Pope Francis Issues Statement on Orlando With NO MENTION OF THE GAY - Still has not named our dead? Let him ask our 49 dead for forgiveness at Orlando

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    Jun 13, 2016 4:34 AM GMT
    http://en.radiovaticana.va/news/2016/06/12/pope_francis_decries_orlando_massacre_and_prays_for_victims/1236740
    ... statement released by the Holy See Press Office Director, Father Federico Lombardi SJ, on the Orlando massacre which has been described as the worst mass shooting in American history.

    Please find below Vatican Radio’s translation of the statement:

    The terrible massacre that has taken place in Orlando, with its dreadfully high number of innocent victims, has caused in Pope Francis, and in all of us, the deepest feelings of horror and condemnation, of pain and turmoil before this new manifestation of homicidal folly and senseless hatred. Pope Francis joins the families of the victims and all of the injured in prayer and in compassion. Sharing in their indescribable suffering he entrusts them to the Lord so they may find comfort. We all hope that ways may be found, as soon as possible, to effectively identify and contrast the causes of such terrible and absurd violence which so deeply upsets the desire for peace of the American people and of the whole of humanity.


    Does anyone see the word GAY there? Any LGBT mention?

    The Pope can go fuck himself along with Republican Gov Scumbag Scott.
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  • nice_chap

    Posts: 283

    Jun 13, 2016 12:09 PM GMT
    I'm not religious at all, and I don't mean to defend religion, but he is condemning the act of killing in his statement, not homosexuals. i would be far more disturbed if he said all those victims deserved to be shot. Telling someone to fuck themselves for expressing some sort of compassion for victims of violence doesn't make you look very compassionate. At times like this, compassion is more important than hatred.
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    Jun 13, 2016 1:56 PM GMT
    theanticock said
    nice_chap saidI'm not religious at all, and I don't mean to defend religion, but he is condemning the act of killing in his statement, not homosexuals. i would be far more disturbed if he said all those victims deserved to be shot. Telling someone to fuck themselves for expressing some sort of compassion for victims of violence doesn't make you look very compassionate. At times like this, compassion is more important than hatred.


    elephant.jpg


    I don't agree with most of what he says but good for the Pope. He isn't victimizing gays as encouragement for new attacks.
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    Jun 13, 2016 2:50 PM GMT
    A)
    theanticock said
    nice_chap saidI'm not religious at all, and I don't mean to defend religion, but he is condemning the act of killing in his statement, not homosexuals. i would be far more disturbed if he said all those victims deserved to be shot. Telling someone to fuck themselves for expressing some sort of compassion for victims of violence doesn't make you look very compassionate. At times like this, compassion is more important than hatred.


    elephant.jpg


    GYMFREAK AKA THEANTICOCK PKA ONTARGET, GO FUCK YOURSELF.

    B)
    nice_chap saidI'm not religious at all, and I don't mean to defend religion, but he is condemning the act of killing in his statement, not homosexuals. i would be far more disturbed if he said all those victims deserved to be shot. Telling someone to fuck themselves for expressing some sort of compassion for victims of violence doesn't make you look very compassionate. At times like this, compassion is more important than hatred.


    Sure he could have said worse, but does that measure that he could have said better?

    How is his slight any less abhorrent than is the slight of the Republican Governor of the State of Florida who also refused to acknowledge us by name while he also was supposedly showing compassion for community, for the Community of Orlando, for the trouble the police had to endure--even for family of the dead (I have children too, he sobbed) only not for the Community of LGBT & friends who were, um, actually killed. Not one mention of us by our name. That wasn't being a typical Republican douchebag?

    So you think you get to wrap that horse up in a dress and not still have horseshit, huh?

    Sorry, no.

    It is the job of the pope to "condemn the act of killing".

    It is also the job of the pope to treat us as being less than human.

    Congrats to the pontiff on doing his job. There, am I now compassionate enough?

    Or can you imagine him officiating at a funeral and not naming the dead as the Pope did not name us.

    Which more compassion? That, or wrathfully calling out that!

    What is more compassionate: Letting a child play in traffic
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    or wrathfully screaming at the child for playing in traffic?
  • FitBlackCuddl...

