Committing Suicide

  • BloodFlame

    Posts: 1768

    Feb 04, 2016 4:15 AM GMT
    I was just thinking, if No one would care or miss you anyway, is it really that selfish to take your own life? I mean, let's say there's a guy whose life is completely shitty for lack of better word. No future, No love, no friends, no family, no pets, no nothing. If he were to commit suicide, he wouldn't be causing hurt to anyone (assuming he killed himself in his own apartment/house so no one has to see) and no one would care anyway since he's just a stranger.

    I've been thinking about this for some time honestly and I know it sounds... Depressing but I just can't wrap my head around how something like this would be selfish if you don't have anyone anyway? And if anything, wouldn't it be selfish to expect a miserable person to continue living their miserable life instead of just moving onto the afterlife to put away their pain and misery?
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    Feb 04, 2016 4:25 AM GMT
    Hang in there boo. Cliche as it may sound but.it gets better.

    Take it one day at a time....
  • Nemesis666

    Posts: 5

    Feb 04, 2016 4:35 AM GMT
    There is no afterlife. Make of this life what you can.
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    Feb 04, 2016 4:45 AM GMT
    It makes me sad any time I hear about someone do that, whether or not I know them. Just because it's a stranger makes no difference. Stay strong, things will get better.
  • BloodFlame

    Posts: 1768

    Feb 04, 2016 5:01 AM GMT
    Chulometta saidHang in there boo. Cliche as it may sound but.it gets better.

    Take it one day at a time....


    I just don't know anymore. I used to tell myself that for years.

    Nemesis666 saidThere is no afterlife. Make of this life what you can.


    I'd like to think there is one. icon_smile.gif

    javelin7 saidIt makes me sad any time I hear about someone do that, whether or not I know them. Just because it's a stranger makes no difference. Stay strong, things will get better.


    But you don't know them so what is there to really be sad about? Life goes on and a new life takes their place.
  • sexy_dad_67

    Posts: 111

    Feb 04, 2016 5:07 AM GMT
    I've contemplated suicide a few times, but there's always a glimmer of hope on the horizon. Maybe gay ageism will be overcome following some event in the near future and I'll actually have a chance at dating. Who knows.
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    Feb 04, 2016 5:08 AM GMT
    theantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    What if you boomerang and wind up right back only this time without your penis? Picture 40 years of monthly periods all because you didn't keep your penis on the planet. Doesn't sound like something you'd wanna rush into. More like something to avoid for as long as possible.

    http://afsp.org/
    If you are in crisis, please call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1-800-273-TALK (8255)
  • badbug

    Posts: 800

    Feb 04, 2016 5:09 AM GMT

    I am not reading this as you being depressed and wanting to off yourself. It sounds like you are just having a little debate in your mind about some aspects of suicide. If you are depressed, please discuss it with someone in your life or call a suicide hotline, sometimes they're really nice. icon_smile.gif

    Full disclosure: I thought briefly about killing myself today. I actually went for a long walk and peered off a bridge. I immediatley thought "no fuck it, i don't want to die" so it wasn't like i was planning to kill myself but i did think there was a small possibility.


    I don't think i needed much convincing not to do it, i wasn't planning on doing it either, the bridge was just along the path i was walking. I did however think about not going on the bridge because i was upset and thought it perhaps not a good idea to even put myself in the position....anyways,

    part of my thinking (as it speaks to your question) is that i can offer betterment to the life or lives of other creatures. I am not too much of a people person but i am an animal lover and any dog i own will be having one excellent life. Same too with any mice or rats or cats or whatever pet i should choose to get.
    I do also from time to time as my finances allow, give money to charity.


    So in the situation you describe, i would say i would think it a bit selfish in the sense that although you laid out a person with nothing in their life to offer anyone or anything...i would suggest that their selfishness lies in them not going out and being of service. Maybe they could adopt a dog in need of rescue or train a seeing eye dog or volunteer somewhere.


