Prop 8 Marriage Ban Upheld By Court

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 26, 2009 5:49 PM GMT
    The result most of us were expecting: the ban upheld, existing gay marriages OK

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30936298/
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    May 26, 2009 6:31 PM GMT
    http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/05/26/california.same.sex.marriage/index.html
  • TallGWMvballe...

    Posts: 1925

    May 26, 2009 6:40 PM GMT
    It is very disappointing although not unexpected.... THIS time there will be even more pushing from Gay rights activists I hope.
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    May 26, 2009 6:44 PM GMT
    muchmorethanmuscle saidWell, at least it's not a step backwards. icon_confused.gif

    I think it IS a step backwards. California had gay marriage, now it is confirmed that it does not.
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    May 26, 2009 6:50 PM GMT
    TallGWMvballer saidIt is very disappointing although not unexpected.... THIS time there will be even more pushing from Gay rights activists I hope.

    Hopefully from a new group of California gay rights activists. The bunch that fought Prop 8 in 2008 bungled it badly, as most observers agree.

    It wasn't just about how Christian interests, like the Catholics & Mormons, brought money to bear (and perhaps illegally), but how incompetent, arrogant and ineffective the gay leadership was. Let's hope a new generation will do better this time.
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    May 26, 2009 7:31 PM GMT
    Very obnoxious to work at a school where other teachers celebrate this position.

    They are beaming with pride while I'm left wondering how much longer this tired debate can continue...


    Iowa of all places will allow gay marriage.

    Iowa.

    For the second time in my life, I am embarrassed to be a Californian.

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    May 26, 2009 7:37 PM GMT
    Y'know - I don't know how this whole thing doesn't just boil down to an issue of gender discrimination. If a man can marry a woman, isn't it discrimination that a woman cannot and if a woman can marry a man, isn't it discrimination that a man cannot? California has written gender discrimination into it's constitution, not just homophobia.
  • jeffper1

    Posts: 148

    May 26, 2009 7:43 PM GMT
    not a step backwards...just a small step......fucking california
    you know we let all the bible belt ppl in and now we have to deal with it
    such a sidetrack
  • jeffper1

    Posts: 148

    May 26, 2009 7:44 PM GMT
    TallGWMvballer saidIt is very disappointing although not unexpected.... THIS time there will be even more pushing from Gay rights activists I hope.
    yes..now is the time to measure our odds
    we can unite and conquer
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    May 26, 2009 7:45 PM GMT
    ucla_matta saidVery obnoxious to work at a school where other teachers celebrate this position.

    They are beaming with pride while I'm left wondering how much longer this tired debate can continue...

    Iowa of all places will allow gay marriage.

    Iowa.

    For the second time in my life, I am embarrassed to be a Californian.

    Well, you needn't be embarrassed for long. The rabid Republicans are already planning to do the same thing in Iowa that they did in California. It may take a little longer, because of the lengthier constitutional amendment cycle in that state, but they are already at work.

    Given how much more conservative Iowa is compared to California, I don't think the Republicans will have much trouble. It's just a matter of going through the amendment procedure, and they'll get their way. I'll bet you any money than in about 2 years Iowa will have banished gay marriage as effectively as Texas or Ohio, or 38 other US states.
  • jeffper1

    Posts: 148

    May 26, 2009 7:46 PM GMT
    ucla_matta saidVery obnoxious to work at a school where other teachers celebrate this position.

    They are beaming with pride while I'm left wondering how much longer this tired debate can continue...


    Iowa of all places will allow gay marriage.

    Iowa.

    For the second time in my life, I am embarrassed to be a Californian.


    don't be matta....let it speak of your convictions....makes you stronger
    it's not the state its the ppl in it
  • jeffper1

    Posts: 148

    May 26, 2009 7:50 PM GMT
    Red_Vespa said
    ucla_matta saidVery obnoxious to work at a school where other teachers celebrate this position.

    They are beaming with pride while I'm left wondering how much longer this tired debate can continue...

    Iowa of all places will allow gay marriage.

    Iowa.

    For the second time in my life, I am embarrassed to be a Californian.

