New Fitness Goal: Gaining muscle

  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 01, 2009 5:17 PM GMT
    Hey guys, I've been posting topics in the past about losing weight, but I've finally decided to do the opposite now. My new fitness goal is add on a few pounds of lean muscle, while not gaining any fat. I'm 20 yr, 5'8, 152 lbs, I've been going to the gym for a while and have a descent experience on nutrition. However, I frankly am completely ignorant on this whole new process. I've focused so much on all the fitness and nutrtional goals of losing weight, that I really don't know much about gaining muscle. I have six weeks to do this, and I'm looking to work my hardest and work as efficiently as possible to get the best results. I mainly just need help on getting a new workout and figuring out how the nutrition works. I'm guessing I have to take in a surplus of calories, and lift heavy in my workouts. However, I'm sure the process entails a great more than just that. My friend recommended I take creatine, so I think that's important too. Any general and maybe specific advice? Again, any help would be great thanks.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 01, 2009 5:26 PM GMT
    Browse through the workout plans at the top of the page for ideas.
    You don't necessarily have to join one of those plans to get ideas and
    inspiration it
  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 02, 2009 1:13 AM GMT
    Well not many people have responded to this, so forget what I just said here. My main goal is to LOSE BODY FAT. At 20 yr, 5'8, and 152 I think I'm around 14-16% body fat, and YES I do think that's high. I'm willing to do WHATEVER that entails whether it be eating less/more calories, gaining muscle, WHATEVER it is as long as I lose as much body fat as I can. Sorry if I sound a bit mad, but I'm just frustrated at the moment with all this fitness crap. Again, any advice will help thanks.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 1:26 AM GMT
    Eat.

    You'll get bigger.
  • bobcatman

    Posts: 37

    May 02, 2009 1:27 AM GMT
    I am currently in the same situation. But here is the thing. You have to eat to keep the fire burning, just make sure it is the right food and at the right time. Protein is great throughout the day and in the night and different types. But you can't forget vegetables and fruits and complex carbohydrates.

    A lot of the articles I am reading are saying protein prior to working out and immediately after working out. During working out you will want some simple carbohydrates and prior to working out for quick energy.

    One thing, when you wake up your body is in a catabolic state and need to have quick whey protein to stop this.

    Body fat is something I am slowly working on. I have toned up and slowly decreased it but it takes time. You should be working more on your muscle and strength, but that is my opinion. I have 12 lbs of muscle, so it is working. And reading a lot to get through all the information.
  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 02, 2009 2:03 AM GMT
    chuckystud saidEat.

    You'll get bigger.


    Dude how many times do I have to tell you? I do NOT wanna get bigger, I want to LOSE BODY FAT. Not everybody wants to look like you
  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 02, 2009 2:08 AM GMT
    bobcatman saidI am currently in the same situation. But here is the thing. You have to eat to keep the fire burning, just make sure it is the right food and at the right time. Protein is great throughout the day and in the night and different types. But you can't forget vegetables and fruits and complex carbohydrates.

    A lot of the articles I am reading are saying protein prior to working out and immediately after working out. During working out you will want some simple carbohydrates and prior to working out for quick energy.

    One thing, when you wake up your body is in a catabolic state and need to have quick whey protein to stop this.

    Body fat is something I am slowly working on. I have toned up and slowly decreased it but it takes time. You should be working more on your muscle and strength, but that is my opinion. I have 12 lbs of muscle, so it is working. And reading a lot to get through all the information.


    Thanks for responding. I thought about gaining muscle too, but then people started to tell me gaining muscle also means gaining some fat. That's exactly what I do NOT want to do. Oh and just to let everybody, I have a bit of experience with this stuff. So yes I know somewhat about carbs, protein, fat, calories, eating 5 meals a day, not eating junk food, cutting out processed foods and bad carbs, controlling calorie intake, eating the right foods, consuming a lot of protein, etc etc etc. Sorry if I sound rude, but I know most of the basics already so Please don't reiterate it. I just need help on what I'm doing now.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 7:46 AM GMT
    Eat. It'll keep your body from becoming a fat storing machine.
  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 02, 2009 7:57 AM GMT
    samerphx said152 lbs is too heavy for your age. you should be 130 or something.


    Alright that's DEFINETELY one thing I know is COMPLETELY false. If I were 130 lbs, I'd be anorexic. EVERYBODY on these kinds of forums has told me that at 152 they do not even recommend me losing more weight. I do not know where you're getting your information from.
  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 02, 2009 7:58 AM GMT
    chuckystud saidEat. It'll keep your body from becoming a fat storing machine.


    Yes, I do eat. I consume at least 2000 calories a day, and NO that is not starving yourself.
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    May 02, 2009 5:14 PM GMT
    Your'e right. You are ignorant, and, not all that coachable.