    I do agree you wouldn't want a miserable person to suffer needlessly but i think it would take some serious consideration about why they are miserable and what could be done about it. Terminal cancer, well by all means. But if you're just unhappy nobody likes you, (not you, the proverbial you) then why not focus on something else besides your own needs. Often that is a good way to feel better about anything.



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    Feb 04, 2016 5:16 AM GMT
    I think you have very primitive understanding of suicide
    People who commit suicide often have everything, they just feel like they have tried everything and nothing brings them fulfillment, but there are other causes like an illness that causes physical pain, emotional stress, no better option



    But to put no friends, no family, no love = suicide, that is stupid

  • BloodFlame

    Posts: 1768

    Feb 04, 2016 5:18 AM GMT
    sexy_dad_67 saidI've contemplated suicide a few times, but there's always a glimmer of hope on the horizon. Maybe gay ageism will be overcome following some event in the near future and I'll actually have a chance at dating. Who knows.


    Not everyone has that glimmer of hope though. For some of us, it burnt out long ago.

    theantijock saidtheantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    What if you boomerang and wind up right back only this time without your penis? Picture 40 years of monthly periods all because you didn't keep your penis on the planet. Doesn't sound like something you'd wanna rush into. More like something to avoid for as long as possible.

    http://afsp.org/
    If you are in crisis, please call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1-800-273-TALK (8255)


    Oh that was suck but I'd rather take that then continue living miserably because for all you know, maybe it'll be better.

    badbug said
    I am not reading this as you being depressed and wanting to off yourself. It sounds like you are just having a little debate in your mind about some aspects of suicide. If you are depressed, please discuss it with someone in your life or call a suicide hotline, sometimes they're really nice. icon_smile.gif

    Full disclosure: I thought briefly about killing myself today. I actually went for a long walk and peered off a bridge. I immediatley thought "no fuck it, i don't want to die" so it wasn't like i was planning to kill myself but i did think there was a small possibility.


    I don't think i needed much convincing not to do it, i wasn't planning on doing it either, the bridge was just along the path i was walking. I did however think about not going on the bridge because i was upset and thought it perhaps not a good idea to even put myself in the position....anyways,

    part of my thinking (as it speaks to your question) is that i can offer betterment to the life or lives of other creatures. I am not too much of a people person but i am an animal lover and any dog i own will be having one excellent life. Same too with any mice or rats or cats or whatever pet i should choose to get.
    I do also from time to time as my finances allow, give money to charity.


    So in the situation you describe, i would say i would think it a bit selfish in the sense that although you laid out a person with nothing in their life to offer anyone or anything...i would suggest that their selfishness lies in them not going out and being of service. Maybe they could adopt a dog in need of rescue or train a seeing eye dog or volunteer somewhere.


    I do agree you wouldn't want a miserable person to suffer needlessly but i think it would take some serious consideration about why they are miserable and what could be done about it. Terminal cancer, well by all means. But if you're just unhappy nobody likes you, (not you, the proverbial you) then why not focus on something else besides your own needs. Often that is a good way to feel better about anything.





    Well, it's 50/50. I haven't done anything yet. But if I coudl, I'd love to do it in the Aokigahara forest of Japan, also known as the "Suicide Forest". It's such a beautiful place and would be the perfect place to end it all after admiring the beauty.

    And even if you did all that, they still wouldn't care much for you. Animals only like getting fed to stay happy and the volunteer places only see you as a warm body who can get replaced.

    But I hear what you're saying.
  • BloodFlame

    Posts: 1768

    Feb 04, 2016 5:21 AM GMT
    Bonifacius saidI think you have very primitive understanding of suicide
    People who commit suicide often have everything, they just feel like they have tried everything and nothing brings them fulfillment, but there are other causes like an illness that causes physical pain, emotional stress, no better option



    But to put no friends, no family, no love = suicide, that is stupid




    Well yes, of course the common cases of suicides often involve having people who have everything but that just proves my point. They had things/people that cared about them. But the person who has nothing, absolutely nothing has nothing to say goodbye to or have anyone to give guilt to.

