Those who 'got everything', Those who 'struggle', Why?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 12:55 AM GMT

    Now this is a 'be honest' thread...

    I suppose this would apply mostly to the men here on RJ that have some life experiences, meaning at least age 40.

    Whether gay or straight, how has life in general treated you? Why does the old saying "If you work hard and play by the rules", not work the same way for every one? In your opinion of your life, has being gay or straight or your race influenced these factors?

    Whatever your circumstances and or your upbringing origins, do you feel you got everything you wanted, handed to you, healthy, very good luck, lucky in everything, money, home of your dream, long relationships, happy marriages or have you had to completely struggle for everything, face complete dogma or jealousy from others, health problems, had adversary enemies, hatred from family, friends, coworkers, money, job or career problems, suicides, homelessness, general bad luck

    A) Those who got everything
    B) Those who struggle



    My life has been B due to my early health problems, eventual sexual orientation and the way outside influences feel about it icon_neutral.gif






  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 1:08 AM GMT
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 1:20 AM GMT
    pellaz saidi dont live in the trump towers but maybe the grey gardens and last night a dead cat or an Xwife woke me up at 3am. For a dream i did not remember. Yet i have live a charmed life because i decree it so.




    In the land of cause, effect and karma, "doing the right thing and playing by the rules" should result in the same for everyone. But yet a persons, "destiny" path seems to have no effect on how or when the person reaches it.

    So,

    Some people are destined for everything
    Some people are destined to struggle


    This must be why "playing by the rules" doesn't work the same for everyone because it is ultimately destiny that determines whether a person gets everything or has to struggle. Playing by the rules will only get you some good karma points while on your destination icon_idea.gif

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 1:39 AM GMT
    ELNathB said Why does the old saying "If you work hard and play by the rules", not work the same way for every one? In your opinion of your life, has being gay or straight or your race influenced these factors?



    The rules do work. Most of my life I've been very poor, and if you had asked me during those years if I thought that working hard and playing by the rules worked, I would have said "hell no!", because I used to consider myself a victim. But looking back I can see that I was not truly working hard like I should have been. I was being lazy (even though I would never had admitted it at the time.) It took years of living this way to finally wake me up to the fact that no one was ever going to rescue me but myself. I had too much pride to accept food stamps or welfare so there were actually times I went hungry. I remember one year my total income for the year was $6000.00, which is well below poverty level. Of course laziness is not entirely true....I was also very very depressed and living with a lot of trauma from my childhood.

    And no, I can't see how my race played any role in my situation at all. It was all emotional stuff.

    Real talk.....I've never met a person who was truly working hard be on welfare very long.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 2:14 AM GMT
    I don't fit into either category. I'm in the middle. I'd be delusional if I claimed everything was handed to me. I'd be ungrateful if I said I had to struggle. Of course my sexuality and race have affected my life. I view the world the way I do based off of my experiences as a black gay boy and now a black gay man. I wouldn't say either has been negative overall. I'd rather be a man than a woman in our society and being gay has removed many pressures that society places on straight men. I think society expects very little from gay men and that is liberating. I'm happy for the struggles I've had as a black man. I feel it's given me character in a way only a black mancan have. I don't think I'd have less character as any other ethnic group. I'd just have different character. I love who I am and being black is a central part if that. Every aspect of my personality presents challenges as well as opportunity. Sometimes its hard not to dwell on the challenges. I feel not being able to recognize, accept and rework those challenges is the must damaging challenge in life.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 2:48 AM GMT
    Radd said
    ELNathB said Why does the old saying "If you work hard and play by the rules", not work the same way for every one? In your opinion of your life, has being gay or straight or your race influenced these factors?



    The rules do work. Most of my life I've been very poor, and if you had asked me during those years if I thought that working hard and playing by the rules worked, I would have said "hell no!", because I used to consider myself a victim. But looking back I can see that I was not truly working hard like I should have been. I was being lazy (even though I would never had admitted it at the time.) It took years of living this way to finally wake me up to the fact that no one was ever going to rescue me but myself. I had too much pride to accept food stamps or welfare so there were actually times I went hungry. I remember one year my total income for the year was $6000.00, which is well below poverty level. Of course laziness is not entirely true....I was also very very depressed and living with a lot a trauma from my childhood.