    Posts: 803

    Jun 15, 2016 12:01 AM GMT
    "Pope Francis Issues Statement on Orlando With NO MENTION OF THE GAY"

    This is the Pope. This is the head of a religious group that does not support/recognize homosexuality. WHAT did you expect him to do? Is not as if he can speak JUST for himself. Is a wonder that he convinced the Vatican collective to allow acknowledgement of the Orlando massacre at all.

    You dudes need to be realistic.
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    Jun 15, 2016 1:43 AM GMT
    FitBlackCuddler said"Pope Francis Issues Statement on Orlando With NO MENTION OF THE GAY"

    This is the Pope. This is the head of a religious group that does not support/recognize homosexuality. WHAT did you expect him to do? Is not as if he can speak JUST for himself. Is a wonder that he convinced the Vatican collective to allow acknowledgement of the Orlando massacre at all.

    You dudes need to be realistic.


    Then he should not have acknowledged the massacre at all because that would have been more compassionate than to show up to give the eulogy while refusing to name the dead. To rub our noses in the blood of our dead.

    Or does he talk about the Holocaust without mentioning Jewish people?
    Does he talk about the slave trade without mentioning African Americans?

    Yet in our time of anguish, vigils around the world for the deaths of 49 of us gunned down in cold blood, this leader of one of the word’s great religions opportunistically dehumanized us by refusing us in death our name. We are human. Our name is Gay. We are the LGBT mass murdered in Orlando.

    If this, his action, is Christian compassion, treating us as piss poorly as was their treatment of us over decades which likely lead to the mind set fostering this disaster, then he can take his compassion and shove it up his royal ass. Amen.

    What should we expect?

    Well, we’re not asking for much.

    He can stand up or he can sit down and shut up.

    Hallelujah, Jesus!
  • mcbrion

    Posts: 306

    Jun 15, 2016 2:22 AM GMT
    theantijock saidhttp://en.radiovaticana.va/news/2016/06/12/pope_francis_decries_orlando_massacre_and_prays_for_victims/1236740
    ... statement released by the Holy See Press Office Director, Father Federico Lombardi SJ, on the Orlando massacre which has been described as the worst mass shooting in American history.

    Please find below Vatican Radio’s translation of the statement:

    The terrible massacre that has taken place in Orlando, with its dreadfully high number of innocent victims, has caused in Pope Francis, and in all of us, the deepest feelings of horror and condemnation, of pain and turmoil before this new manifestation of homicidal folly and senseless hatred. Pope Francis joins the families of the victims and all of the injured in prayer and in compassion. Sharing in their indescribable suffering he entrusts them to the Lord so they may find comfort. We all hope that ways may be found, as soon as possible, to effectively identify and contrast the causes of such terrible and absurd violence which so deeply upsets the desire for peace of the American people and of the whole of humanity.


    Does anyone see the word GAY there? Any LGBT mention?

    The Pope can go fuck himself along with Republican Gov Scumbag Scott.
    elephant-pope.png


    Interesting that this was written up as the worst mass shooting in US History, given that that is not an accurate statement. The would have been the Greenwood, Tulsa Oklahoma massacre in 1921.

    In any case, there were not ONLY LGBT people in the club. There were also straights in the club. The point is the senseless of the killing, which the Pope acknowledged. Why the vitriol because he didn't say the word "gay"? Is compassion less so because the statement doesn't fit political criteria? It's not like Ronald Reagan not mentioning the word "AIDS" until Rock Hudson's funeral. THAT was cold - and intentional.
    People are just going to see only what they're capable of seeing and some won't see past that. I don't see Putin making any statement on it, or Congress or the Senate - other than a general statement. And Trump? He's said nothing compassionate at all.
    The Pope did not get shot, so he's not even a blip on my radar , and I don' t have room in my heart for hatred - and especially right now: there are still people hanging on to life by a thread. I can just worry about those who might not make it and I can pray for the survivors and those whose lives are still uncertain. No room for anything else.
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    Jun 15, 2016 2:52 PM GMT
    The pope's religion actively & systematically endeavored to dehumanize us.

