1. Palestine 100 years ago and prior centuries was the Greek-Latin/European name for Eretz Yisrael.
It was NOT a district/jurisdiction (let alone demographic group) in the Ottoman Empire.
Nor under the Mamlukes or Crusaders before that, going back to 1099.
AyaTrolLiar> The two were generally not conflated.
Should we believe the 1911 Britannica telling us how the word was then used or a known pathological liar for the cause?
AyaTrolLiar> The British used the term "Filastin" in Arabic and "Eretz Yisra'el" in Hebrew during the Mandate years, but they themselves used "Palestine" (not "Israel" or "Judah"
The "Mandate years" were less than 100 years ago, yet still we see the equating of the three terms as the same.
Odd that his first sentence tells us 2 of the terms were not "conflated" while his second sentences say the 2, and another term, were "conflated" by the British during the Mandate years.
Since Israel traditionally referred only to the northern kingdom and Judah to the southern, neither term would have been appropriate for both combined. Ergo the British opted for "Eretz Yisrael", the Land of Israel, as "Palestine" had been "conflated" for centuries before the Mandate.
AyaTrolLiar> At the turn of the last century, Palestine was already considered a "Wattaniya - a geopolitical locality - within a Qawmiyya - the pan-Arabist sphere of belonging", according to Israeli historian Ilan Pappé:
dear. When you are relegated to one selective odd-ball historian - with a known penchant of twisting facts to suit his model - the desperation is evident.
It's quite amazing how such a "locality" could exist exactly within borders that wouldn't be defined until 2 decades later.The Palestine Paradoxhttp://www.realjock.com/gayforums/2652202
AyaTrolLiar> "distinguished by dialect, customs and the people itself."
Except that the differences internally were greater than across the new borders. An Arab in Jericho to the east was closer in language, custom and blood to one in Amman (Trans/Jordan) than one in Gaza in the south. An Arab in Gaza was closer to one in El Arish (Egypt) than in Nazareth to the north. An Arab in Nazareth was closer to one in Tyre (Lebanon) than to the first Arab in Jericho.
AyaTrolLiar> "By 1922 [the year the British Mandate began], the majority of the Palestinian leaders, and one guesses the population at large, conceptualized Palestine as the national homeland of the Palestinians lying between the river Jordan and the Mediterranean."
How odd that prior to the conceptualization of this border, southern Lebanon and Trans-Jordan had been included in "Palestine".
Indeed, that conceptualization still existed a decade and a half (and we'll see below, also more than half a century) later.
What made Nayef Hawatmeh (founder of the DFLP), born to a Christian Bedouin tribe in Salt (Trans-Jordan) around 1938, a "Palestinian"?!
AyaTrolLiar> Haim Gerber notes that polls showed, as early as 1914, the inhabitants of the land "were very much 'Palestinians' in their own eyes, and in fact even in the eyes of their Ottoman overlords."
Let's look at more than one sentence written by Gerber, his source:
|| scholars almost universally agree that there were NO traces of Palestinian identity before it was invented by the British in 1918
. Rashid Khalidi and Yehoshua Porath are alone in claiming that such an identity existed a little
earlier, although for Porath it was no more than a reaction to Zionism
|| I do NOT argue that a Palestinian nation existed before 1920
|| I do NOT even argue the existence of a full-fledged, self-conscious ethnic community.
So he then jettisoned Gerber in favor of a different source, Porath.
ATLF> Porath is considered the foremost expert on the Palestinian national movement
And the title of his masterpiece on the subject?
|| The emergence of the Palestinian-Arab national movement, 1918-1929
And he twists it to make it appear to have been completed already by "1914"?!
He was claiming it began a century earlier?!The Emergence of Palestinian Arab Nationalism in the Mid-to-Late 20th Centuryhttp://www.realjock.com/gayforums/4193729
AyaTrolLiar> The standard work on the topic - a book to which he himself has appealed in the past - is "The Emergence of the Palestinian-Arab National Movement, 1918-1929", by Yehoshua Porath.
ROTFL. I didn't "appeal" to that book. It was his source. I just pointed out that the title contradicted the selective twisted quotes of the AyaTrolLiar, who was claiming that Palestinian Arab nationalism dated to the 1830s - and that Porath agreed with that.
AyaTrolLiar> Palestinian Arab nationalism is an Early-20th Century movement
Oh? Not in the 1830s? I guess that's progress!
But still there is a complete lack of nuance. It "emerged" in bits and pieces.
With different thoughts and beliefs that varied over time.
Consider that from 1949-1967 there was no movement to establish a Palestinian Arab state in the territories (then held by Arab governments).
Those in Judea, Samaria and eastern Jerusalem accepted Trans/Jordan's unification/annexation and Trans/Jordanian citizenship.
Consider that the PLO wouldn't try to take over Jordan until 1970 (after they lost the "West Bank").
The current form is a post-1967 phenomenon.
(See that thread: the inclusion of Bedouin and Armenians as Palestinians is a post-Oslo phenomenon.)