    And no, I can't see how my race played any role in my situation at all. It was all emotional stuff.

    Real talk.....I've never met a person who was truly working hard be on welfare very long.





    The problem many have, myself included, you cant pick your parents, where you grow up or the family situation you are born into. Many people suffered from childhood trauma and those of us who did, seem to be the ones in the life struggling category. You reach a certain age, on the way to your destiny, and you discover or realize you don't belong where your parents or extended family put you

    It appears when most gay men, discover that they are gay, and say their family, parents originate in the state of Wyoming, that young adult gay man soon discovers he 'does not belong' in Wyoming due to the safety of his life or career. So he moves to a big city, with lots of others like him and becomes resentful of his family, parents because he discovered that there is a world outside of his struggling hometown his family never told him about. The struggling family and parents not only reject the young gay man for being gay but now resent him for moving away, trying to 'get everything' on his own, left them behind to struggle for themselves. "Never forget where you came from" as the parents say.

    In this new environment, he meets new people that 'have everything' already and that his own 'struggling' is something to be internally shameful of in front of people who have everything, who wouldn't understand his version of struggling.

    Misery loves company? Those who have everything attract those who have everything and those that struggle attract those that struggle? Does this define social class? We have heard many stories of people, "pulling themselves out of poverty" but yet they are still strugglers, most never achieve or get everything. I suppose this is how the 'middle class' was created, not quite getting everything but not quite struggling either. icon_neutral.gif






  • craycraydoesd...

    Posts: 596

    Feb 09, 2016 3:00 AM GMT
    Meh, mostly in-between mediocrity for me. I lived a bit hedonistically and have a lot less saved up then others my age. Relationship with family was always rocky, but they've passed recently, maybe I'll come to regret not mending things with them, in the future. Cholesterol is way too high, along with blood pressure. Maybe go to gym once a week now. My job is one where I care and give very little, and get, well, just enough to live comfortably. Whatever, at least I'm white and can have a sex life even at this age icon_biggrin.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 3:07 AM GMT
    theantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    http://www.webmd.com/healthy-aging/news/20051020/early-retirement-early-death
    55-Year-Old Retirees Die Sooner Than 65-Year-Old Retirees

    Early retirement is supposed to give you extra golden years to enjoy. But that may not happen, a new study suggests.

    A study of Shell Oil employees shows that people who retire at age 55 and live to be at least 65 die sooner than people who retire at 65. After age 65, the early retirees have a 37% higher risk of death than counterparts that retired at 65.

    That's not all. People who retire at 55 are 89% more likely to die in the 10 years after retirement than those who retire at 65.


    http://www.voxeu.org/article/fatal-attraction-access-early-retirement-and-mortality
    We find that a reduction in the retirement age causes a significant increase in the risk of premature death – defined as death before age 67 – for males but not for females. The effect for males is not only statistically significant but also quantitatively important. According to our estimates, one additional year of early retirement causes an increase in the risk of premature death of 2.4 percentage points


    Be careful what you wish for.
  • craycraydoesd...

    Posts: 596

    Feb 09, 2016 3:10 AM GMT
    Probably because they get to do more fun things in early retirement, while risking accidental death. Pay to play.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 3:36 AM GMT
    theantijock saidtheantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    http://www.webmd.com/healthy-aging/news/20051020/early-retirement-early-death
    55-Year-Old Retirees Die Sooner Than 65-Year-Old Retirees

    Early retirement is supposed to give you extra golden years to enjoy. But that may not happen, a new study suggests.

    A study of Shell Oil employees shows that people who retire at age 55 and live to be at least 65 die sooner than people who retire at 65. After age 65, the early retirees have a 37% higher risk of death than counterparts that retired at 65.

    That's not all. People who retire at 55 are 89% more likely to die in the 10 years after retirement than those who retire at 65.


    http://www.voxeu.org/article/fatal-attraction-access-early-retirement-and-mortality
    We find that a reduction in the retirement age causes a significant increase in the risk of premature death – defined as death before age 67 – for males but not for females. The effect for males is not only statistically significant but also quantitatively important. According to our estimates, one additional year of early retirement causes an increase in the risk of premature death of 2.4 percentage points


    Be careful what you wish for.