    You cannot gain muscle without gaining weight, because muscle has weight, unless you happen to lose fat at the same time, and the only way you can really do that well is with chemical muscle enhancement.

    Muscle is much denser than fat, and muscle burns about 15 calories per 1 pound of it, per day, every day.

    If you want to be able to be leaner, stay leaner, and have a higher metabolic rate, you have to increase your lean muscle mass, or muscle mass ratio. In fact, increasing your lean muscle mass is the ONLY way that you can increase your base metabolism, without chemicals, as you grow older. Having more muscle allow you to eat more calories; eating more calories allows you to have more muscle.

    Since you're already tiny, the latter (changing your body composition) is not really an option for you. To gain lean muscle / weight you need a surplus of calories which works out to about 15 calories per pound of lean muscle; you need about 600 calories for a moderate workout; you need about 600 calories to grow on.

    So, let's say you have 140 pounds of muscle, that would be 2100 calories, JUST TO SUPPORT THE MUSCLE. Now add 600 calories for growth. Add another 600 calories to sustain a moderate workout. Clearly, you're not even getting enough calories to sustain your current weight, much less a vigorous workout routine geared towards metabolic activation and muscle gain, and athletic performance.

    I've tried telling you several times, but, you keep defeating yourself in your lack of research, stubbornness, and lack of common sense. If you want a slow metabolism that preserves fat, and sheds muscle, keep doing what you're doing.

    The laws of science, and your body work that way. You can continue to NOT listen, and, you'll continue to fail.

    When I'm at most lowest fat levels, around 4%, I'll bring my calories UP to over 4000 to sustain my activity level, and 3-a-day workouts.

    Eat to win.

    In this picture, I'm eating over 3800 calories per day, and working out three times a day. Clearly, you don't need 3800 calories a day, but, you need at least enough to makes gains, or you're wasting your time in your workouts.

    9730_176046.jpg

    Low calories diets, particularly those low in carbs, invoke the feast famine response teaching your body how to becoming a fat-storing, muscle-burning, machine. That's why fat asses so often fail in diet. They just don't get it. They refuse to understand it.

    Without gaining some weight, you cannot gain muscle. Without adequate calories you cannot gain muscle. Unless you have a dead on diet, great genes, or use chemical muscle enhancement, you can't gain weight without gaining a bit of fat.

    That's just how the human machine works.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 6:55 PM GMT
    chuckystud saidYour'e right. You are ignorant, and, not all that coachable.

    You cannot gain muscle without gaining weight, because muscle has weight, unless you happen to lose fat at the same time, and the only way you can really do that well is with chemical muscle enhancement.

    Muscle is much denser than fat, and muscle burns about 15 calories per 1 pound of it, per day, every day.

    If you want to be able to be leaner, stay leaner, and have a higher metabolic rate, you have to increase your lean muscle mass, or muscle mass ratio. In fact, increasing your lean muscle mass is the ONLY way that you can increase your base metabolism, without chemicals, as you grow older. Having more muscle allow you to eat more calories; eating more calories allows you to have more muscle.

    Since you're already tiny, the latter (changing your body composition) is not really an option for you. To gain lean muscle / weight you need a surplus of calories which works out to about 15 calories per pound of lean muscle; you need about 600 calories for a moderate workout; you need about 600 calories to grow on.

    So, let's say you have 140 pounds of muscle, that would be 2100 calories, JUST TO SUPPORT THE MUSCLE. Now add 600 calories for growth. Add another 600 calories to sustain a moderate workout. Clearly, you're not even getting enough calories to sustain your current weight, much less a vigorous workout routine geared towards metabolic activation and muscle gain, and athletic performance.

    I've tried telling you several times, but, you keep defeating yourself in your lack of research, stubbornness, and lack of common sense. If you want a slow metabolism that preserves fat, and sheds muscle, keep doing what you're doing.

    The laws of science, and your body work that way. You can continue to NOT listen, and, you'll continue to fail.

    When I'm at most lowest fat levels, around 4%, I'll bring my calories UP to over 4000 to sustain my activity level, and 3-a-day workouts.

    Eat to win.

    In this picture, I'm eating over 3800 calories per day, and working out three times a day. Clearly, you don't need 3800 calories a day, but, you need at least enough to makes gains, or you're wasting your time in your workouts.

    9730_176046.jpg

    Low calories diets, particularly those low in carbs, invoke the feast famine response teaching your body how to becoming a fat-storing, muscle-burning, machine. That's why fat asses so often fail in diet. They just don't get it. They refuse to understand it.

