Can talented smart guys be really that antisocial and not open?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2016 8:22 AM GMT
    I have met one interesting guy in Silicon Valley from Rhode Island who graduated from a really good school and got great job as data science programmer at a mobile game company. This guy is 23-24 and I am 28 and also in tech but different role than him.

    I ran into him at my gym. I maybe did not make the best first impression. At first I glanced at him several times and he glanced back with serious blank stare. Eventually when passing by him I introduced myself to him and shook his hand. It all warmed up to casual conversation. He told me on what days he may come in and usually I have seen him 2 more times. Then couple weeks later, I have not seen him anymore, not even on days he mentioned he might come.

    So I found him and request him to accept LinkedIn invite (he has facebook too but I don't use facebook). He ignored it. Then I sent him email I found from Google via his forum where he used his real name and he ignored this too. So obviously this guy was not into me neither as a potential dating material or platonic friend. I think he is homophobic straight or closeted gay case and he found in me "queernes" that turned him off and changed schedule to avoid me.

    The thing is I did not try to hit on him, I was just getting to know him. Find out what he is open to. But he ruled out giving me a chance. After he not only rejected my Linkedin but blocked me, I emailed him I did not try to make him uncomfortable and apologized for crossing line. He replied, he appreciated I wanted to get to know him though tracking him online was no so cool (well its his pessimistic perception, in reality it was just finding a way to contact him after long break, not monitoring him).

    The kicker was when he told me he is in general not into forming relationships of any kind? I was like huh? No, I don't believe that. Its more likely that he does not trust me than he does not want more friends. But who knows, maybe smart guys who graduate from Ivy league colleges on average tend to be very antisocial and closed minded? Who knows.

    I left him alone and moved on. That does not mean if I run into him again I won't nod at him or say hi when passing by him but he does not make impression of a friendly and understanding type.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2016 2:25 PM GMT
    Tech skills are often socially crippling. It's just how the brain works. You have done your due diligence so this is on him , leave him alone.
  • inmidair

    Posts: 70

    Feb 17, 2016 4:13 PM GMT
    First, I'd like to recommend a book: Quiet: The Power of Introverts in a World that Can't Stop Talking

    Just because this person is introverted doesn't mean that he is "antisocial" or, as Alpha13 suggested, "socially crippled." Small talk and superficial conversation can be exhausting for introverts. Just because you've reached out to him doesn't mean that he's contractually obligated to be superficially pleasant at you until the end of time.

    There are dozens of reasons that he might have stopped going to the gym or changed his schedule; it probably has nothing to do with you.

    Finally, you reached out to him, you contacted him, you made your point. Continuing to stalk him on the Internet and scrounge up his personal details isn't going to improve his impression of you if he's not already interested.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2016 4:58 PM GMT
    willowcrow231 said
    ...I think he is homophobic straight or closeted gay case and he found in me "queernes" that turned him off and changed schedule to avoid me.

    ...But who knows, maybe smart guys who graduate from Ivy league colleges on average tend to be very antisocial and closed minded?


    Your one statement about him seems more than adequate to terminate any further attempts at contact. Speculation about the consequences of educational background are therefore probably immaterial, as well as inaccurate.

    But on that second point, it is true that some people from an elite background tend not to socialize outside their accustomed circles. It's not so much the education itself, or talent, but rather their entire upbringing. They simply don't ordinarily befriend people who are socially beneath them. Yet they do make friends easily enough, they're anything but anti-social, you just aren't likely to ever see it if you don't travel in the same circles that they do.

    Now whether he falls into that category I can't know. But if he does then you face as big a hurdle as his presumed homophobia. Unless you can match his pedigree with an equal one of your own.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2016 7:10 PM GMT
    It can be hard to meet people in the Bay Area. Everyone is really busy and people are very protective of their time and "space." I also suspect that in Silicon Valley sending someone a LinkedIn invite is not seen as a casual move ... it involves opening up a lot of information to someone else. Maybe this guy is more extreme than others or maybe you sent out an over-eager vibe that turned him off. Either way, you might want to try getting to know people in a more structured setting like a club or church or class, which makes everyone feel a bit safer and provides a common interest to connect over.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2016 7:26 PM GMT
    the only thing you is his college and employer.

    for example:
    he might have cheated his way to degree. His current employment might wish they hired someone else.

    possibly maybe not talented smart???
  • FRE0

    Posts: 4865

    Feb 17, 2016 8:02 PM GMT
    Probably it will be impossible to determine what the situation is. Perhaps is is closeted gay and afraid that contact with you could expose him; who knows? Since he has shown no interest in having any further contact with you, I suggest just forgetting about him. Most likely he would see further attempts to contact him as being unduly intrusive. These things happen. The important thing is to accept it without being discouraged from meeting others.