    This for gay men? This is new territory since most of our community hardly makes it past 50 years old. If we are living longer now, at least to normal retirement age (which will eventually be 70 years old), this makes sense, but todays working youth, will probably not 'officially retire' such as the baby boom gen.

    Getting everything early on in life will certainly help with this decision to retire early, but as discussed with Radd, getting everything v struggling seems to stem from created social class, depending on origination

    Today's, I want everything now, youth, so far, do not understand what it means to struggle, except for those that would be considered a minority class. Currently, there is no plan for LGBT elders when we become retirement age (Hilary has mentioned something about our future).

    In the next 20 years, if a lot of us make it, should be interesting to see LGBT assisted living centers arise in the big cities. As we know in our community, looks only last for so long. Our dancing DJ's are getting older too, wonder what life would be like at a LGBT retirement home (Tuesday night depends night) icon_lol.gif

    For now, maybe its just best we do retire early, get our fun and complete our lives by 65. Like some of these Vietnam or WWII vets you see rolling around in wheel chairs, I just don't see most of us, as a community, getting to that point, watching reruns of Queer As Folk and the Babylon back room or reliving our hey days on the circuit dance floor. I just don't see this happening icon_lol.gif

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 4:05 AM GMT
    The healthiest, happiest, longest lived & even the wealthiest people I've known never stopped working.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 4:33 AM GMT
    theantijock saidThe healthiest, happiest, longest lived & even the wealthiest people I've known never stopped working.




    Well, I guess im old fashion, I expect a work/life balance


    d51RKKDFhEwfieIYDXIQKyu3-rsqZphp7Rq7lY4u

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 5:25 AM GMT
    ELNathB said
    theantijock saidThe healthiest, happiest, longest lived & even the wealthiest people I've known never stopped working.




    Well, I guess im old fashion, I expect a work/life balance


    d51RKKDFhEwfieIYDXIQKyu3-rsqZphp7Rq7lY4u



    If what you do for a living give your life meaning why not live to work?
  • SilverRRCloud

    Posts: 872

    Feb 09, 2016 5:30 AM GMT
    I managed to choose both the right parents and the right extended family. This helped a lot.

    A few of them were somewhat paranoid along the lines of 'Only the paranoid survive!' And I picked up on that.icon_biggrin.gif Essentially, I grew up thinking that the best thing I could do was to speak softly and carry a very big stick. (Not sure if the pun was intended or not.icon_biggrin.gif)

    The self-realization that I was gay came soon enough for me to understand that I really needed to upgrade the stick part as much as possible.

    So, I really never struggled since I have always had plenty. But I also worked my ass off to make sure that I am always a few steps ahead of the crowd, and that I can provide for myself even if the going got very, very tough.

    And, yeah, the going got really though, and my investment in very marketable skills, experience, work/academic record and substantial savings won the day.

    I have enjoyed the ride very much, so far. I continue to work about 4 days a week on an easy schedule for most of the year, and I dive into the serious, back-breaking work for about two months a year. (Coz I can.:lolicon_smile.gif

    One major benefit: do not have to sweat the small stuff.

    SC

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 7:16 AM GMT
    MrFuscle said
    ELNathB said
    theantijock saidThe healthiest, happiest, longest lived & even the wealthiest people I've known never stopped working.




    Well, I guess im old fashion, I expect a work/life balance


    d51RKKDFhEwfieIYDXIQKyu3-rsqZphp7Rq7lY4u



    If what you do for a living give your life meaning why not live to work?



    1) My line of work requires me to work for somebody else
    2) That somebody else relies upon profit margins
    3) Live to work means I give everything to somebody else
    4) Work to live means I give equal parts of me to somebody else
    5) Owning or running your own business or farm, being your own boss, is a 24/7 Live to work commitment
    6) Working 9-5 is a shared, Work to live commitment between you and somebody else
    7) Anything that comes remotely middle to either of these is whats called an Independent Contractor, but has its own pros/cons
    8} If I won the $100 Mil+ lottery, I would probably be a real estate investor, who travels a lot and 'works 9-5'. Buy a small horse farm, pay somebody to run it and take vacations there


  • metta

    Posts: 39090

    Feb 09, 2016 7:53 AM GMT
    I'm sure that we all have out own stories of how life has its ups and downs.

