Protest Vote: Hillary Is the Same As Trump. True or False?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 23, 2016 4:07 AM GMT
    NYT: When I am confronted by the “not voting” or “protest voting” crowd, their argument often boils down to one of principle: They can’t possibly vote for Trump or Clinton because both are flawed in their own ways.

    I know immediately that they have bought into the false equivalency nonsense, and additionally are conflating the casting of a ballot with an endorsement of a candidate’s shortcomings.

    Both ideas are incredibly problematic and potentially self-destructive.

    First — and this cannot be said enough — Clinton and Trump are not equally bad candidates. One is a conventional politician who has a long record of public service full of pros and cons. The other is a demagogic bigot with a puddle-deep understanding of national and international issues, who openly courts white nationalism, is hostile to women, Mexicans and Muslims, and is callously using black people as pawns in a Donnie-come-lately kinder-gentler campaign.

    Second, a vote isn’t just about the past — although comparing these two candidates on their pasts still leaves one as the clear choice — but about the present and the future.

    There is a simple truth here: Either Clinton or Trump will be the next president of the United States. Not Jill Stein. Not Gary Johnson. Clinton or Trump.

    There is another truth: That person will appoint someone to fill the current vacancy on the Supreme Court (assuming that the Senate doesn’t find religion and move on Merrick Garland before the new president takes office) and that person will also appoint federal judges to fill the 88 district court and court of appeals vacancies that now exist (there are 51 nominees pending for these seats).

    These judgeships alone could cast a long shadow — not just for one or two terms of a presidency, but for decades, until those judges retire or die.

    This election isn’t just about you or me, or Clinton or Trump. This election is quite literally about the future, all of our and our children’s and their children’s futures.

    As Bernie Sanders himself said last week: “This is not the time for a protest vote.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/22/opinion/the-folly-of-the-protest-vote.html?
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    Sep 23, 2016 10:47 AM GMT
    The NYT is so full of shit, it cures constipation.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14382

    Sep 23, 2016 1:03 PM GMT
    The New York Times is no longer the prestigious paper of record. It has declined into an uncredible, ultra leftist piece of garbage. The same exact thing also pertains to the Washington Post. Both of them are a terrible disgrace to American journalism.
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19138

    Sep 23, 2016 2:21 PM GMT
    roadbikeRob saidThe New York Times is no longer the prestigious paper of record. It has declined into an uncredible, ultra leftist piece of garbage. The same exact thing also pertains to the Washington Post. Both of them are a terrible disgrace to American journalism.



    ^^^ This ^^^
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    Sep 23, 2016 5:43 PM GMT
    Normally I have no problem with a protest vote and I've written in Alfred E. Neuman on ballots a few times in my decades of voting, the last time being when the Democrats ran Crist for FL Gov. It killed me to not rally for the Democratic ticket against Scott who I think is disgusting but it wasn't at the presidential level and even at that not with the stakes at risk that we see now. This is truly phenomenal. We've never seen this threat to Democracy before, certainly not in living memory.

    One of two major parties crumbling, Their party leaders abandoning ship. The military telling us that they'd not follow tRump as Commander-in-chief were he to attempt to implement some of his campaigning. So many senior military leaders backing H. Clinton that tRump thought to gather 88 names of both disgraced and unknown military brass to "endorse" him & in doing so deceived the military into using them to form the symbolic 88 listed as endorsing which is white hood for HH or Heil hitler. Already he took our military and smeared them in racist shit and someone would vote for that?

    Never before have we seen foreign service diplomats, you know, the guys who have one ear to our country and the other ear to the rest of the world, never before have we seen them gather to denounce a tRump as presidential candidate. Never before have we seen Holocaust survivors denounce a presidential candidate.

    From survivors of the worst war crimes of history, to editorial boards of century-long supporters of the GOP, to our diplomats who've been stationed around the world, to our own Military, to the Republican's own party leaders, all these good people calling out warning against trump as candidate for president.

    This is not the time for a protest vote.

    And if Jill Green had balls or a brain, she'd throw her support to Hillary.
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    Sep 23, 2016 9:29 PM GMT
    Voting 3rd party denies the winner a mandate which means he or she will have to govern closer to the center. Since the House Of Reps is unlikely to flip, Hillary won't be giving out any of her promised Socialist Freebees and Taxes.
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    Sep 23, 2016 10:27 PM GMT
    mx5guynj saidVoting 3rd party denies the winner a mandate which means he or she will have to govern closer to the center. Since the House Of Reps is unlikely to flip, Hillary won't be giving out any of her promised Socialist Freebees and Taxes.


    Yeah, and T.Rump's plans will knock 20 million off health care and cost TRILLIONS for his programs of entitlement to the rich and even more military spending. (We already spend more than the next 7 countries combined).
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    Sep 23, 2016 11:35 PM GMT
    Hillary is worse because it will
    be a continuation of big ,corrupt, insider politics. Trump would be a weak outsider president and that is what we need right now in order to rebuild the Democracy. We will need term limits however, to get Congress functioning again. I'm not voting for either.
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19138

    Sep 26, 2016 2:42 PM GMT
    MaleElement saidHillary is worse because it will
    be a continuation of big ,corrupt, insider politics. Trump would be a weak outsider president and that is what we need right now in order to rebuild the Democracy. We will need term limits however, to get Congress functioning again. I'm not voting for either.


    I don't think Trump would be a weak outsider president at all. If anything, his outsider status will give him the freedom and power to knock some heads in DC and threaten that he will expose those holding up progress and change and who won't put "America First". Trump has a huge ego, and that ego means that the last thing he wants is to look like a failed president to the world.
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    Sep 26, 2016 2:45 PM GMT
    God_Said saidThe NYT is so full of shit, it cures constipation.

    Some people appear to be proudly uninformed and flat out dumb. Trump has made these people proud of their lack of brain power.