Spinoff 2.0: Gay Standards--Better, Faster Stronger

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    Apr 15, 2009 4:21 AM GMT
    I posted on another thread about gay media standards and another one about racial stereotypes and how that leads to interesting outcomes in the gay community, to put it mildly. Some asked for information (CJC) so this is for you. My previous question was what influence does the media have on communicating standards to our community--to all of us. Some think its minimal. I think it's greater than we realize. We are virtually marinated in media and we absorb messages from it that we accept uncritically.

    I think this topic is important because it goes to what the next generation learns about themselves and others, and more importantly does society owe it to them to do anything about it. But equally important is that the effects don't stop once we reach adulthood; these kids grow up to hold onto these various stereotypes as adults and view others through that lens. In the gay community, because we are smaller these effects are more concentrated.


    What media teaches our kids about types.

    While many argue that it’s just human nature to make sweeping generalizations about people, the media certainly takes an active role in reinforcing them. Taking a critical look at what those generalizations mean, how they paint so many people unfairly, and most important, how they may misinform our kids about the world around them, can go a long way to undoing the damage.

    What are they?

    Media is full of economic, gender, and ethnic stereotypes, from the roles of good guys and bad guys in video games, to the animated films our youngest children enjoy. White male heroes outnumber both women and minorities in media portrayals. And although women have come a long way in how popular culture reflects their status, statistics show that women are still most often relegated to roles of love interest, sex object, or selfless saint.

    [b]Why they matter[/b]
    The images our kids see powerfully inform their sense of what is “normal.” When kids see class, racial, and sexual relations portrayed over and over, it reinforces class, race, and gender stereotypes. The characters they see can become role models – and kids may want to imitate the behavior they see. They may also form judgments about others based on portrayals.

    When I posted originally, it was based on my observations, but check out the video on this link for a more sophisticated treatment of what I was trying to convey.

    A lot of people will take issue with this. This is a forum topic for adults who might be interested, so if you're just going to say who cares, then perhaps you can skip over this forum. But if you have something interesting to say, it would be cool to hear what you think.

    My personal view is that it comes down to money. I think that the powers that be realize that if they feature young models who don't look like most people, it creates anxiety and a desire to emulate them. That way we keep coming back, keep buying products to attain the look we are so often presented with--even if it is a narrow one. That's bad because it makes nearly everyone insecure to a certain degree especially when you're young and impressionable.

    What media teaches our kids

    * Studies show that almost twice as many blacks and Hispanics show up as villains in mainstream media
    * A Dads and Daughters study of G-rated films revealed that there are 3 male characters to every female character
    * Almost twice as many non-white males are portrayed as physically aggressive in G-rated movies
    * 60% of female video game characters are presented in a sexualized fashion

    watch the video here: http://www.commonsensemedia.org/battling-stereotypes-tips
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    Apr 15, 2009 4:24 AM GMT
    http://www.commonsensemedia.org/battling-stereotypes-tips
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    Apr 15, 2009 4:28 AM GMT
    Is that video seriously serious?
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    Apr 15, 2009 7:05 AM GMT
    campbells_soup_40vk.jpg

    If you don't like your label, then change your behavior. Simple as that. People are gonna treat you like a flaming, glitter-farting fairy when you act like a flaming, glitter-farting fairy just as much as they'll treat you like a doctor if you act like a doctor or a dumb blond if you act like a dumb blond. I think most people will agree (even if only privately) that a black guy is more likely to pull a gun on you in a dark alley downtown than a white guy. It's a sad fact of life that it breaks down like that, but that's where those stereotypes arise from: general behaviors that can be expected from a group of people sharing similar characteristics.

    Welcome to the general cruelty of generalizations. You can either accept your label or actively mold yourself to another.
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    Apr 15, 2009 7:24 AM GMT
    There's a saying: "Art imitates science."

    And another saying: "Art is a reflection of popular culture."

    I.e, we may not feel that all black folks are bad. However, if you watched Black in America, you know that 80% of black kids are born to single parent households. Here in Dallas 1 in 10 is infected with HIV. Various other statistics, with regard to prison population and so on. It is what it is.

    Often, art is a reflection of the current state of popular culture.

    The only thing you can do to change that REALITY is for the culture to change from within.

    Everyone is NOT second winner. Some folks ARE losers. Some folks are fatties, creeps, etc. Reality is what it is, even if we don't sometimes like it.

    Stereoptypes get broken down by changes in behavior. Bucking the trend. You have a point with regard to the enforcement of those stereotypes, but media, and art, are a reflection upon the reality of popular culture.

    I've NEVER had a gun pulled on me by some folks.
    I've NEVER been scolded on the phone by some folks who are CSR's, ever.
    I've NEVER been blasted by hip-hop at 02:00 by some folks, ever.
    I've NEVER been told that "I am on the phone here" while the only one in the store, and scolded by some folks.
    I've RARELY been antagonized by some folks.

    We come to base our beliefs (generalizations, at that) upon our experiences. Like it, or not.