    By treating us as less than 100% human, religion created the mindset making us a target to massacre.

    The blood of our brethren stains the hands of religion.

    In slighting us by refusing to name us, by refusing to acknowledge our loss of our lives, the pope has wiped our noses in the blood of our dead, be our dead LGBT or gay-friendly, our dead wrung dead at the hand of religion.
  • FitBlackCuddl...

    Posts: 803

    Jun 15, 2016 4:49 PM GMT
    theantijock saidThe pope's religion actively & systematically endeavored to dehumanize us.

    By treating us as less than 100% human, religion created the mindset making us a target to massacre.

    The blood of our brethren stains the hands of religion.

    In slighting us by refusing to name us, by refusing to acknowledge our loss of our lives, the pope has wiped our noses in the blood of our dead, be our dead LGBT or gay-friendly, our dead wrung dead at the hand of religion.


    HOW has the pope been "treating us as less than 100% human"? What other major event in Orlando could the Pope have been talking about?
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    Jun 15, 2016 8:36 PM GMT
    FitBlackCuddler said
    theantijock saidThe pope's religion actively & systematically endeavored to dehumanize us.

    By treating us as less than 100% human, religion created the mindset making us a target to massacre.

    The blood of our brethren stains the hands of religion.

    In slighting us by refusing to name us, by refusing to acknowledge our loss of our lives, the pope has wiped our noses in the blood of our dead, be our dead LGBT or gay-friendly, our dead wrung dead at the hand of religion.


    HOW has the pope been "treating us as less than 100% human"? What other major event in Orlando could the Pope have been talking about?


    Does anybody care to put their wedding album aside and dignify that with a response?
  • FitBlackCuddl...

    Posts: 803

    Jun 16, 2016 10:05 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    FitBlackCuddler said
    theantijock saidThe pope's religion actively & systematically endeavored to dehumanize us.

    By treating us as less than 100% human, religion created the mindset making us a target to massacre.

    The blood of our brethren stains the hands of religion.

    In slighting us by refusing to name us, by refusing to acknowledge our loss of our lives, the pope has wiped our noses in the blood of our dead, be our dead LGBT or gay-friendly, our dead wrung dead at the hand of religion.


    HOW has the pope been "treating us as less than 100% human"? What other major event in Orlando could the Pope have been talking about?


    Does anybody care to put their wedding album aside and dignify that with a response?


    Perhaps when you human beings decide to STOP creating artificial differences by CALLING YOURSELVES GAY, then you can RETURN to being 100% human.
  • Cutlass

    Posts: 426

    Jun 21, 2016 9:42 AM GMT
    The pope did what he had to do and that is to marginalize, ignore and deny us human and civil rights. By not acknowledging and giving us any consideration, he wants to make sure that those who are "inherently (or intrinsically) disordered" shall not be recognized and rather dismissed in this tragedy. The thought that this was most likely an attack on gays and they were the victims would not be considered and the root cause simply overlooked. When the pope was early in his position and asked about gays, he said, "Who am I to judge?" My first thought then was to think that there was going to be a major change in the Vatican's stance on gays. Silly me. It's back to the old school of thought that the church holds tightly to. And this from a church whose clergy is considered to be half or over half gay. So much for the church's hypocritical saying that it is for social justice. Social justice for whom?
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19138

    Jun 21, 2016 2:06 PM GMT
    FitBlackCuddler said"Pope Francis Issues Statement on Orlando With NO MENTION OF THE GAY"

    This is the Pope. This is the head of a religious group that does not support/recognize homosexuality. WHAT did you expect him to do? Is not as if he can speak JUST for himself. Is a wonder that he convinced the Vatican collective to allow acknowledgement of the Orlando massacre at all.

    You dudes need to be realistic.