    Well, you needn't be embarrassed for long. The rabid Republicans are already planning to do the same thing in Iowa that they did in California. It may take a little longer, because of the lengthier constitutional amendment cycle in that state, but they are already at work.

    Given how much more conservative Iowa is compared to California, I don't think the Republicans will have much trouble. It's just a matter of going through the amendment procedure, and they'll get their way. I'll bet you any money than in about 2 years Iowa will have banished gay marriage as effectively as Texas or Ohio, or 38 other US states.

    it's a matter of time....
    however...i love the way some of us come together to try and make it better for those who follow into the future.....
    fuck the politicians.....they don't do much for me
    but will say this.......write 'em and bog em down.....with you thoughts and feelings.....they will start to listen
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    May 26, 2009 7:57 PM GMT
    jeffper1 saidfuck the politicians.....they don't do much for me
    but will say this.......write 'em and bog em down.....with you thoughts and feelings.....they will start to listen

    The politicians run the show, we have no options. What we CAN do is never vote for a Republican for so much as dog catcher.

    No matter what their personal charm and stated positions, once in office Republicans vote the Party Platform, which is virulently anti-gay. They smile to your face and say nice things at rallies, and then vote as the Party demands.

    Not that Democrats are totally reliable as allies, either. They've thrown us under the bus any number of times. But up against a Republican they are the lesser of 2 evils, and in party primaries we have a chance to choose the more gay-friendly.
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    May 26, 2009 8:17 PM GMT
    It's rather depressing, but I can't say I didn't see it coming either. It's okay though, they may have won this battle, but the war definitely isn't over. Hopefully this sparks even more new and existing activists to come out and do something. Sucks to be a Californian right now. icon_redface.gif
  • jeffper1

    Posts: 148

    May 26, 2009 8:35 PM GMT
    Red_Vespa said
    jeffper1 saidfuck the politicians.....they don't do much for me
    but will say this.......write 'em and bog em down.....with you thoughts and feelings.....they will start to listen

    The politicians run the show, we have no options. What we CAN do is never vote for a Republican for so much as dog catcher.

    No matter what their personal charm and stated positions, once in office Republicans vote the Party Platform, which is virulently anti-gay. They smile to your face and say nice things at rallies, and then vote as the Party demands.

    Not that Democrats are totally reliable as allies, either. They've thrown us under the bus any number of times. But up against a Republican they are the lesser of 2 evils, and in party primaries we have a chance to choose the more gay-friendly.


    i agree vespa..but who the heck really has our backs????
    just us
  • daveza

    Posts: 22

    May 26, 2009 8:41 PM GMT
    MASS PROTEST TO START FROM UCLA AT 4PM. MARCH TO FEDERAL BUILDING. CALLING UPON PRESIDENT OBAMA TO TAKE FEDERAL ACTION NOW.

    FOLLOW ALL UPDATES VIA TWITTER @imdavevalk
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    May 26, 2009 8:45 PM GMT
    jeffper1 saidi agree vespa..but who the heck really has our backs????
    just us

    Yeah, basically just us. I really think Hillary Clinton does, but not her weasely husband Bill. I have low expectations for Obama, but we knew we were doomed with another Republican President, so we make do with what we've got.

    It's argued that gays can't gain real influence with Democrats because they take us for granted. They figure, what options do gays have? Vote Republican and slit their own throats? We're the only game in town, they hafta vote for us.

    But our actual option is to not vote at all. If Democrats want us to turn out on election day, then give us something tangible in return. If not, then do without us.

    We certainly aren't getting a good return for our investment as it is, so we don't seem to have much to lose anyway. You don't want our 10% of the vote? Fine, win your elections some other way.
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    May 26, 2009 8:54 PM GMT
    We knew that the CA Supreme Court was on our side, even if we disagree with this ruling. I can't imagine what would have happened if the will of the people was not upheld (as wrong as it is). This gives us a chance to convince the people, make the change, and make it permanent, rather than band-aid fixes.

    You can already tell how far the tide has turned even in California.

    But tell them the decision they made is not theirs to make and you might as well tell a teenager not to smoke. Nothing but a fight.