    I wasn't saying that if you don't have those things, it means you should automatically kill yourself but you gotta admit, it's a terrible life to live.
  • Nemesis666

    Posts: 5

    Feb 04, 2016 5:24 AM GMT
    "I firmly believe that we're here to experience a lifetime of growth and to glean from personal lessons."

    We're not here for any reason other than the fact that one's parents had sex nine months or so before one's birth, but we are here. We may as well experience life for all it's worth given that we had no choice in the matter.
  • BloodFlame

    Posts: 1768

    Feb 04, 2016 5:28 AM GMT
    MuchMoreThanMuscle saidSuicide is NEVER selfish. When a person reaches the point that s/he feels the only escape from pain is to end physical life on this plane that person has simply reached an all time inescapable low. Either that person is chronically suffering from mental illness or is reacting to some type of stimuli that has become too much to tolerate.

    I really resent it when people call others "selfish" because they lost the strength to carry on. It's just the cliché reaction/response to label, sermonize and lecture on the tragic actions other people succumb to. People hear this from a relative or a friend and then they regurgitate and it say it over and over.

    I've known way too many people who took their own lives; starting as early as my junior year of high school. Now, as I'm in my forties I don't have enough fingers on both hands to count the number of people I either knew intimately or casually who chose to end their lives. Knowing only one person who committed suicide is way too many.

    I firmly believe that we're here to experience a lifetime of growth and to glean from personal lessons. If you end that before your time you sever the opportunity to truly have that experience. Some people's lessons in this life are much harder than others.

    If you are thinking of harming yourself reach out and call 911 or go to the emergency room.


    Exactly, it's just a little hypocritical to call someone whose in pain selfish for trying to end their pain.
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    Feb 04, 2016 5:31 AM GMT
    Well, maybe not. But there is a lot of context to any situation. Just a couple of examples.

    One friend and I had some in-depth, though very beery conversations on the subject. It was kind of a high-pressure environment (grad skool). We agreed (I thought) that there were so many great opportunities to make a fresh start, that suidide was never an answer to a bad situation. Especially for young guys, but really, for everyone.
    Later, I learned that he killed himself a few weeks after I left town. The way that he did it caused a lot of trouble for everybody and ultimately cost millions of dollars in added security bureaucracy and inefficiency for the whole university. And maybe even the whole country.

    Similarly, I remember the incident depicted in the movie "Prayers For Bobby." Not only was that horrifyingly traumatic for the drivers involved, but it ultimately cost many, many millions of dollars to erect suicide barriers on every highway overpass in the state. And it shut down the walkway to the beach in my town for years.

    On the other hand, I'm pretty sure that a friend of mine who had terminal cancer used the (legal) lethal dose method. But it was never discussed. His was probably the most dignified and inspirational last year that I've ever heard of. He lived life to the fullest, right up to the very last day that he could. And then one day, he was suddenly gone. I've seen plenty of other people, including my father, waste away in a shitty hospital bed, in pain and/or in a drugged-out haze. Racking up bills and misery. That doesn't seem like the right way to go. But really, the only way to avoid it is to have an alternative plan.

    My friends and I are reaching the age where people are most likely to die of cancer, and many of us have had a few scares. The good news is that if you make it another decade, cancer becomes much less likely. Anyhow, it has got me to thinking about The End. What is the protocol, if you are alone? It would be kind of creepy to walk yourself down to the county morgue. Equally creepy to just leave a nasty corpse in your house for - somebody - to find eventually. One thought was to just sail the boat out into the Pacific. Head someplace warm. Rig the boat to scuttle itself in deep water when the time comes. No fuss, no mess.
  • interesting

    Posts: 577

    Feb 04, 2016 5:34 AM GMT
    BloodFlame said

    javelin7 saidIt makes me sad any time I hear about someone do that, whether or not I know them. Just because it's a stranger makes no difference. Stay strong, things will get better.