    I have worked hard. I have had some luck. I have had disappointments. I was never given stuff. My father died when I was 18. Looking back, I could have made some better decisions. On the other hand, I don't really regret most of the decisions that I made.

    I remember reading a study many years ago that said people regret most what they did not try. Life was never supposed to be perfect. It should be experienced. Just do the best you can with what you have to work with. And I don't mean just financially.
  • Antarktis

    Posts: 213

    Feb 09, 2016 2:29 PM GMT
    in the immortal words of Jane Fonda to Oprah when asked how she became so wealthy. "I came by it the old fashioned way."

    Oprah: "You worked hard."
    Jane: "No, I inherited."
  • Fireworkz

    Posts: 606

    Feb 09, 2016 4:08 PM GMT
    I've fallen between A and B. A combination of hard work, struggle, working smart and luck

    B - My parents struggled for money so I didn't have much growing up

    A - I was good academically and very ambitious. I did well at school.
    I got good grades. Had free university education like everyone else at the time (although the government has withdrawn this). I got a top class degree which gave me the choice of the plumb jobs.
    Got my first job in investment Banking from knowing the right people.
    Made more than most in my starting job and was able to buy a flat in London pretty quickly. Although had no life for 2 years.

    Lost job in the banking crisis and realized I wanted a different path with work life balance.
    Tried different careers. Became self employed which was more of a struggle financially more because of the boom bust cycle.

    Now I pretty much love my life because I'm always growing. I struggle sometimes but it doesn't occur as a struggle. I see it as growth and development.

    Nothing was handed to me. I looked for and made use of the available opportunities.

    In terms of personal life I had my issues coming to terms with my sexuality especially growing up in the black community. I can't say I struggled. I more avoided dealing with it for awhile until I was comfortable being gay. Lucky that London has a diverse gay community.
    There is probably still more work for me to do in being out in the black community.





  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 4:39 PM GMT
    ELNathB said
    MrFuscle said
    ELNathB said
    theantijock saidThe healthiest, happiest, longest lived & even the wealthiest people I've known never stopped working.


    Well, I guess im old fashion, I expect a work/life balance

    d51RKKDFhEwfieIYDXIQKyu3-rsqZphp7Rq7lY4u



    If what you do for a living give your life meaning why not live to work?


    1) My line of work requires me to work for somebody else
    2) That somebody else relies upon profit margins
    3) Live to work means I give everything to somebody else
    4) Work to live means I give equal parts of me to somebody else
    5) Owning or running your own business or farm, being your own boss, is a 24/7 Live to work commitment
    6) Working 9-5 is a shared, Work to live commitment between you and somebody else
    7) Anything that comes remotely middle to either of these is whats called an Independent Contractor, but has its own pros/cons
    8} If I won the $100 Mil+ lottery, I would probably be a real estate investor, who travels a lot and 'works 9-5'. Buy a small horse farm, pay somebody to run it and take vacations there


    Work isn't just about work. It's about being busy. Being engaged in the world. And it doesn't matter what you do, your life's ambition or whatever gets you out of your house, out of your head on a regular basis.

    Dreaming of a life of leisure seems lovely but the reality is that it becomes more work than work to keep yourself busy. And if you're not keeping yourself busy, yer gonna eventually stagnate and die sooner than you would have had you kept moving. It is that simple. Life is movement.

    Even in the thread in Science forum I created recently about what is life, the investigation there involves the initial animating of the physical into life. That through the most basic dissipation of energy, the physical though physical processes take on qualities of living. Life is motion and in our lives, working provides structure for motion.

    So while you might like retirement for a while, maybe a few years, eventually, it's gonna get old. Even on your 150 foot yacht, which your mere 100 million won't afford--not a nice one, anyway--yer gonna run out of ports to visit. And as you age in retirement, you run out of people, because they are aging too. So whether they die off young by accident or disease or suddenly by suicide, or whether they whither slower, as you wind up outliving them, you wind up alone. No matter how good you were at socializing earlier in life, those around you die off too.

    And so work then provides also a social structure. Even if some of the people there you don't like, that you have that human contact regularly in your life. That keeps you living. Without it you die. Alone, at your leisure, but dead.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 5:35 PM GMT
    theantijock said

    [quote]Work isn't just about work. It's about being busy. Being engaged in the world. And it doesn't matter what you do, your life's ambition or whatever gets you out of your house, out of your head on a regular basis.