    I give it two years before the constitution is changed again.
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    May 26, 2009 9:00 PM GMT
    they really fucked up because as much as i want it to become legal, that requires them to change what was already ruled. and if it does get changed that jsut means it can get changed again!

    this right should not even be up for debate its an equal legit right.
  • UBdevil_doc

    Posts: 24

    May 26, 2009 9:16 PM GMT
    I'm glad I risked my life to protect and serve the country..... AND again still being denied my basic right, the freedom to marry. I'm glad chickens have more rights than me in California.
  • czkiwi

    Posts: 23

    May 26, 2009 9:32 PM GMT
    UBdevil_doc saidI'm glad I risked my life to protect and serve the country..... AND again still being denied my basic right, the freedom to marry. I'm glad chickens have more rights than me in California.


    AGREED. And Chief Justice Ron George uses the argument that gays can already join is a protected union equal to marriage. Really?

    Does my partner get my pension, if I die, NO but a spouse would. (and 1001 other federal, state and local laws that are not protected by unions)
    How is that equal to marriage. Who was defending us? It's time to fight, to rally, to march! Anyone with me? This IS worth fighting for.
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    May 26, 2009 9:46 PM GMT
    czkiwi said
    UBdevil_doc saidI'm glad I risked my life to protect and serve the country..... AND again still being denied my basic right, the freedom to marry. I'm glad chickens have more rights than me in California.


    AGREED. And Chief Justice Ron George uses the argument that gays can already join is a protected union equal to marriage. Really?

    Does my partner get my pension, if I die, NO but a spouse would. (and 1001 other federal, state and local laws that are not protected by unions)
    How is that equal to marriage. Who was defending us? It's time to fight, to rally, to march! Anyone with me? This IS worth fighting for.

    My partner cannot get my Social Security when I die, nor me his, even if we do marry in a state that allows gay marriage. Thank DOMA and Bill Clinton for that.

    He threw us under the bus after his Congressional losses in 1994, and so he could win reelection in 1996. Then did nothing for gays for the rest of his second term.

    The statements of Chief Justice George are false, as well he knows. But I blame gay Californians for this mess, and their incompetent gay leadership. Support a lot of "feel good" liberals who can't organize their way out of a paper bag and this is the result.
  • swogdog

    Posts: 143

    May 26, 2009 9:52 PM GMT
    Even though I expected this, it's still an emotional hit.

    I hope that our leaders can work together now, and not fracture the effort in individual bids to be crowned the next Milk.

    My opinion is that we need to educate the ones who are against gay marriage (assuming we can).

    Okay, so I have to share this personal story of trying to educate my relatives in Bakersfield - republican bastion of the West... My own family there is INCREDIBLY conservative. My uncle asked, "why should I give you extra rights by allowing you to marry a man?". I asked, "what do you mean extra rights?"

    "You can already legally marry: if you marry a woman. So, if we give you the right to marry a man you will have extra rights beyond the straight community." He replied.

    "Well, uncle Jerry, when I gain the right to marry a man, you will gain that right as well."

    "I don't want to marry a MAN!" he said.

    "I don't want to marry a woman!"

    That began a conversation in which I actually made some headway towards his understanding the issue. I believe he is now starting to get it, as is his wife. Two down, about a dozen others to go...

    Anyway, I think it's at the individual level that we have to try and make changes, but it's hard - emotionally and mentally - for me to challenge people one on one, as I'm sure it is for many. But it's what I feel I have to do and I hope what many of us will do.
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    May 26, 2009 9:53 PM GMT
    It's tyranny of the majority and a failure to uphold the Equal Protection clause of the California and US constitutions. Even "The People" cant amend their constitution to exclude a whole class of people. Otherwise, nobody is secure in their rights.

    Gays should put a referendum on the ballot to tax churches. . Carry the battle to the enemy! . Tax the Churches! . Écrasez l'infâme!
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    May 26, 2009 9:54 PM GMT
    daveZA saidMASS PROTEST TO START FROM UCLA AT 4PM. MARCH TO FEDERAL BUILDING. CALLING UPON PRESIDENT OBAMA TO TAKE FEDERAL ACTION NOW.

    FOLLOW ALL UPDATES VIA TWITTER @imdavevalk




    omg!!! go bruins!! i'm proud to be a ucla graduate!!!