    Often, stereotypes have a STRONG basis in FACT.

    You break down stereotypes by behaving properly. Not all gay folks are rainbow fairies. Those folks that don't act like rainbow fairies help to break down stereotypes and foster understanding.

    E.g. as a customer, I have an expectation that when I call the phone company the rep will engage in active listening and work to resolve my issue, NOT SCOLD ME. In such instances, I hang on up, and call back, unless it goes to far, in which case I call the CEO's office, and let them know how I was treated. Being gay, black, fat, etc. does NOT entitle, nor obligate, one to bad behavior.

    There's a time honored saying: "Make a customer happy, gain 5. Piss a customer off, lose 10."

    We don't live in Utopia. It's as simple as that.

    If one is antagonistic, flippant, rude, they reinforce a stereotype.

    That's why it's so important to not be an enabler to bad behavior, whether it's being rude, overeating, or being closeted. They're all bad behavior. Because we don't set expectations, society as a whole has declined in its sensibilities. Anything goes should not be the rule of the day.

    I don't spend money at the McDonald's near my house. Why? They've fucked up our order one to many times because they refuse to have American English speakers taking orders. We spend our money elsewhere (at the McDonald's further up the road where they DO speak English). Does that make me a bigot? Of course not. That makes me tired of having my order fucked up.

  • Anto

    Posts: 2035

    Apr 15, 2009 10:35 AM GMT
    Being closeted is bad behavior?
  • Anto

    Posts: 2035

    Apr 15, 2009 10:53 AM GMT
    * Studies show that almost twice as many blacks and Hispanics show up as villains in mainstream media
    * A Dads and Daughters study of G-rated films revealed that there are 3 male characters to every female character
    * Almost twice as many non-white males are portrayed as physically aggressive in G-rated movies
    * 60% of female video game characters are presented in a sexualized fashion


    Those facts are subjective and lacking in context. They can be interpreted in different ways as well, not necessarily negative either.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 15, 2009 11:15 AM GMT
    Favorite line of that video:

    "If you're not sensitive, these movies can be funny."

    They can be funny even if you are!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 15, 2009 11:35 AM GMT
    Upon further review, that website is the most fear-mongering, blatant agenda pushing, moral-panic inducing website I've ever seen. The only reason sites like that exist is because there are so many abysmally crappy parents out there who shouldn't be allowed to have children. Having common sense, a strong sense of self, and being mature and responsible are the best tools you can have as parents, NOT the use of websites like that dreck.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 15, 2009 8:51 PM GMT
    HotToddy saidUpon further review, that website is the most fear-mongering, blatant agenda pushing, moral-panic inducing website I've ever seen. The only reason sites like that exist is because there are so many abysmally crappy parents out there who shouldn't be allowed to have children. Having common sense, a strong sense of self, and being mature and responsible are the best tools you can have as parents, NOT the use of websites like that dreck.


    ^ AMEN!!
  • Rookz

    Posts: 947

    Apr 15, 2009 9:15 PM GMT
    Oh twentysixpoint, another one of your postings bites the dust.

  • Klutch84

    Posts: 286

    Apr 15, 2009 10:41 PM GMT
    withHonor saidOh twentysixpoint, another one of your postings bites the dust.



    I admire his cause/persistence but when "Becky's & Bob's" don't wanna listen, they aren't gonna hear it.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 16, 2009 6:48 AM GMT
    Shifty84 said
    withHonor saidOh twentysixpoint, another one of your postings bites the dust.



    I admire his cause/persistence but when "Becky's & Bob's" don't wanna listen, they aren't gonna hear it.
    That's why persistence is important. When you are studying, sometimes you have to read a chapter more than once. When you are trying to teach people something, you expose them to the information over and over. Twentysixpoint's original post is related to issues in the Asian Aversion thread. This is why minorities are being marginalized in the gay community. Its comes from the very core of the society they grew up in! Why the gay community tolerates the marginalization of its own members when its fighting marginalization itself is what makes racial issues so frustrating for those of us who get it!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 16, 2009 6:54 AM GMT
    flex89 saidcampbells_soup_40vk.jpg

    If you don't like your label, then change your behavior. Simple as that. People are gonna treat you like a flaming, glitter-farting fairy when you act like a flaming, glitter-farting fairy just as much as they'll treat you like a doctor if you act like a doctor or a dumb blond if you act like a dumb blond. I think most people will agree (even if only privately) that a black guy is more likely to pull a gun on you in a dark alley downtown than a white guy. It's a sad fact of life that it breaks down like that, but that's where those stereotypes arise from: general behaviors that can be expected from a group of people sharing similar characteristics.

    Welcome to the general cruelty of generalizations. You can either accept your label or actively mold yourself to another.
    Changing my label would make sense if I was being fairly labelled to begin with. How do you label something you don't understand anyway? How about I do something that affects how people choose to attach that label to me and others to begin with? How about innocent til proven guilty? How about I change what others think without the need to change my behavior?

    Homosexual does not equal criminal. Non-white skin does not equal criminal.