    Without gaining some weight, you cannot gain muscle. Without adequate calories you cannot gain muscle. Unless you have a dead on diet, great genes, or use chemical muscle enhancement, you can't gain weight without gaining a bit of fat.

    That's just how the human machine works.


    You are a fantastic resource for realjock. Thanks for sharing with us!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 7:13 PM GMT
    First, 152 at 5'8", at any age is almost the ideal weight, depending on body composition. If you are working out consistently, that would be considered a lightweight or extremely ripped, again, depending on body composition.

    Second, I say ignore the scale. Focus on your body image as far as what you want your body to look like or feel like. Also, keep in mind that focusing on the scale can be misleading and can lead to frustration. I have a relatively small bone stucture (which from a symmetry standpoint is a good thing) and I may give up on average about 10 lbs to the next guy just based on that. People always say I look about 10-20 lbs more than I actually am.

    To chuckystud's points, you have to better define your goals and make sure there's no contradictions. You say you want to drop body fat, but it also sounds like you don't want to drop weight. The only way to do that is to replace fat with muscle and you cannot do that without eating right. So, chucky's advice to eat is spot-on, but you have to eat the right foods and focus on increasing your muscle mass.
  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 02, 2009 8:24 PM GMT
    chuckystud saidYour'e right. You are ignorant, and, not all that coachable.

    You cannot gain muscle without gaining weight, because muscle has weight, unless you happen to lose fat at the same time, and the only way you can really do that well is with chemical muscle enhancement.

    Muscle is much denser than fat, and muscle burns about 15 calories per 1 pound of it, per day, every day.

    If you want to be able to be leaner, stay leaner, and have a higher metabolic rate, you have to increase your lean muscle mass, or muscle mass ratio. In fact, increasing your lean muscle mass is the ONLY way that you can increase your base metabolism, without chemicals, as you grow older. Having more muscle allow you to eat more calories; eating more calories allows you to have more muscle.

    Since you're already tiny, the latter (changing your body composition) is not really an option for you. To gain lean muscle / weight you need a surplus of calories which works out to about 15 calories per pound of lean muscle; you need about 600 calories for a moderate workout; you need about 600 calories to grow on.

    So, let's say you have 140 pounds of muscle, that would be 2100 calories, JUST TO SUPPORT THE MUSCLE. Now add 600 calories for growth. Add another 600 calories to sustain a moderate workout. Clearly, you're not even getting enough calories to sustain your current weight, much less a vigorous workout routine geared towards metabolic activation and muscle gain, and athletic performance.

    I've tried telling you several times, but, you keep defeating yourself in your lack of research, stubbornness, and lack of common sense. If you want a slow metabolism that preserves fat, and sheds muscle, keep doing what you're doing.

    The laws of science, and your body work that way. You can continue to NOT listen, and, you'll continue to fail.

    When I'm at most lowest fat levels, around 4%, I'll bring my calories UP to over 4000 to sustain my activity level, and 3-a-day workouts.

    Eat to win.

    In this picture, I'm eating over 3800 calories per day, and working out three times a day. Clearly, you don't need 3800 calories a day, but, you need at least enough to makes gains, or you're wasting your time in your workouts.

    9730_176046.jpg

    Low calories diets, particularly those low in carbs, invoke the feast famine response teaching your body how to becoming a fat-storing, muscle-burning, machine. That's why fat asses so often fail in diet. They just don't get it. They refuse to understand it.

    Without gaining some weight, you cannot gain muscle. Without adequate calories you cannot gain muscle. Unless you have a dead on diet, great genes, or use chemical muscle enhancement, you can't gain weight without gaining a bit of fat.

    That's just how the human machine works.



    If you bothered to keep reading what I said on my thread, I want to LOSE BODY FAT. Apparently, gaining muscle entails gaining some fat, whihc is exactly what I do NOT want to do. I've done my research and know that losing body fat means lowering the calories. Do you keep thinking I want to look like some meathead with nothing on me but fat muscle? I do not want veins popping out all over my body, all that and big fat muscles is disgusting.
  • sfboy987

    Posts: 209

    May 02, 2009 8:38 PM GMT
    EastCoastNAZ saidFirst, 152 at 5'8", at any age is almost the ideal weight, depending on body composition. If you are working out consistently, that would be considered a lightweight or extremely ripped, again, depending on body composition.

    Second, I say ignore the scale. Focus on your body image as far as what you want your body to look like or feel like. Also, keep in mind that focusing on the scale can be misleading and can lead to frustration. I have a relatively small bone stucture (which from a symmetry standpoint is a good thing) and I may give up on average about 10 lbs to the next guy just based on that. People always say I look about 10-20 lbs more than I actually am.