    ^^^ This ^^^ I look at the Pope's statement as glass half full, not as the OP who sees it as glass half empty. These victims were human beings first, and maybe not all of them were even gay. It doesn't matter what their sexuality was at this point, they were victims of a terrorist who clearly had no regard for human life.
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    Jun 21, 2016 2:20 PM GMT
    The Pope doesn't use the G word; Obama persists in avoiding the I word. What goes around comes around.
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    Jun 21, 2016 5:02 PM GMT
    Cutlass saidThe pope did what he had to do and that is to marginalize, ignore and deny us human and civil rights. By not acknowledging and giving us any consideration, he wants to make sure that those who are "inherently (or intrinsically) disordered" shall not be recognized and rather dismissed in this tragedy. The thought that this was most likely an attack on gays and they were the victims would not be considered and the root cause simply overlooked. When the pope was early in his position and asked about gays, he said, "Who am I to judge?" My first thought then was to think that there was going to be a major change in the Vatican's stance on gays. Silly me. It's back to the old school of thought that the church holds tightly to. And this from a church whose clergy is considered to be half or over half gay. So much for the church's hypocritical saying that it is for social justice. Social justice for whom?


    That reads absolutely correct and well said. Thank you.

    And this hypocrisy is highlighted by that Republicans such as FL gov Scott would not only as did the Pope refuse to name LGBT as the victim of this massacre but would insist that the FBI not redact that the attack upon we who don't exist was by Radical Islamisism.

    Add to that the homophobia and the anti-Semitism and the Islamophobia arising from within our own LGBT community.

    This is the horseshit the world throws at us. It is by the Grace of God that those of us left standing have survived.

  • Jun 21, 2016 10:47 PM GMT
    The Old Testament nonsense bigotry has no place in Christianity. The core tenet of Christianity is love. Love God, Love your neighbor, love yourself, love your enemy. The Old Testament (the domain of Judaism, not of Christianity but is included for historical perspective) is violent and the Koran is even worse. Hate begets more hate and some posters in this thread must have had negative experience from titular/nominal "Christians."

    "A large portion of clergy are gay" (paraphrasing) because in olden days you either married or joined the clergy if you and your family were Catholic.

    I applaud the good faith effort of Pope Francis to extend love and simpathy to all because all of sin and "who am I to judge how another sins?"
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    Jun 21, 2016 11:00 PM GMT
    MarcoAlejandro91 saidThe Old Testament...has no place in Christianity. The core tenet of Christianity is love. Love God, Love your neighbor, love yourself, love your enemy. The Old Testament (the domain of Judaism, not of Christianity but is included for historical perspective) is violent and the Koran is even worse. Hate begets more hate and some posters in this thread must have had negative experience from titular/nominal "Christians."

    "A large portion of clergy are gay" (paraphrasing) because in olden days you either married or joined the clergy if you and your family were Catholic.

    I applaud the good faith effort of Pope Francis to extend love and simpathy to all because all of sin and "who am I to judge how another sins?"


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_TestamentThe Old Testament is the first section of the Christian Bible, based primarily upon the Hebrew Bible, a collection of religious writings by ancient Israelites[1] believed by most Christians and Jews to be the sacred Word of God.[2] It is the counterpart to the New Testament, the second portion of the Christian Bible.

  • Jun 21, 2016 11:14 PM GMT
    Correction/clarification: Christian morals are all found in the New Testament. Whenever there is a conflict of message between the teachings of Jesus and the historical perspective of the culture he grew up in, the New Testament version should be used exclusively and the Old Testament version shouldn't be adhered to.

    Therefore all bigotry and hatred found in the Old Testament not found in the New Testament has no place in Christianity.
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    Jun 22, 2016 12:43 AM GMT
    MarcoAlejandro91 saidCorrection/clarification: Christian morals are all found in the New Testament. Whenever there is a conflict of message between the teachings of Jesus and the historical perspective of the culture he grew up in, the New Testament version should be used exclusively and the Old Testament version shouldn't be adhered to.

    Therefore all bigotry and hatred found in the Old Testament not found in the New Testament has no place in Christianity.


    Um, yikes.

    Have you considered studying the issue first?