    Also, technical competence and sociability are not necessarily mutually exclusive.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2016 8:38 PM GMT
    willowcrow231 saidAt first I glanced at him several times and he glanced back with serious blank stare. Eventually when passing by him I introduced myself to him and shook his hand. It all warmed up to casual conversation. He told me on what days he may come in and usually I have seen him 2 more times.

    So I found him and request him to accept LinkedIn invite (he has facebook too but I don't use facebook). He ignored it. Then I sent him email I found from Google via his forum where he used his real name and he ignored this too.

    I'm guessing that he's hot and you were staring at him in the gym. Sending the email and doing the LinkedIn thing sounds a bit creepy to me given that you hardly know each other. And you don't even know if he's gay or not.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2016 8:46 PM GMT
    Lol sound like a stalker, he stared at you in a weird way, not in a *I wanna sleep or fuck with you kind of way**. You sent the link in which is weird, He's not gay. MOve on.
  • Tawrich

    Posts: 67

    Feb 17, 2016 8:51 PM GMT
    Dude..you flat out stalked the guy. You bumped into someone at the gym and made small talk. LinkedIn isn't Facebook. It's a professional service. Would you associate random relationship interests with your work network which not only includes past mentors but also your current bosses before even getting to know them? The follow up email is even more of a red flag. It's probably not even his personal email that you found its his work email which is monitored by the company. The fact that you dug up his educational history instead of asking him about it is even more ridiculous.
  • Peterluke

    Posts: 23

    Feb 18, 2016 12:01 AM GMT
    He may just not be that into you. You may have come off as pushy. Some people prefer true friendship or a true love instead of collecting them. I don't think you are anti-social because you are picky when it comes to friendship or relationship. I suggest you to forget about him. He does not seem interested.
  • builtofbrick

    Posts: 54

    Feb 18, 2016 1:38 AM GMT
    move on
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 18, 2016 2:08 AM GMT
    1. This is just ONE guy.
    2. Don't spend much of your time on people who aren't willing to spend much of their time on you. ESPECIALLY if you don't even know if they are a good person or not. It will save you a lot of energy and frustration.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 18, 2016 2:08 AM GMT
    Some people are introverted, some people are also highly selective about who they hang out with. He also may just not be interested in you as a friend of any kind. He has that right and you expecting people to want to at least be your friend unfortunately is a shaky investment to automatically place on people. However, you have the right idea on having enough confidence to approach him, and you should keep doing so, although what you should change is your outlook on others who do not accept your offerings. He may actually really think you are cool, but may have self esteem issues and be afraid of getting close to others because he carries shame or insecurity. No matter the reason, it is best to look at him in the best way despite his denial of a deeper connection with you. I used to deny being friends with people ALL of the time because I had a deep inferiority complex I was carrying with me from childhood, so I understand how it feels to say no to people when you really want to say yes, but you believe you're not worthy of having friends.

    Keep pursuing as many people as you can and eventually you will get lucky and make a connection with someone who will appreciate your forwardness.
  • badbug

    Posts: 800

    Feb 18, 2016 5:53 AM GMT
    Maybe he is schizoid. Those people are quite interesting.

    They don't really see the point of human relationships. The general outlook among them seems to be: "i am me, why would i care about anyone else". And not in a malicious "i am all that matters sense" like a narcissistic person or a sociopath. But in a "why care about people" sense. Not caring isn't hating or wanting to hurt or feeling hurt by, it's simply not caring what other people think good or bad.