    But you don't know them so what is there to really be sad about? Life goes on and a new life takes their place.


    That's true, but think about this, do you consider yourself a good person? If yes, then think about how many bad people are there in the world, taking your own life away just means you're disrupting that balance.

    But honestly, I've thought about this too, too many bad moments in life. People always said suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, but I think they're wrong, it's the solution to all of the temporary problems. Maybe it's cowardice, but I couldn't do it, and there's my family to think about, and my pets. I could never think what they would feel if I suddenly end my life.

    And if you have no one depending on you, no one to miss you when you're gone (which is hard to believe, since everyone on this Earth has build some sort of relationship with someone), then is it just loneliness that's the cause of this thought?
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    Feb 04, 2016 5:34 AM GMT
    "Oh that would suck but I'd rather take that then continue living miserably because for all you know, maybe it'll be better."

    Or maybe the same or maybe more difficult. But assuming some survival of personality, then you'd still be you. Your life would still be your life to make with what you will, given whatever advantages you might be born with.

    There are 7 billion people on the planet. 3 billion live on less than $2.50 a day. 1.3 billion live on less than $1.25 a day. If you make $6,500 per year, you are in the top 20% of the richest people on the planet. 80% have the opportunity to only earn less than that.

    What do you suppose are your odds of coming back better positioned then you are currently?
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    Feb 04, 2016 5:42 AM GMT
    BloodFlame said
    Bonifacius saidI think you have very primitive understanding of suicide
    People who commit suicide often have everything, they just feel like they have tried everything and nothing brings them fulfillment, but there are other causes like an illness that causes physical pain, emotional stress, no better option



    But to put no friends, no family, no love = suicide, that is stupid




    Well yes, of course the common cases of suicides often involve having people who have everything but that just proves my point. They had things/people that cared about them. But the person who has nothing, absolutely nothing has nothing to say goodbye to or have anyone to give guilt to.

    I wasn't saying that if you don't have those things, it means you should automatically kill yourself but you gotta admit, it's a terrible life to live.



    not up to me to judge how other people should live their lives and put a stamp on them especially if it concerns their most private and intimate aspects which is purely their business and I will even bring this further, I am pretty sure some people are very happy and in peace and harmony for not having friends, family or ''love''. Like I said I think you have primitive mindset
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    Feb 04, 2016 5:43 AM GMT
    mindgarden said... Anyhow, it has got me to thinking about The End. What is the protocol, if you are alone? It would be kind of creepy to walk yourself down to the county morgue. Equally creepy to just leave a nasty corpse in your house for - somebody - to find eventually. One thought was to just sail the boat out into the Pacific. Head someplace warm. Rig the boat to scuttle itself in deep water when the time comes. No fuss, no mess.


    You and automation will be the ruin of us. Stop taking away all the jobs.

    Interesting point on costs though because I had already stumbled onto that web page
    http://afsp.org/about-suicide/state-fact-sheets/#Nevada


    Nevada-State-Facts.png


    There, costs 1 million per suicide. Now you have something to feel selfish & guilty about.

    OP, 2nd leading cause of death your age group in Nevada. Get the fuck out of Nevada.
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    Feb 04, 2016 5:54 AM GMT
    I know this hasn't helped when I've said it before, but it's one of the very, very few things I actually believe:

    People who actually know what it is to be without or to be alone, those who must embrace their own frailty and vulnerability in such a way that they never forget it, are the most human among us and make the deepest contributions to whatever you want to call the collective human conscience. If all those people suddenly disappeared, I don't think it's much of an exaggeration to say that the human race would spend a few days behaving like the RJ politics forum before disappearing in a mutually assured puff of toxic radiation.

