US protests 'harassment' by Chinese vessels

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    Mar 09, 2009 11:36 PM GMT


    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090309/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_china_incident

    Chinese Mariners Stripped to Their Underwear...sounds homoerotic, but I'm sure it's just good tactical maneuvering.
  • DCEric

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    Mar 10, 2009 12:00 AM GMT
    Well, to be fair, they stripped only after the wet t-shirt contest.
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    Mar 10, 2009 12:51 AM GMT


    Have a quick read about the 1956 Suez Crisis.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suez_crisis

    My hunch is that China will soon make a play for Taiwan and give the US the kind of choice that we gave England in 1956. I.E. China will to say the US: "Defend your foreign policy interest (i.e. Taiwan's sovereignty) and we will destroy your economy (by no longer financing your deficits). And my guess we will do what England did - save what we can of our economy and accelerate the end of our role as a super power and the defender of the status quo in Asia.
  • DCEric

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    Mar 10, 2009 12:58 AM GMT
    flieslikeabeagle said

    Have a quick read about the 1956 Suez Crisis.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suez_crisis

    My hunch is that China will soon make a play for Taiwan and give the US the kind of choice that we gave England in 1956. I.E. China will to say the US: "Defend your foreign policy interest (i.e. Taiwan's sovereignty) and we will destroy your economy (by no longer financing your deficits). And my guess we will do what England did - save what we can of our economy and accelerate the end of our role as a super power and the defender of the status quo in Asia.


    We have a winner. World power goes in 100 year cycles. Its been almost 100 years for the US. Taiwan and N. Korea seem to be the center of it. Usually some backwater country *cough*India*cough* who is going ahead with an economic boom along with the bad guy, takes over. Last time, Germany played the bad guy who unseated the UK for the USA, before that France... that ditched the Habsburgs.

    Ta-da!
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    Mar 10, 2009 1:12 AM GMT
    I thought we already gave up Taiwanese sovereignty.
  • DCEric

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    Mar 10, 2009 2:06 AM GMT
    owl975 saidI thought we already gave up Taiwanese sovereignty.


    Then why do we arm them?
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    Mar 10, 2009 4:39 AM GMT
    Apparently, it's the latest in a series of events created or at least fostered by the Chinese navy.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7933171.stm


    China has increasingly tested the United States military, in its satellites, electronic defenses, and now physically in (international) coastal waters.

    I think that this is all besides the point-they have our economy by the balls so to speak, in that we're increasingly relying on them to fund our deficit. I hope that the future military policies of the United States take that into account.
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    Mar 10, 2009 7:28 AM GMT
    north_runner saidApparently, it's the latest in a series of events created or at least fostered by the Chinese navy.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7933171.stm


    China has increasingly tested the United States military, in its satellites, electronic defenses, and now physically in (international) coastal waters.

    I think that this is all besides the point-they have our economy by the balls so to speak, in that we're increasingly relying on them to fund our deficit. I hope that the future military policies of the United States take that into account.
    Fuck that, I hope future ECONOMIC policies of the United States take that into account. How long has Chine received favored nation status from the US, despite their totalitarian policies and recently-in-the-news piece of shit exports.
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    Mar 10, 2009 8:05 AM GMT
    Oh, you're just not getting enough melanine.

    ;-)
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    Mar 10, 2009 9:05 AM GMT



    Maverick75Fuck that, I hope future ECONOMIC policies of the United States take that into account

    LOL i meant to say that too.
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    Mar 10, 2009 9:13 AM GMT
    Beaux saidOh, you're just not getting enough melanine.

    ;-)


    LMAO icon_lol.gif
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Mar 10, 2009 10:32 PM GMT
    It seems China does this same thing with every new President
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    Mar 10, 2009 10:36 PM GMT
    China is the new SuperPower, thanks to the Bush Administration. We must kiss their ass, as once other countries kissed ours. Thank you Republicans, that the US is now a second-rate power, held hostage by China.
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    Mar 10, 2009 11:00 PM GMT
    Topics like this one really make me ponder:

    Vatican City still has not gotten over the fact it is no longer a superpower.

    Mother England by the end, was happy to see the sun set on the empire, and handed a lot of it to the UN.

    So how is America, and Americans going to deal with it, when the sun sets in the American Empire? When they are no longer the main Superpower, and another country, will be able to do to America, what America has done to other Countries; dominate them?