    Some self aware schizoids will often discourage people from getting attached to them, knowing that they cannot reciprocate. It takes them too much mental effort to try and remember or to have to remember and act upon the feelings and expectations of someone else. Imagine if you had to call your back fence every so often and pretend you cared about how it was doing. How long would you keep it up for? Would you want to meet more back fences?

    It's a very rare condition. But it's not impossible that this person has features or is infact schizoid.

    Schizoids are like the opposite of me, so i find them fascinating. That's why i know a fair amount about them and have interacted with a few. I met one once in my psychiatrist's office waiting room. Spoiler alert: we didn't become friends! lol

  • SilverRRCloud

    Posts: 875

    Feb 18, 2016 6:19 AM GMT
    People who for better or worse see themselves as belonging to a specific elite due to their education, present position, wealth, etc. often (not always) tend to view other, non-elite people as mere instruments in achieving some of their plans.

    Sure, the birds of the feather... we all know, flock together. So, like many other people, the members of the elites tend to be self-centered. They swim in their own ponds, mostly trying to enhance their own standing by exchanging favors with the other players. Naturally, they agree to socialize amongst themselves as such behavior is actually conducive to achieving their goals.

    Outside their elite world, some of them would befriend a less fortunate guy because he is good at what he does/how he looks, and can be exploited to a degree. Once the deed is done/goal has been achieved, you can always retreat behind the gated entrance of your own elite, and show no further interest in someone who is not a member of your club anyway.

    Remember to either collect your favors in ADVANCE from all the elite folks around, or move on swiftly before you invest more than 3 min. of your time.

    Few people achieve any elite status (even the ill-perceived one) by being fair and honest players... So, be warnedicon_biggrin.gif

    SC
  • Tawrich

    Posts: 67

    Feb 18, 2016 6:36 AM GMT
    SilverRRCloud saidPeople who for better or worse see themselves as belonging to a specific elite due to their education, present position, wealth, etc. often (not always) tend to view other, non-elite people as mere instruments in achieving some of their plans.

    Sure, the birds of the feather... we all know, flock together. So, like many other people, the members of the elites tend to be self-centered. They swim in their own ponds, mostly trying to enhance their own standing by exchanging favors with the other players. Naturally, they agree to socialize amongst themselves as such behavior is actually conducive to achieving their goals.

    Outside their elite world, some of them would befriend a less fortunate guy because he is good at what he does/how he looks, and can be exploited to a degree. Once the deed is done/goal has been achieved, you can always retreat behind the gated entrance of your own elite, and show no further interest in someone who is not a member of your club anyway.

    Remember to either collect your favors in ADVANCE from all the elite folks around, or move on swiftly before you invest more than 3 min. of your time.

    Few people achieve any elite status (even the ill-perceived one) by being fair and honest players... So, be warnedicon_biggrin.gif

    SC


    I think by elite you mean sociopathic? There is a huge difference between being goal driven and prioritizing different things in life and seeing others as tools. Granted high functioning sociopaths do well in certain fields like business or war.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 18, 2016 7:22 AM GMT
    Sorry to break it to you, but you are a creep and the guy reacted in the most reasonable way I could think of. May be if you were a baby boomer and have little to no knowledge of what social networking means, you would be less of a creep and more of a caveman, but you are a millennial and you should know what online stalking entails. What you did is equivalent to some guy who had a brief conversation with a stranger going completely out of his way to find that person's phone number, and then calling that person up without any notice. It is creepy as hell.

    So you talked to this guy one or few times after he caught you staring at him a couple of times. You really think that entitles you to his respect and eagerness in getting to know you better? That's the same type of bullshit complaints straight guys make when they over exaggerate the significance of some brief conversations they had with women who were just being polite.

    Okay, may be you are not a creep, but, at the very least, you are socially inept. First of all, not everyone goes to the gym to socialize. Some people don't have a whole lot of time, so, when they do make it to the gym, their priority is exercising and not networking/relationship building. That doesn't mean they are a closeted homophobe; they are just tired, and they really have to get going. Also, there is this thing called "being an introvert". There are people who are not naturally wired to feel the need to socialize and interact with others all the time; in fact, some people can find social interactions - especially with strangers - draining and stressful. No, that also doesn't mean they are homophobes; they just have a different personality. The best thing to do is to give them space and let them come to you after you've introduced yourself and established a connection upon first meeting; pursuing this type of people aggressively will only push them away.