    Melodrama aside, emotional pain comes from the same place that empathy does, and the human race DESPERATELY needs people who understand pain well enough to care when they see it in others. They may not see their contribution to the evolution of the human race, but I believe (perhaps irrationally) that this contribution is very, very real.

    In that academic (and admittedly detached) sense I still hold that the sort of suicide you describe is selfish, if understandable. I also maintain that this sort of person, including yourself in particular, is not truly without a future or even without attachments. This is a distortion of perception, perhaps of neurochemistry, with which one can get help and later come to see more clearly in retrospect.



    On a different note, I can't imagine what the cleanup crew have to go through. Rocky had the idea that he'd go early in the morning before anyone woke up, outside so nobody would have to clean up his house. But somebody had to clean up the site; medics and law enforcement had to fence off the area, and while the kids wouldn't have seen his body they would have seen police cars and ambulances at the edge of the park and known something was wrong. His friends and coworkers had to clean out his house and his office, too numb to do anything else, to spare his next of kin (somebody will be designated for that) the task. He put a lot of time, thought, and effort into convincing himself that he was doing the right thing, but he had positive effects on the world around him that I don't think he ever fully realized. Even ten years later I still keep finding new dark unexplored shadows that only he could have illuminated. He had no way of knowing how much poorer the world would be for his loss, and even had I known I wouldn't have had the words to tell him except to say that whether or not he believed that neither he nor the world had any reason to keep him around, it certainly was not true.
  • badbug

    Posts: 800

    Feb 04, 2016 6:03 AM GMT
    And even if you did all that, they still wouldn't care much for you. Animals only like getting fed to stay happy


    You must not have too much positive experience with animals.


    It seems like though, that a lot of this has to do with how people see you. Regardless if animals loved you or not for making them happy, you're still making them happy. Regardless if volunteer shelters saw you as some sort of slave, you are still doing work to help people even if they don't appreciate it enough.

    Making it not about you, is the goal you are trying to achieve. This is why you are depressed, because you don't like where you are or how the world treats you....worry more about how you are treating things with less power than you, be they animal or human.


    You seem like a decent enough, thoughtful person. I am sure you will figure out how to be happy if you give yourself time and work on it. 24 is young and there is a good possibility you will feel differently about life and your role in it when you are 30.

    My brother killed himself when he was around your age, and i know he would of loved so much that he missed. He never experienced the internet, got to go out drinking or doing drugs with me ( i am really good at doing drugs!) , got to witness the new sport of MMA which he would of gone crazy for, seen how crazy fast motorbikes are getting and he never got to give himself a chance and talk to a doctor and give any medications a shot. He also didn't get to grow or mature as a person and figure out the needlessness of taking his own life so young.


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    Feb 04, 2016 7:35 AM GMT
    Lose yourself in the service of others.

    I learned long ago I can't change who I am. I can change how I think, act and behave.

    Focus is key to sucess! Strive to do something for someone other than yourself daily. Just a simple thing like hand out a bottle of water to a homeless person.

    Be thankful and Have gratitude. The basic ideas that bring you back to reality.

    How many millions live on less than a dollar a day? It's more like billions and most of the people on the planet.

    Be a volunteer and contribute to society.

    Praise God or the Universe or what ever you want. Look upward and say, I can do this. You will find yourself and happiness will creep back in.



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    Feb 04, 2016 7:49 AM GMT
    I was at a point about 2 years ago where I was considering suicide. It was a dark time in my life because I had lost my legs earlier. At the time I lost my legs they were the only thing of value to me. They were the only part of myself that I prided myself in and believed I was capable of almost anything because of them.

    You see, I used to be an avid runner. I had picked up running after playing soccer in high school. Running helped me quit smoking, running kept me lean, running allowed me to eat whatever I wanted. I used to love running long distances, running on the beaches, running trails. I ran this one trail called the hash every saturday, where you basically run a trail that trailsetters had blazed earlier in the week. Guam had a reputation for one of the toughest in the world. You got to see some pretty amazing scenery running thru the jungles, climbing down cliffs, swimming thru bays, running down beaches. I loved it. There were many times you had to climb and of course you need your legs to do that and everything I had mentioned earlier. In addition to that, I love fashion. I love the whole no-socks look that not many people on Guam are into so it was my own style.