    Dreaming of a life of leisure seems lovely but the reality is that it becomes more work than work to keep yourself busy. And if you're not keeping yourself busy, yer gonna eventually stagnate and die sooner than you would have had you kept moving. It is that simple. Life is movement.

    Even in the thread in Science forum I created recently about what is life, the investigation there involves the initial animating of the physical into life. That through the most basic dissipation of energy, the physical though physical processes take on qualities of living. Life is motion and in our lives, working provides structure for motion.

    So while you might like retirement for a while, maybe a few years, eventually, it's gonna get old. Even on your 150 foot yacht, which your mere 100 million won't afford--not a nice one, anyway--yer gonna run out of ports to visit. And as you age in retirement, you run out of people, because they are aging too. So whether they die off young by accident or disease or suddenly by suicide, or whether they whither slower, as you wind up outliving them, you wind up alone. No matter how good you were at socializing earlier in life, those around you die off too.

    And so work then provides also a social structure. Even if some of the people there you don't like, that you have that human contact regularly in your life. That keeps you living. Without it you die. Alone, at your leisure, but dead.


    great post
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 6:17 PM GMT
    theantijock saidtheantijock%20engage%20stalker%20reducti

    http://www.webmd.com/healthy-aging/news/20051020/early-retirement-early-death
    55-Year-Old Retirees Die Sooner Than 65-Year-Old Retirees

    Early retirement is supposed to give you extra golden years to enjoy. But that may not happen, a new study suggests.

    A study of Shell Oil employees shows that people who retire at age 55 and live to be at least 65 die sooner than people who retire at 65. After age 65, the early retirees have a 37% higher risk of death than counterparts that retired at 65.

    That's not all. People who retire at 55 are 89% more likely to die in the 10 years after retirement than those who retire at 65.


    http://www.voxeu.org/article/fatal-attraction-access-early-retirement-and-mortality
    We find that a reduction in the retirement age causes a significant increase in the risk of premature death – defined as death before age 67 – for males but not for females. The effect for males is not only statistically significant but also quantitatively important. According to our estimates, one additional year of early retirement causes an increase in the risk of premature death of 2.4 percentage points


    Be careful what you wish for.

    Or, guard well what you've got.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Feb 09, 2016 8:06 PM GMT
    Lol only 40 or up? Yeah because you only have real life experiences if you're 40 and up, meanwhile teenagers and kids even younger get raped, molested, beaten and starve quite commonly?...sorry but that was just silly and already demonstrates that you're not someone who has struggled enough to recognize how universal trials are.

    No one completely struggles in life and no one has everything handed to them either. I don't care if you live in Trump Tower or a dumpster, no one is exempt from having to experience challenges in life, and there are homeless men scavenging for food on the streets whom are happier than many psychotic business owners who yell at everyone they know on a regular basis.

    Open your mind up to define what struggle and what privilege really means in the grand scheme of things. But then again I am only 23 so I guess my input is completely unfounded.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Feb 09, 2016 8:29 PM GMT
    I have everything but not enough time to use it, because I'm dying at some shitty-ass day job.icon_cry.gif
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Feb 09, 2016 8:31 PM GMT
    Radd said
    ELNathB said Why does the old saying "If you work hard and play by the rules", not work the same way for every one? In your opinion of your life, has being gay or straight or your race influenced these factors?



    The rules do work. Most of my life I've been very poor, and if you had asked me during those years if I thought that working hard and playing by the rules worked, I would have said "hell no!", because I used to consider myself a victim. But looking back I can see that I was not truly working hard like I should have been. I was being lazy (even though I would never had admitted it at the time.) It took years of living this way to finally wake me up to the fact that no one was ever going to rescue me but myself. I had too much pride to accept food stamps or welfare so there were actually times I went hungry. I remember one year my total income for the year was $6000.00, which is well below poverty level. Of course laziness is not entirely true....I was also very very depressed and living with a lot a trauma from my childhood.

    And no, I can't see how my race played any role in my situation at all. It was all emotional stuff.

    Real talk.....I've never met a person who was truly working hard be on welfare very long.

    Was that before or after the nose job?
  • toastvenom

    Posts: 1020

    Feb 09, 2016 8:32 PM GMT
    oh yeah, much like my school grades. B all the way!!