represent. We can help. Join us today.
  • 24hourguy

    Posts: 364

    Dec 17, 2015 4:22 PM GMT
    I guess if I were putting myself in situations where I were surrounded by a bunch of 20-somethings I'd notice it. What I have noticed is that I tend to hang around with people around my age and we just do different things than we did in our 20's.
    Frankly, I don't waste much time worrying about what some baby-gay thinks of me (if they even do).
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Dec 17, 2015 4:41 PM GMT
    I think it makes everyone depressed. I hear 30 year olds, or even twenty-somethings who are afraid of turning 30, seeming overly dismal about it.

    I've been accused of ageism for advising older guys to try dating guys their own age, but I actually think my advice is the only way to stop these evil brats:

    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/4151703

    ^all those posts and nothing to say.

    Let them have their cake.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 5:06 PM GMT
    theantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    Of the 170 I've currently clicked onto ignore, here's what I posted into their internal notes of the random first 31 on the list...

    super disgusting
    trolling as an anti-American
    ageist
    disgusting piece of shit
    quoted post with gross pic in it
    perv really disgusting
    puppet
    ageist scumbag
    random ignore
    keeps posting ass stuff
    too often wrong
    douche (and curiously this guy came back as another screenname also on ignore also with comment that he seems to be a douche to everyone lol. what a surprise that, huh)
    ageist scum
    disgusting
    sock suspected
    just wants to fight
    asshole
    random ignore
    disgusting posts
    too much ass stuff
    ageist
    fuck'm
    scum ageist
    perv
    argumentative wackjob
    too presumptuous
    a perv and total scumbag
    non stop ass stuff
    always with the ass
    guy’s a douche
    seems to be a scumbag to everyone (see above lol) also ageist scum. fuck'm

    So 6 out of 31 of that part of the ignore list or about 20% of those I click onto ignore are because of their ageist comments.

    I'm a good person and there's no reason for me to see that shit. So I just click that onto ignore. It's not even been directed at me except by that hottjoe piece of shit but even when I see these guys do it to others or just make ageist statements in general, I click them onto ignore as soon as I read it. Nothing I'd ever need to see a 2nd time. That's what I think of them: nothing.

    Even when we were kids when our political mantra was don't trust anyone over 30, we were never so purposely, personally disrespectful to others as are these scumbags today.

    To the study, I've found that to be real true and I've expressed the same on this forum. I'd have added though that the ageism effects str8s too. I've a cousin who struggles with it, though she self-admittedly has vanity issues so where she used to get hit on, now she gets called mam.

    I didn't know I had vanity issues in that I always knew I had the look that people wanted to bed and I was generous with that, I had a lot of fun. But when I got older, probably when I hit my mid 50s, instead of heads turning my way, I found eyes averting me and that's when I first noticed my vanity. I had always found heads turning towards me to be slightly embarrassing, but now I found heads turning away really sucked. Suddenly, the having been embarrassed was a blessing.

    The part of that little article I really liked was its mention of other aspects of depression, all building on each other, like the AIDS survival guilt it notes. Man, I am so aware of that in me. The 80s/90s were brutal with burying friends.

    But beyond survival guilt, there's also the guilt of ageing beyond their years, not just in dealing with AIDS but in all of living and dying. So that when you pass the age of someone you loved but buried, there's another cause of depression along with a little bit of guilt and with even a somewhat perverted longing to be dead too, to be again with those you've loved.

    Ageing is not easy. I do not highly recommend it. That whole it get's better campaign, yeah, we just said that to get you through adolescence so you'd live long enough to suffer ageing gay.

    Another aspect of depression building on depression I'd add in the gay category, that happens to str8s too but more so with us, is seeing our siblings enjoying their families, raising their kids, when we didn't have that. We didn't have marriage and we didn't have adoption rights. And we didn't have 1000s of years of those institutions supporting that lifestyle and that mindset. And as we head towards our oldest years, on top of all our prior sufferings, we will have no one when we are infirm to protect us.