    Just asking.......
  • styrgan

    Posts: 2017

    Mar 10, 2009 11:11 PM GMT
    Red_Vespa saidChina is the new SuperPower, thanks to the Bush Administration. We must kiss their ass, as once other countries kissed ours. Thank you Republicans, that the US is now a second-rate power, held hostage by China.


    No one should mistake China's holding of such a large percentage of our debt for true power. As we have seen in this economic crisis, the power a creditor has over its debtors is only valid so long as the debtor is willing to pay back his debt.

    One could make a similar counterargument based on the same facts. Because of our economic relationships with China, it would be imprudent for their government to allow any foreign policy disputes to escalate into a direct confrontation.
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    Mar 10, 2009 11:45 PM GMT
    I don't think it's a matter of saying thanks to the Republicans, as it would of happened anyway, even if the Democrats were in power.
  • TexanMan82

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    Mar 10, 2009 11:52 PM GMT
    China, the new superpower? That's rich. Have you been paying attention to what's happening over there?


    Pattison, you Aussies should just stick to what y'all know best, partying and riding kangaroos.

    Leave that silly "world superpower" talk to the big boys of the world.
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    Mar 11, 2009 12:06 AM GMT
    Beaux said

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090309/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_china_incident

    Chinese Mariners Stripped to Their Underwear...sounds homoerotic, but I'm sure it's just good tactical maneuvering.


    The US better be careful. China may suddenly call in all those notes/ cash those bonds

    or worse yet - stop manufacturing and selling us all that stuff. and gosh darn it what the hell would we do then!!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 11, 2009 12:13 AM GMT
    TexanMan82 saidChina, the new superpower? That's rich. Have you been paying attention to what's happening over there?


    Pattison, you Aussies should just stick to what y'all know best, partying and riding kangaroos.

    Leave that silly "world superpower" talk to the big boys of the world.


    Well we wish we could. But with America fucking up so badly, and Aussies, and Australians loosing their homes as well paying a price for it. We have a right to comment, and com plane. We also know Mr president of the moment, is not going to be able to turn things around.


    Can you imagine the out cry, if Americans were loosing their homes and jobs, because of the actions of us Aussies.
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    Mar 11, 2009 12:19 AM GMT
    Blackguy4you said

    or worse yet - stop manufacturing and selling us all that stuff. and gosh darn it what the hell would we do then!!


    ring ring
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    Indonesia?
    How long would it take for you to flood the U.S. market with remote control fart machines and fake doggie doo?



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  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 11, 2009 12:36 AM GMT
    First off: The US has been, since the early 1990s, placing China in strategic and military documents as a "threat", along with a "resurgent Russia."

    - Military adventurism on the part of the US and NATO, as well as placement of military bases, is strategically designed to contain Russia and China

    See:

    * Defense Planning Guidance 1992 - the Wolfowitz Doctrine
    http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E0CE5D61E38F93BA35750C0A964958260
    * "The Grand Chessboard" (1997) - By: Zbigniew Brzezinski, a top US strategist, with immense influence in US foreign policy planning circles, member of top US and international think tanks, CSIS, the Council on Foreign Relations, founder of Trilateral Commission, former National Security Adviser. Wrote this book as an outline for a grand strategy for the US empire in controlling Eurasia
    http://www.amazon.com/Grand-Chessboard-American-Geostrategic-Imperatives/dp/0465027261
    * Rebuilding America's Defenses - the Project for the New American Century, September 2000
    www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf
    * Joint Vision 2020 - Pentagon document, 2002 - outlining "full spectrum dominance"
    http://www.defenselink.mil/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=45289

    In the above-referenced documents, as well as in a similar variety of sources elsewhere, places such as Afghanistan, Iraq, the former Yugoslavia/Balkan states, Central Asia - Georgia, Uzbekistan, Pakistan, Iran, Turkey, are all seen as geo-strategic imperatives in advancing and maintaining the US empire and imperial hegemony over the globe.

    Specific reference to control over Central Asia is directed against both Russia and (especially) China.


    Economically, China has grown very fast. But it's growth was the result of and totally dependent, and still remains totally dependent upon US-led globalization, and specifically the US domestic consumer economy.

    China's economy is based upon being the nation of outsourced labour, with foreign corporations moving operations there, producing massive amounts of consumer products, which are then sold cheaply in Europe and North America, specifically, the US.

    Now, that the US is in a recession, which is only getting worse and likely to head into a Depression, consumption and imports fall. As these fall, so too, does the Chinese economy.