    When I woke up in the hospital with no legs, I thought my whole life had been taken from me. I eventually reached the point of despair that I mentioned in the beginning. I finally realised that I needed to change my situation by getting myself out of there. I moved back to the states and started to live my new life away from all the memories of the old. (Everywhere I drove on Guam I was reminded of running because I always ran on the sidewalks on the streets. I didn't like treadmills because they're boring.)

    Eventually, in figuring things out as a double amputee on my own I started to enjoy life again. My point to this whole story is to change your situation. If you feel like there is nothing where you are at currently, then change your situation. Move somewhere else. It will be scary as shit, but if you really want to experience something, anything, then seek it out. It's not going to find you.

    I don't know if you're referring to yourself or not, but I believe it's always within your power to change your situation. Unless of course you're a POW somewhere, but even those POW's made hell for their captors.
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    Feb 04, 2016 8:02 AM GMT
    runner1701 saidI was at a point about 2 years ago where I was considering suicide. It was a dark time in my life because I had lost my legs earlier. At the time I lost my legs they were the only thing of value to me. They were the only part of myself that I prided myself in and believed I was capable of almost anything because of them.

    You see, I used to be an avid runner. I had picked up running after playing soccer in high school. Running helped me quit smoking, running kept me lean, running allowed me to eat whatever I wanted. I used to love running long distances, running on the beaches, running trails. I ran this one trail called the hash every saturday, where you basically run a trail that trailsetters had blazed earlier in the week. Guam had a reputation for one of the toughest in the world. You got to see some pretty amazing scenery running thru the jungles, climbing down cliffs, swimming thru bays, running down beaches. I loved it. There were many times you had to climb and of course you need your legs to do that and everything I had mentioned earlier. In addition to that, I love fashion. I love the whole no-socks look that not many people on Guam are into so it was my own style.

    When I woke up in the hospital with no legs, I thought my whole life had been taken from me. I eventually reached the point of despair that I mentioned in the beginning. I finally realised that I needed to change my situation by getting myself out of there. I moved back to the states and started to live my new life away from all the memories of the old. (Everywhere I drove on Guam I was reminded of running because I always ran on the sidewalks on the streets. I didn't like treadmills because they're boring.)

    Eventually, in figuring things out as a double amputee on my own I started to enjoy life again. My point to this whole story is to change your situation. If you feel like there is nothing where you are at currently, then change your situation. Move somewhere else. It will be scary as shit, but if you really want to experience something, anything, then seek it out. It's not going to find you.

    I don't know if you're referring to yourself or not, but I believe it's always within your power to change your situation. Unless of course you're a POW somewhere, but even those POW's made hell for their captors.


    You are brave and I really admire you
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    Feb 04, 2016 8:38 AM GMT
    I think I remember exchanging friendly messages with you in the past, we mostly talked about music. No matter how bad you feel, you are a great person and every life matters and is important. I'm not sure what your going through, but just stay strong. Today's society is so superficial and isolated, people equate things like money, prestige, looks, and sex with happiness; we've been programmed to eat, mate, feed, repeat. This works for most people but for others it's emptiness. without higher meaning, ideals, honor, and self respect people like us slowly die inside. Chivalry is dead and it's a dog eat dog world now, it seems like everything is turned upside down than the way it's supposed to be. Strive for higher meaning and follow your dreams, achieve self actualization, conquer your demons and strengthen your weaknesses.
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    Feb 04, 2016 8:55 AM GMT
    Great article

    Maslow: The 12 Characteristics of a Self-Actualized Person.

    http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/maslow-the-12-characteris_b_7836836.html