    To chuckystud's points, you have to better define your goals and make sure there's no contradictions. You say you want to drop body fat, but it also sounds like you don't want to drop weight. The only way to do that is to replace fat with muscle and you cannot do that without eating right. So, chucky's advice to eat is spot-on, but you have to eat the right foods and focus on increasing your muscle mass.



    Thanks for the response, and yeah I figured the scale is misleading. My goal is to lose body fat. I WAS considering gaining muscle, but people have told me that also means gaining some fat along the way. Again, I do NOT want to gain fat. Sorry if I contradicted myself, but that one guy kinda agitated me by saying I'm heavy at 152, when most guys including you say that's an "ideal weight." Again, I want to lose body fat, so I'll do whatever that entails whether it's losing weight, gaining muscle, eating less/more as long as I do not gain any fat.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 9:04 PM GMT
    The poster's ignorance is AMAZING. He said "My new fitness goal is add on a few pounds of lean muscle, while not gaining any fat. I'm 20 yr, 5'8, 152 lbs, I've been going to the gym for a while and have a descent experience on nutrition."

    Veins popping out is from very low fat levels and being in extreme good cardio condition. Low fat...around 4% (likely much lower than you've ever been). You keep saying you want to lose fat, but, the way to lose fat is to gain muscle, all while eating enough calories to sustain that muscle, and supporting athletic performance. I show you a picture of low fat, and you continue to whine. Actually, you lashed out. To bad I'm good at it, huh?

    I didn't read anything where I told you that you should look like me. Not one thing. Clearly, you don't have the knowledge, discipline, genes, or coachability to do what I do. I'd never, for even a minute, imagine you could do what I do, and I suggested no such thing. Go re-read what I wrote.

    I told you how to gain muscle, and to do that, you have to eat. It's much easier to stay lean if you have muscle, because unlike fat, it burns calories just sitting there.

    If you've done your research, why do you even ask the question? If you're so smart, why are you continuing to fail?

    You lash out at me (it's o.k., I've meant folks like you before and can take it just fine), but, clearly, I know what I'm talking about and gave you sound advice, and other folks support me.

    Clearly you're not trainable. Clearly, you also weren't taught how to behave properly, which, I suspect speaks to a long list of issues you probably have.

    Losing fat is NOT about just lowering calories, but, about metabolic activation. That's the point you keep missing. A flame that burns hot burns more fat. A flame can't burn hot without fuel. You can't workout without fuel. When I compete, I bring my calories UP and increase my activity level to get to extremely low fat as shown in the picture. You truly don't get it, and don't seem willing to accept sound advice in a gracious way.

    Now, think, for just a second. E.g. Lance Armstrong, do you think he's fat? Of course not. He eats like a pig! When you see a guy on stage, not only is he carrying mounds of muscle, he's also exceptionally fit. You simple can't get that lean without performing at an extremely high level. You'd do well to come to understand that to have athletic performance, in any sport, you have to fuel the furnace. I.e., you have to eat.

    Oh, well. Your loss. I'm much better at it than you, obviously.

    Read it and weep, Little One.

    http://www.bodybuilders.com/chuckg.htm

    You have a bunch of issues little buddy.

    Good luck with whatever it is you're trying to do.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 9:12 PM GMT
    MrJames saidYou are a fantastic resource for realjock. Thanks for sharing with us!


    Thanks, ...I'll be here all week.
  • dannyboy1101

    Posts: 977

    May 02, 2009 9:37 PM GMT
    Well this was a forum worth reading... Topics shouldn't change in three postings.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 9:41 PM GMT
    How did you reach your estimate of 14-16% body fat?
    (BIA, DXA, Caliper in N number of places, tape measure at N number of places? dunk tank)?

    WHY do you think that is high? High for what or compared to who?

    Get much lower and you WILL get more ripped looking and visibly veiny.
    Especially in you do it in a hurry.

    You cannot convert your remaining body fat into lean muscle.
    Muscle is made of protein which contains nitrogen. Fat does not contain nitrogen ( oversimplyfying here)

    You can lose fat through cardio for extended times at about 40% max heart rate while eating a slight caloric deficit.

    You can build lean muscle mass through resistance training and slight caloric surplus with plenty of protein, essential oils, and moderate carbs.

    Can you simultaneously have caloric deficit and surplus? Not in the same day.
    Your seemingly contradictory objectives can only be balanced by you.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 02, 2009 9:56 PM GMT
    Hugo Rivera has written an article" Lose Bodyfat And Gain Muscle With A Good Bodybuilding Diet"

    http://bodybuilding.about.com/od/nutritionbasics/a/samplediet.htm

    http://bodybuilding.about.com/od/nutritionbasics/a/nutrition.htm

    Hope the articles are helpful to you