    Without this economic crisis, China would surely rise as the next great superpower, but, what political economists refer to as the Transnational Capitalist Class (TCC), or "global ruling class" (transnational elites primarily based in Europe and North America), seek to end the age of superpowers.

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    Mar 11, 2009 12:36 AM GMT
    To end the age of superpowers, the US empire must collapse, and the growth of China must be reigned in and controlled... essentially, tame the rising giant. If you study the Chinese economic giants in industry and banking, you will see that there has been an ever-increasing amount of Western, primarily British or American, corporate and banking kingpins appearing on the boards of Chinese companies. As well as this, US and European banks have been buying into and buying up the Chinese economy for the past several years. Such as JP Morgan Chase.

    The idea on the part of this TCC (global elite), is to create a new international, or transnational global society - an international socio-political-economic structure.

    The economic crisis, will serve to bring the countries of the world down to the same level, to allow for an international restructuring on an unprecedented scale.

    The Financial Times recently ran an article claiming that the solution to the world economic crisis is the formation of a world government:
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7a03e5b6-c541-11dd-b516-000077b07658.html?nclick_check=1

    This is the trend that the global political economy is, and has been, headed towards. China is significant in as much as the world seems to be restructuring the global political economy on the basis of creating it on the example of the "China model", of totalitarian capitalism.

    Even the financial times article above holds the quote, "International governance tends to be effective, only when it is anti-democratic."

    In fact, in November, 2008, the National Intelligence Council in the US, representing the centralized body over all 16 US intelligence agencies, working in cooperation with multinational corporations and the top international think tanks, such as the Council on Foreign Relations and the Royal Institute of International Affairs, released a report outlining their projections for the future of the world by 2025.

    In it, the economic crisis is discussed in terms of its projected outcomes, in that it will get much worse, global growth will slow and detract, western democracies will suffer greatly, and that the general trend will be for countries to follow the China model of economic development in "creating a new international system."

    The report also outlines the decline of the US as a superpower, and the emergence of regional blocs of power - Europe, Asia and North America, with regional governance structures, modeled on the EU, and regional currencies, modeled on the Euro.

    The report also states: "“Most of the pressing transnational problems – including climate change, regulation of globalized financial markets, migration, failing states, crime networks, etc. – are unlikely to be effectively resolved by the actions of individual nation-states. The need for effective global governance will increase faster than existing mechanisms can respond"

    It further stated, "the better economic performance of many authoritarian governments could sow doubts among some about democracy as the best form of government," and that "even in many well-established democracies, surveys show growing frustration with the current workings of democratic government and questioning among elites over the ability of democratic governments to take the bold actions necessary to deal rapidly and effectively with the growing number of transnational challenges."
    http://www.dni.gov/nic/NIC_2025_project.htmlE

    In effect, it outlines a decline in democracy in coordination with a rise in a new international world order.

    However, in relation to China, which is already so dependent upon the US, and holds US debt and treasury bills, there is a good chance it will seek to retake Taiwan. If the US acts, China may drop their dollars, which will mark the end of the dollar as the world reserve currency, as other nations will follow suit. However, the effect this will have will collapse the US economy, and China's economy would follow suit. So it will not be a decision made lightly.

    Historically, every period of a declining hegemon, or world imperial power, has always been marked by massive international conflict, such as several simultaneous or world wars - as well as economic crises and collapse.
  • styrgan

    Posts: 2017

    Mar 11, 2009 12:39 AM GMT
    Beaux said
    Blackguy4you said

    or worse yet - stop manufacturing and selling us all that stuff. and gosh darn it what the hell would we do then!!


    ring ring
    Hello?
    Indonesia?
    How long would it take for you to flood the U.S. market with remote control fart machines and fake doggie doo?



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    Are you Jim Cramer? Over the last fifteen or so years, China has actually become a real economy...
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 11, 2009 7:50 AM GMT
    Dietary Fiber: helping folks find the humor since wheat met bread.
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    Mar 12, 2009 6:19 AM GMT
    All I can say about this topic is it's just a matter of time before China reclaims what is theirs. U.S. is in trouble economically and China has the U.S.'s back in this financial crisis. As of 2009, according to Chinese websites and mainstream Hong Kong media, the Chinese Communist Party is gradually aiming towards a possible reunification in 2012.

    Other than what's going to happen.. here you can watch about what is China all about... and oh yes, you can think of China as a top super nation but think of what they are consist of with all that power! D:<