    All that can be super depressing.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 5:24 PM GMT
    theantijock saidtheantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    Of the 170 I've currently clicked onto ignore, here's what I posted into their internal notes of the random first 31 on the list...

    super disgusting
    trolling as an anti-American
    ageist
    disgusting piece of shit
    quoted post with gross pic in it
    perv really disgusting
    puppet
    ageist scumbag
    random ignore
    keeps posting ass stuff
    too often wrong
    douche (and curiously this guy came back as another screenname also on ignore also with comment that he seems to be a douche to everyone lol. what a surprise that, huh)
    ageist scum
    disgusting
    sock suspected
    just wants to fight
    asshole
    random ignore
    disgusting posts
    too much ass stuff
    ageist
    fuck'm
    scum ageist
    perv
    argumentative wackjob
    too presumptuous
    a perv and total scumbag
    non stop ass stuff
    always with the ass
    guy’s a douche
    seems to be a scumbag to everyone (see above lol) also ageist scum. fuck'm

    So 6 out of 31 of that part of the ignore list or about 20% of those I click onto ignore are because of their ageist comments.

    I'm a good person ...

    I didn't know I had vanity issues in that I always knew I had the look that people wanted to bed and I was generous with that, I had a lot of fun. But when I got older, probably when I hit my mid 50s, instead of heads turning my way, I found eyes averting me and that's when I first noticed my vanity. ...

    All that can be super depressing.

    "Vanity of vanities! All is vanity!" Reading the number and tenor of your ignore comments, "vanity" is the least of your many problems.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 5:26 PM GMT
    MGINSD said"Vanity of vanities! All is vanity!" Reading the number and tenor of your ignore comments, "vanity" is the least of your many problems.


    dogpaddle, pool turd, dogpaddle
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 5:28 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    MGINSD said
    All that can be super depressing.

    "Vanity of vanities! All is vanity!" Reading the number and tenor of your ignore comments, "vanity" is the least of your many problems.

    dogpaddle, pool turd, dogpaddle

    See what I mean? Didn't think so. Put me on ignore, too, why dontcha?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 5:32 PM GMT
    MGINSD said

    See what I mean? Didn't think so. Put me on ignore, too, why dontcha?


    You're an amusing piece of shit.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 6:02 PM GMT
    Please don't quote that stuff. That was easily the most disturbing thing I've read in weeks, and I just read several articles about Martin Shkreli.
  • JackNNJ

    Posts: 1051

    Dec 17, 2015 6:14 PM GMT
    theantijock saidtheantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    Of the 170 I've currently clicked onto ignore, here's what I posted into their internal notes of the random first 31 on the list...

    super disgusting
    trolling as an anti-American
    ageist
    disgusting piece of shit
    quoted post with gross pic in it
    perv really disgusting
    puppet
    ageist scumbag
    random ignore
    keeps posting ass stuff
    too often wrong
    douche (and curiously this guy came back as another screenname also on ignore also with comment that he seems to be a douche to everyone lol. what a surprise that, huh)
    ageist scum
    disgusting
    sock suspected
    just wants to fight
    asshole
    random ignore
    disgusting posts
    too much ass stuff
    ageist
    fuck'm
    scum ageist
    perv
    argumentative wackjob
    too presumptuous
    a perv and total scumbag
    non stop ass stuff
    always with the ass
    guy’s a douche
    seems to be a scumbag to everyone (see above lol) also ageist scum. fuck'm

    So 6 out of 31 of that part of the ignore list or about 20% of those I click onto ignore are because of their ageist comments.

    I'm a good person and there's no reason for me to see that shit. So I just click that onto ignore. It's not even been directed at me except by that hottjoe piece of shit but even when I see these guys do it to others or just make ageist statements in general, I click them onto ignore as soon as I read it. Nothing I'd ever need to see a 2nd time. That's what I think of them: nothing.

    Even when we were kids when our political mantra was don't trust anyone over 30, we were never so purposely, personally disrespectful to others as are these scumbags today.

    To the study, I've found that to be real true and I've expressed the same on this forum. I'd have added though that the ageism effects str8s too. I've a cousin who struggles with it, though she self-admittedly has vanity issues so where she used to get hit on, now she gets called mam.

    I didn't know I had vanity issues in that I always knew I had the look that people wanted to bed and I was generous with that, I had a lot of fun. But when I got older, probably when I hit my mid 50s, instead of heads turning my way, I found eyes averting me and that's when I first noticed my vanity. I had always found heads turning towards me to be slightly embarrassing, but now I found heads turning away really sucked. Suddenly, the having been embarrassed was a blessing.