    One last thing: just because you screwed up, acted like a creep, and, as a result, drove away a guy who clearly seems polite and sympathetic without being a pushover, doesn't mean every smart or talented person is antisocial and closed minded. What are you, a three year old? One experience defines an entire class of people for you? Grow the fuck up and go out to gain some perspectives.

    Sorry for venting out on you, I am just tired of people like you who feel entitled to respectful, friendly treatment from everyone after acting like a total creep.
  • Tawrich

    Posts: 67

    Feb 18, 2016 8:03 AM GMT
    stevee90 saidSorry to break it to you, but you are a creep and the guy reacted in the most reasonable way I could think of. May be if you were a baby boomer and have little to no knowledge of what social networking means, you would be less of a creep and more of a caveman, but you are a millennial and you should know what online stalking entails. What you did is equivalent to some guy who had a brief conversation with a stranger going completely out of his way to find that person's phone number, and then calling that person up without any notice. It is creepy as hell.

    So you talked to this guy one or few times after he caught you staring at him a couple of times. You really think that entitles you to his respect and eagerness in getting to know you better? That's the same type of bullshit complaints straight guys make when they over exaggerate the significance of some brief conversations they had with women who were just being polite.

    Okay, may be you are not a creep, but, at the very least, you are socially inept. First of all, not everyone goes to the gym to socialize. Some people don't have a whole lot of time, so, when they do make it to the gym, their priority is exercising and not networking/relationship building. That doesn't mean they are a closeted homophobe; they are just tired, and they really have to get going. Also, there is this thing called "being an introvert". There are people who are not naturally wired to feel the need to socialize and interact with others all the time; in fact, some people can find social interactions - especially with strangers - draining and stressful. No, that also doesn't mean they are homophobes; they just have a different personality. The best thing to do is to give them space and let them come to you after you've introduced yourself and established a connection upon first meeting; pursuing this type of people aggressively will only push them away.

    One last thing: just because you screwed up, acted like a creep, and, as a result, drove away a guy who clearly seems polite and sympathetic without being a pushover, doesn't mean every smart or talented person is antisocial and closed minded. What are you, a three year old? One experience defines an entire class of people for you? Grow the fuck up and go out to gain some perspectives.

    Sorry for venting out on you, I am just tired of people like you who feel entitled to respectful, friendly treatment from everyone after acting like a total creep.


    +1
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 18, 2016 9:20 AM GMT
    stevee90 saidSorry to break it to you, but you are a creep and the guy reacted in the most reasonable way I could think of. May be if you were a baby boomer and have little to no knowledge of what social networking means, you would be less of a creep and more of a caveman, but you are a millennial and you should know what online stalking entails. What you did is equivalent to some guy who had a brief conversation with a stranger going completely out of his way to find that person's phone number, and then calling that person up without any notice.


    So you argument is they invented something called PHONEBOOK decades ago for stalkers?

    And my friend, if I was a total stalker, I would not just send 1 follow up email, I would keep emailing him even after he insisted to not contact him which would escalate to unwanted contact and harassment. Hell, I would even go to his house since he told me where he lives and get called up to police and a restraining order.

    stevee90 said
    So you talked to this guy one or few times after he caught you staring at him a couple of times. You really think that entitles you to his respect and eagerness in getting to know you better? That's the same type of bullshit complaints straight guys make when they over exaggerate the significance of some brief conversations they had with women who were just being polite.


    First how do you know how well I got to know him after a few encounters? Some people just hit off right away and some take time to warm up. How did you think then he handled being nice and going out of his way across half gym to approach me and say goodbye before he left home?

    And I your comment insinuating that I am liar and all I wanted from this guy was to have sex is insulting.

    Besides women are different in social and often occupational roles, not as many women hold tech jobs and same tech interests/hobbies as guys.

    stevee90 said
    The best thing to do is to give them space and let them come to you after you've introduced yourself and established a connection upon first meeting;


    If I did that all the time I would not have any friends at all. Has this not occurred to you that I am Polish and therefore Americans will not naturally go out of their way to really get to know me, they will rather expect me to say hello and talk to them?
    If you are not born in the United States or did not acquire American English accent when growing up as kid and you are not surrounded by your ethnic people, you are second citizen. Period.

    stevee90 said
    Sorry for venting out on you, I am just tired of people like you who feel entitled to respectful, friendly treatment from everyone after acting like a total creep.