    Here, lemme crash course google that for you...

    http://www.uscatholic.org/articles/201402/what-relationship-between-old-and-new-testaments-28454The relationship between the Old Testament and the New Testament reflects both the continuity and discontinuity between the Christian and Israelite faiths. Christians believe God had one plan for salvation that was revealed first to the Israelites and then to all peoples through Jesus Christ. The New Testament and Old Testament, then, tell one ongoing story of salvation. At the same time, the authors of the New Testament were proposing something radically new: Jesus’ fulfillment of the Israelites’ hope in God’s promises. (or at least that's what they liked to tell themselves)

    For the New Testament writers, the Old Testament was holy scripture. To tell the story of Jesus, those authors relied largely on the vocabulary and methods of reading scripture that already existed in the Jewish world. According to one scholarly estimate, the New Testament has more than 4,000 references to the Old Testament; thus the books of the Old Testament have been important for Christians and remain, in the words of the Second Vatican Council’s Dei Verbum (Dogmatic Constitution on Divine Revelation), “permanently valuable” because they were “written under divine inspiration.”


    In other words, the Old Testament is intrinsic to Christianity. We get to deny the new but you don't get to divorce from the old. I know that doesn't seem fair, but that's how your guys set it up.
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  • Jun 22, 2016 12:54 AM GMT
    You are funny, Hidden Member.

    The New Testament references the Old

    The New Testament sometimes contradicts the Old

    Jesus died for our sins and formed a new covenant, one where ancient Jewish traditions and bigotry are unneeded.

    However, there are those who use arguments found in the Old Testament to discriminate. These titular/nominal "Christian" aren't speaking with the Holy Spirit or living the words of Christ.

    Quick Google sources can provide plenty of incredible and irrelevant dribble.

    I don't hold any ill will towards you and the world would be a better place if the teachings of Jeshua and Gautama Buddha were taken to heart by more people. Hatred is only destructive, nothing constructive comes from it.
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    Jun 22, 2016 1:10 AM GMT
    http://www.uscatholic.org/about-usWho publishes U.S. Catholic ?

    U.S. Catholic magazine is published by the Claretians. Following in the footsteps of St. Anthony Claret—a prolific writer and publisher whom Pope Pius XI called the "Modern Apostle of the Good Press"—the Claretians in the United States began their publishing ministry in 1935 with the first edition of the magazine The Voice of St. Jude. In 1963, during the Second Vatican Council, The Voice of St. Jude transformed into U.S. Catholic magazine.

    Who are The Claretians?

    The Claretian Missionaries are a Roman Catholic religious community of priests and brothers. They are dedicated to the mission of living and spreading the Gospel of Jesus. For more information, visit www.claretiansusa.org.
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    Jun 22, 2016 1:19 AM GMT
    http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/relations-jews-docs/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_20151210_ebraismo-nostra-aetate_en.html#4._The_relationship_between_the_Old_and_New_Testament_and_the_Old_and_New_Covenant
    4. The relationship between the Old and New Testament and the Old and New Covenant

    27. The covenant that God has offered Israel is irrevocable. "God is not man, that he should lie" (Num 23:19; cf. 2 Tim 2:13). The permanent elective fidelity of God expressed in earlier covenants is never repudiated (cf. Rom 9:4; 11:1–2). The New Covenant does not revoke the earlier covenants, but it brings them to fulfilment....

    ...The New Covenant is grounded in and based on the Old, because it is ultimately the God of Israel who concludes the Old Covenant with his people Israel and enables the New Covenant in Jesus Christ. ...

    ...The roots of Christianity lie in the Old Testament, and Christianity constantly draws nourishment from these roots....

    With the existence of the New Testament, the question naturally arose quite soon of how the two testaments are related to one another, whether for example the New Testament writings have not superseded the older writings and nullified them. This position was represented by Marcion, who in the second century held that the New Testament had made the Old Testament book of promises obsolete, destined to fade away in the glow of the new, just as one no longer needs the light of the moon as soon as the sun has risen. This stark antithesis between the Hebrew and the Christian Bible never became an official doctrine of the Christian Church. By excluding Marcion from the Christian community in 144, the Church rejected his concept of a purely "Christian" Bible purged of all Old Testament elements, bore witness to its faith in the one and only God who is the author of both testaments, and thus held fast to the unity of both testaments, the "concordia testamentorum".
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    Jun 27, 2016 1:33 AM GMT
    Where is the Pope's revised statement on Orlando. He wants forgiveness but still has not named our dead? Let him go to Orlando and there apologize to our 49 dead.