    The part of that little article I really liked was its mention of other aspects of depression, all building on each other, like the AIDS survival guilt it notes. Man, I am so aware of that in me. The 80s/90s were brutal with burying friends.

    But beyond survival guilt, there's also the guilt of ageing beyond their years, not just in dealing with AIDS but in all of living and dying. So that when you pass the age of someone you loved but buried, there's another cause of depression along with a little bit of guilt and with even a somewhat perverted longing to be dead too, to be again with those you've loved.

    Ageing is not easy. I do not highly recommend it. That whole it get's better campaign, yeah, we just said that to get you through adolescence so you'd live long enough to suffer ageing gay.

    Another aspect of depression building on depression I'd add in the gay category, that happens to str8s too but more so with us, is seeing our siblings enjoying their families, raising their kids, when we didn't have that. We didn't have marriage and we didn't have adoption rights. And we didn't have 1000s of years of those institutions supporting that lifestyle and that mindset. And as we head towards our oldest years, on top of all our prior sufferings, we will have no one when we are infirm to protect us.


    All that can be super depressing.


    Holy shit, dude.
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    Dec 17, 2015 7:51 PM GMT
    PhoenixNYC saidInteresting study. I can understand why some of us in my age bracket would feel that way. Oddly enough, I haven't personally encountered much ageism in NYC. I started to feel invisible in the Midwest as I grew older, but my 40s and 50s have been great so far in NY. Perhaps a total middle-age life change and career change helped.


    Strange that you would mention that. In spite of LA's well known reputation for attitude, generally found that not to be true. I had a great time over my 30 years there. Here though ????

    Most guys my age are still real busy with family stuff so most of my friends are much older or much younger.

    The old guys I know from the old car activities and from around here since we are a senior community. The young guys I know from the gym. (I get quite the endorphin buzz from working out and I am quite outgoing and talkative). They like hanging out around me .... all straight though.

    For the first time in a very long time I went out last Saturday night. No cover charges around here (in the Short North) so I went into what had to be about 20 bars ... all almost next door to one another. Straight bars I'm treated like one of the gang without regard to age. Gay bars here, I'm viewed as a pariah. I never had this happen in LA, even in WeHo.

    After the bars I went for pizza at a Mikey's Late Night Pizza on High St and in a very long line I got talking to some OSU kids in line behind me. When we got up to the order window they asked if I was eating there, and I said sure. They asked if I minded if they joined me and I said of course not. That would have zero chance of happening with the homosexuals around here .... zero. WeHo, absolutely it would happen. I just don't understand what the hell happened here as this place used to be so fun.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Dec 17, 2015 8:04 PM GMT
    I must be right at the median age. I've had bonaparts (and others) mock me for being too old, and the antijock (and others) call me ageist.

    If I was the only hated/bullied person on RJ, I might think it's just me.

    I'm starting to think it's just RJ.icon_confused.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 8:32 PM GMT
    I personally have quite a few gay friends between 45 and 60 who I consider some of my best friends. They have more depth then my fellow 20 something's who are living in the fast lane, always competing with one another trying to make it in NYC.

    I will admit though. By being nice to a lot of older gay men (happy hour is usually their time), it's common for them to take advantage of that notion and the creep comes out full swing. It's unpleasant. They think they're entitled to your body in a matter of minutes. I don't get groped/harassed as much from guys around my age. Sorry to say, but the desperation can get real so I can understand why the young ones automatically assume "this guy's a creep"

    I don't let a few bad experiences change my attitude towards an entire demographic but you do have to be more careful as a young gay man in the bar scene.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 9:39 PM GMT
    BP201 saidI personally have quite a few gay friends between 45 and 60 who I consider some of my best friends. They have more depth then my fellow 20 something's who are living in the fast lane, always competing with one another trying to make it in NYC.

    I will admit though. By being nice to a lot of older gay men (happy hour is usually their time), it's common for them to take advantage of that notion and the creep comes out full swing. It's unpleasant. They think they're entitled to your body in a matter of minutes. I don't get groped/harassed as much from guys around my age. Sorry to say, but the desperation can get real so I can understand why the young ones automatically assume "this guy's a creep"

    I don't let a few bad experiences change my attitude towards an entire demographic but you do have to be more careful as a young gay man in the bar scene.