    My friend everybody deserve a respect, even creeps as long as they are not out there to harm people. You sound like a crazy immature teenager. Calling out people's names and believing they always deserve punishment for making bad decisions regardless of their intention because you believe your judgement call is always right, is so self-centered and immature. You come across as somebody who goes by Italian mafia style decision making.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 18, 2016 10:26 AM GMT
    OP - In my opinion you came across as too eager. That is a big turn-off to many.
  • namche

    Posts: 13

    Feb 18, 2016 3:54 PM GMT
    Tawrich and Steve gave the best response here.

    Your extended replies to both indicates that you simply don't get it, and I'd really suggest that you think about your defensiveness and try to learn something from what they wrote.

    Frankly, reading your words was difficult as the answers to questions your raise are, to me, so self-evident, your defensiveness came screaming through, not any substance.

    Whether he's into you or not, gay or straight, or likes goats is entirely not the point.

    You really did cross lines. It is not the subject about which you speak who is socially inept. There really is no other way to put this: you are.

    Nope. What you did to track him down on the internet and message him was just, well, weird. Really. Try to think about what some of these guys are saying here, back up and consider a new approach with anyone else going forward. If there is any possibility of even an acquaintanceship with this person, which I doubt, keep anything further between you in-person.

    He may have thought you were the greatest thing since sliced bread, but doing what you did? You blew it.

    Almost anyone I know/knew at any age would have been put off by your actions. Criminal? Of course not. And, no. I seriously doubt you are a creep. In fact, I'm sure you aren't. Immature? Yes.

    Learn from this, and don't track someone down as you did again. At best, is pretty odd.
  • namche

    Posts: 13

    Feb 18, 2016 4:04 PM GMT
    I meant to add this:

    You asked a question.

    Almost 20 guys, in one way or the other, basically gave your the same answer. No one here supported your views or actions.

    What you did wasn't cool and not helpful to you.

    I'd again suggest to take that poll to heart and think about what they are saying.

    They're right.
  • Wendigo9

    Posts: 426

    Feb 18, 2016 10:19 PM GMT
    Most really smart and attractive people are pretty much perfectionists in their time away from others, I have an IQ of 176 and constantly try to shape my body to my liking. It's just a matter of self-hate and wanting to improve everything about ourselves.
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    Feb 19, 2016 6:50 AM GMT
    I get it. You come from a different country, where different values exist and different mannerisms prevail. I also get that Americans in general tend to be more individualistic and private to their neighbours, etc. than Europeans.

    But I also know that there is a specific type of people who fails to grasp the fact that different personality types exist, and, consequently, not everyone will respond well to one method of social interaction. People who, even when they find themselves in a completely different environment, automatically assume that everyone around them will act as what they think is appropriate. If not, then they think those people are abnormal - antisocial, homophobic, whatever.

    Your problem isn't the fact that you are from Poland and your distinct accent supposedly is an alienating feature. If anything, you could have the most perfect American-English accent, but people - including that guy you met at the gym - will still likely keep you at distance. Why? Because you are too stubborn to accommodate different cultures and different individuals that you live amongst.

    Also, the fact that you think everyone deserves respect, no matter what, only goes to prove you do have self-entitlement issue. There is a difference between rights and respect. Yes, you certainly do have every right to be a creep as long as you are not actually harming anyone; but that does not mean the person you are creeping on is obligated to respect you. Respect is something that you need to earn and also something that you can lose. At least that's the way it works in the society you now live in.

    If you want to make friends and build meaningful relationships, I would strongly recommend you to 1) accept that your way of social interaction may not be very accommodating of people with different personality types, and 2) learn what is considered a cultural norm in relationship building process for countries like United States (as it may be different from that of Poland). You may have been the most sociable guy in Poland, but, based on what you've shared, I think you are the one being more socially inept than the guy you've been talking about.