    Maybe that's it? Maybe the straight youngins somehow figure it out that I'm not sexually interested in anyone ... period .... or they don't worry about that shit. I treat everyone the same whether they're 18 or 80 and I feel they do the same with me.

    You even say hi to a homosexual around here and they jump out of their skin. LA wasn't like that for the most part. Plus, what a ugly ugly queenie fem gay community here. Didn't used to be that bad and in fact was rather good.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Dec 17, 2015 9:41 PM GMT
    BP201 saidI personally have quite a few gay friends between 45 and 60 who I consider some of my best friends. They have more depth then my fellow 20 something's who are living in the fast lane, always competing with one another trying to make it in NYC.

    I will admit though. By being nice to a lot of older gay men (happy hour is usually their time), it's common for them to take advantage of that notion and the creep comes out full swing. It's unpleasant. They think they're entitled to your body in a matter of minutes. I don't get groped/harassed as much from guys around my age. Sorry to say, but the desperation can get real so I can understand why the young ones automatically assume "this guy's a creep"

    I don't let a few bad experiences change my attitude towards an entire demographic but you do have to be more careful as a young gay man in the bar scene.

    Not wanting to be sexually harassed =/= ageism
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 9:51 PM GMT
    "Ageism Linked Depression Is Rampant in the Mature LGBT Community"

    Bullshit.

    Other than the fact that most of us have no children and grandbabies to occupy our time - nevermind who is going to care for us as we march towards decrepitude...lots of str8s have kids who couldn't care less about them.

    I disagree.

    We didn't do anything wrong. It's not just an LGBT thing.

    And if it is "rampant", I will wager that every human being who was ever young feels more than a little sad to see themselves decline.

    P.S. Love guys my own age. icon_wink.gif


  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 10:12 PM GMT
    BP201 saidI personally have quite a few gay friends between 45 and 60 who I consider some of my best friends. They have more depth then my fellow 20 something's who are living in the fast lane, always competing with one another trying to make it in NYC.

    I will admit though. By being nice to a lot of older gay men (happy hour is usually their time), it's common for them to take advantage of that notion and the creep comes out full swing. It's unpleasant. They think they're entitled to your body in a matter of minutes. I don't get groped/harassed as much from guys around my age. Sorry to say, but the desperation can get real so I can understand why the young ones automatically assume "this guy's a creep"

    I don't let a few bad experiences change my attitude towards an entire demographic but you do have to be more careful as a young gay man in the bar scene.


    I personally have quite a few gay friends who are fat, ugly and black, even a few twinks. I consider some of them my best friends. They have more width, more indentations, more asymmetries and pigment issues which makes looking at them so very interesting.

    f23035c80096343d9bcfad206e0602df.gif

    I must admit, however, by being so nice to a lot of ugly fat twinky black guys--they don't seem very happy--it's fairly typical that they try to get in my pants which I find highly offensive. You can imagine how I don't like anyone in my pants. Even though I do get groped by guys my age, it's more fun rejected everyone else. And when I do, that's not my sexual preference I'm acting upon, that's my fat shaming, racist self pouring out of me. Though I try to hide it by saying how magnanimous I am in my friendship selection processes...

    funny-bugs-bunny-animated-gif-17.gif

    ...when what I'm really thinking is

    e0Dw6_s-200x150.gif

    Of course, when they call me on it, I tell them to stop bullying me. It's my body and I'm allowed to not have sex with fat ugly black twinks. You may think that's just like reverse ageism, but no, that's just my sexual preference. It doesn't mean I wouldn't be their friend as long as no one gets drunk, which is awfully big of me, knowing how creepy they really are.

    39153c9d6bbdde394efb050ee42bef20.gif

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 17, 2015 10:25 PM GMT
    Alan, you're fucking weird.
  • FRE0

    Posts: 4865

    Dec 17, 2015 10:37 PM GMT
    Age is only part of the problem.

    Unfortunately, it is difficult to find older guys who are reasonably fit. It seems that most are very overweight which makes them unattractive in the eyes of many younger gay men. Also, many gay men don't seem to know how to relate to other men other than sexually and that can be off-putting.

    Even in my geriatrified state, I have received compliments and propositions from young guys on this site.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Dec 17, 2015 10:48 PM GMT
    bon_pan saidAlan, you're fucking weird.

    He also keeps mischaracterizing me.icon_mad.gif